Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 5:13 PM, maderios wrote: Earlier today: This error takes away Gimp-2.8 of the world of the professional_s_. And now: What you call safety belt/hard hat is useless for _me_... This is the main problem I have with your argumentation: talking for many people, while

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Ken Warner
1) What if saving a flattened image is exactly what I want to do. 2) It is not exactly true that further work is near impossible. On 8/14/2012 4:01 AM, Ofnuts wrote: With the previous behavior, if you save in a non-XCF file format, then all you save is a flattened image on which further work

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Burnie West
On 08/14/2012 08:07 AM, Ken Warner wrote: 1) What if saving a flattened image is exactly what I want to do. It's easy - just export it 2) It is not exactly true that further work is near impossible. But without the layers saved separately it's a lot more complex -- of course, depending on

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Richard Gitschlag
Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2012 21:45:48 +0200 From: ofn...@laposte.net To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior On 08/13/2012 09:09 PM, maderios wrote: On 08/13/2012 09:00 PM, Archie Arevalo wrote

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Ken Warner
1) Well then, if I open a jpg file and make layers and paths etc. and want to save my work, why is it anathema to export it as an XCF file? 2) Your assumption is that there are layers after the image is flattened seems odd. On 8/14/2012 9:39 AM, Burnie West wrote: On 08/14/2012 08:07 AM, Ken

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 9:59 PM, Ken Warner wrote: 1) Well then, if I open a jpg file and make layers and paths etc. and want to save my work, why is it anathema to export it as an XCF file? Gmail tells me there are 58 deleted messages in this conversation (yes). That is, after 58 messages you

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Ken Warner
...and it still seems as if you have a reading comprehension problem. I asked a simple question -- I think if you would take the time to try and understand the question, you wouldn't be so insulting to people who disagree with your design principles. On 8/14/2012 12:21 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread maderios
On 08/14/2012 09:21 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 9:59 PM, Ken Warner wrote: 1) Well then, if I open a jpg file and make layers and paths etc. and want to save my work, why is it anathema to export it as an XCF file? Gmail tells me there are 58 deleted messages in

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 11:40 PM, maderios wrote: Only a native file format and a lossy file format ? Hum (in french, sorry) Native for who ? 61 deleted messages later you finally started asking the right kind of questions :) As already explained on a frigging huge amount of occasions

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-14 Thread Archie Arevalo
On Tuesday 14 August 2012 21:40:24 maderios wrote: On 08/14/2012 09:21 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 9:59 PM, Ken Warner wrote: 1) Well then, if I open a jpg file and make layers and paths etc. and want to save my work, why is it anathema to export it as an XCF

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Jim Clark
, that's how Audacity does the same thing and he said, That's also how Photoshop does it. Please. Truce. Thanks- Jim Clark From: Ken Warner kwarner...@verizon.net To: Cc: gimp-user-list@gnome.org Date: 08/12/2012 12:01 PM Subject: Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread bruno
On Mon, 13 Aug 2012 08:55:05 -0500, Jim Clark wrote: Are you saying you would like to see the thousands/millions of contented users say so? Please don't encourage that! (Though I am one.) My mail box is already full to overflowing with this discussion that is clearly going nowhere. Remember

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread maderios
On 08/13/2012 03:55 PM, Jim Clark wrote: I have just downloaded a sound processing program called Audacity. Putzed around, hit save and was told This will save in Audacity's native format; for wave files use 'Export'. I was telling my son about the grief the developers were taking and,

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Mon, Aug 13, 2012 at 8:58 PM, maderios wrote: On 08/13/2012 03:55 PM, Jim Clark wrote: You confuse professional and amateur work. I'm Audacity user. It works well for amateurs, not for professionnal people. I hate to tell you, but Audacity is extensively used in the professional

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Archie Arevalo
On Monday 13 August 2012 18:58:24 maderios wrote: On 08/13/2012 03:55 PM, Jim Clark wrote: I have just downloaded a sound processing program called Audacity. Putzed around, hit save and was told This will save in Audacity's native format; for wave files use 'Export'. I was telling my son

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Archie Arevalo
On Monday 13 August 2012 21:05:23 Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: On Mon, Aug 13, 2012 at 8:58 PM, maderios wrote: On 08/13/2012 03:55 PM, Jim Clark wrote: You confuse professional and amateur work. I'm Audacity user. It works well for amateurs, not for professionnal people.

