[gentoo-dev] xinetd use flag and xinetd files being installed

2006-01-28 Thread William Hubbs
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Sat, Jan 28, 2006 at 08:33:26PM -0500, Doug Goldstein wrote: How about the packages that don't even ask and just install logrotate stuff? Like Apache, lighttpd, and mysql? What about xinetd? The same thing is happening there. I have some files

Re: [gentoo-dev] Make logrotate a global USE flag?

2006-01-29 Thread William Hubbs
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Sun, Jan 29, 2006 at 07:46:30AM +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote: We already had this discussion. It's not that it's another file, it's that it's another file in /etc, which is backed up and requires administrator attention on every upgrade.

[gentoo-dev] where to install source files for c++ templates

2006-02-13 Thread William Hubbs
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 All, I am working on version bumping app-accessibility/festival and app-accessibility/speech-tools. I can get them to build outside an ebuild fine, but I have found that festival #includes actual source files from speech-tools to instantiate c++

[gentoo-dev] assistance requested with festival and speech-tools

2006-09-17 Thread William Hubbs
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 All, I could use assistance with getting the current versions of festival and speech-tools into portage. The issue is that festival directly includes sources from speech-tools, and speech-tools is also a library in its own right which can be used by

[gentoo-dev] OpenRC stable pushes

2012-12-07 Thread William Hubbs
I want to explain about the recent openrc's going directly to stable. The team had been testing from the previous stable, 0.9.x series all the way through 0.10.x. We found out recently that releng needed the new openrc stable because of the cds/isos being broken. There hadn't been bugs reported,

Re: [gentoo-dev] OpenRC stable pushes

2012-12-07 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Dec 07, 2012 at 09:24:54AM -0600, William Hubbs wrote: I want to explain about the recent openrc's going directly to stable. The team had been testing from the previous stable, 0.9.x series all the way through 0.10.x. We found out recently that releng needed the new openrc stable

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cleaning tree of outdated packages

2012-12-13 Thread William Hubbs
I think another good reason for treecleaning a package is if upstream for the package stops supporting their package and recommends that you use a new package. In this situation, once the new package hits stable, there is really not a reason to keep the old package around. Instead, any necessary

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cleaning tree of outdated packages

2012-12-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 06:24:30PM -0500, Jeff Horelick wrote: On 13 December 2012 17:57, Mike Gilbert flop...@gentoo.org wrote: On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 1:59 PM, Jory A. Pratt anar...@gentoo.org wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 12/13/2012 12:48 PM, Tomáš Chvátal

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cleaning tree of outdated packages

2012-12-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 10:06:34PM -0500, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 13/12/12 06:49 PM, William Hubbs wrote: For example, glibc-2.9 and gcc-2.95. I think that if we are going to keep things this old in the tree we need a good reason

Re: [gentoo-dev] Cleaning tree of outdated packages

2012-12-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 05:57:16PM -0500, Mike Gilbert wrote: I am sure that some people find it very handy to have old gcc ebuilds around. It might come in handy for testing. Testhing what? It doesn't matter if they can't compile the latest kernel. If someone files a bug for that, it gets

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: [gentoo-dev-announce] Summary Council meeting: Tuesday 11 December 2012

2012-12-14 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Dec 14, 2012 at 02:05:27PM -0500, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 14/12/12 01:28 PM, Greg KH wrote: On Fri, Dec 14, 2012 at 11:43:41AM +0100, Fabian Groffen wrote: Handling separate /usr support == After the

[gentoo-dev] udev distro vs upstream choices

2012-12-15 Thread William Hubbs
All, what are the specific choices I made in udev that are distro choices vs upstream choices. People have said to me a couple of times that there were choices I made that are not upstream choices. If there is something I can undo in udev to make it easier for us I will do that; I'm just not

Re: [gentoo-dev] udev distro vs upstream choices

2012-12-15 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 07:10:22PM -0500, Richard Yao wrote: On 12/15/2012 06:02 PM, William Hubbs wrote: All, what are the specific choices I made in udev that are distro choices vs upstream choices. People have said to me a couple of times that there were choices I made

