Re: The Linux

[Ted Roche]

On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 4:04 PM, Rich Duke  wrote:
> What is the most delicious flavor of Linux I should be using?
>
They're all delish. Like French or Indian food, depends on your
palate. What is it you want to do: general purpose desktop, video
production, web server?

--
Ted Roche
Ted Roche & Associates, LLC
http://www.tedroche.com
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Re: The Linux

[Drew Van Zandt]

I find Ubuntu tasty for desktops, but not quite baked enough for servers.
 Debian is nice and meaty for that, and the two are quite similar.

Tastes vary, though.

*
Drew Van Zandt
Cam # US2010035593 (M:Liam Hopkins R: Bastian Rotgeld)
Domain Coordinator, MA-003-D.  Masquerade aVST
*


On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 4:15 PM, Ted Roche  wrote:

> On Thu, Mar 21, 2013 at 4:04 PM, Rich Duke  wrote:
> > What is the most delicious flavor of Linux I should be using?
> >
>
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Re: The Linux

[Jerry Feldman]

On 03/21/2013 04:37 PM, Drew Van Zandt wrote:
> I find Ubuntu tasty for desktops, but not quite baked enough for 
> servers.  Debian is nice and meaty for that, and the two are quite 
> similar.
>
> Tastes vary, though.
>
Linux mint looks ok on the desktop also, it is based on Ubuntu. I use 
Fedora on my home desktop and it works well. The Boston LInux servers 
are running CentOS (based on RHEL). The bottom line is what others are 
saying, tastes vary. There are certain areas on a server where I will 
opt for a Red Hat based solution because some of the components are 
maintained by Red Hat. Ubunbtu seems to be branching as a Windows 8 
alternative on traditional computing, as well as tablets, smartphones 
and hybrids.
Ubuntu is based on Debian but has more frequent release schedules. 
Repositories are Debian based, Deselect/apt.
Fedora and OpenSuSE are based on RPM/yum repositories.

So, the bottom line is that you should look at your personal 
requirements. I find that Ubuntu, Mint, Fedora, and OpenSuSE are very 
easy to install, and you can download live CDs. There are also a 
plethora of desktop options, such as Gnome (2 and 3), Unity (Ubuntu), 
Mint has the Cinnamon and Mate desktops, Fedora uses Gnome 3 by default, 
but in all you can select different desktops like KDE, or XFCE.  
Additionally, Fedora and Open SuSE can be installed from a live CD, but 
also from a DVD that contains just about everything.

-- 
Jerry Feldman 
Boston Linux and Unix
PGP key id:3BC1EB90
PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66  C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90

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Re: The Linux

[David & Tina Ohlemacher]

I would recommend:
- Install VMWare player (free) or Virtual Box (free/open).
- Try distros within virtual machines. You may install directly from an
iso, no disks to burn.
- Check out distrowatch.com

Personally: Linux Mint Debian Edition (LMDE w/ XFCE).   It is not Ubuntu
based as is regular Mint. It is a rolling distro, which I like.

-d
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Re: The Linux

[Jerry Feldman]

Confirmed, but you have to download it from OpenSuSE.

On 03/22/2013 12:48 PM, John Abreau wrote:
> I read somewhere that Unity is available on Fedora now.
>
>
>
> On Mar 22, 2013, at 9:09 AM, Jerry Feldman  wrote:
>
>> On 03/21/2013 04:37 PM, Drew Van Zandt wrote:
>>> I find Ubuntu tasty for desktops, but not quite baked enough for
>>> servers.  Debian is nice and meaty for that, and the two are quite
>>> similar.
>>>
>>> Tastes vary, though.
>>>
>> Linux mint looks ok on the desktop also, it is based on Ubuntu. I use
>> Fedora on my home desktop and it works well. The Boston LInux servers
>> are running CentOS (based on RHEL). The bottom line is what others are
>> saying, tastes vary. There are certain areas on a server where I will
>> opt for a Red Hat based solution because some of the components are
>> maintained by Red Hat. Ubunbtu seems to be branching as a Windows 8
>> alternative on traditional computing, as well as tablets, smartphones
>> and hybrids.
>> Ubuntu is based on Debian but has more frequent release schedules.
>> Repositories are Debian based, Deselect/apt.
>> Fedora and OpenSuSE are based on RPM/yum repositories.
>>
>> So, the bottom line is that you should look at your personal
>> requirements. I find that Ubuntu, Mint, Fedora, and OpenSuSE are very
>> easy to install, and you can download live CDs. There are also a
>> plethora of desktop options, such as Gnome (2 and 3), Unity (Ubuntu),
>> Mint has the Cinnamon and Mate desktops, Fedora uses Gnome 3 by default,
>> but in all you can select different desktops like KDE, or XFCE.
>> Additionally, Fedora and Open SuSE can be installed from a live CD, but
>> also from a DVD that contains just about everything.
>>
>> -- 
>> Jerry Feldman 
>> Boston Linux and Unix
>> PGP key id:3BC1EB90
>> PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66  C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90
>>
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-- 
Jerry Feldman 
Boston Linux and Unix
PGP key id:3BC1EB90
PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66  C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90

