Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
On 06/12/2012 12:29 AM, Chris Stankevitz wrote: Michael, On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 7:22 PM, Michael Orlitzky mich...@orlitzky.com wrote: Portage doesn't know what you want to do, so it does the safe thing and lets you decide. Either, Somewhat tongue-in-cheek: I don't know either. I don't want udev, udisks, hwdb or even know what they are. Somebody else wants all that stuff on my system (gentoo profile or the gentoo handbook author) and I wish that person would have addressed emerge's concerns WRT use flags. I understand, but somewhere along the line, you installed something that needs udisks, and udisks needs udev with USE=hwdb set. If you went to install that thing now (whatever it was), you would be faced with a choice: enable USE=hwdb, or don't install the thing. Maybe USE=hwdb should be default for udev, who knows. Sometimes USE flags are basically essential like git with USE=perl and the devs will make them default. Other times, the flag may do something stupid but another package requires it anyway. In that case, you don't want the flag on by default, and so you're still stuck with a choice. If you *always* want it to just emerge the thing, enable the autounmask-write feature. I didn't know what RUBY was or why it was on my system or who wanted it or whether that person wanted ruby_targets_ruby19 or RUBY_TARGETS or whatever. Me waiting would require 1) that I knew RUBY was a temporary problem that would be fixed in the future [I assumed it was not... just like hwdb] and 2) that I not perform an emerge sync/world. When I `emerge -puDN world` and something looks like it's going to be a big pain in the ass, I just ignore it for a few days and `emerge -uN1' the rest of the packages a few at a time. Often it gets fixed (or obsoleted) before I have to deal with it.
Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 21:29:48 -0700, Chris Stankevitz wrote: Portage doesn't know what you want to do, so it does the safe thing and lets you decide. Either, I don't know either. I don't want udev, udisks, hwdb or even know what they are. Somebody else wants all that stuff on my system (gentoo profile or the gentoo handbook author) and I wish that person would have addressed emerge's concerns WRT use flags. They have, as far as is possible. udisks needs udev with hwdb, and the ebuild tells you that when you try to merge it. An ebuild can override default flag settings for itself, but not for other packages (that would lead to anarchy) so it tells you what changes are needed and offers to make them for you. When hwdb becomes more global in scope, it may make sense to add it to the desktop profiles as default, but for now it is optional. If you choose a distro that offers you maximum choice over how your system is built, you really shouldn't complain about being given choices... -- Neil Bothwick How is it one careless match can start a forest fire, but it takes a whole box to start a campfire? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
On Sun, 10 Jun 2012 19:57:42 -0700 Chris Stankevitz chrisstankev...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Background: I enable USE flags by adding them to /etc/portage/package.use. This file is filled with all sorts of personal preference customizations of my system. This file does not contain required system USE flags. A month ago emerge insisted that I enable a USE flag ruby_targets_ruby19 to a bunch of packages on my system. Feeling uncomfortable adding a system required USE flag to package.use (vs personal preference customization), I posted to this list and indeed learned that I was going about it all wrong! In that particular case, I should have added 'RUBY_TARGETS=ruby18 ruby19' to /etc/make.conf. Actually, the Gentoo team should add this to the profile... presumably they will eventually do this or have done so already. Question: Today emerge is asking me to add =sys-fs/udev-171-r6 hwdb to package.use to appease udisk. Just as before, this looks fishy to me and I would like to get your opinion about how to properly satisfy this seemingly system-required-use-flag. My gut instinct is that this USE flag requirement should be handled by the Gentoo team in the profile or in some other place that I never look at. It's not a question of system vs personal preference It's a question of treating USE flags as global or local in scope. The USE variable in make.conf applies globally, and the package.use file applies to individual packages. Portage itself couldn't care how you view the use of your flags, so you should organize them how you see fit. See here: $ euses -sf hwdb sys-fs/udev:hwdb - read vendor/device string database and add it to udev database The flag applies to only one package. Some USE flags do not have a sane default so there's no choice the devs can make on your behalf. Especially convenience features like this one - some folk want it, others do not. So the devs delegate the choice to you to apply in any way you see fit. What do you guys think? Should I append udev hwdb to package.use right after my long list of personal preference customizations? Thank you, Chris PS: A snippet from my /etc/portage/package.use: # Give a GUI to cmake dev-util/cmake qt4 # Enable nice mounts in gnome gnome-base/gvfs fuse # Enable plotting in octave sci-mathematics/octave gnuplot # Enable GNOME right-click to create targz app-arch/file-roller nautilus # Satisfy a dependency I do not understand needed by a package I never heard of =sys-fs/udev-171-r6 hwdb -- Alan McKinnnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