Re: [gentoo-dev] udev distro vs upstream choices

2012-12-16 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 10:35:44PM -0500, Richard Yao wrote: On 12/15/2012 10:03 PM, William Hubbs wrote: On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 07:10:22PM -0500, Richard Yao wrote: On 12/15/2012 06:02 PM, William Hubbs wrote: All, what are the specific choices I made in udev that are distro choices

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: eudev project announcement

2012-12-17 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 01:31:59PM -0800, Greg KH wrote: On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 09:03:40PM +0100, J. Roeleveld wrote: Olav Vitters o...@vitters.nl wrote: On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 09:29:26AM -0500, Richard Yao wrote: As I said in an earlier email, Lennart Poettering claims that it does

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: eudev project announcement

2012-12-18 Thread William Hubbs
On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 07:50:51AM +0100, Ulrich Mueller wrote: On Mon, 17 Dec 2012, William Hubbs wrote: This all started with the April 2012 council meeting when it was pushed through that separate /usr without an initramfs is a supported configuration, so yes, the previous council

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: eudev project announcement

2012-12-18 Thread William Hubbs
On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 01:51:27PM -0500, Richard Yao wrote: On 12/18/2012 01:45 PM, William Hubbs wrote: On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 07:50:51AM +0100, Ulrich Mueller wrote: On Mon, 17 Dec 2012, William Hubbs wrote: This all started with the April 2012 council meeting when it was pushed

Re: [gentoo-dev] Moving our/portage stuff to var

2012-12-20 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 20, 2012 at 06:58:11AM -0500, Rich Freeman wrote: On Thu, Dec 20, 2012 at 4:25 AM, George Shapovalov geo...@gentoo.org wrote: On Thursday 20 December 2012 09:11:39 Ulrich Mueller wrote: /var/cache/repositories/local== the new location for a local overlay Also I wonder if

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: eudev project announcement

2012-12-21 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 04:04:31PM +0100, J. Roeleveld wrote: On Friday, December 21, 2012 09:38:36 AM Rich Freeman wrote: On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 8:51 AM, Ian Stakenvicius a...@gentoo.org wrote: On 21/12/12 03:10 AM, J. Roeleveld wrote: An init* needs to be kept in sync with the rest of

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: eudev project announcement

2012-12-21 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 06:36:05PM +0100, J. Roeleveld wrote: On Friday, December 21, 2012 10:21:02 AM William Hubbs wrote: On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 04:04:31PM +0100, J. Roeleveld wrote: On Friday, December 21, 2012 09:38:36 AM Rich Freeman wrote: On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 8:51 AM, Ian

Re: [gentoo-dev] gen_usr_ldscript --libdir=/lib

2012-12-26 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 10:48:23PM +0100, Diego Elio Pettenò wrote: On 24/12/2012 20:08, Mike Frysinger wrote: i.e. saying we should get rid of gen_usr_ldscript and use --libdir=/lib makes absolutely no sense. it's just begging for people to screw things up constantly and waste developer

Re: [gentoo-dev] gen_usr_ldscript --libdir=/lib

2012-12-27 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 07:55:38AM +, Tony Chainsaw Vroon wrote: On Wed, 2012-12-26 at 22:01 -0600, William Hubbs wrote: Actually, since ulm pointed out in another thread that the council has not mandated that we support separate /usr without an initramfs, I am re-considering

Re: [gentoo-dev] gen_usr_ldscript --libdir=/lib

2012-12-27 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 08:00:09AM -0500, Rich Freeman wrote: On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 2:55 AM, Tony Chainsaw Vroon chain...@gentoo.org wrote: On Wed, 2012-12-26 at 22:01 -0600, William Hubbs wrote: Actually, since ulm pointed out in another thread that the council has not mandated that we

Re: [gentoo-dev] gen_usr_ldscript --libdir=/lib

2012-12-27 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 01:35:55PM -0500, Mike Gilbert wrote: On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 12:03 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 08:00:09AM -0500, Rich Freeman wrote: On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 2:55 AM, Tony Chainsaw Vroon chain...@gentoo.org wrote: On Wed