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Re: The Linux

[David Hardy]

I have Fedora as a vm and yes, it runs Unity.  Takes some getting used to;
 I have had various Ubuntu versions from 5 through 12.10, and Fedora from 6
through 18 now;  also have tried OpenSuSe, briefly, Mint, WattOS,  CentOS,
Scientific Linux, and Red Hat from their desktop distro 6.2 through the
current RHEL 6.4.

I used to like Ubuntu but recently not so much, due to constant updates
that bork the hardware configs, and other business-related matters.  Plus
trying to look as much like W8 as possible and rushing into the cell phone
and tablet markets.

So I have Fedora 18 at home next to a RHEL 6.4 box and at work we run RHEL
5.3 through 6.1.

YMMV, of course.


I

On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 2:05 PM, Jerry Feldman  wrote:

> Confirmed, but you have to download it from OpenSuSE.
>
> On 03/22/2013 12:48 PM, John Abreau wrote:
> > I read somewhere that Unity is available on Fedora now.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mar 22, 2013, at 9:09 AM, Jerry Feldman  wrote:
> >
> >> On 03/21/2013 04:37 PM, Drew Van Zandt wrote:
> >>> I find Ubuntu tasty for desktops, but not quite baked enough for
> >>> servers.  Debian is nice and meaty for that, and the two are quite
> >>> similar.
> >>>
> >>> Tastes vary, though.
> >>>
> >> Linux mint looks ok on the desktop also, it is based on Ubuntu. I use
> >> Fedora on my home desktop and it works well. The Boston LInux servers
> >> are running CentOS (based on RHEL). The bottom line is what others are
> >> saying, tastes vary. There are certain areas on a server where I will
> >> opt for a Red Hat based solution because some of the components are
> >> maintained by Red Hat. Ubunbtu seems to be branching as a Windows 8
> >> alternative on traditional computing, as well as tablets, smartphones
> >> and hybrids.
> >> Ubuntu is based on Debian but has more frequent release schedules.
> >> Repositories are Debian based, Deselect/apt.
> >> Fedora and OpenSuSE are based on RPM/yum repositories.
> >>
> >> So, the bottom line is that you should look at your personal
> >> requirements. I find that Ubuntu, Mint, Fedora, and OpenSuSE are very
> >> easy to install, and you can download live CDs. There are also a
> >> plethora of desktop options, such as Gnome (2 and 3), Unity (Ubuntu),
> >> Mint has the Cinnamon and Mate desktops, Fedora uses Gnome 3 by default,
> >> but in all you can select different desktops like KDE, or XFCE.
> >> Additionally, Fedora and Open SuSE can be installed from a live CD, but
> >> also from a DVD that contains just about everything.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jerry Feldman 
> >> Boston Linux and Unix
> >> PGP key id:3BC1EB90
> >> PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66  C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90
> >>
> >> ___
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>
>
> --
> Jerry Feldman 
> Boston Linux and Unix
> PGP key id:3BC1EB90
> PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66  C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90
>
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Re: The Linux

[Jerry Feldman]

