Re: Satellite Internet relative security
On 08/26/2017 09:46 PM, James A. Kuzdrall wrote:
> On Friday 25 August 2017 13:04:11 Brian St. Pierre wrote:
>> On Fri, Aug 25, 2017 at 11:56 AM, James A. Kuzdrall
>>
>> wrote:
>>> Does Linux have any special problems interfacing with the dish
>>> equipment?
>>> Is a standard Ethernet connection enough, or must they install software
>>> on the Linux computer?
>>
>> I had service through Hughes for a couple years around 2010 or so. They
>> give you a modem, connect a cable from dish to modem, connect ethernet
>> cable from computer to modem, and it's more or less like having dsl or
>> cable with horrible latency. You don't need to install anything on linux,
>> though you may get hassled by customer support if you have to call in.
>>
>> The latency is bad. You can end up with no service or degraded performance
>> in heavy rain, snow, and/or if there's any snow/ice buildup on the dish. I
>> think they still have a daily usage cap, but I'm not sure. It's probably
>> better than dialup if you don't care about the latency, but I'd consider it
>> a last resort. If there is still a usage cap, you might look at whether a
>> mobile data plan and tethering is a viable alternative.
>
> Latency would be a pain. Since the military controls combat drones via
> satellite, I assumed it would be fast. It could be that the commercial links
> go through more processing hubs, but how about the suggestion that it has a
> built-in latency?
Speed ("fast" or "slow") and latency ("quick" or "lagging") are two completely
different things
Satellite Internet (when it's working) is *both* high-speed *and* high-latency,
and there's no contradiction there.
The latency doesn't so much have anything do with `more processing hubs';
it's just that routing everything through a geostationary satellite means the
signals
ultimately need to travel roughly *100,000 miles* (round trip) before you can
see
a response from whatever website or other service you're using. Even at *light
speed*,
that's more than a half-second of delay.
Think about it this way: if you have a bunch of stuff to move from Nashua to
Manchester by car,
and you're going to drive it there at 60 MPH, it's going to take something like
20 minutes, each way,
per trip. You can move your stuff *faster* by using a bigger car/truck and
carrying more stuff
on each trip, but you can't do anything about the 20-minute *latency*. While
you can increase
the overall `items shipped per day' rate, no specific item can make the trip in
less
than 20 minutes--and if you need to convey items *back* to complete an
exchanges,
then no exchange can complete in less than 40 minutes because that's how much
latency
is `built into the system'.
And if for some reason you go from Nashua to Manchester and back *by way of
California*...,
again it doesn't matter how big a truck you have or how much it can carry at
once,
you're still going to have *days* of latency if you take such a long route.
That's the thing about latency: it's pretty much always, by definition, `built
in':
once you have latency, there's generally nothing you can do to work around it.
If you just have a slow (low-bandwidth) link, there are some things that
can be done to make more efficient use that limited bandwidth.
Having said all of that: some people find that high-speed + high-latency
links are unusable; other's probably find that they're perfectly fine.
You wouldn't want to be trying to remote control something *in real time*
over a satellite link, but there are things like sending e-mail or downloading
large files
(or queuing up actions on a mostly-autonomous UAV!) where even an full extra
second of *lag*
probably shouldn't make much of a difference
--
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Re: Satellite Internet relative security
Greetings all, Thank you for the information and insights. My few suspicions were confirmed and my knowledge broadened. The dish company representatives are purposely non-technical. Their answer was "When you sign up we will send a technician to your house who can answer those questions." I will continue, without too much inconvenience, with my dial-up and infrequent trips to the library. Jim Kuzdrall On Friday 25 August 2017 13:04:11 Brian St. Pierre wrote: > On Fri, Aug 25, 2017 at 11:56 AM, James A. Kuzdrall > > wrote: > > Does Linux have any special problems interfacing with the dish > > equipment? > > Is a standard Ethernet connection enough, or must they install software > > on the Linux computer? > > I had service through Hughes for a couple years around 2010 or so. They > give you a modem, connect a cable from dish to modem, connect ethernet > cable from computer to modem, and it's more or less like having dsl or > cable with horrible latency. You don't need to install anything on linux, > though you may get hassled by customer support if you have to call in. > > The latency is bad. You can end up with no service or degraded performance > in heavy rain, snow, and/or if there's any snow/ice buildup on the dish. I > think they still have a daily usage cap, but I'm not sure. It's probably > better than dialup if you don't care about the latency, but I'd consider it > a last resort. If there is still a usage cap, you might look at whether a > mobile data plan and tethering is a viable alternative. Latency would be a pain. Since the military controls combat drones via satellite, I assumed it would be fast. It could be that the commercial links go through more processing hubs, but how about the suggestion that it has a built-in latency? > > If you're concerned about surveillance I would be paranoid and just assume > that any/all of your physical layers either are compromised already or can > easily be compromised. Focus your efforts on transport/application layer > security instead. If a government actor wants to watch your activity, > they're going to just serve a surveillance order at your ISP and tap your > traffic off the router. Like almost all Americans, I have nothing to hide from Amazon, Google, China, or the US. But, it would be nice if they just asked instead of creeping around through our computers like they do. It can't be stopped now, I agree, but there is value in making it a bit more challenging for them. Think of the poor patriot who has to dig into our computer every time our email or search contains a key word. Booring. If some variation is necessary for access or secrets, it keeps the poor drudge awake, ready to spot real enemies of the people or sales targets. Jim Kuzdrall ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: Satellite Internet relative security
On Fri, Aug 25, 2017 at 11:56 AM, James A. Kuzdrall wrote: > Does Linux have any special problems interfacing with the dish > equipment? > Is a standard Ethernet connection enough, or must they install software on > the Linux computer? > I had service through Hughes for a couple years around 2010 or so. They give you a modem, connect a cable from dish to modem, connect ethernet cable from computer to modem, and it's more or less like having dsl or cable with horrible latency. You don't need to install anything on linux, though you may get hassled by customer support if you have to call in. The latency is bad. You can end up with no service or degraded performance in heavy rain, snow, and/or if there's any snow/ice buildup on the dish. I think they still have a daily usage cap, but I'm not sure. It's probably better than dialup if you don't care about the latency, but I'd consider it a last resort. If there is still a usage cap, you might look at whether a mobile data plan and tethering is a viable alternative. If you're concerned about surveillance I would be paranoid and just assume that any/all of your physical layers either are compromised already or can easily be compromised. Focus your efforts on transport/application layer security instead. If a government actor wants to watch your activity, they're going to just serve a surveillance order at your ISP and tap your traffic off the router. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