Re: [gentoo-dev] gen_usr_ldscript --libdir=/lib

2012-12-27 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 01:49:50PM -0500, Rich Freeman wrote: On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 12:03 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: As I and others have said on this list a thousdand times, moving everything to /usr never had anything to do with systemd and udev. This is a completely

Re: [gentoo-dev] gen_usr_ldscript --libdir=/lib

2012-12-27 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 03:14:37PM -0500, Rich Freeman wrote: Something I don't like about this whole debate is that it tends to come off as I've never run an initramfs and darn it I want to keep it that way. Gentoo has always been a cutting-edge/innovative distro. We have prefix, hardened,

Re: [gentoo-dev] configuration-doc.eclass: an eclass to install a CONFIGURATION doc file and show an elog message first time package is installed

2013-01-03 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Jan 03, 2013 at 02:01:03PM +0100, Pacho Ramos wrote: # Copyright 1999-2012 Gentoo Foundation # Distributed under the terms of the GNU General Public License v2 # $Header: $ # @ECLASS: configuration-doc # @MAINTAINER: # Pacho Ramos pa...@gentoo.org # @AUTHOR: # Author: Pacho Ramos

Re: [gentoo-dev] configuration-doc.eclass: an eclass to install a CONFIGURATION doc file and show an elog message first time package is installed

2013-01-03 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Jan 03, 2013 at 10:03:21PM +0100, Pacho Ramos wrote: El jue, 03-01-2013 a las 14:29 -0600, William Hubbs escribió: [...] case ${EAPI:-0} in 0|1|2|3) die Unsupported EAPI=${EAPI:-0} (too old) for ${ECLASS} ;; 4|5) # EAPI=4 is required

Re: [gentoo-dev] About using a CONFIGURATION (or SETUP) file under /usr/share/doc for configuration information

2013-01-05 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jan 04, 2013 at 11:34:59PM -0600, Donnie Berkholz wrote: On 10:26 Sat 22 Dec , Pacho Ramos wrote: Hello After seeing: https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=440214 Looking to a lot of its blockers shows that we are using elog messages for informing people about

[gentoo-dev] call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-09 Thread William Hubbs
All, as you probably know by now, udev-197 has hit the tree. This new version implements a new feature called predictable network interface names [1], which I have currently turned off for live systems, because it will require migration on the part of the user. When you upgrade to this new

Re: [gentoo-dev] call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-09 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Jan 09, 2013 at 02:59:10PM -0800, Christopher Head wrote: On Wed, 9 Jan 2013 16:13:10 -0600 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/PredictableNetworkInterfaceNames This seems like a good thing for some systems

Re: [gentoo-dev] call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-10 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Jan 09, 2013 at 11:33:42PM -0500, Rich Freeman wrote: On Wed, Jan 9, 2013 at 11:21 PM, Daniel Campbell dlcampb...@gmx.com wrote: So long as users retain the choice of keeping eth* or wlan*, no complaints from me. I (and others) came to Gentoo to get away from systemd, and this

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-12 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 02:11:43AM +, Steven J. Long wrote: Christopher Head wrote: William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: There is a way for users to opt out if we default this to on, but I think the new naming scheme has advantages over the traditional eth* wlan* etc names

Re: [gentoo-dev] [PATCH eutils] Introduce run_in_build_dir() used in a few ebuilds.

2013-01-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 02:29:43PM +0100, Michał Górny wrote: The run_in_build_dir() command simply runs given command in the directory stated as BUILD_DIR. This variable is used commonly by autotools-utils, cmake-utils and python-r1 eclasses, therefore I'm proposing adding the relevant

Re: [gentoo-dev] [PATCH eutils] Introduce run_in_build_dir() used in a few ebuilds.

