[gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
On 2020-01-06, Dale wrote: > Finally got around to rebooting. It was a experience for sure. X > wouldn't come up, the plasma thingy doing its thing. Jeepers. No > wonder I hate rebooting. I try to remember to reboot all of my machines once a month or so when I've got some spare time (especially after significant updates). Otherwise, something will demand/cause a reboot in the middle of something urgent and then you know what happens... -- Grant Edwards grant.b.edwardsYow! for ARTIFICIAL at FLAVORING!! gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
On Sat, Jan 4, 2020 at 10:13 PM Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > On 2020-01-02 14:12, Rich Freeman wrote: > > > > Device Model: ST8000AS0003-2HH188 > > > > > > I recall reading about SMR but can't recall the details of what it is. > > > far as I know, this is just a basic 8TB drive. > > > > This is an SMR drive. You should DEFINITELY read up on what they are. > > How do you know? The identfying string doesn't appear in the kernel > source (I did a case-insensitive recursive grep). > https://www.seagate.com/www-content/product-content/hdd-fam/seagate-archive-hdd/en-us/docs/100827317b.pdf These drives provide the following key features: • 8TB capacity for efficient storage-per-slot. • Affordable efficiencies with 2TB-per-disk Drive Managed SMR-based hard drive technology. ... -- Rich
[gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
On 2020-01-02 14:12, Rich Freeman wrote: > > Device Model: ST8000AS0003-2HH188 > > > > I recall reading about SMR but can't recall the details of what it is. > > far as I know, this is just a basic 8TB drive. > > This is an SMR drive. You should DEFINITELY read up on what they are. How do you know? The identfying string doesn't appear in the kernel source (I did a case-insensitive recursive grep). -- Please don't Cc: me privately on mailing lists and Usenet, if you also post the followup to the list or newsgroup. To reply privately _only_ on Usenet and on broken lists which rewrite From, fetch the TXT record for no-use.mooo.com.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
On Friday, 3 January 2020 01:37:49 GMT Dale wrote: > I'll try to reboot the new kernel in a bit. It's building at the > moment. Thanks for posting about this. I did not see it in other > replies. I thought it might be in Rich's but didn't see it. The extra > nudge was helpful. > > Dale > > :-) :-) I had mentioned about this kernel module in a previous post of mine. It may make some difference, or it may not. It depends on the drive and its specific data management mechanism: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shingled_magnetic_recording#Data_management -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
Mick wrote: > On Thursday, 2 January 2020 18:48:03 GMT Dale wrote: >> Ian Zimmerman wrote: >>> On 2020-01-01 18:09, Dale wrote: As some may recall, I have a 8TB external SATA hard drive that I do back ups on. Usually, I back up once a day, more often if needed. Usually I turn the power on, mount it, do the back ups, unmount and turn the power back off. Usually it is powered up for 5 minutes or so. When I unmount it tho, I sometimes notice it is still doing something. I can feel the mechanism for the heads moving. It has a slight vibration to it. Questions are, what is it doing and should I let it finish before powering it off? I'd assume that once it in unmounted, the copy process is done so the files are safe. I guess it is doing some sort of internal checks or something but I'm not sure. >>> I have observed the same thing. But in my case, I also disconnect the >>> _cable_ from the computer to the enclosure when I am done ... and still >>> the drive activity goes on. From that I conclude that it is the drive >>> circuitry itself doing some kind of internal housekeeping, and there is >>> no point in worrying about it because one would wait forever for it to >>> end. >> That's one thing that makes it unnervey. I'll put my hand around to the >> back and feel those little bumps. I wait until I think it is done but >> just as I'm about to power it off, it bumps again. It's so >> unpredictable, I never know if it is done doing its thing or not. Just >> like now, it's unmounted, did that during last reply, it hasn't did the >> bump thingy while reading your reply or me typing mine in so far. Now >> as soon as I reach around to turn it off, it'll likely do the bump thing >> again. lol > I suspect it is now reading your mind! Is this a case of AI?! > > LOL! > > >> One thing is for sure tho, if you unplug the cable, whatever it is >> doing, it's internal. Sort of hard for the puter to be doing something >> when it isn't connected. That narrows the options down a lot. That's a >> good piece of info there. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Dale >> >> :-) :-) > In case you missed it in a previous post - have you compiled CONFIG_DM_ZONED > in your kernel to see if its performance changes? > > https://zonedstorage.io/linux/config/ > > It's behaviour may not change whatsoever, if the drive only has an internal > (SMR firmware) data write mechanism. However, if the drive is exposing an > I/O > API to the OS, then you could well see a difference to how its data storage > bumps, spins and shakes as it flushes its journal and goes about its garbage > collection process when the Linux kernel 'talks' to it. > It seems that is not enabled in my kernel. Symbol: DM_ZONED [=n] It took some effort to find and enable everything to get that but I finally found them all. It seems three things has to be enabled in order for that option to be visible. Then after that, make wouldn't work. I checked the gcc settings, emerged libtool and checked on everything else with no improvement. Then I copied the .config file to a safe spot and did a make clean. When I copied the file back and ran make again, it worked. No clue on what was up with that. You know my luck tho. ;-) I'll try to reboot the new kernel in a bit. It's building at the moment. Thanks for posting about this. I did not see it in other replies. I thought it might be in Rich's but didn't see it. The extra nudge was helpful. Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
