Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] Properties of package sets

2007-07-05 Thread Marius Mauch
On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 05:07:28 +0200
Marius Mauch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Please reply on gentoo-portage-dev, _not_ on gentoo-dev, thanks.
 
 One missing feature in portage is the lack of package sets. Before we
 (re)start working on that however I'd like to get some feedback about
 what properties/features people would expect from portage package set
 support.
 Some key questions:
 
 - should they simply act like aliases for multiple packages? E.g.
 should `emerge -C sets/kde` be equivalent to `emerge -C kdepkg1
 kdepkg2 kdepkg3 ...`? Or does the behavior need to be smarter in
 some ways?
 
 - what kind of atoms should be supported in sets? Simple and versioned
 atoms for sure, but what about complex atoms (use-conditional, any-of,
 blockers)?
 
 - should sets be supported everywhere, or only in selected use cases?
 (everywhere would include depstrings for example)
 
 - what use cases are there for package sets? Other than the
 established system and world, and the planned all and
 security sets.
 
 - how/where should sets be stored/distributed?

Forgot one question:

- should sets have metadata? (e.g. a description for searching)

There hasn't been much feedback yet, so if you want to add anything now
is your chance, otherwise I'll implement things the way that works
best/is easiest for me, which might be different from what you expect.

Marius

PS: I also accept off-list replies

-- 
Public Key at http://www.genone.de/info/gpg-key.pub

In the beginning, there was nothing. And God said, 'Let there be
Light.' And there was still nothing, but you could see a bit better.


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: cyclic dependency

2007-07-05 Thread Vieri Di Paola

--- Christian Faulhammer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Is a
 PDEPEND possible?

I followed your suggestion and posted a couple of
ebuilds for the upcoming Shorewall 4 package:

http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=174588

I am not seeing cyclic dependency issues anymore.

Thanks for any suggestions.

Vieri



  

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[gentoo-dev] Pre-Last Rites: net-irc/bitchx

2007-07-05 Thread Markus Ullmann
As we know from previous bugs and mails here on -dev, bitchx is pretty
much unmaintained and now has an open security bug.

https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=183149

So if no-one wants to take it, p.masking it in a week from now and
remove it regular 30 days after.

-Jokey



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Re: [gentoo-dev] Pre-Last Rites: net-irc/bitchx

2007-07-05 Thread Luca Barbato
Markus Ullmann wrote:
 As we know from previous bugs and mails here on -dev, bitchx is pretty
 much unmaintained and now has an open security bug.
 
 https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=183149
 
 So if no-one wants to take it, p.masking it in a week from now and
 remove it regular 30 days after.
 

Workalike client suggested?

lu

-- 

Luca Barbato

Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC
http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Pre-Last Rites: net-irc/bitchx

2007-07-05 Thread Michael Hanselmann
Hi Luca

On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 01:14:00PM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote:
 Workalike client suggested?

After using BitchX for several years, I switch to irssi like 2.5 years
ago. It felt like the most similar client, altough they're a bit
different.

Greets,
Michael

-- 
http://hansmi.ch/


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Pre-Last Rites: net-irc/bitchx

2007-07-05 Thread Raúl Porcel
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Luca Barbato wrote:
 
 Workalike client suggested?
 
 lu
 

epic5,epic4,irssi,ircii,ninja,scrollz,weechat

:)
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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GDewz+GtA+3375P7o9jDe34=
=Aqyn
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Re: [gentoo-dev] Pre-Last Rites: net-irc/bitchx

2007-07-05 Thread Tom Wesley
On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 01:48:20PM +0200, Luca Barbato [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
 is there a script to mimic bx in irssi or epic5?
 
 lu

There are specific scripts to minic specific functionality, so whatever
you're missing can probably be replicated.  Find a #irssi :)

tomaw



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[gentoo-dev] Re: Re: package with funny licence