2013-01-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 04:08:18PM +0100, Michał Górny wrote: On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 09:05:31 -0600 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 02:29:43PM +0100, Michał Górny wrote: The run_in_build_dir() command simply runs given command in the directory stated

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Re: call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-14 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 06:04:01AM +, Steven J. Long wrote: On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 William Hubbs wrote: Steven J. Long wrote: If you're certain that every user with a current simple setup, who uses the kernel default names, and has such a firewall setup isn't going to suddenly find

Re: [gentoo-dev] systemd/udev split

2013-01-14 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 01:59:14PM -0500, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 14/01/13 01:06 PM, Oleksii Shevchuk wrote: Hi list! After introducing eudev, is there any reason to do systemd/udev split? Ask in 6 months to a year, after eudev

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Re: call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-14 Thread William Hubbs
On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 01:25:01AM +0100, Peter Stuge wrote: William Hubbs wrote: I have a bug opened with the docs team and release engineering to discuss whether we want the new names for new installs. IMO yes we do. What's that bug - or what is the good way to thumbs up/down? https

Re: [gentoo-dev] call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-17 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 07:44:39PM +0100, Tobias Klausmann wrote: Hi! On Thu, 17 Jan 2013, Peter Stuge wrote: Tobias Klausmann wrote: It has been rather nifty that if I walk up to a random machine with exactly one NIC (that I've been asked to examine/fix), I _know_ that there will

Re: [gentoo-dev] call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-18 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 08:33:13AM -0500, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 18/01/13 07:24 AM, viv...@gmail.com wrote: Since for servers predictable names are useful and for desktop (which usually have only one ethernet that never change) Is it

Re: [gentoo-dev] call for testers: udev predictable network interface names

2013-01-19 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 10:07:42AM -0500, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 18/01/13 09:54 AM, William Hubbs wrote: On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 08:33:13AM -0500, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 18/01/13

Re: [gentoo-dev] news item for udev 197-r3 upgrade (yes, I know, it's late)

2013-01-27 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 08:06:48PM +0100, Felix Kuperjans wrote: Mike Gilbert: On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 1:29 PM, Felix Kuperjans fe...@desaster-games.com wrote: Samuli Suominen wrote: please review this news item, seems we need one after all Hello Samuli, /dev/root is no longer

Re: [gentoo-dev] Removals reply

2013-02-02 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Feb 02, 2013 at 02:05:50PM +0100, Tomáš Chvátal wrote: Dne So 2. února 2013 12:44:30, Vaeth napsal(a): When I came to Gentoo many years ago, this was a very rare problem, but the removal of packages has tremendously increased, and it is not only me who is observing this problem -

Re: [gentoo-dev] The /run migration

2013-02-06 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Feb 06, 2013 at 10:23:06AM -0500, Mike Gilbert wrote: On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:03 AM, Ian Stakenvicius a...@gentoo.org wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 06/02/13 09:53 AM, Markos Chandras wrote: On 6 February 2013 14:18, Ian Stakenvicius a...@gentoo.org

Re: [gentoo-dev] The status of the 'minor' arches in gentoo

2013-02-17 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, Feb 17, 2013 at 05:03:43PM +0100, Agostino Sarubbo wrote: Now, imho, we have 2 choice: 1)Support them with an iso or at least a manual if we can't do an handbook 2)Lose the stable keyword and don't waste manpower anymore. We also have another choice if there is so little interest in

Re: [gentoo-dev] Evaluating a new malloc()

2013-02-26 Thread William Hubbs
On Tue, Feb 26, 2013 at 11:10:09AM -0800, Matt Turner wrote: On Tue, Feb 26, 2013 at 8:35 AM, Alec Warner anta...@gentoo.org wrote: In terms of 'following Gentoo policy.' We encourage packages to be as close to upstream as possible. I cannot fathom why when you basically find a performance

[gentoo-dev] rfc: patch systemd.eclass to use pkg-config if available

2013-03-11 Thread William Hubbs
All, systemd, like udev, stores directory paths in a way that they can be queried from pkg-config. However, the systemd.eclass currently does not use this ability. The following patch models the systemd eclass after the udev eclass and leaves the current defaults in place if there is an issue

Re: [gentoo-dev] rfc: patch systemd.eclass to use pkg-config if available

2013-03-11 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 05:37:12PM -0400, Mike Gilbert wrote: On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 5:18 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: All, systemd, like udev, stores directory paths in a way that they can be queried from pkg-config. However, the systemd.eclass currently does not use

Re: [gentoo-dev] rfc: patch systemd.eclass to use pkg-config if available

2013-03-11 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 11:47:47PM +0100, Michał Górny wrote: On Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:28:08 -0500 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 05:37:12PM -0400, Mike Gilbert wrote: On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 5:18 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: All

Re: [gentoo-dev] How shall we name the EAPI 6 patch applying function?

