Re: [gentoo-portage-dev] New emerge --mindeps option for exclusion of build time dependencies (bug #132355)
Zac Medico [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The attached patch for bug #132355 [1] adds a --mindeps option for emerge that effectively allows build time dependencies to be excluded from dependency calculations involving binary and installed packages. With this patch, it's possible to remove all build time dependencies from a system with the command `emerge --depclean --mindeps`. When --mindeps is used to install packages, it causes build time dependencies to be excluded for binary packages and packages that are already installed. Consider this a suggestion disguised as a question: why not make that the overall default instead of enabled with a command-line switch? It makes sense. Don't install the packages that aren't needed. Simple. -- I used to think romantic love was a neurosis shared by two, a supreme foolishness. I no longer thought that. There's nothing foolish in loving anyone. Thinking you'll be loved in return is what's foolish. -- Rita Mae Brown pgpBrWUoe71FW.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-portage-dev] New emerge --mindeps option for exclusion of build time dependencies (bug #132355)
On Tue, 2006-07-11 at 22:32 -0700, Zac Medico wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi everyone, The attached patch for bug #132355 [1] adds a --mindeps option for emerge that effectively allows build time dependencies to be excluded from dependency calculations involving binary and installed packages. With this patch, it's possible to remove all build time dependencies from a system with the command `emerge --depclean --mindeps`. When --mindeps is used to install packages, it causes build time dependencies to be excluded for binary packages and packages that are already installed. This patch will change the previous default behavior for `emerge --usepkg package list`, but if desired, the user will be able use --mindeps together with --usepkg. Are there any suggestions to improve on this idea or is it fine the way that it is? Please invert the logic so that rather than changing default behavior you add a new option choose the types of deps to include. I was in favor and thought we were going to do it after 2.1 and the 2006 release under the idea of the variable ACCEPT_DEPENDS export ACCEPT_DEPENDS=DEPEND RDEPEND PDEPEND emerge -K system Whatever we do in the end does not really matter as long as we don't change default expected behaviors. Zac [1] http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=132355 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEtIlf/ejvha5XGaMRAo26AKCovCALx/VDIft6e+0lh+FI7IQsoQCg8o6M UW+dnXPwMe/tIje1A4RYqRs= =9uIv -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Ned Ludd [EMAIL PROTECTED] Gentoo Linux -- gentoo-portage-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-portage-dev] New emerge --mindeps option for exclusion of build time dependencies (bug #132355)
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Ned Ludd wrote: Please invert the logic so that rather than changing default behavior you add a new option choose the types of deps to include. Can you explain how my proposed change in the default behavior of --usepkg is going to hurt things? The current default behavior is inconsistent because build time dependencies are considered for packages that are installed but not for binary packages that are about to be installed. By doing away with this one special case for binary packages, the dependency calculation will be consistent for installed vs. binary packages. I was in favor and thought we were going to do it after 2.1 and the 2006 release under the idea of the variable ACCEPT_DEPENDS export ACCEPT_DEPENDS=DEPEND RDEPEND PDEPEND emerge -K system While I admire the flexibility of your ACCEPT_DEPENDS proposal, I feel that it exposes far too much complexity to the user. Eventually, the functionality of emerge will be available as part of the portage api and people will probably be able to exploit it to do all kinds of crazy things like that. I just don't feel that it's appropriate to expose something like that through the emerge interface. Can you explain why we should expose that much complexity through the emerge interface? Whatever we do in the end does not really matter as long as we don't change default expected behaviors. Again, can you explain how my proposed change is going to hurt things? Zac -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEtRPH/ejvha5XGaMRAkICAKCutrtehYGHyHN+UQUDjTRvUWxDqwCff4Fv 6Z2UUrFPD4UP9aCD2QHi2XM= =tRS4 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- gentoo-portage-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-portage-dev] New emerge --mindeps option for exclusion of build time dependencies (bug #132355)
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Ned Ludd wrote: On Wed, 2006-07-12 at 08:22 -0700, Zac Medico wrote: Ned Ludd wrote: Please invert the logic so that rather than changing default behavior you add a new option choose the types of deps to include. Can you explain how my proposed change in the default behavior of --usepkg is going to hurt things? The current default behavior is inconsistent because build time dependencies are considered for packages that are installed but not for binary packages that are about to be installed. And nor should they be unless the user explicitly asks for it. There basically should be no valid reason to look at build deps as we are dealing with a binary pkg because the package is already built. Updates are most often performed from source, are they not? If the build deps are already merged then they'll be ready and waiting for the next source based update or rebuild. export ACCEPT_DEPENDS=DEPEND RDEPEND PDEPEND emerge -K system While I admire the flexibility of your ACCEPT_DEPENDS proposal, I feel that it exposes far too much complexity to the user. Really? To me it would seem very natural to the Gentoo user who is already familiar with ACCEPT_KEYWORDS. For the type of functionality that we're after, a simple boolean option should suffice. ACCEPT_DEPENDS exposes implementation details that go far beyond the required information. For example, RDEPEND and PDEPEND can actually be collapsed together, so DEPEND and RDEPEND are the only real choices that are currently available. To me it seems like the wrong fix for the problem at hand and changes portage's default behavior in an undesired way. Don't get me wrong I'm definitely in favor of finer grained control over all the dep handling in general, but don't think this option should become the default. I'd invert your logic like in Kumba's proposed patch did and run with that. What about this functionality as it applies to packages that are already installed? If we invert the logic in that case, build deps will no longer be considered by default when the user runs `emerge -uD world` or `emerge --depclean`. That's an even larger change in behavior and, like I said in my reply to Drake, I'm afraid that it would cause lots of complaints and/or bugs filed. My proposed change will provide consistency in all cases with a change in the default --usepkg behavior that I feel will be acceptable to the vast majority of portage users. Zac -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEtTz//ejvha5XGaMRAk+uAJ9PwwvS9tOupY8K8g661FHF92vinQCgw9t/ GUsyhoTbR0GDpzxOsVFTfgE= =D6MW -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- gentoo-portage-dev@gentoo.org mailing list