Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread 'Oliver Morton' via geoengineering
I am not condoning Andrew's action, but I am not convinced by Doug's argument that its results are necessarily harmful (though Doug says "non-zero", I think it is clear that he expects a negative result). If this leads to a fuller, open discussion of what sort of experiments are and aren't

[geo] World in the making: On the global visual politics of climate engineering

2023-03-03 Thread Geoengineering News
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/review-of-international-studies/article/world-in-the-making-on-the-global-visual-politics-of-climate-engineering/276476FAE0FA1C5993251C36216A01D2 *Authors* Ann-Kathrin Benner

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread Andrew Lockley
I'm inclined to take what Oliver says as gospel. Instead of denouncing me for summoning SATAN, perhaps I can invite the congregation of the list to consider an alternative? It may be possible for some of the high priests of geoengineering to convene an inquisition, for vetting proposed

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread 'Jessica Gurevitch' via geoengineering
Weighing in here on this very interesting issue. I agree with Oliver Morton that there is real value here, but I see the value as cautionary. In reality, Andrew Lockley's experiment is not going to change the climate, but it is a rogue implementation of a climate intervention. This makes an

RE: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread Stephen Salter
Hi All I ask as an ignorant non-legal person, please could one of the many expert ethicists and political decision makers help me understand the difference between the release of very small quantities of medicinally benign material aimed at helping all species intended to advance knowledge

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread Andrew Lockley
Jessica I've taken on board your point that the SATAN branding (while perhaps usefully provocational in the UK) is more literally believed elsewhere - and therefore probably isn't appropriately cross cultural. I remember a similar problem with mitigation being described as a "Manhatten project",

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread David desJardins
On Thu, Mar 2, 2023 at 12:18 AM Daniele Visioni wrote: > I personally don’t want to be associated even remotely with anything you > do now or in the future, so this will be my last message on this group > before I unsubscribe. > I don't want to be associated with Andrew Lockley either, but he's

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread 'donn viviani' via geoengineering
There is an EPA authority, the Toxic Substances Control Act, TSCA, that can require risk information be developed and submitted to EPA for review prior to releasing chemicals into the environment, at scale, for a new use: TSCA Section 5(a) Significant New Use Rules (SNURs) can be used to

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread David Hawkins
To clarify, my intent is not to pass judgement on Andrew's experiment (and I have already posted my criticism of Make Sunset's actions, especially their claims and efforts to sell "cooling credits"). My point is a pragmatic one: continued experiments without some form of advance review (and I do

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread Clare James
The EPA is a domestic agency for the USA - a good example of why international governance may ?should? be sought for geoengineering (if academics can stop slapping each other with gloves and drawing up meaningless letters asking to ban research). Until then, forum shopping will continue. On Fri,

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread Ron Baiman
Hi David et al., Not particularly anxious to wade into another debate over these issues but I think it's important to set (at least my understanding of) the record straight. In its latest Nevada launches Make Sunsets gave advanced notice and received permission

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread Ron Baiman
* did not cause harm* On Fri, Mar 3, 2023 at 2:27 PM Ron Baiman wrote: > Hi David et al., > > Not particularly anxious to wade into another debate over these issues but > I think it's important to set (at least my understanding of) the record > straight. > > In its latest Nevada launches Make

[geo] Comment on “An approach to sulfate geoengineering with surface emissions of carbonyl sulfide” by Quaglia et al. (2022) (Preprint)

2023-03-03 Thread Geoengineering News
https://egusphere.copernicus.org/preprints/2023/egusphere-2023-268/ *Authors* Marc von Hobe , Christoph Brühl, Sinikka T. Lennartz, Mary E. Whelan, and Aleya Kaushik How to cite. von Hobe, M., Brühl, C., Lennartz, S. T., Whelan, M. E., and Kaushik, A.: Comment on “An approach to sulfate

Re: [geo] SATAN

2023-03-03 Thread 'Hawkins, David' via geoengineering
Of course it is perverse that our societies have failed to act against releases of GHGs but that is not a persuasive argument for those who believe there should be some form of advance review of outdoor SRM experiments. Like it or not, the need for social license for such experiments appears