2013-04-03 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Apr 03, 2013 at 11:56:09AM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: There was a slight mis-understanding between me and ulm. On Wed, 3 Apr 2013 11:14:37 +0200 Michał Górny mgo...@gentoo.org wrote: a) patch files can be specified directly or through a directory in which *all* files will be

[gentoo-dev] news item -- baselayout-1.x deprecation final warning

2013-04-07 Thread William Hubbs
warning Author: William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain Posted: 2013-04-10 Revision: 1 News-Item-Format: 1.0 Display-If-Installed: sys-apps/baselayout-2 WARNING! THIS NEWS ITEM REQUIRES IMMEDIATE ATTENTION! On 28 Jun 2011, baselayout-2.x and OpenRC were first marked stable on all

Re: [gentoo-dev] news item -- baselayout-1.x deprecation final warning

2013-04-07 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, Apr 07, 2013 at 04:37:42PM -0400, Alex Xu wrote: On 07/04/13 04:13 PM, Roy Bamford wrote: On 2013.04.07 20:36, William Hubbs wrote: If you do not upgrade your systems to openrc-0.11.8 before it leaves the tree, you may need to reinstall them. /quote I think you mean

Re: [gentoo-dev] news item -- baselayout-1.x deprecation final warning

2013-04-07 Thread William Hubbs
All, here is the second draft. I am including updates from this thread as well as a couple of my own. Let me know what you think. Thanks, William Title: baselayout-1.x deprecation final warning Author: William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain Posted: 2013-04-10 Revision: 1

[gentoo-dev] new eclass: systemd-next.eclass

2013-04-13 Thread William Hubbs
All, this eclass is an alternative to systemd.eclass, and maintains full compatibility with it; however, it expands it so that it can query pkgconfig for the directory paths. It returns the same default paths as systemd.eclass if there is an error with pkgconfig. I am sending this out for review

Re: [gentoo-dev] new eclass: systemd-next.eclass

2013-04-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 04:15:03PM -0400, Rich Freeman wrote: On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 3:43 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: I am sending this out for review so we can commit it to the tree when we commit our alternate systemd ebuild in a few days. This will be set up so

Re: [gentoo-dev] new eclass: systemd-next.eclass

2013-04-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 11:27:24PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 14:43:14 -0500 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: this eclass is an alternative to systemd.eclass, and maintains full compatibility with it; however, it expands it so that it can query pkgconfig

Re: [gentoo-dev] new eclass: systemd-next.eclass

2013-04-13 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 12:41:59AM +0100, Markos Chandras wrote: On 13 April 2013 22:30, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 11:27:24PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 14:43:14 -0500 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: this eclass

Re: [gentoo-dev] rfc: oldnet scripts splitting out from OpenRC

2013-04-24 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 02:16:51PM -0400, Rich Freeman wrote: On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 1:54 PM, William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: if we keep a dependency for a while, even behind something like IUSE=+oldnet, when we drop it, people will still be hit if they do emerge --depclean before

Re: [gentoo-dev] rfc: oldnet scripts splitting out from OpenRC

2013-04-24 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 07:32:44PM -0400, Rick Zero_Chaos Farina wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 04/24/2013 07:17 PM, William Hubbs wrote: On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 06:34:46PM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 02:16:51PM -0400, Rich Freeman wrote

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-01 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 03:13:54PM +0200, Pacho Ramos wrote: El mié, 01-05-2013 a las 13:00 +0200, Fabio Erculiani escribió: [...] The only remaining problem is about eselect-sysvinit, for this reason, I am probably going to create a new separate pkg called _sysvinit-next_, that

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-01 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 11:14:28PM +0200, Fabio Erculiani wrote: On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Paweł Hajdan, Jr. phajdan...@gentoo.org wrote: On 5/1/13 3:04 AM, Fabio Erculiani wrote: As far as I read the bug, Mike (vapier) is doing the right thing. Distros doing lots of custom changes

