Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
I just tried editing a file that has an FF with a few common editors. It does not work properly in several of them. In particular in linux textedit and in JHS codemirror. I would not be able to work with scripts that had FF in them! On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:38 PM Henry Rich wrote: > In the middle of a line FF would need to be whitespace which would mean > you have to decide how to display it, etc. > > Treated as a line-end it is discarded as the file is read, and there are > no further repercussions as the FF is not part of what gets interpreted. > > There would be the side effect that 5!:5 would not recover the FF. But > if the FF is useful to editors and doesn't hurt us, I can see allowing it. > > hhr > > On 7/18/2021 6:22 PM, Eric Iverson wrote: > > Is it used only when alone on a line? Things get messier when it is > allowed > > anywhere, > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:10 PM Michal Wallace > > > wrote: > > > >> FF is actually pretty commonly used in source code... I use it all the > time > >> in python and rust. > >> It's actually used as part of the GNU C coding standard, according to > >> wikipedia (pretty sure that's where I picked it up...) > >> > >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_break#Semantic_use > >> > >> > >> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:55 PM Eric Iverson > >> wrote: > >> > >>> In linux jconsole input ctrl+l, is not treated as LF. Instead it > scrolls > >>> down the page. > >>> > >>> I think you will find that ctrl+l will behave differently on many > >> different > >>> hosts, terminal managers, J front ends, etc. I think making it behave > in > >> a > >>> useful way and the same way in all cases is not possible. And including > >> it > >>> is a script introduces a whole new level of complication. > >>> > >>> Before changing the JE, the use case should be studied and probably > >>> revisited. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> And it is unlikely to be consistent with other languages. > >>> > >>> > >>> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:37 PM Raul Miller > >> wrote: > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke > >>> wrote: > > I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be > >>> treated > > like LF. > Yes. > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_character > > Thanks, > > -- > Raul > -- > For information about J forums see > http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > >>> -- > >>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > >>> > >> -- > >> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > >> > > -- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. > https://www.avg.com > > -- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
In the middle of a line FF would need to be whitespace which would mean you have to decide how to display it, etc. Treated as a line-end it is discarded as the file is read, and there are no further repercussions as the FF is not part of what gets interpreted. There would be the side effect that 5!:5 would not recover the FF. But if the FF is useful to editors and doesn't hurt us, I can see allowing it. hhr On 7/18/2021 6:22 PM, Eric Iverson wrote: Is it used only when alone on a line? Things get messier when it is allowed anywhere, On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:10 PM Michal Wallace wrote: FF is actually pretty commonly used in source code... I use it all the time in python and rust. It's actually used as part of the GNU C coding standard, according to wikipedia (pretty sure that's where I picked it up...) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_break#Semantic_use On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:55 PM Eric Iverson wrote: In linux jconsole input ctrl+l, is not treated as LF. Instead it scrolls down the page. I think you will find that ctrl+l will behave differently on many different hosts, terminal managers, J front ends, etc. I think making it behave in a useful way and the same way in all cases is not possible. And including it is a script introduces a whole new level of complication. Before changing the JE, the use case should be studied and probably revisited. And it is unlikely to be consistent with other languages. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:37 PM Raul Miller wrote: On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke wrote: I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated like LF. Yes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_character Thanks, -- Raul -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm -- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
Yeah. Or at least that's the only way I've ever seen it used. It was originally literally to feed a new form into your printer when you were printing your source code, so it really doesn't make sense anywhere else. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:22 PM Eric Iverson wrote: > Is it used only when alone on a line? Things get messier when it is allowed > anywhere, > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:10 PM Michal Wallace > wrote: > > > FF is actually pretty commonly used in source code... I use it all the > time > > in python and rust. > > It's actually used as part of the GNU C coding standard, according to > > wikipedia (pretty sure that's where I picked it up...) > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_break#Semantic_use > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:55 PM Eric Iverson > > wrote: > > > > > In linux jconsole input ctrl+l, is not treated as LF. Instead it > scrolls > > > down the page. > > > > > > I think you will find that ctrl+l will behave differently on many > > different > > > hosts, terminal managers, J front ends, etc. I think making it behave > in > > a > > > useful way and the same way in all cases is not possible. And