2007-07-05 Thread Steve Long
Jeroen Roovers wrote:

 On Wed, 04 Jul 2007 15:28:04 +0100
 Steve Long [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 It maybe be Published by some group, but they seem to make no
 restrictions whatsoever. As such, I'd personally feel quite happy
 using it as-is; I don't think they much care either way :-)
 
 Hmmm. A license is *needed* as long as modifying/distributing the
 package is restricted by copyright. The as-is license specifically
 grants you the right to use the software it pertains to. Without an
 explicit license, you may not (ever) modify or distribute it. You would
 need to obtain permission from the copyright owner in that case -
 otherwise the normal copyright restrictions are in effect.

Sure but afaict they disavow all restrictions. In response (aiui) to the
standard question What may we do with this? the first line reads:
You're allowed. You're a bozo.

The BOZO Manifesto takes up the rest of the document, wherein
The Bozotic Software Foundation (hereafter referred to as us or
you or everyone except Emacs-19) imo stipulates that in effect the
users are part of the group holding publishing rights, or rather that the
code is public domain (everyone except Emacs-19.)

 Again, to ask the copyright owner for a simple (written) statement
 saying how the software may be (freely or not) distributed and modified
 is currently the next step.
 
Agreed; I'm sure I've seen that [EMAIL PROTECTED] addy on other software if 
manson is
non-responsive. An email counts as written ofc, although a gpg sig might be
advisable. (Although I do not think this particular case merits such
caution.. but then, I'm a bozo ;)


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Re: [gentoo-dev] laying out arch profiles

2007-07-05 Thread Chris Gianelloni
On Wed, 2007-06-27 at 12:31 -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote:
 maintaining arch things across multiple operating systems is boring me so i'd 
 like to start moving to profiles that outline arch-specific details
 
 for example:
 default-linux/parent:
   ../base
 default-linux/sh/parent:
   ..
   ../../arch/sh
 arch/sh/parent:
   ..
 arch/parent - none
 
 all of the arch-specific details would be moved out of base/ and into arch/ 
 (like altivec, sse, sse2, mmx, etc...) and then they can be unmasked in the 
 respective arch/$arch/ subdir
 
 this would be for 2007.1+ profiles and we can leave the old things in place 
 until we phase out 2007.0 and older completely

This is actually something I was already planning on working on setting
up.  To avoid conflicting with the current profiles, I was planning on
making a new profile tree.  I wasn't planning on using it for 2007.1's
official media, though, but rather just /experimental stuff, since I'd
rather get much more testing on it before it goes live as the default.

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Alpha/AMD64/x86 Architecture Teams
Games Developer/Council Member/Foundation Trustee
Gentoo Foundation


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Nominations open for the Gentoo Council 2007/08

2007-07-05 Thread Chris Gianelloni
On Mon, 2007-07-02 at 21:10 +0200, Torsten Veller wrote:
 Chris Gianelloni wolf31o2

While I thank you for the nomination for next year's Gentoo Council, I
have decided that I no longer wish to be associated with the Gentoo
Council or any other form of management or leadership within Gentoo.
It is simply too stressful being harassed constantly by our developer
pool.  I sincerely hope that whomever decides to run for Council this
year takes into account that of the original elected Council, two have
retired (both due to being tired of having the shit roll downhill to
them) from Gentoo completely, and three of the remaining aren't running
for re-election.

Being a Council member is the worst job in Gentoo.  Be sure you're ready
to be treated like complete shit from your fellow developers all the
while having your integrity questioned daily before accepting your
nominations.  I know that I wouldn't accept a position on the Gentoo
Council even if it was a paying job.

I've also come to realize that trying to give a single direction to
something like Gentoo is an extremely foolish endeavor.  The better
solution is smaller projects and tasks that have defined goals and can
actually be accomplished.  Any kind of general direction for the entire
distribution would either mean leaving out groups, or moving in a
direction that conflicts with the goals of our current groups.  Don't
get me wrong, the Council is definitely needed.  I just think their
focus should be on attainable and measurable goals, not lofty
dreamy-eyed goals with no real way to measure whether we're moving in
the right direction.