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-02 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, May 02, 2013 at 04:26:06PM +1200, Kent Fredric wrote: - its a consistent approach that is bootloader agnostic - it doesn't require you to understand your bootloaders scripting system to add it to the init= line - its no brains required, and hard to mess up Why should we do something

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-02 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, May 02, 2013 at 03:39:25PM -0400, Mike Gilbert wrote: On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 3:01 PM, Fabio Erculiani lx...@gentoo.org wrote: On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 8:13 PM, Mike Gilbert flop...@gentoo.org wrote: If you manually write your own configuration for GRUB2, it is no more convoluted

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-02 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, May 03, 2013 at 08:27:36AM +1200, Kent Fredric wrote: On 3 May 2013 07:01, Fabio Erculiani lx...@gentoo.org wrote: If it's that simple, why on earth do we have all the eselect modules we have!? Hm, upon reading that list and seeing what they do, it raises another argument

Re: [gentoo-dev] USE_EXPAND is not an IUSE replacement [was: New USE_EXPAND: CLAWS_MAIL_PLUGINS]

2013-05-04 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, May 03, 2013 at 11:03:41PM -0400, Rick Zero_Chaos Farina wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 05/03/2013 05:28 PM, Mike Gilbert wrote: On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 5:08 PM, René Neumann li...@necoro.eu wrote: Am 03.05.2013 22:20, schrieb Zac Medico: Is it worth

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-08 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 08, 2013 at 11:49:18PM +0800, Ben de Groot wrote: On 8 May 2013 23:39, Fabio Erculiani lx...@gentoo.org wrote: On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 5:26 PM, Ben de Groot yng...@gentoo.org wrote: On 1 May 2013 18:04, Fabio Erculiani lx...@gentoo.org wrote: It looks like there is some consensus

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-08 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, May 09, 2013 at 12:21:53AM +0800, Ben de Groot wrote: On 8 May 2013 23:49, Fabio Erculiani lx...@gentoo.org wrote: On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 5:39 PM, Chí-Thanh Christopher Nguyễn chith...@gentoo.org wrote: Ben de Groot schrieb: On 1 May 2013 18:04, Fabio Erculiani lx...@gentoo.org

[gentoo-dev] OpenRC supporting systemd units

2013-05-08 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 08, 2013 at 07:07:17PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: It is quite likely that OpenRC will start supporting unit files soon. Then in many cases we will be able to strip down this to just one init format which would satisfy both init systems. Do you want to fill me in? ;-) I haven't seen

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: devmanual moved to github

2013-05-14 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, May 12, 2013 at 12:08:21PM -0400, Rich Freeman wrote: On Sun, May 12, 2013 at 11:54 AM, Markos Chandras hwoar...@gentoo.org wrote: This is the kind of policies that kill user contributions. I am very sad to witness this once again. I have mixed feelings for this very reason.

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: devmanual moved to github

2013-05-14 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 12:21:06AM +0200, Peter Stuge wrote: Alexander Berntsen wrote: [GitHub] enforces some particular workflow You keep saying this. What do you mean? I'll clarify! A lot of projects (including Linux) just use GitHub for hosting and nothing else. I don't see

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-15 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 10:16:01PM +0800, Ben de Groot wrote: We don't control upstreams, but we still have choices. At this point I only see Gnome and udev upstreams who are forcing their users to use systemd. (There may be other projects too that I'm not aware of.) Udev doesn't force

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-15 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 10:56:21PM +0200, Alexander Berntsen wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 15/05/13 17:10, Luca Barbato wrote: Those that can't use systemd: - those not using a recent linux kernel And let's not forget those who aren't using Linux at all. I'm

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-15 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 02:18:13PM -0400, waltd...@waltdnes.org wrote: On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 03:41:31PM +0200, Fabio Erculiani wrote Are we realizing that in order to keep systemd out of our way, we're currently writing and maintaining drop-in replacements for the features that systemd is

Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-16 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 04:08:17PM +0200, Pacho Ramos wrote: El mié, 15-05-2013 a las 15:41 +0200, Fabio Erculiani escribió: Are we realizing that in order to keep systemd out of our way, we're currently writing and maintaining drop-in replacements for the features that systemd is already