including > > it > > > is a script introduces a whole new level of complication. > > > > > > Before changing the JE, the use case should be studied and probably > > > revisited. > > > > > > > > > > > > And it is unlikely to be consistent with other languages. > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:37 PM Raul Miller > > wrote: > > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke > > > wrote: > > > > > I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be > > > treated > > > > > like LF. > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_character > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Raul > > > > > -- > > > > For information about J forums see > http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > > > > > -- > > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > > > -- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > -- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
Is it used only when alone on a line? Things get messier when it is allowed anywhere, On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 6:10 PM Michal Wallace wrote: > FF is actually pretty commonly used in source code... I use it all the time > in python and rust. > It's actually used as part of the GNU C coding standard, according to > wikipedia (pretty sure that's where I picked it up...) > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_break#Semantic_use > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:55 PM Eric Iverson > wrote: > > > In linux jconsole input ctrl+l, is not treated as LF. Instead it scrolls > > down the page. > > > > I think you will find that ctrl+l will behave differently on many > different > > hosts, terminal managers, J front ends, etc. I think making it behave in > a > > useful way and the same way in all cases is not possible. And including > it > > is a script introduces a whole new level of complication. > > > > Before changing the JE, the use case should be studied and probably > > revisited. > > > > > > > > And it is unlikely to be consistent with other languages. > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:37 PM Raul Miller > wrote: > > > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke > > wrote: > > > > I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be > > treated > > > > like LF. > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_character > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > -- > > > Raul > > > -- > > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > > > -- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > -- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
FF is actually pretty commonly used in source code... I use it all the time in python and rust. It's actually used as part of the GNU C coding standard, according to wikipedia (pretty sure that's where I picked it up...) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_break#Semantic_use On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:55 PM Eric Iverson wrote: > In linux jconsole input ctrl+l, is not treated as LF. Instead it scrolls > down the page. > > I think you will find that ctrl+l will behave differently on many different > hosts, terminal managers, J front ends, etc. I think making it behave in a > useful way and the same way in all cases is not possible. And including it > is a script introduces a whole new level of complication. > > Before changing the JE, the use case should be studied and probably > revisited. > > > > And it is unlikely to be consistent with other languages. > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:37 PM Raul Miller wrote: > > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke > wrote: > > > I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be > treated > > > like LF. > > > > Yes. > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_character > > > > Thanks, > > > > -- > > Raul > > -- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > -- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
In linux jconsole input ctrl+l, is not treated as LF. Instead it scrolls down the page. I think you will find that ctrl+l will behave differently on many different hosts, terminal managers, J front ends, etc. I think making it behave in a useful way and the same way in all cases is not possible. And including it is a script introduces a whole new level of complication. Before changing the JE, the use case should be studied and probably revisited. And it is unlikely to be consistent with other languages. On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 5:37 PM Raul Miller wrote: > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke wrote: > > I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated > > like LF. > > Yes. > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_character > > Thanks, > > -- > Raul > -- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke wrote: > I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated > like LF. Yes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitespace_character Thanks, -- Raul -- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
Bingo! When reading from a script, the code discards UP TO TWO trailing
control characters at the end of a line. Thus
0!:1 (49 12 13 { a.)
1
1
0!:1 (49 12 13 10 { a.) NB. normal Windows
1♀
|spelling error
| 1♀
| ^
|[-0]
0!:1 (49 12 10 { a.) NB. Normal Linux
1
1
0!:1 (49 5 10 { a.) NB. Any control character is deleted
1
1
That explains the mystery. We still need to agree on whether FF should
be a line-end.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 5:21 PM, Michal Wallace wrote:
Hrm. I always place it on a blank line by itself, and it does not give a
spelling error on linux in this case.
Could it be that the code for platform-specific line endings ignores any
character c after an LF if 32>a.i.c ?
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke wrote:
It looks like FF is not supported in linux scripts, e.g.
