Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Dark, When you put it like that, one can't help thinking that we have, as blind gamers, have just lived through a 30 year period in 10 years or so. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of dark Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2011 10:54 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed Hi Tom. Amusing, angela in an empty level? that would be a pain to get past, the vacuume of the ancients! ;D. I must confess, having had to monitor most of the releases over the last few years I don't think your correct in terms of saying we've missed out on a boom in games, rather I'd say that at the moment the emphasis has changed. Back when Gma, bsc and presumably esp were working ten years ago, it seems a lot of developers had the thought of creating games of the 80's and 90's in an accessible form, just as Dan and justin said in the troop podcast. There then seemed to be a boom on such games, alien outback, pipe, the original plans for monti, superliam, jim kitchins' Mac1 game etc. Obviously though like everything else, there was a boom and bust syndrome and people's expectations and desires changed. People started to say we've got enough wrack up score style affairs, what next? I even remember when Liam released judgement day, there were those who's reaction was oooh no, not another one now, it seems we have two catagories of games. Free or fun affairs which are made either by start out devs with bgt, or by experienced devs for fun, which tend to be arcade games but don't tend to wrack up a huge amount of interest, and serious! games, which have huge amounts of options, levels, game modes or whatever. Of course like any trend there are some exceptions such as Q9, but generally it seems now the average accessible game player has higher expectations of what they will play, and what they expect if paying for a game, than previously. Were bsc to release something like troopanum now, the reaction I think would be what, you expect us to pay money for something like this? This is however just the way game developement seems to work. from the players perspective it's a difference in demand and supply, while from the developers' it's a different spur to your creative talent, sinse like anything else artistic which you put your own time and effort into, your own individually created game has to be! individually yours even if it is created with community in put. That's again a nice aspect of the gaming community, such things can be discussed, tested, thought over etc, rather than some big evil company boss saying make this, sinse we sell more of these and the advertizing says it'll appeal to people This is just what Mr. Marx meant when he spoke about the alienation of labour, and the online community is a pretty good example of something which doesn't fall into that very nasty hole. But before I go into a socialist wrant i'll stop ;D. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Thomas, It all depends really on personal preference. In my opinion, some of those games are quite good. I don't know what people think of River Raiders, I know I play it nearly every day, I find it quite addictive, and I would suggest that the few who regularly post to my scoreboard finds the same enjoyment in it for them. But certainly some of the other projects are ok. There are only one or two projects out of the approximate dozen that were released that I feel would not bring as much public enjoyment without at least some expansion, which I am assisting some of the newby developers to do. I myself play quite a lot of them, and although they are mainly rainy day games that aren't as complicated as Judgment Day or even Troopanum, I still find quite a lot of enjoyment in them. Yes, some of them can be quite buggy, but I try not to let that get in the way of my enjoyment of it. There are not a lot of serious developers like you, Che, Philip and David around. As far as I am aware David is very well educated in maths and science as well as software development. Most of these people though, have had an average education and are struggling to come up with concepts and ideas alone. This is why I try and give as much assistance as is in my power to those developers who are starting out, free of charge, rather than being judgmental and botching their hopes and ideas. I'm not necessarily saying you are being judgmental, but I have seen quite a lot of undue complaint in the community. This game is bad, there's no replay value, etc, rather than giving constructive criticisms as to what can be done better. Whether amateur or professional, these developers are quite proud of what they are achieving and I feel they should be given the respect they are due as developers, and as far as I am concerned, they should be given more respect because of the fact that they can find bags of time to sit down and learn a scripting language for the purpose of carrying out one of the costliest exercises that can ever be imagined, i.e. developing for such a small-packed, tightly knitted community like the audiogaming market. The only way I believe audiogames can become as complicated as they used to be, is by collaborating on projects as me and a few other potential start-outs are attempting to do now. That way everybody can learn from everybody else's skills in a working environment, like Justin and Dan did, and then branch out independently to make their own projects. My views and opinions may sound far fetched and unrealistic, but I've generally found them to be more effective in my seven years experience of software development than expecting them to learn and work alone without the support of their community base, the result being that they generally get downhearted and decide