Re: Toolbox layout and Help menu
On Fri, 11 Feb 2000 14:05:42 -0500 (EST), Glyph Lefkowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: It seems like this is really the only reasonable option -- I think that there should be a 'menu' spot in the tools, like the top-left menu in the image windows, since the toolbar is frequently too thin for the menus anyway (vertical layout, try using a large font in your gtk theme sometime...) and if it's not (horizontal layout), then the menubar is taking up far too much screen real estate for no reason. It would not be hard to add a "button" that pops up the menus. People would probably go "Where the hell is the menu?" if we did that, though. Kelly
Re: Toolbox layout and Help menu
On Fri, 11 Feb 2000, Sven Neumann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Your list looked interesting. But, you seem to ignore the menu problem. IMHO 2 columns is the absolute minimum since even then get problems with the Help menu. If we'd allow less than 2 columns, not even Xtns will be accesible any longer. Hey, don't prevent me from using one of my favourite layouts! :-) Really, having all icons on a single column is quite useful sometimes. As I mentioned in my previous message, this fits perfectly on a Sun screen (1152x900) because the height of the single-column toolbox is 880 pixels + the WM title. And since it is so thin, I can configure my WM to make the Gimp toolbox appear on all workspaces. I like this when I work with large images and I put one very large window in each workspace. I did not ignore the menu problem. If the "Help" bug is fixed (it is a one-line change in app/menu.c to make it last-from-left), then only the "File" menu is visible. But when I work with very large images, I do not need the "Xtns" menu at all, so I can live without it until I finish working on full-screen images and go back to a more traditional layout for the Gimp toolbox. That being said, I also like the columns-spinbutton idea, as long as the minimum is 1 column. I agree with the other parts of your message, and with your suggestion to move the Measure tool in the View menu or Info window. -Raphael
Re: Toolbox layout and Help menu
Hi, I did not ignore the menu problem. If the "Help" bug is fixed (it is a one-line change in app/menu.c to make it last-from-left), then only the "File" menu is visible. But when I work with very large images, I do not need the "Xtns" menu at all, so I can live without it until I finish working on full-screen images and go back to a more traditional layout for the Gimp toolbox. That being said, I also like the columns-spinbutton idea, as long as the minimum is 1 column. I agree with the other parts of your message, and with your suggestion to move the Measure tool in the View menu or Info window. Loosing access to a menu may be acceptable to you, but I think it is in no way acceptable for a program that wants to reach a larger audience. I see the bugreports coming in daily. Additionally I don't know how the color-selector should fit into a one-column layout. In other word: unacceptable for the masses, but you may always change the 2 to a 1 in the spinbutton creator for your own personal pleasure. Alternatively we can of course merge all menus into one GIMP menu... Salut, Sven
Re: Toolbox layout and Help menu
On Fri, 11 Feb 2000, Sven Neumann wrote: Alternatively we can of course merge all menus into one GIMP menu... It seems like this is really the only reasonable option -- I think that there should be a 'menu' spot in the tools, like the top-left menu in the image windows, since the toolbar is frequently too thin for the menus anyway (vertical layout, try using a large font in your gtk theme sometime...) and if it's not (horizontal layout), then the menubar is taking up far too much screen real estate for no reason. I think that a menubar on that window looks dumb... since it is essentially a palette. --- Even if you can deceive people about a product through misleading statements, sooner or later the product will speak for itself. - Hajime Karatsu
Toolbox layout and Help menu
Hi, Marc wrote: So... I am not against this change, but I also see no reason to do it, especially since that makes gimp different to other apps, and I think there should be a very good reason for this. Since all GNOME apps have the help menu rightmost but not seperated from the other menus, we wouldn't be the only app that does it this way... On a related subject, I want to express that I'm not very content with the latest changes to the toolbox since it is now impossible to have a horizontal toolbox with the colorselectors at the right side. The default setup we shipped with until now was never intended to be a solution, since having 3 columns of icons with the selectors packed to the right wastes a lot of space. So this setup was more or less an accident. IMHO there are only two useful setups: One is to have the toolbox vertically layed out with the tools in 3 columns and the selectors below. Alteratively you could (can't anymore) lay it out horizontally with 2 rows of tools and the selectors placed to the right. I know the old setup was broken from the beginning, but the recent changes IMHO render the whole idea of having a configurable toolbar useless. I'd vote for the following solution: Completely get rid of the interactive resizing (since it obviously can't be fixed to work correctly) and offer two alternative layouts (as described above) which are switchable from the preferences dialog. The horizontal layout would have a Help menu and probably even a Dialogs menu, while the vertical layout would add these as entries to the File menu (or probably Xtns for the Help menu). I think it should be possible to switch the layout on the fly by providing the necessary containers and reparent the contents between them, but if it turns out to be undoable, I guess users could even live with the need to restart The GIMP for the change to take place. From my experience you don't change the layout too often once you've found your favorite. Salut, Sven