9!:14''
j903/j64avx2/linux/beta-l/commercial/
www.jsoftware.com/2021-06-17T13:00:33/clang-10-0-0/SLEEF=1
('1',FF,'2') fwrite 't1.ijs'
3
0!:1 <'t1.ijs'
1
2
|spelling error
| 1
2
|^
|[-0] t1.ijs
I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated
like LF.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 1:15 PM Henry Rich wrote:
Every bytecode that is not an ASCII graphic or SP, CR, TAB, or LF will
cause a spelling error if encountered as a word:
". 12 { a.
|spelling error
|
The question here is whether FF is enough of an industry-standard to be
called whitespace, like TAB.
I don't know myself. I have looked at the code & decided that making FF
look like LF for script purposes is not too hard, while making it look
like TAB takes more work.
But I am loath to make any change at all until I understand why FF works
sometimes and not others. As I see it, any script containing FF would
fail when loaded, unless the FF were buried inside a string. If you
have cases where this is not so I want to know where the FF is
disappearing to.
In the meantime you can use Eric's trick of stripping FF during load.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 3:56 PM, Eric Iverson wrote:
FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not
tested.
There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure
it
makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it
and
perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich
wrote:
I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do
it
if there are no problems.
Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
same error there as on Windows.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files
to
divide my code into "pages".
(I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one
page
at
a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at
the
top
of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It
works
fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I
try
to load a J script written this way in the windows version of
jconsole,
it
gives me a spelling error on that character.
Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
change my ways? :D
--
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http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
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Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
Sound point. To summarize:
* If FF is part of a broader markup language, that markup should be
handled in a preprocessor.
* OTOH, if you use a preprocessor, you can't complain if everyone else
uses one too, and if they are not compatible you have Babel. That is,
calling for a preprocessor only postpones problems.
* Does treating FF like LF really rise to the level of change that
deserves a preprocessor?
** We already have 2 line-ends - LF and CR - and this is just adding a
3d - not breaking new ground
** FF is currently an error so there is no chance that making it a
line-end will affect any existing cases
* Is FF useful and intuitive? Intuitive for sure; useful perhaps.
If that ends the debate, I would vote to make FF a line-end, and I would
vote against making it whitespace.
But I still want to know how you were able to load a script with a FF
character.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 5:11 PM, Eric Iverson wrote:
What about chars for vertical tab, bell, etc? What is whitespace and what
is an error is a tricky question. I would be against any change in this
area. It has been this way for 30 years.
Fancier scripts (literate programming) are great, but FF is the tip of that
iceberg. I suggest that a script preprocessor is the right solution.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke wrote:
It looks like FF is not supported in linux scripts, e.g.
9!:14''
j903/j64avx2/linux/beta-l/commercial/
www.jsoftware.com/2021-06-17T13:00:33/clang-10-0-0/SLEEF=1
('1',FF,'2') fwrite 't1.ijs'
3
0!:1 <'t1.ijs'
1
2
|spelling error
| 1
2
|^
|[-0] t1.ijs
I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated
like LF.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 1:15 PM Henry Rich wrote:
Every bytecode that is not an ASCII graphic or SP, CR, TAB, or LF will
cause a spelling error if encountered as a word:
". 12 { a.
|spelling error
|
The question here is whether FF is enough of an industry-standard to be
called whitespace, like TAB.
I don't know myself. I have looked at the code & decided that making FF
look like LF for script purposes is not too hard, while making it look
like TAB takes more work.
But I am loath to make any change at all until I understand why FF works
sometimes and not others. As I see it, any script containing FF would
fail when loaded, unless the FF were buried inside a string. If you
have cases where this is not so I want to know where the FF is
disappearing to.
In the meantime you can use Eric's trick of stripping FF during load.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 3:56 PM, Eric Iverson wrote:
FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not
tested.
There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure
it
makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it
and
perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich
wrote:
I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do
it
if there are no problems.
Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
same error there as on Windows.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files
to
divide my code into "pages".
(I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one
page
at
a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at
the
top
of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It
works
fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I
try
to load a J script written this way in the windows version of
jconsole,
it
gives me a spelling error on that character.
Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
change my ways? :D
--
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http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
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Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
Hrm. I always place it on a blank line by itself, and it does not give a
spelling error on linux in this case.