it's not worth their time or energy. I'll get off my soapbox now. Smile. Regards Damien. - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 4:23 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed Hi Shaun, Yes, but the general quality of those games have gone down. What i mean by that is now that BGT has been released a lot of new game developers are trying to produce games, but a lot of what I've seen from them are a bunch of amateur practice games. Nothing really skillfully written which is to be expected from people just starting out. I'm not saying this to be negative, rude, etc but I think that some of the new amateur games should have been simply private affairs rather than public releases since they are proof of concepts rather than games. I won't name names or their projects as I don't want to hurt anyones feelings, but I think some of the new BGT developers should wait until they have enough skills under their belt to produce something a little more complete I guess is the word for it. HTH --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Funnily enough tom, both in terms of Megaman and in terms of the bsc games, I never had them when they first came out. i actually didn't play the original nes mega man games until 2005 when i got the aniversary collection for the gamecube, and I only became interested because of the snes offerings. Likewise I didn't play hunter, troopanum 2 etc until 2006, possibly one reason why I've never cared to buy classic pipe or classic troop, sinse for me the two later games seem to cover the earlier ones. Certainly i play and enjoy them, but I very much disagree that it is just! the classic appeal of the games which makes them worth playing. Were someone (as occasionally happens), to turn up on the forum asking for classic arcade games or games they could play in a short amount of time, I'd most likely recommend troopanum and pipe 2, possibly hunter (depending upon age given the grizly deaths), superliam, alien outback, dynaman, the pinball games, pakcman talks and indeed Q9, simply because they are well worth playing. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
That's one reason why I personally am trying to be selective before giving an announced bgt game a page in the database or news, because I cannot be sure of quality, this has irritated some people, but I think it's necessary. That being said, pontes backgammon as i SAId earlier was a bgt project I've been quite impressed with recently. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Damien, Right. That's exactly why I didn't name names or specifically point out the new games I didn't like. I don't want to put the developer down for giving it his or her best. I remember all to well there was a time I was exactly where they were when starting out, and it is certainly not helpful for a more experienced dev to put their work down when they are just beginning. I realise it is my personal expectations are just too high. As was pointed out on list earlier now that there have been games like Shades of Doom, Rail Racer, Entombed, Time of Conflict, and other more complex audio games released I want to see more games like that. When a new game comes out that is very simple I can't help but feel a little disappointed that there isn't more games of the quality I am looking for. Of course, I know the reason is that as you pointed out we are talking about amateur developers, with an average education, with little to know experience, trying to get off the ground and therefore aren't ready to take on a project like Troopenum yet let alone Shades of Doom or something as complex as Time of Conflict. Cheers! On 5/19/11, Damien Pendleton dam...@x-sight-interactive.net wrote: Hi Thomas, It all depends really on personal preference. In my opinion, some of those games are quite good. I don't know what people think of River Raiders, I know I play it nearly every day, I find it quite addictive, and I would suggest that the few who regularly post to my scoreboard finds the same enjoyment in it for them. But certainly some of the other projects are ok. There are only one or two projects out of the approximate dozen that were released that I feel would not bring as much public enjoyment without at least some expansion, which I am assisting some of the newby developers to do. I myself play quite a lot of them, and although they are mainly rainy day games that aren't as complicated as Judgment Day or even Troopanum, I still find quite a lot of enjoyment in them. Yes, some of them can be quite buggy, but I try not to let that get in the way of my enjoyment of it. There are not a lot of serious developers like you, Che, Philip and David around. As far as I am aware David is very well educated in maths and science as well as software development. Most of these people though, have had an average education and are struggling to come up with concepts and ideas alone. This is why I try and give as much assistance as is in my power to those developers who are starting out, free of charge, rather than being judgmental and botching their hopes and ideas. I'm not necessarily saying you are being judgmental, but I have seen quite a lot of undue complaint in the community. This game is bad, there's no replay value, etc, rather than giving constructive criticisms as to what can be done better. Whether amateur or professional, these developers are quite proud of what they are achieving and I feel they should be given the respect they are due as developers, and as far as I am concerned, they should be given more respect because of the fact that they can find bags of time to sit down and learn a scripting language for the purpose of carrying out one of the costliest exercises that can ever be imagined, i.e. developing for such a small-packed, tightly knitted community like the audiogaming market. The only way I believe audiogames can become as complicated as they used to be, is by collaborating on projects as me and a few other potential start-outs are attempting to do now. That way everybody can learn from everybody else's skills in a working environment, like Justin and Dan did, and then branch out independently to make their own projects. My views and opinions may sound far fetched and unrealistic, but I've generally found them to be more effective in my seven years experience of software development than expecting them to learn and work alone without the support of their community base, the result being that they generally get downhearted and decide it's not worth their time or energy. I'll get off my soapbox now. Smile. Regards Damien. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
In fairness though tom there is another side to this. Several developers started as ameter devs and actually improved as they went along. I'm thinking here both of people like rs games, and of philip bennefall himself. going from 3D snake and duck blaster to the bgt engine itself is a pretty good idea of what a developer can do if they stick to things and keep learning. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Dark, Yeah, I know. Trust me I've been there and done that myself. My first games, so-called games, were pretty boring affairs. They would be pretty laughable compared to what I'm creating now. For instance, the first game I wrote was text-based and was suppose to be something like a intergalactic gladiator type game. To give you an idea of how lame this thing was you selected the type of alien creature you wanted to fight and you would be placed in an arena with the creature. You were then presented with a number of options like fire your blaster pistol, fire your blaster rifle, throw thermal detonator, swing light saber, etc. It was turn based and you basically took turns chopping and shooting each other to death. Definitely nothing very interesting to write home about. Now, look where I am today. Cheers! On 5/19/11, dark d...@xgam.org wrote: In fairness though tom there is another side to this. Several developers started as ameter devs and actually improved as they went along. I'm thinking here both of people like rs games, and of philip bennefall himself. going from 3D snake and duck blaster to the bgt engine itself is a pretty good idea of what a developer can do if they stick to things and keep learning. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hmm. You've still got the spirit, Phil is working on one, and we get a game or two from Jim Kitchen every so often, and there are others either coming or are recently on the scene of game production. Things move slowly because games aren't made in a day, so to speak. I'm thinking that Sarah, MOTA's 2 and 3 dimensional versions, and Raceway will be big new arrivals. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed Hi Charles, Yes, in deed. I remember Troopenum was huge when it came out. I believe Aliens in the Outback came out about the same time. As I recall ESP and BSC were really popular at roughly the same time on the list. Also GMA put out Shades of Doom 1.0 around 2001 so that was a really good year for games and a huge step forward for accessible gaming. Before that year the majority of the games out there were the PCs Dos games, Jim Kitchen's Dos games, and GMA's early versions of Lonewolf and Trek 99 were Dos games as well. Its easy to forget how much of a driving force BSC, ESP, and GMA were in those days. Unfortunately, the creative spirit that started the Windows gaming experience from 2000 to 2004 or so seems to have dried up. Cheers! On 5/17/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: I remember there being so much traffic, and I think it was on this list as a matter of fact, about this game, Troopanum. The NFB was promoting the game because it was produced by blind gamers. Wasn't it about the same time as Aliens in the Outback was big? After a few months of reading about the game, I downloaded and tried it. After playing it for about 20 minutes, I bought it. The podcast reminded me of the unpacking aspect of the game. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
I think having all the new games so spaced apart in terms of when they're released has had a profound effect on the community. Nobody really steals each other's thunder so there's a lot more cooperation than you'd see in the sighted games world. Some folks think that we've already gone through our golden age of accessible games. I don't agree. With the quality of the upcomming releases Charles mentionned plus others, we could see a perfect storm which creates an even better period ahead for us. On 5/18/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Hmm. You've still got the spirit, Phil is working on one, and we get a game or two from Jim Kitchen every so often, and there are others either coming or are recently on the scene of game production. Things move slowly because games aren't made in a day, so to speak. I'm thinking that Sarah, MOTA's 2 and 3 dimensional versions, and Raceway will be big new arrivals. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed Hi Charles, Yes, in deed. I remember Troopenum was huge when it came out. I believe Aliens in the Outback came out about the same time. As I recall ESP and BSC were really popular at roughly the same time on the list. Also GMA put out Shades of Doom 1.0 around 2001 so that was a really good year for games and a huge step forward for accessible gaming. Before that year the majority of the games out there were the PCs Dos games, Jim Kitchen's Dos games, and GMA's early versions of Lonewolf and Trek 99 were Dos games as well. Its easy to forget how much of a driving force BSC, ESP, and GMA were in those days. Unfortunately, the creative spirit that started the Windows gaming experience from 2000 to 2004 or so seems to have dried up. Cheers! On 5/17/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: I remember there being so much traffic, and I think it was on this list as a matter of fact, about this game, Troopanum. The NFB was promoting the game because it was produced by blind gamers. Wasn't it about the same time as Aliens in the Outback was big? After a few months of reading about the game, I downloaded and tried it. After playing it for about 20 minutes, I bought it. The podcast reminded me of the unpacking aspect of the game. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. -- Michael Feir Volunteer at The Dam http://www.thedam.org 2011-- Owner of Silver Smiles Join and share the silver lining in your life. Group homepage: http://groups.google.com/group/silver-smiles 2010-- Twitter: mfeir Skype: michael-feir Author of Personal Power: How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People 2006-2008 http://michaelfeir.blogspot.com/2009/01/personal-power.html A Life of Word and Sound 2003-2007 http://michaelfeir.blogspot.com/2009/01/life-of-word-and-sound.html Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine 1996-2004 Check out my blog at: http://www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Well michael, this is generally true, though I will stick a hand up for some of the graphical indi developers here on the community front as well in tersm of general niceness to their players and availability to cooperate and chat, one reason why discussing access changes with indi developers is generally far more fruitful than discussing them with the industry. that being said, the community around accessible games is indeed a good thing. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories- Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
As I've said before I did always find it a bit sad that some of what I used to considder major developers sort of came and went in terms of what they were doing, the way that bsc, vip gameszone and draconis were as regular releasers as someone like Gma before other considderations got in the way. This just does seem to be the way things work though, even jason Alan has had to backoff from entombed developement due to his work, though he stil is keeping going if slowly. That being said, I think what you might call the core developers who work seriously and constantly has expanded more than people have drifted off, sinse I think were I listing the main developers now it'd probably have to include a good few more people such as Philip bennifall, jean-luc pontico with sound rts, and most recently Aprone aka Jeremy. Heck, look at Airik the Clerric. Someone wanders onto audiogames.net, and within a month we're looking hopefully at another pretty hefty game release. So, while there are certainly people who've had to stop developing due to other commitments, the amount of people working seriously on games does seem to have expanded quite a lot, particularly with the release of bgt. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Let's not forget BGT either. That's going to make it a lot easier for more people to create games. We are the Knights who say...Ni! - Original Message - From: Michael Feir michael.f...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2011 8:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed I think having all the new games so spaced apart in terms of when they're released has had a profound effect on the community. Nobody really steals each other's thunder so there's a lot more cooperation than you'd see in the sighted games world. Some folks think that we've already gone through our golden age of accessible games. I don't agree. With the quality of the upcomming releases Charles mentionned plus others, we could see a perfect storm which creates an even better period ahead for us. On 5/18/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Hmm. You've still got the spirit, Phil is working on one, and we get a game or two from Jim Kitchen every so often, and there are others either coming or are recently on the scene of game production. Things move slowly because games aren't made in a day, so to speak. I'm thinking that Sarah, MOTA's 2 and 3 dimensional versions, and Raceway will be big new arrivals. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed Hi Charles, Yes, in deed. I remember Troopenum was huge when it came out. I believe Aliens in the Outback came out about the same time. As I recall ESP and BSC were really popular at roughly the same time on the list. Also GMA put out Shades of Doom 1.0 around 2001 so that was a really good year for games and a huge step forward for accessible gaming. Before that year the majority of the games out there were the PCs Dos games, Jim Kitchen's Dos games, and GMA's early versions of Lonewolf and Trek 99 were Dos games as well. Its easy to forget how much of a driving force BSC, ESP, and GMA were in those days. Unfortunately, the creative spirit that started the Windows gaming experience from 2000 to 2004 or so seems to have dried up. Cheers! On 5/17/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: I remember there being so much traffic, and I think it was on this list as a matter of fact, about this game, Troopanum. The NFB was promoting the game because it was produced by blind gamers. Wasn't it about the same time as Aliens in the Outback was big? After a few months of reading about the game, I downloaded and tried it. After playing it for about 20 minutes, I bought it. The podcast reminded me of the unpacking aspect of the game. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. -- Michael Feir Volunteer at The Dam http://www.thedam.org 2011-- Owner of Silver Smiles Join and share the silver lining in your life. Group homepage: http://groups.google.com/group/silver-smiles 2010-- Twitter: mfeir Skype: michael-feir Author of Personal Power: How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People 2006-2008 http://michaelfeir.blogspot.com/2009/01/personal-power.html A Life of Word and Sound 2003-2007 http://michaelfeir.blogspot.com/2009/01/life-of-word-and-sound.html Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine 1996-2004 Check out my blog at: http://www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Charles, Yeah, but I was thinking more of the companies who made accessible gaming what it is today. For instance, ESP was a driving force 10 years ago, but ESP Softworks is gone and although Draconis has assumed control of ESP there hasn't been anything really new from them for at least three years. BSC Games was also a driving force 8, 9, 10 years ago and now that Justin is working full time there hasn't been anything in the works since Castle Quest was canceled. Dan pretty much quit developing games, released everything as abandonware, and now works full time at a college as I recall. I know that real life takes priority over game development, know that better than anyone, but still I can't help feel like something is gone/missing from this community. We need something more than Blastbay Studios, USA Games, and the ocational game from Jim Kitchen to keep the community going. I hope now that BGT is out we start seeing something like what we saw 5 to 10 years ago where people were creating lots of games and style of games like Side-scrollers, Pinball games, FPS Shooters, etc. Anyway, when it comes to time it takes to create a game of any serious quality I definitly can write the book on that story. I've been working on an engine, of various versions, for about three years, and have hjust now finally produced what I think will be a fully cross-platform portible version of the G3D Engine based on SDL 1.2.13 and FMOD 4.32. At least MOTA beta 19 seems to work decently on both Windows and Linux now aside for a few bugs. Which does bring up a funny story. A couple of days ago I was testing MOTA beta 19 when I loaded up the game Angela couldn't walk, run, jump, and was basically stuck in one spot. I spent two entire days driving myself crazy trying to figure out why something that was working an hour earlier just stopped working. Turns out I forgot I had updated the level data file, and for some reason when I saved it was empty. As a result nothing was initialized when the game loaded. When I copied the original data file over to the levels directory the game loaded up and ran perfectly. So I had to make the changes and resave it. Lol! Cheers! On 5/18/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Hmm. You've still got the spirit, Phil is working on one, and we get a game or two from Jim Kitchen every so often, and there are others either coming or are recently on the scene of game production. Things move slowly because games aren't made in a day, so to speak. I'm thinking that Sarah, MOTA's 2 and 3 dimensional versions, and Raceway will be big new arrivals. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Tom. Amusing, angela in an empty level? that would be a pain to get past, the vacuume of the ancients! ;D. I must confess, having had to monitor most of the releases over the last few years I don't think your correct in terms of saying we've missed out on a boom in games, rather I'd say that at the moment the emphasis has changed. Back when Gma, bsc and presumably esp were working ten years ago, it seems a lot of developers had the thought of creating games of the 80's and 90's in an accessible form, just as Dan and justin said in the troop podcast. There then seemed to be a boom on such games, alien outback, pipe, the original plans for monti, superliam, jim kitchins' Mac1 game etc. Obviously though like everything else, there was a boom and bust syndrome and people's expectations and desires changed. People started to say we've got enough wrack up score style affairs, what next? I even remember when Liam released judgement day, there were those who's reaction was oooh no, not another one now, it seems we have two catagories of games. Free or fun affairs which are made either by start out devs with bgt, or by experienced devs for fun, which tend to be arcade games but don't tend to wrack up a huge amount of interest, and serious! games, which have huge amounts of options, levels, game modes or whatever. Of course like any trend there are some exceptions such as Q9, but generally it seems now the average accessible game player has higher expectations of what they will play, and what they expect if paying for a game, than previously. Were bsc to release something like troopanum now, the reaction I think would be what, you expect us to pay money for something like this? This is however just the way game developement seems to work. from the players perspective it's a difference in demand and supply, while from the developers' it's a different spur to your creative talent, sinse like anything else artistic which you put your own time and effort into, your own individually created game has to be! individually yours even if it is created with community in put. That's again a nice aspect of the gaming community, such things can be discussed, tested, thought over etc, rather than some big evil company boss saying make this, sinse we sell more of these and the advertizing says it'll appeal to people This is just what Mr. Marx meant when he spoke about the alienation of labour, and the online community is a pretty good example of something which doesn't fall into that very nasty hole. But before I go into a socialist wrant i'll stop ;D. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Michael, Yeah, that's always a possibility of course. I was kind of struck by something Justin said in his podcast a couple of days ago about how back in the 80's he was a huge fan of arcade games and that was the inspiration for games like Troopenum. As someone who was also sighted during that time period as well I naturally saw that quality in his games and purchased Troopenum as it was clearly like many of the games I had played growing up. However, in my own way I'm just now beginning to follow in Justin's footsteps. What I mean by that is I too was sighted, have lots of mainstream gaming experience, and I'm about to bring to the table some new content that has never been done in audio before. As Charles pointed out Mysteries of the Ancients 2d and 3d versions are in there own way as revolutionary to this community as Troopenum or Shades of Doom was 10 years ago. The inspiration, as it were, for MOTA is of course the Tomb Raider games of the late 90's. USA Raceway, when completed, will be an accessible game similar to Nascar Thunder. Hopefully it will live up to some of the other racing games out there like Rail Racer that admitedly is an excellent racing game in and of itself. Those are actually only a small collection of games I have in my todo list. I've got plenty of other ideas I have written down, but haven't mentioned publically on the list. So you are right, who knows, perhaps games like that will inspire people to create bigger and better things. I know as for myself when I started writing games like Mysteries of the Ancients I was really thinking of getting into the 3d first-person genre. I still intend to do that, but now that I've been actively following Star Wars The Old Republic from Bioware online I am getting interested in perhaps doing an RPG game like that in the future. Entombed is a great example of how it could be done, but it would be an extremely long and difficult project to create. Not sure I want to commit to something that complex and time consuming now that I have an FPS Engine I can use to crank out games fairly quickly now. However, that just gives you an idea of how one idea leads to another. Cheers! On 5/18/11, Michael Feir michael.f...@gmail.com wrote: I think having all the new games so spaced apart in terms of when they're released has had a profound effect on the community. Nobody really steals each other's thunder so there's a lot more cooperation than you'd see in the sighted games world. Some folks think that we've already gone through our golden age of accessible games. I don't agree. With the quality of the upcomming releases Charles mentionned plus others, we could see a perfect storm which creates an even better period ahead for us. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Dark, You are certainly right about the direction of accessible games changing over the last few years. Mostly it was a good thing. Like you said from 2000 to 2004 most of the games were arcade affairs like DynaMan, Aliens in the Outback, Troopenum, Dark Destroyer, Pipe, Pipe 2, Hunter, Tarzan Junior, etc that were a throwback to the 1980's style of gaming. One reason there were so many game releases back to back is an arcade game like Troopenum is relatively easy to create compared to some of the games we have seen over the last three/four years or so. For instance, in 2006, I believe it was, Che mentioned to the list his idea to create Rail Racer. When he finally released 1.0 in 2007 or so it totally changed the way VI gamers think of racing games and raised the bar considerably. I litterally had to rethink Raceway from the ground up because of it. What I mean by that is that the original plans for ESP Raceway was for a racing game on par with Poll Position. You'd have like 8 different tracks, and up to four cars on the track. There was no season mode, no points, no upgrades, and all and all just a plane Jane racing game. I realized with games like Rail Racer coming out and free games like Topspeed and Mach1 already out there Raceway wouldn't do well financially. So I decided to rethink the game and use something like Nascar Thunder as my basis which is a mainstream game with a lot more features etc that would be selling points. Then, of course, there is Entombed. Again this is a game right up there with mainstream RPG games, and has totally redefined what I and others are willing to pay for in terms of games. People know I've been thinking of an RPG game for a while now, perhaps one like Sryth, but I've realized that a text-based game alone is not going to sell. Now, days there is this expectation of fighting sounds, weapons, background ambience, some music, etc followed by some narration voice which means a strict paper and pen style game isn't probably in demand any more. Something more roguelike such as Entombed is the style accessible RPG games will most likely take. Last, but certainly not least, is Time of Conflict. Once again GMA has amazed me, as well as everyone else, with something new and revolutionary. It reminds me of the various Civilization games were you build an army and then proceed to take over the planet by whiping out the enemy forces. It is a game with no parallel in accessible gaming and even SoundRTS, which is a decent real time strategy game itself, doesnt' quite compare to Time of Conflict in the RTS genre. I've litterally spent more than a week fighting a single campaign in Time of Conflict. So I agree that expectations for commercial games do get higher and higher as time goes buy. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