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-17 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 01:58:41AM +0100, Steven J. Long wrote: William Hubbs wrote: waltdnes wrote: Question... when Sun made OpenOffice depend on Java (also a Sun product) did Gentoo developers run around suggesting that Java be made a part of the core Gentoo base system? I

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Making systemd more accessible to normal users

2013-05-18 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, May 18, 2013 at 01:02:12PM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 10:45:18PM -0500, William Hubbs wrote No one is arguing against that. All this thread is about is making systemd a first-class citizen, like OpenRC/Sysvinit, so it will be as smooth as possible

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-05-26 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 11:55:24AM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote: Openrc is small, but the wrapper really needs to know which is which and worst case switch inittab. Please explain why this wrapper would need to switch inittab. Inittab is only used by sysvinit and has no uses in any other init

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-05-26 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 11:41:06AM -0500, William Hubbs wrote: On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 11:55:24AM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote: Openrc is small, but the wrapper really needs to know which is which and worst case switch inittab. Please explain why this wrapper would need to switch inittab

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-05-26 Thread William Hubbs
On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 06:55:45PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: On Sun, 26 May 2013 11:48:30 -0500 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 11:41:06AM -0500, William Hubbs wrote: On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 11:55:24AM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote: Openrc is small

Re: [gentoo-dev] New USE_EXPAND flag for www-servers/monkeyd

2013-05-28 Thread William Hubbs
On Tue, May 28, 2013 at 09:07:37PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: For the others, how large is the benefit of having them switchable? At least some of them look like something that wouldn't hurt people if it was always-built. The dev manual states that use flags are to control optional

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Switchup-mode and boottime selector? Was: eselect init

2013-05-29 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 09:56:00PM +0200, Tom Wijsman wrote: There are a couple of other possible approaches... 1) If the 2 systems can achieve peacefull co-existance (i.e. no identically-named files with different contents) then simply have 2 boot entries in /etc/lilo.conf (or grub

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Switchup-mode and boottime selector? Was: eselect init

2013-05-29 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 02:06:42AM +0200, Tom Wijsman wrote: On Wed, 29 May 2013 15:55:23 -0500 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: We want to make this easier towards the user, therefore doing heavy discussion to exhaust all the alternatives and maybe someone's interested

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Switchup-mode and boottime selector? Was: eselect init

2013-05-30 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 08:35:22AM +0200, Tom Wijsman wrote: Remember that eselect init is optional and an opt-in by emerging it, this is in no way suggested anywhere to become a default on all systems. Ok, that's cool then, I just would hate to see it become a default. William

[gentoo-dev] inittab was: Re: Switchup-mode and boottime selector? Was: eselect init

2013-05-30 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 08:30:00AM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote: Because it isn't just editing a file or rebuilding the kernel but also have a short trip in single mode to switch back and forth inittab. inittab is only used by sysvinit and busybox init right? If so, it is unfortunate that busybox

Re: [gentoo-dev] New USE_EXPAND flag for www-servers/monkeyd

2013-06-01 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 01:23:59PM +0200, Ralph Sennhauser wrote: On Tue, 28 May 2013 17:15:40 -0500 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org wrote: On Tue, May 28, 2013 at 09:07:37PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: For the others, how large is the benefit of having them switchable? At least some

Re: [gentoo-dev] New USE_EXPAND flag for www-servers/monkeyd

2013-06-01 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Jun 01, 2013 at 08:00:22PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: If a switch only changes the default in a config file, a flag is useless. Ok, maybe so in this case. If a switch toggles a feature that does not introduce additional dependencies, is small and can be toggled from within the app,

Re: [gentoo-dev] New USE_EXPAND flag for www-servers/monkeyd

2013-06-01 Thread William Hubbs
On Sat, Jun 01, 2013 at 10:26:54PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: Dnia 2013-06-01, o godz. 15:20:32 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org napisał(a): On Sat, Jun 01, 2013 at 08:00:22PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: If a switch toggles a feature that does not introduce additional dependencies