Could it be that the code for platform-specific line endings ignores any
character c after an LF if 32>a.i.c ?
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke wrote:
> It looks like FF is not supported in linux scripts, e.g.
>
>9!:14''
> j903/j64avx2/linux/beta-l/commercial/
> www.jsoftware.com/2021-06-17T13:00:33/clang-10-0-0/SLEEF=1
>
>('1',FF,'2') fwrite 't1.ijs'
> 3
>0!:1 <'t1.ijs'
>1
> 2
> |spelling error
> | 1
> 2
> |^
> |[-0] t1.ijs
>
> I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated
> like LF.
>
> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 1:15 PM Henry Rich wrote:
>
> > Every bytecode that is not an ASCII graphic or SP, CR, TAB, or LF will
> > cause a spelling error if encountered as a word:
> >
> > ". 12 { a.
> > |spelling error
> > |
> > The question here is whether FF is enough of an industry-standard to be
> > called whitespace, like TAB.
> >
> > I don't know myself. I have looked at the code & decided that making FF
> > look like LF for script purposes is not too hard, while making it look
> > like TAB takes more work.
> >
> > But I am loath to make any change at all until I understand why FF works
> > sometimes and not others. As I see it, any script containing FF would
> > fail when loaded, unless the FF were buried inside a string. If you
> > have cases where this is not so I want to know where the FF is
> > disappearing to.
> >
> > In the meantime you can use Eric's trick of stripping FF during load.
> >
> > Henry Rich
> >
> >
> >
> > On 7/18/2021 3:56 PM, Eric Iverson wrote:
> > > FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
> > > linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not
> tested.
> > >
> > > There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure
> it
> > > makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
> > >
> > > If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it
> > and
> > > perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
> > >
> > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do
> it
> > >> if there are no problems.
> > >>
> > >> Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
> > >> same error there as on Windows.
> > >>
> > >> Henry Rich
> > >>
> > >> On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
> > >>> I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files
> to
> > >>> divide my code into "pages".
> > >>>
> > >>> (I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one
> page
> > >> at
> > >>> a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at
> the
> > >> top
> > >>> of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
> > >>>
> > >>> I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It
> > works
> > >>> fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I
> > try
> > >>> to load a J script written this way in the windows version of
> jconsole,
> > >> it
> > >>> gives me a spelling error on that character.
> > >>>
> > >>> Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
> > >>> change my ways? :D
> > >>>
> --
> > >>> For information about J forums see
> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> > >> https://www.avg.com
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> For information about J forums see
> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> > >>
> > > --
> > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> >
> >
> > --
> > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> > https://www.avg.com
> >
> > --
> > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> >
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
What about chars for vertical tab, bell, etc? What is whitespace and what
is an error is a tricky question. I would be against any change in this
area. It has been this way for 30 years.
Fancier scripts (literate programming) are great, but FF is the tip of that
iceberg. I suggest that a script preprocessor is the right solution.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 4:55 PM chris burke wrote:
> It looks like FF is not supported in linux scripts, e.g.
>
>9!:14''
> j903/j64avx2/linux/beta-l/commercial/
> www.jsoftware.com/2021-06-17T13:00:33/clang-10-0-0/SLEEF=1
>
>('1',FF,'2') fwrite 't1.ijs'
> 3
>0!:1 <'t1.ijs'
>1
> 2
> |spelling error
> | 1
> 2
> |^
> |[-0] t1.ijs
>
> I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated
> like LF.
>
> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 1:15 PM Henry Rich wrote:
>
> > Every bytecode that is not an ASCII graphic or SP, CR, TAB, or LF will
> > cause a spelling error if encountered as a word:
> >
> > ". 12 { a.
> > |spelling error
> > |
> > The question here is whether FF is enough of an industry-standard to be
> > called whitespace, like TAB.
> >
> > I don't know myself. I have looked at the code & decided that making FF
> > look like LF for script purposes is not too hard, while making it look
> > like TAB takes more work.