Rather than go into more and more what I think are major deficiencies in
what the Council can and can not do due to the ever-changing developer
pool, I think I'll just shut up now.  If anyone wants to discuss with me
any of this stuff, feel free to contact me.

 Say YES or NO.

How about a resounding NO, instead?

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Alpha/AMD64/x86 Architecture Teams
Games Developer/Council Member/Foundation Trustee
Gentoo Foundation


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Nominations open for the Gentoo Council 2007/08

2007-07-05 Thread Chris Gianelloni
On Wed, 2007-07-04 at 18:23 +0300, Petteri Räty wrote:
 How is being a devrel member important for the table? I don't think it's
 any more special than any other TLP.

It is very important in the case of Council members as the Council is
the escalation point for Developer Relations appeals.

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Alpha/AMD64/x86 Architecture Teams
Games Developer/Council Member/Foundation Trustee
Gentoo Foundation


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Re: [gentoo-dev] Nominations open for the Gentoo Council 2007/08

2007-07-05 Thread Petteri Räty
Chris Gianelloni kirjoitti:
 On Wed, 2007-07-04 at 18:23 +0300, Petteri Räty wrote:
 How is being a devrel member important for the table? I don't think it's
 any more special than any other TLP.
 
 It is very important in the case of Council members as the Council is
 the escalation point for Developer Relations appeals.
 

True, but I am only in the devrel list because recruiters happens to be
a devrel sub project but in the end it shouldn't matter much whether
there is a tick there or not.

Regards,
Petteri



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Re: [gentoo-dev] Nominations open for the Gentoo Council 2007/08

2007-07-05 Thread Ciaran McCreesh
On Thu, 05 Jul 2007 15:20:55 -0700
Chris Gianelloni [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Wed, 2007-07-04 at 18:23 +0300, Petteri Räty wrote:
  How is being a devrel member important for the table? I don't think
  it's any more special than any other TLP.
 
 It is very important in the case of Council members as the Council is
 the escalation point for Developer Relations appeals.

The Council is the escalation point for QA appeals too. At least in
theory...

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh



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Re: [gentoo-dev] laying out arch profiles

2007-07-05 Thread Mike Frysinger
On Thursday 05 July 2007, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
 On Wed, 2007-06-27 at 12:31 -0400, Mike Frysinger wrote:
  maintaining arch things across multiple operating systems is boring me so
  i'd like to start moving to profiles that outline arch-specific details
 
  for example:
  default-linux/parent:
  ../base
  default-linux/sh/parent:
  ..
  ../../arch/sh
  arch/sh/parent:
  ..
  arch/parent - none
 
  all of the arch-specific details would be moved out of base/ and into
  arch/ (like altivec, sse, sse2, mmx, etc...) and then they can be
  unmasked in the respective arch/$arch/ subdir
 
  this would be for 2007.1+ profiles and we can leave the old things in
  place until we phase out 2007.0 and older completely

 This is actually something I was already planning on working on setting
 up.  To avoid conflicting with the current profiles, I was planning on
 making a new profile tree.  I wasn't planning on using it for 2007.1's
 official media, though, but rather just /experimental stuff, since I'd
 rather get much more testing on it before it goes live as the default.

you proposing we rearchitect it all or just for testing purposes before going 
live ?  i can see both ...
profiles/frags/
  libc/uclibc/
  libc/gclibc/
  arch/amd64/
  arch/sh/
  kernel/linux/
  kernel/bsd/
  kernel/bsd/freebsd/
  kernel/bsd/openbsd/

profiles/default-linux/amd64/parent
  ../../frags/arch/amd64
  ../../frags/kernel/linux
  ../../frags/libc/glibc
  ..
-mike


