On Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:09:04 -0700
Donnie Berkholz dberkh...@gentoo.org wrote:
On 19:06 Wed 11 Mar , Thilo Bangert wrote:
the presumption seems to be, that as a dev one has to be
available via IRC. it has long been my feeling that Gentoo as a
project could realize more of its potential by better
integrating people who dont do IRC.
I think IRC helps to build a more tightly knit community and, because
of this, is very important to Gentoo. The less close we are as a
community, the more free we feel to be hostile because we don't see
the folks on the other end of the big tube as real people. It's much
like a technique that militaries use during wars to de-personalize
the enemy, except with the Internet, we start that way and have to
apply effort to grow closer.
This is an interesting point you raise, though I don't think it applies in this
I believe, rather, that the issue is the 'community' appears more like a
'cabal' when the discussions take place on #IRC and therefore aren't available
in public archives.
Even if they are, an IRC log is a *terrible* way to document an issue.
Since the discussion is Re: '*DEVS* on IRC', I think the problem should be
You all get more closely knit, perhaps, yet appear to do more *in secret*.
There is *no way* to find out what is going on, without becoming part of the
problem... by asking, or lurking, on IRC. This is bad.
Example? After months of searching for a reason, after seeing many apparently
random updates to a previously stable tree of perl modules, I happen to keep an
IRC session log which shows with this FSCKING USEFUL TIDBIT:
... no motivated developers. the perl team completely vanished.
Anyone considering using Gentoo should KNOW that, if they use perl in any
substantive way. Wouldn't you agree?
Now, why isn't there a discussion about this on the gentoo-perl mailing list?
Not even a post from some DEV with a cry for HELP? If there's a problem, *who*
is doing *what* to address it, and *where*?
Oh, right, there's *some* discussion on IRC...
Anyway, it's just one example. In this case, I'd be glad to see *some*
documentation of the (apparent total) collapse of the 'perl team' and what is
being proposed to fix the problem, *without* having to become part of the cabal.
Since there is a mailing list dedicated for discussions of perl and gentoo,
that seems the most logical place to air the dirty laundry and announce/discuss
the plan for moving forward. IMO.
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