I see where you're coming from. Sort of like the fact that the Indy racers of today are good, but they just aren't a member of the Unser family, nor is there an A. J. Foyt among them. There are good guitarists, but there's no Hendrix. For the most part, what got the games for the blind industry what it has become is gone. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2011 10:29 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed Hi Charles, Yeah, but I was thinking more of the companies who made accessible gaming what it is today. For instance, ESP was a driving force 10 years ago, but ESP Softworks is gone and although Draconis has assumed control of ESP there hasn't been anything really new from them for at least three years. BSC Games was also a driving force 8, 9, 10 years ago and now that Justin is working full time there hasn't been anything in the works since Castle Quest was canceled. Dan pretty much quit developing games, released everything as abandonware, and now works full time at a college as I recall. I know that real life takes priority over game development, know that better than anyone, but still I can't help feel like something is gone/missing from this community. We need something more than Blastbay Studios, USA Games, and the ocational game from Jim Kitchen to keep the community going. I hope now that BGT is out we start seeing something like what we saw 5 to 10 years ago where people were creating lots of games and style of games like Side-scrollers, Pinball games, FPS Shooters, etc. Anyway, when it comes to time it takes to create a game of any serious quality I definitly can write the book on that story. I've been working on an engine, of various versions, for about three years, and have hjust now finally produced what I think will be a fully cross-platform portible version of the G3D Engine based on SDL 1.2.13 and FMOD 4.32. At least MOTA beta 19 seems to work decently on both Windows and Linux now aside for a few bugs. Which does bring up a funny story. A couple of days ago I was testing MOTA beta 19 when I loaded up the game Angela couldn't walk, run, jump, and was basically stuck in one spot. I spent two entire days driving myself crazy trying to figure out why something that was working an hour earlier just stopped working. Turns out I forgot I had updated the level data file, and for some reason when I saved it was empty. As a result nothing was initialized when the game loaded. When I copied the original data file over to the levels directory the game loaded up and ran perfectly. So I had to make the changes and resave it. Lol! Cheers! On 5/18/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Hmm. You've still got the spirit, Phil is working on one, and we get a game or two from Jim Kitchen every so often, and there are others either coming or are recently on the scene of game production. Things move slowly because games aren't made in a day, so to speak. I'm thinking that Sarah, MOTA's 2 and 3 dimensional versions, and Raceway will be big new arrivals. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Charles, Yes, something like that. While there are new devs and new games coming along to replace BSC, Draconis, DanZ Games, etc let's face it. There is still aplace for Hunter, Troopenum, Search Party, ESP Pinball, etc. They are, in a way, our classic games now. They are, in a sense, like what the original NES games mean to WII gamers. You can still get Megaman, but there is something about the originals you'll always miss. Cheers! On 5/18/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: I see where you're coming from. Sort of like the fact that the Indy racers of today are good, but they just aren't a member of the Unser family, nor is there an A. J. Foyt among them. There are good guitarists, but there's no Hendrix. For the most part, what got the games for the blind industry what it has become is gone. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
not to mention that with bgt its possible for new devs to pop up out of nowhere. At 02:06 a.m. 19/05/2011, you wrote: I think having all the new games so spaced apart in terms of when they're released has had a profound effect on the community. Nobody really steals each other's thunder so there's a lot more cooperation than you'd see in the sighted games world. Some folks think that we've already gone through our golden age of accessible games. I don't agree. With the quality of the upcomming releases Charles mentionned plus others, we could see a perfect storm which creates an even better period ahead for us. On 5/18/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Hmm. You've still got the spirit, Phil is working on one, and we get a game or two from Jim Kitchen every so often, and there are others either coming or are recently on the scene of game production. Things move slowly because games aren't made in a day, so to speak. I'm thinking that Sarah, MOTA's 2 and 3 dimensional versions, and Raceway will be big new arrivals. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed Hi Charles, Yes, in deed. I remember Troopenum was huge when it came out. I believe Aliens in the Outback came out about the same time. As I recall ESP and BSC were really popular at roughly the same time on the list. Also GMA put out Shades of Doom 1.0 around 2001 so that was a really good year for games and a huge step forward for accessible gaming. Before that year the majority of the games out there were the PCs Dos games, Jim Kitchen's Dos games, and GMA's early versions of Lonewolf and Trek 99 were Dos games as well. Its easy to forget how much of a driving force BSC, ESP, and GMA were in those days. Unfortunately, the creative spirit that started the Windows gaming experience from 2000 to 2004 or so seems to have dried up. Cheers! On 5/17/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: I remember there being so much traffic, and I think it was on this list as a matter of fact, about this game, Troopanum. The NFB was promoting the game because it was produced by blind gamers. Wasn't it about the same time as Aliens in the Outback was big? After a few months of reading about the game, I downloaded and tried it. After playing it for about 20 minutes, I bought it. The podcast reminded me of the unpacking aspect of the game. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. -- Michael Feir Volunteer at The Dam http://www.thedam.org 2011-- Owner of Silver Smiles Join and share the silver lining in your life. Group homepage: http://groups.google.com/group/silver-smiles 2010-- Twitter: mfeir Skype: michael-feir Author of Personal Power: How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People 2006-2008 http://michaelfeir.blogspot.com/2009/01/personal-power.html A Life of Word and Sound 2003-2007 http://michaelfeir.blogspot.com/2009/01/life-of-word-and-sound.html Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine 1996-2004 Check out my blog at: http://www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Well what I have seen is That with the event of bgt, a load of teams have started. Loads of indipendant teams mainly opensource hackers have released loads of stuff. The language is sertainly versitile. This along with those that have started in python and with the games from game madness, apron, etc have probably releaved preasure from the main companies which I am happy. At 04:27 a.m. 19/05/2011, you wrote: Hi Dark, You are certainly right about the direction of accessible games changing over the last few years. Mostly it was a good thing. Like you said from 2000 to 2004 most of the games were arcade affairs like DynaMan, Aliens in the Outback, Troopenum, Dark Destroyer, Pipe, Pipe 2, Hunter, Tarzan Junior, etc that were a throwback to the 1980's style of gaming. One reason there were so many game releases back to back is an arcade game like Troopenum is relatively easy to create compared to some of the games we have seen over the last three/four years or so. For instance, in 2006, I believe it was, Che mentioned to the list his idea to create Rail Racer. When he finally released 1.0 in 2007 or so it totally changed the way VI gamers think of racing games and raised the bar considerably. I litterally had to rethink Raceway from the ground up because of it. What I mean by that is that the original plans for ESP Raceway was for a racing game on par with Poll Position. You'd have like 8 different tracks, and up to four cars on the track. There was no season mode, no points, no upgrades, and all and all just a plane Jane racing game. I realized with games like Rail Racer coming out and free games like Topspeed and Mach1 already out there Raceway wouldn't do well financially. So I decided to rethink the game and use something like Nascar Thunder as my basis which is a mainstream game with a lot more features etc that would be selling points. Then, of course, there is Entombed. Again this is a game right up there with mainstream RPG games, and has totally redefined what I and others are willing to pay for in terms of games. People know I've been thinking of an RPG game for a while now, perhaps one like Sryth, but I've realized that a text-based game alone is not going to sell. Now, days there is this expectation of fighting sounds, weapons, background ambience, some music, etc followed by some narration voice which means a strict paper and pen style game isn't probably in demand any more. Something more roguelike such as Entombed is the style accessible RPG games will most likely take. Last, but certainly not least, is Time of Conflict. Once again GMA has amazed me, as well as everyone else, with something new and revolutionary. It reminds me of the various Civilization games were you build an army and then proceed to take over the planet by whiping out the enemy forces. It is a game with no parallel in accessible gaming and even SoundRTS, which is a decent real time strategy game itself, doesnt' quite compare to Time of Conflict in the RTS genre. I've litterally spent more than a week fighting a single campaign in Time of Conflict. So I agree that expectations for commercial games do get higher and higher as time goes buy. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] the spirit of game production - Re: brings back memories - Re: Fw: BlindSoftware.comBlog Feed
Hi Shaun, Yes, but the general quality of those games have gone down. What i mean by that is now that BGT has been released a lot of new game developers are trying to produce games, but a lot of what I've seen from them are a bunch of amateur practice games. Nothing really skillfully written which is to be expected from people just starting out. I'm not saying this to be negative, rude, etc but I think that some of the new amateur games should have been simply private affairs rather than public releases since they are proof of concepts rather than games. I won't name names or their projects as I don't want to hurt anyones feelings, but I think some of the new BGT developers should wait until they have enough skills under their belt to produce something a little more complete I guess is the word for it. HTH On 5/18/11, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: Well what I have seen is That with the event of bgt, a load of teams have started. Loads of indipendant teams mainly opensource hackers have released loads of stuff. The language is sertainly versitile. This along with those that have started in python and with the games from game madness, apron, etc have probably releaved preasure from the main companies which I am happy. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