> >
> > But I am loath to make any change at all until I understand why FF works
> > sometimes and not others. As I see it, any script containing FF would
> > fail when loaded, unless the FF were buried inside a string. If you
> > have cases where this is not so I want to know where the FF is
> > disappearing to.
> >
> > In the meantime you can use Eric's trick of stripping FF during load.
> >
> > Henry Rich
> >
> >
> >
> > On 7/18/2021 3:56 PM, Eric Iverson wrote:
> > > FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
> > > linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not
> tested.
> > >
> > > There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure
> it
> > > makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
> > >
> > > If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it
> > and
> > > perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
> > >
> > > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do
> it
> > >> if there are no problems.
> > >>
> > >> Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
> > >> same error there as on Windows.
> > >>
> > >> Henry Rich
> > >>
> > >> On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
> > >>> I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files
> to
> > >>> divide my code into "pages".
> > >>>
> > >>> (I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one
> page
> > >> at
> > >>> a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at
> the
> > >> top
> > >>> of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
> > >>>
> > >>> I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It
> > works
> > >>> fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I
> > try
> > >>> to load a J script written this way in the windows version of
> jconsole,
> > >> it
> > >>> gives me a spelling error on that character.
> > >>>
> > >>> Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
> > >>> change my ways? :D
> > >>>
> --
> > >>> For information about J forums see
> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> > >> https://www.avg.com
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> For information about J forums see
> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> > >>
> > > --
> > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> >
> >
> > --
> > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> > https://www.avg.com
> >
> > --
> > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> >
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
--
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Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
It looks like FF is not supported in linux scripts, e.g.
9!:14''
j903/j64avx2/linux/beta-l/commercial/
www.jsoftware.com/2021-06-17T13:00:33/clang-10-0-0/SLEEF=1
('1',FF,'2') fwrite 't1.ijs'
3
0!:1 <'t1.ijs'
1
2
|spelling error
| 1
2
|^
|[-0] t1.ijs
I think FF is normally considered to be whitespace, so it can be treated
like LF.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 1:15 PM Henry Rich wrote:
> Every bytecode that is not an ASCII graphic or SP, CR, TAB, or LF will
> cause a spelling error if encountered as a word:
>
> ". 12 { a.
> |spelling error
> |
> The question here is whether FF is enough of an industry-standard to be
> called whitespace, like TAB.
>
> I don't know myself. I have looked at the code & decided that making FF
> look like LF for script purposes is not too hard, while making it look
> like TAB takes more work.
>
> But I am loath to make any change at all until I understand why FF works
> sometimes and not others. As I see it, any script containing FF would
> fail when loaded, unless the FF were buried inside a string. If you
> have cases where this is not so I want to know where the FF is
> disappearing to.
>
> In the meantime you can use Eric's trick of stripping FF during load.
>
> Henry Rich
>
>
>
> On 7/18/2021 3:56 PM, Eric Iverson wrote:
> > FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
> > linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not tested.
> >
> > There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure it
> > makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
> >
> > If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it
> and
> > perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich wrote:
> >
> >> I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do it
> >> if there are no problems.
> >>
> >> Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
> >> same error there as on Windows.
> >>
> >> Henry Rich
> >>
> >> On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
> >>> I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files to
> >>> divide my code into "pages".
> >>>
> >>> (I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one page
> >> at
> >>> a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at the
> >> top
> >>> of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
> >>>
> >>> I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It
> works
> >>> fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I
> try
> >>> to load a J script written this way in the windows version of jconsole,
> >> it
> >>> gives me a spelling error on that character.
> >>>
> >>> Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
> >>> change my ways? :D
> >>> --
> >>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> >>
> >> --
> >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> >> https://www.avg.com
> >>
> >> --
> >> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
> >>
> > --
> > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
Every bytecode that is not an ASCII graphic or SP, CR, TAB, or LF will
cause a spelling error if encountered as a word:
". 12 { a.
|spelling error
|
The question here is whether FF is enough of an industry-standard to be
called whitespace, like TAB.
I don't know myself. I have looked at the code & decided that making FF
look like LF for script purposes is not too hard, while making it look
like TAB takes more work.