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Re: eselect init

2013-06-04 Thread William Hubbs
Hi Luca, On Mon, Jun 03, 2013 at 12:35:29AM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote: Again you should read the whole thread, please do, the whole eselect init stuff should stay opt-in for the time being so all this discussion is close to pointless. Can we please make this remain opt-in always? I too would

Re: [gentoo-dev] Temporary DevRel actions for CoC violations

2013-06-19 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 03:43:41PM -0400, Alexandre Rostovtsev wrote: Gentoo developers have been resigning from the project because they got burned out by dealing with ad-hominems, insults, and flames. I do not see CoC enforcement as some sort of plot to enforce groupthink or silence debate,

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: eselect init

2013-06-20 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 06:10:27PM +0100, Steven J. Long wrote: Fabio Erculiani wrote: - only init is currently handled by eselect-init, which is now using a very small wrapper POSIX shell script to redirect the calls to the currently running init How does say, switching inittab format,

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-06-20 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 12:16:36PM +0200, Fabio Erculiani wrote: There is a new version of eselect-init in the systemd-love overlay to play with. The new version saw the following major changes: - the /sbin/init (aka the symlink that eselect-init handles) can be changed to whatever one

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-06-20 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 04:39:59AM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: Dnia 2013-06-20, o godz. 15:56:09 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org napisał(a): On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 12:16:36PM +0200, Fabio Erculiani wrote: There is a new version of eselect-init in the systemd-love overlay to play

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-06-21 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 01:50:02PM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote: On 06/21/2013 01:26 PM, Pacho Ramos wrote: Thanks for the explanation. But I think that, currently, the only remaining objection is whether play with /sbin/init (that needs sysvinit to be changed if I don't misremember) or with

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-06-21 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 12:23:28PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: If eselect-init installs the wrapper as /sbin/einit, we don't have to touch /sbin/init at all, then, the only thing someone would have to do is to add an entry to their boot loader with init=/sbin/einit on the kcl to use it.

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-06-21 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 05:23:51PM +0200, Fabio Erculiani wrote: I think that sysvinit's /sbin/init should be renamed to /sbin/sysvinit (or /bin/sysvinit?), anyway... Feel free to file a request with sysvinit upstream to see if they will do this; I don't think we should be randomly renaming

Re: [gentoo-dev] eselect init

2013-06-21 Thread William Hubbs
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 05:13:33PM +0100, Markos Chandras wrote: On 21 June 2013 16:29, Michał Górny mgo...@gentoo.org wrote: Dnia 2013-06-21, o godz. 10:16:10 William Hubbs willi...@gentoo.org napisał(a): On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 12:23:28PM +0200, Michał Górny wrote: If eselect-init

Re: [gentoo-dev] Gentoo Hangouts

2013-06-24 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 09:14:44AM +0100, Diego Elio Pettenò wrote: A VC is a full commitment, and its attractiveness is often much higher _before_ you use it.. Agreed. I have found that if I am on a voice chat with someone, say on skype, it requires my full attention, especially since I use

Re: [gentoo-dev] Dropping static libs support from cryptsetup and lvm2

2013-07-29 Thread William Hubbs
On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 11:32:12PM +0200, Pacho Ramos wrote: How the /usr in other partition ended finally then? I though that, since there are a lot of things in / that rely in others in /usr, people were supposed to either use initramfs or busybox to get /usr mounted Unfortunately it hasn't

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Dropping static libs support from cryptsetup and lvm2

2013-07-31 Thread William Hubbs
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 07:42:26PM +, Robin H. Johnson wrote: As both a member of base-system, and the lvm2 maintainer, I'm going to go and look at fixing them, because I'd prefer to keep them available as static builds. Robin, I'm curious what the use case for keeping them as static

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Dropping static libs support from cryptsetup and lvm2

2013-07-31 Thread William Hubbs
On Thu, Aug 01, 2013 at 04:22:29AM +0200, Luca Barbato wrote: On 01/08/13 04:03, William Hubbs wrote: On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 07:42:26PM +, Robin H. Johnson wrote: As both a member of base-system, and the lvm2 maintainer, I'm going to go and look at fixing them, because I'd prefer

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