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread maderios
On 08/13/2012 07:43 PM, Archie Arevalo wrote: On Monday 13 August 2012 18:58:24 maderios wrote: On 08/13/2012 03:55 PM, Jim Clark wrote: I have just downloaded a sound processing program called Audacity. Putzed around, hit save and was told This will save in Audacity's native format;

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Mon, Aug 13, 2012 at 10:09 PM, maderios wrote: LibreOffice is another good example. If you open a .doc and Save, it will ask you if you want to save it in native Open Document format. Libreoffice doesnt ask you... Oh, but it does ask you whether you really want to save to .doc instead of

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Ken Warner
But, continuing to *argue* here is fruitless. This is most certainly and sadly true. On 8/13/2012 11:20 AM, Patrick Shanahan wrote: * maderiosmader...@gmail.com [08-13-12 14:09]: ... Libreoffice doesnt ask you, you choose or write what you want. When you want to save with Libreoffice, or

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Archie Arevalo
On Monday 13 August 2012 11:35:38 Ken Warner wrote: But, continuing to *argue* here is fruitless. This is most certainly and sadly true. How about looking at it this way... We see the reasons behind the change, we were able to adapt to it. Stating that GIMP that the changes are a

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread maderios
On 08/13/2012 09:00 PM, Archie Arevalo wrote: On Monday 13 August 2012 11:35:38 Ken Warner wrote: But, continuing to *argue* here is fruitless. This is most certainly and sadly true. How about looking at it this way... We see the reasons behind the change May you explain here the

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Ofnuts
On 08/13/2012 09:09 PM, maderios wrote: On 08/13/2012 09:00 PM, Archie Arevalo wrote: On Monday 13 August 2012 11:35:38 Ken Warner wrote: But, continuing to *argue* here is fruitless. This is most certainly and sadly true. How about looking at it this way... We see the reasons behind

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-13 Thread Archie Arevalo
On Monday 13 August 2012 21:09:33 maderios wrote: On 08/13/2012 09:00 PM, Archie Arevalo wrote: On Monday 13 August 2012 11:35:38 Ken Warner wrote: But, continuing to *argue* here is fruitless. This is most certainly and sadly true. How about looking at it this way...

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread maderios
On 08/11/2012 11:40 PM, Gfxuser wrote: On 11.08.12 at 23:19 maderios wrote: For me, export word is useless and confusing. Export to what? To jpeg, png, xcf, tiff ? It depends on the file where you start. You could start with a jpeg and want to export to .xcf, or the contrary Hi

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread maderios
On 08/12/2012 04:43 PM, Patrick Shanahan wrote: * maderiosmader...@gmail.com [08-12-12 10:06]: ... The problem is not to understand ! All I know, all I see, is that the change save and save as in Gimp-2.8 complicates my life too. I use working method with Gimp-2.6 that allows me to save

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread isabel brison
On 12 August 2012 08:37, kiwi_steve for...@gimpusers.com wrote: But I have to say, the amount of flak the developers are taking about this is totally unjustified. Then why are they getting it? I've always heard you shouldn't look a gift horse in the mouth. We're getting awesome software

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sun, Aug 12, 2012 at 8:03 AM, kiwi_steve wrote: And judging from the number of people (myself included) who are still annoyed about it and asking for it to be put back the way it was, the questions and concerns are NOT being answered - unless you call telling people to just get used to it

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sun, Aug 12, 2012 at 3:25 PM, Daniel Hauck wrote: The name Jesus is correctly pronounced [hey-soos']. Oh boy... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus#Etymology_of_name I think it's pretty clear what users and developers want and they aren't the same. There we go again. Let me reinstate

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sun, Aug 12, 2012 at 11:37 AM, kiwi_steve wrote: Gimp used to be a great photo editor, now its useful but cumbersome to use because even if you open a JPG you can't even change the size and just save-as a JPG - that is just utter nonsense. You absolutely can. It's just called differently,

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Andrew Clarke
but you will make us grumpier and less willing to work on the project Please don't get grumpy, because GIMP is GREAT and its moving forward. I am looking forward to higher bit processing... I wish at times we could close some threads as I am getting a little tied of deleting emails, forums

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sun, Aug 12, 2012 at 3:52 PM, Daniel Hauck wrote: Why, in the File-Save as... dialog do other graphical file formats appear in the file browsing? If this is to be a consistent behavior, why taunt the user (and his expectations) by showing them *.JPG and other files and then not allow them

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Ken Warner
Your implied assertion that people who remain silent support the new interface cannot be validated -- just like the arbitrary design choices that led to this discussion. On 8/12/2012 8:25 AM, isabel brison wrote: Let's think: how many people have written in about this? Fifty, a hundred?