But I am loath to make any change at all until I understand why FF works
sometimes and not others. As I see it, any script containing FF would
fail when loaded, unless the FF were buried inside a string. If you
have cases where this is not so I want to know where the FF is
disappearing to.
In the meantime you can use Eric's trick of stripping FF during load.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 3:56 PM, Eric Iverson wrote:
FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not tested.
There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure it
makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it and
perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich wrote:
I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do it
if there are no problems.
Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
same error there as on Windows.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files to
divide my code into "pages".
(I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one page
at
a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at the
top
of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It works
fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I try
to load a J script written this way in the windows version of jconsole,
it
gives me a spelling error on that character.
Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
change my ways? :D
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
--
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https://www.avg.com
--
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Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
More on FF. If there is to be preprocessing of a script to make it suitable
for load, it should be done in J, rather than the front end.
load fix 'test.ijs'
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:56 PM Eric Iverson
wrote:
> FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
> linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not tested.
>
> There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure it
> makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
>
> If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it and
> perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
>
> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich wrote:
>
>> I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do it
>> if there are no problems.
>>
>> Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
>> same error there as on Windows.
>>
>> Henry Rich
>>
>> On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
>> > I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files to
>> > divide my code into "pages".
>> >
>> > (I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one page
>> at
>> > a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at the
>> top
>> > of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
>> >
>> > I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It works
>> > fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I
>> try
>> > to load a J script written this way in the windows version of jconsole,
>> it
>> > gives me a spelling error on that character.
>> >
>> > Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
>> > change my ways? :D
>> > --
>> > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>
>>
>> --
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>> https://www.avg.com
>>
>> --
>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>>
>
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
FF char (12{a.) gets a spelling error if in a script that is loaded in
linux. I think this would be the same as in windows but have not tested.
There are lots of values that will give spelling errors. I am not sure it
makes sense to special case (i.e. ignore FF).
If the FF is desired for its behavior in an editor, that is OK. But it and
perhaps other chars should be stripped out before being fed to load.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich wrote:
> I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do it
> if there are no problems.
>
> Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
> same error there as on Windows.
>
> Henry Rich
>
> On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
> > I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files to
> > divide my code into "pages".
> >
> > (I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one page
> at
> > a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at the
> top
> > of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
> >
> > I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It works
> > fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I try
> > to load a J script written this way in the windows version of jconsole,
> it
> > gives me a spelling error on that character.
> >
> > Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
> > change my ways? :D
> > --
> > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
no clue. as far as i know it's just a plain ascii character. as i said, it
works in jqt on windows, too.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 3:39 PM Henry Rich wrote:
> I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do it
> if there are no problems.
>
> Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
> same error there as on Windows.
>
> Henry Rich
>
> On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
> > I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files to
> > divide my code into "pages".
> >
> > (I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one page
> at
> > a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at the
> top
> > of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
> >
> > I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It works
> > fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I try
> > to load a J script written this way in the windows version of jconsole,
> it
> > gives me a spelling error on that character.
> >
> > Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
> > change my ways? :D
> > --
> > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
> --
> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
>
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
Re: [Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
I will look into turning FF into LF when a script is read, & will do it
if there are no problems.
Does Linux do something to the FF? I don't see why you don't get the
same error there as on Windows.
Henry Rich
On 7/18/2021 7:58 AM, Michal Wallace wrote:
I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files to
divide my code into "pages".
(I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one page at
a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at the top
of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It works
fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I try
to load a J script written this way in the windows version of jconsole, it
gives me a spelling error on that character.
Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
change my ways? :D
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
--
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[Jgeneral] FF character in J source files on windows jconsole.
I sometimes use the ^L character (FF, or 12{a.) in source code files to
divide my code into "pages".
(I have emacs set up so that I can page back and forth showing one page at
a time without scrolling, so the top line of the page is always at the top
of the screen when that page is showing, etc.)
I've done this with J source code with no problems in the past. It works
fine in jqt and in jconsole on linux, but I just discovered that if I try
to load a J script written this way in the windows version of jconsole, it
gives me a spelling error on that character.
Is this something that could be officially supported, or do I need to
change my ways? :D
--
For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