On Thursday, 2 January 2020 18:48:03 GMT Dale wrote: > Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > On 2020-01-01 18:09, Dale wrote: > >> As some may recall, I have a 8TB external SATA hard drive that I do > >> back ups on. Usually, I back up once a day, more often if > >> needed. Usually I turn the power on, mount it, do the back ups, > >> unmount and turn the power back off. Usually it is powered up for 5 > >> minutes or so. When I unmount it tho, I sometimes notice it is still > >> doing something. I can feel the mechanism for the heads moving. It has > >> a slight vibration to it. Questions are, what is it doing and should > >> I let it finish before powering it off? I'd assume that once it in > >> unmounted, the copy process is done so the files are safe. I guess it > >> is doing some sort of internal checks or something but I'm not sure. > > > > I have observed the same thing. But in my case, I also disconnect the > > _cable_ from the computer to the enclosure when I am done ... and still > > the drive activity goes on. From that I conclude that it is the drive > > circuitry itself doing some kind of internal housekeeping, and there is > > no point in worrying about it because one would wait forever for it to > > end. > > That's one thing that makes it unnervey. I'll put my hand around to the > back and feel those little bumps. I wait until I think it is done but > just as I'm about to power it off, it bumps again. It's so > unpredictable, I never know if it is done doing its thing or not. Just > like now, it's unmounted, did that during last reply, it hasn't did the > bump thingy while reading your reply or me typing mine in so far. Now > as soon as I reach around to turn it off, it'll likely do the bump thing > again. lol I suspect it is now reading your mind! Is this a case of AI?! LOL! > One thing is for sure tho, if you unplug the cable, whatever it is > doing, it's internal. Sort of hard for the puter to be doing something > when it isn't connected. That narrows the options down a lot. That's a > good piece of info there. > > Thanks. > > Dale > > :-) :-) In case you missed it in a previous post - have you compiled CONFIG_DM_ZONED in your kernel to see if its performance changes? https://zonedstorage.io/linux/config/ It's behaviour may not change whatsoever, if the drive only has an internal (SMR firmware) data write mechanism. However, if the drive is exposing an I/O API to the OS, then you could well see a difference to how its data storage bumps, spins and shakes as it flushes its journal and goes about its garbage collection process when the Linux kernel 'talks' to it. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
Ian Zimmerman wrote: > On 2020-01-01 18:09, Dale wrote: > >> As some may recall, I have a 8TB external SATA hard drive that I do >> back ups on. Usually, I back up once a day, more often if >> needed. Usually I turn the power on, mount it, do the back ups, >> unmount and turn the power back off. Usually it is powered up for 5 >> minutes or so. When I unmount it tho, I sometimes notice it is still >> doing something. I can feel the mechanism for the heads moving. It has >> a slight vibration to it. Questions are, what is it doing and should >> I let it finish before powering it off? I'd assume that once it in >> unmounted, the copy process is done so the files are safe. I guess it >> is doing some sort of internal checks or something but I'm not sure. > I have observed the same thing. But in my case, I also disconnect the > _cable_ from the computer to the enclosure when I am done ... and still > the drive activity goes on. From that I conclude that it is the drive > circuitry itself doing some kind of internal housekeeping, and there is > no point in worrying about it because one would wait forever for it to > end. > That's one thing that makes it unnervey. I'll put my hand around to the back and feel those little bumps. I wait until I think it is done but just as I'm about to power it off, it bumps again. It's so unpredictable, I never know if it is done doing its thing or not. Just like now, it's unmounted, did that during last reply, it hasn't did the bump thingy while reading your reply or me typing mine in so far. Now as soon as I reach around to turn it off, it'll likely do the bump thing again. lol One thing is for sure tho, if you unplug the cable, whatever it is doing, it's internal. Sort of hard for the puter to be doing something when it isn't connected. That narrows the options down a lot. That's a good piece of info there. Thanks. Dale :-) :-)
[gentoo-user] Re: External hard drive and idle activity
On 2020-01-01 18:09, Dale wrote: > As some may recall, I have a 8TB external SATA hard drive that I do > back ups on. Usually, I back up once a day, more often if > needed. Usually I turn the power on, mount it, do the back ups, > unmount and turn the power back off. Usually it is powered up for 5 > minutes or so. When I unmount it tho, I sometimes notice it is still > doing something. I can feel the mechanism for the heads moving. It has > a slight vibration to it. Questions are, what is it doing and should > I let it finish before powering it off? I'd assume that once it in > unmounted, the copy process is done so the files are safe. I guess it > is doing some sort of internal checks or something but I'm not sure. I have observed the same thing. But in my case, I also disconnect the _cable_ from the computer to the enclosure when I am done ... and still the drive activity goes on. From that I conclude that it is the drive circuitry itself doing some kind of internal housekeeping, and there is no point in worrying about it because one would wait forever for it to end. -- Please don't Cc: me privately on mailing lists and Usenet, if you also post the followup to the list or newsgroup. To reply privately _only_ on Usenet and on broken lists which rewrite From, fetch the TXT record for no-use.mooo.com.