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sun, Aug 12, 2012 at 8:30 PM, daniel wrote: Is there any reason you skipped over the part about the damage caused by deviations from the accepted standard for user interface behavior and how it affects not only the user work flow in GiMP but also in other programs a user may use at the

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sun, Aug 12, 2012 at 8:17 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: Why, in the File-Save as... dialog do other graphical file formats appear in the file browsing? If this is to be a consistent behavior, why taunt the user (and his expectations) by showing them *.JPG and other files and then not

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Maarten De Munck
Alexandre Prokoudine schreef op zo 12-08-2012 om 21:09 [+0400]: ...there are thousands more GIMP users who didn't find the issue was worth complaining about absolutely doesn't imply that. This is not black and white world where people either support or not support things. There's such a

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread jfrazierjr
So please, don't count my silence so far as indifference... Likewise... my silence is not indifference... I LOVE the new behavior. For what I do most, which is creating/editing images with multiple layer/mask support, the change is EXTREMELY welcome. First you have gotten rid of the

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Archie Arevalo
On Sunday 12 August 2012 21:02:07 Alexandre Prokoudine wrote: On Sun, Aug 12, 2012 at 8:30 PM, daniel wrote: Is there any reason you skipped over the part about the damage caused by deviations from the accepted standard for user interface behavior and how it affects not only the user work

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-12 Thread Archie Arevalo
On Sunday 12 August 2012 09:01:21 Ken Warner wrote: Your implied assertion that people who remain silent support the new interface cannot be validated -- just like the arbitrary design choices that led to this discussion. On 8/12/2012 8:25 AM, isabel brison wrote: Let's think: how many

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread Andreas Lemke
How about using the corresponding export commands or binding them to your preferred keys? It doesn't do xcf but this may be acceptable if you mostly export to an image format. Andreas Am 11.08.2012 20:15, schrieb maderios: Hi This message is addressed to developers. New Gimp-2.8 would be a

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 10:15 PM, maderios wrote: New Gimp-2.8 would be a good tool but it is unusable for me. Example: I use, hundreds of times per hour, the functions save and save as, indifferently on .png. xcf or .jpeg. Should I take that literally, that would mean you are pressing

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread Ken Warner
Clearly you can't be a professional as you say you are because GIMP 2.8 is targeted toward professionals. That according to people who have the responsibility of deciding who meant to use GIMP. :=) On 8/11/2012 11:15 AM, maderios wrote: Hi This message is addressed to developers. New

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread Alexandre Prokoudine
On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 10:19 PM, Ken Warner wrote: Clearly you can't be a professional as you say you are because GIMP 2.8 is targeted toward professionals. That according to people who have the responsibility of deciding who meant to use GIMP. :=) We don't expect every single professional

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread Andreas Lemke
Maybe you can tell us more about what you are doing. I might suspect that it is a repetitive task that could be automated with a script. Let us know if you need help on that. Andreas Am 11.08.2012 20:15, schrieb maderios: Hi This message is addressed to developers. New Gimp-2.8 would be a

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread maderios
On 08/11/2012 09:58 PM, Andreas Lemke wrote: Maybe you can tell us more about what you are doing. I might suspect that it is a repetitive task that could be automated with a script. Let us know if you need help on that. Andreas Hi No repetitive task (happily !). I create images. It's just

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread Michael Schumacher
On 11.08.2012 22:51, maderios wrote: Hi No repetitive task (happily !). I create images. It's just art... Ex, I need to edit and save many versions of the same image. I use different format, png, xcf, jpeg. That's why Gimp has become so complicated for me to use, compared to 2.6 But that

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread maderios
On 08/11/2012 10:59 PM, Michael Schumacher wrote: On 11.08.2012 22:51, maderios wrote: Hi No repetitive task (happily !). I create images. It's just art... Ex, I need to edit and save many versions of the same image. I use different format, png, xcf, jpeg. That's why Gimp has become so

Re: [Gimp-user] Gimp-2.8_Save and save as bad behavior

2012-08-11 Thread Gfxuser
On 11.08.12 at 23:19 maderios wrote: For me, export word is useless and confusing. Export to what? To jpeg, png, xcf, tiff ? It depends on the file where you start. You could start with a jpeg and want to export to .xcf, or the contrary Hi Maderios, the 'save and export' behaviour as