Alan McKinnon writes: On Sun, 10 Jun 2012 19:57:42 -0700 Chris Stankevitz chrisstankev...@gmail.com wrote: Today emerge is asking me to add =sys-fs/udev-171-r6 hwdb to package.use to appease udisk. Just as before, this looks fishy to me and I would like to get your opinion about how to properly satisfy this seemingly system-required-use-flag. My gut instinct is that this USE flag requirement should be handled by the Gentoo team in the profile or in some other place that I never look at. It's not a question of system vs personal preference It's a question of treating USE flags as global or local in scope. The USE variable in make.conf applies globally, and the package.use file applies to individual packages. Portage itself couldn't care how you view the use of your flags, so you should organize them how you see fit. See here: $ euses -sf hwdb sys-fs/udev:hwdb - read vendor/device string database and add it to udev database The flag applies to only one package. Some USE flags do not have a sane default so there's no choice the devs can make on your behalf. Especially convenience features like this one - some folk want it, others do not. So the devs delegate the choice to you to apply in any way you see fit. I think Chris' question is more about why he has to manually activate this USE flag, as it seems to be necessary anyway, in his case. Looking at my own setup, I have built udev with hwdb, but I do not know why. There is no hwdb in make.conf or package.use, emerge --info does not show it, but emerge --info sys-fs/udev does. I'm on version 182-r3. What do you guys think? Should I append udev hwdb to package.use right after my long list of personal preference customizations? Yes. Or use the --autounmask-write option for emerge (may need the new portage), this will add it automatically, with a comment. Wonko
Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
On Sun, 10 Jun 2012 19:57:42 -0700, Chris Stankevitz wrote about [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb: [snip] A month ago emerge insisted that I enable a USE flag ruby_targets_ruby19 to a bunch of packages on my system. That is not really coded as a USE flag. You should put that in /etc/make.conf, thus RUBY_TARGETS='ruby19' In fact, on the machine on which I am writing this, this option is coded as: RUBY_TARGETS='ruby18 ruby19' So forget all about /etc/portage/package.use for this. -- Regards, Dave [RLU #314465] == dwn...@ntlworld.com (David W Noon) == signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Alex Schuster wo...@wonkology.org wrote: I think Chris' question is more about why he has to manually activate this USE flag, as it seems to be necessary anyway, in his case. Alex, Yes this is correct. I see now I was far too wordy in the OP and thank you for your terse translation! Typically when I solve a gentoo system problem by adding modifying package.use, I am doing something wrong. (e.g. ruby_targets_ruby19). I gather that the udev/hwdb/udisk case is an exception. The correct way to solve this gentoo system problem is to echo sys-fs/udev hwdb /etc/portage/package.use Thank you, Chris
Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
On 06/11/2012 07:30 PM, Chris Stankevitz wrote: On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 1:26 AM, Alex Schuster wo...@wonkology.org wrote: I think Chris' question is more about why he has to manually activate this USE flag, as it seems to be necessary anyway, in his case. Alex, Yes this is correct. I see now I was far too wordy in the OP and thank you for your terse translation! Typically when I solve a gentoo system problem by adding modifying package.use, I am doing something wrong. (e.g. ruby_targets_ruby19). I gather that the udev/hwdb/udisk case is an exception. The correct way to solve this gentoo system problem is to echo sys-fs/udev hwdb /etc/portage/package.use Portage doesn't know what you want to do, so it does the safe thing and lets you decide. Either, a) You want USE=-hwdb, in which case emerging udisks is a mistake. b) You want to emerge udisks, in which case USE=-hwdb is a mistake. The autounmask feature allows you to make (b) the default if that's what you want. The ruby_targets_ruby19 thing is a good example of where you may not want that behavior by default. Something was screwed up, people noticed it, and the devs ultimately fixed it. The most-correct thing to do was nothing (i.e. wait).
Re: [gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
Michael, On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 7:22 PM, Michael Orlitzky mich...@orlitzky.com wrote: Portage doesn't know what you want to do, so it does the safe thing and lets you decide. Either, Somewhat tongue-in-cheek: I don't know either. I don't want udev, udisks, hwdb or even know what they are. Somebody else wants all that stuff on my system (gentoo profile or the gentoo handbook author) and I wish that person would have addressed emerge's concerns WRT use flags. The ruby_targets_ruby19 thing is a good example of where you may not want that behavior by default. Something was screwed up, people noticed it, and the devs ultimately fixed it. The most-correct thing to do was nothing (i.e. wait). I didn't know what RUBY was or why it was on my system or who wanted it or whether that person wanted ruby_targets_ruby19 or RUBY_TARGETS or whatever. Me waiting would require 1) that I knew RUBY was a temporary problem that would be fixed in the future [I assumed it was not... just like hwdb] and 2) that I not perform an emerge sync/world. Thank you! Chris
[gentoo-user] Adding a use flag: hwdb
Hello, Background: I enable USE flags by adding them to /etc/portage/package.use. This file is filled with all sorts of personal preference customizations of my system. This file does not contain required system USE flags. A month ago emerge insisted that I enable a USE flag ruby_targets_ruby19 to a bunch of packages on my system. Feeling uncomfortable adding a system required USE flag to package.use (vs personal preference customization), I posted to this list and indeed learned that I was going about it all wrong! In that particular case, I should have added 'RUBY_TARGETS=ruby18 ruby19' to /etc/make.conf. Actually, the Gentoo team should add this to the profile... presumably they will eventually do this or have done so already. Question: Today emerge is asking me to add =sys-fs/udev-171-r6 hwdb to package.use to appease udisk. Just as before, this looks fishy to me and I would like to get your opinion about how to properly satisfy this seemingly system-required-use-flag. My gut instinct is that this USE flag requirement should be handled by the Gentoo team in the profile or in some other place that I never look at. What do you guys think? Should I append udev hwdb to package.use right after my long list of personal preference customizations? Thank you, Chris PS: A snippet from my /etc/portage/package.use: # Give a GUI to cmake dev-util/cmake qt4 # Enable nice mounts in gnome gnome-base/gvfs fuse # Enable plotting in octave sci-mathematics/octave gnuplot # Enable GNOME right-click to create targz app-arch/file-roller nautilus # Satisfy a dependency I do not understand needed by a package I never heard of =sys-fs/udev-171-r6 hwdb