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[gentoo-dev] glibc-2.6 / gcc-4.2 going into ~arch

2007-07-05 Thread Mike Frysinger
get your waaait dont do it votes in now, i plan on pushing:
glibc-2.6 ~amd64 ~ppc ~ppc64 ~x86
gcc-4.2.0 ~amd64 ~x86
in the next day or so
-mike


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Re: [gentoo-dev] glibc-2.6 / gcc-4.2 going into ~arch

2007-07-05 Thread Jim Ramsay
Mike Frysinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 get your waaait dont do it votes in now, i plan on pushing:
 glibc-2.6 ~amd64 ~ppc ~ppc64 ~x86
 gcc-4.2.0 ~amd64 ~x86

Are there any crazy upgrade paths like the good old libstdc++ bump?

-- 
Jim Ramsay
Gentoo/Linux Developer (rox,gkrellm)


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Re: [gentoo-dev] glibc-2.6 / gcc-4.2 going into ~arch

2007-07-05 Thread Mike Frysinger
On Friday 06 July 2007, Jim Ramsay wrote:
 Mike Frysinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  get your waaait dont do it votes in now, i plan on pushing:
  glibc-2.6 ~amd64 ~ppc ~ppc64 ~x86
  gcc-4.2.0 ~amd64 ~x86

 Are there any crazy upgrade paths like the good old libstdc++ bump?

no
-mike


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Re: [gentoo-dev] glibc-2.6 / gcc-4.2 going into ~arch

2007-07-05 Thread Jim Ramsay
Mike Frysinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Friday 06 July 2007, Jim Ramsay wrote:

  Are there any crazy upgrade paths like the good old libstdc++ bump?

 no

And there was great rejoicing.

-- 
Jim Ramsay
Gentoo/Linux Developer (rox,gkrellm)


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Re: [gentoo-dev] glibc-2.6 / gcc-4.2 going into ~arch

2007-07-05 Thread Mike Frysinger
On Friday 06 July 2007, Mike Frysinger wrote:
 get your waaait dont do it votes in now, i plan on pushing:
 glibc-2.6 ~amd64 ~ppc ~ppc64 ~x86
 gcc-4.2.0 ~amd64 ~x86
 in the next day or so

sorry, forgot about ~ia64 as well
-mike


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[gentoo-portage-dev] Re: [gentoo-dev] [RFC] Properties of package sets

2007-07-05 Thread Marius Mauch
On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 05:07:28 +0200
Marius Mauch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Please reply on gentoo-portage-dev, _not_ on gentoo-dev, thanks.
 
 One missing feature in portage is the lack of package sets. Before we
 (re)start working on that however I'd like to get some feedback about
 what properties/features people would expect from portage package set
 support.
 Some key questions:
 
 - should they simply act like aliases for multiple packages? E.g.
 should `emerge -C sets/kde` be equivalent to `emerge -C kdepkg1
 kdepkg2 kdepkg3 ...`? Or does the behavior need to be smarter in
 some ways?
 
 - what kind of atoms should be supported in sets? Simple and versioned
 atoms for sure, but what about complex atoms (use-conditional, any-of,
 blockers)?
 
 - should sets be supported everywhere, or only in selected use cases?
 (everywhere would include depstrings for example)
 
 - what use cases are there for package sets? Other than the
 established system and world, and the planned all and
 security sets.
 
 - how/where should sets be stored/distributed?

Forgot one question:

- should sets have metadata? (e.g. a description for searching)

There hasn't been much feedback yet, so if you want to add anything now
is your chance, otherwise I'll implement things the way that works
best/is easiest for me, which might be different from what you expect.

Marius

PS: I also accept off-list replies

-- 
Public Key at http://www.genone.de/info/gpg-key.pub

In the beginning, there was nothing. And God said, 'Let there be
Light.' And there was still nothing, but you could see a bit better.


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