On 03/22/2013 12:44 PM, David & Tina Ohlemacher wrote:
> I would recommend:
> - Install VMWare player (free) or Virtual Box (free/open).
> - Try distros within virtual machines. You may install directly from 
> an iso, no disks to burn.
> - Check out distrowatch.com 
>
> Personally: Linux Mint Debian Edition (LMDE w/ XFCE).   It is not 
> Ubuntu based as is regular Mint. It is a rolling distro, which I like.
>
Settting up a VM for Linux is pretty simple, and I agree with you here. 
You don't need a large machine for running virtual servers. For 
instance, my Acer Aspire One netbook with an Atom processor and 1GB of 
memory is running Linux Mint14 with VirtualBox as the VMM, and Windows 
XP and Ubuntu 12.10 as the guest OS. Virtual Box and VMWare Player both 
work well under Windows. Just one caveat. If you can turn on 
virtualization support in the BIOS you will get better performance. It 
is off by default on all systems I am aware of. Nearly all desktop 
systems today have virtualization support , but many laptops do notr.

-- 
Jerry Feldman 
Boston Linux and Unix
PGP key id:3BC1EB90
PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66  C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90

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Re: The Linux

[David Hardy]

I second Jerry's tip on turning on virtualization in the BIOS, if possible.
 Do it before setting up Virtual Box or VMware Player.

My Fedora is a vm in Virtual Box under W8 (I had to have W as a backup for
wife's dying laptop running Vista). I can jack up the RAM to 32GB and run a
whole bunch of vm's in it.

Also playing Real Soon Now with how the KVM stuff works in RHEL 6.4.



On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 3:08 PM, Jerry Feldman  wrote:

> On 03/22/2013 12:44 PM, David & Tina Ohlemacher wrote:
> > I would recommend:
> > - Install VMWare player (free) or Virtual Box (free/open).
> > - Try distros within virtual machines. You may install directly from
> > an iso, no disks to burn.
> > - Check out distrowatch.com 
> >
> > Personally: Linux Mint Debian Edition (LMDE w/ XFCE).   It is not
> > Ubuntu based as is regular Mint. It is a rolling distro, which I like.
> >
> Settting up a VM for Linux is pretty simple, and I agree with you here.
> You don't need a large machine for running virtual servers. For
> instance, my Acer Aspire One netbook with an Atom processor and 1GB of
> memory is running Linux Mint14 with VirtualBox as the VMM, and Windows
> XP and Ubuntu 12.10 as the guest OS. Virtual Box and VMWare Player both
> work well under Windows. Just one caveat. If you can turn on
> virtualization support in the BIOS you will get better performance. It
> is off by default on all systems I am aware of. Nearly all desktop
> systems today have virtualization support , but many laptops do notr.
>
> --
> Jerry Feldman 
> Boston Linux and Unix
> PGP key id:3BC1EB90
> PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66  C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90
>
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>
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Re: The Linux Cafe

[Jon maddog Hall]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
> The new list for Linux types to discuss politics, current events, and
> everything else considered "Off topic": 

I find it interesting that the people who complained the loudest about
the topic being "off topic" were also the ones who spent the most time
talking about it and discussing it.

And were do we go when the people on the Linux Cafe tell you that the
discussion you desire to have is "off topic"?

I personally have no interest in going to a list called "Linux Cafe" for
discussions of things considered "off topic" by other people.

Methinks thou doth protest too much, particularly when we have a mechanism
for filtering out "off topic" discussions..[OT]

md
-- 
Jon "maddog" Hall
Executive Director   Linux International(R)
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 80 Amherst St. 
Voice: +1.603.672.4557   Amherst, N.H. 03031-3032 U.S.A.
WWW: http://www.li.org

Board Member: Uniforum Association, USENIX Association

(R)Linux is a registered trademark of Linus Torvalds in several countries.
(R)Linux International is a registered trademark in the USA used pursuant
   to a license from Linux Mark Institute, authorized licensor of Linus
   Torvalds, owner of the Linux trademark on a worldwide basis
(R)UNIX is a registered trademark of The Open Group in the USA and other
   countries.

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Re: The Linux Cafe

[Fred]

On Fri, 2005-01-07 at 02:13 -0500, Jon maddog Hall wrote:
..
> I personally have no interest in going to a list called "Linux Cafe" for
> discussions of things considered "off topic" by other people.
> 
> Methinks thou doth protest too much, particularly when we have a mechanism
> for filtering out "off topic" discussions..[OT]
> 
> md

Well, it's a choice. I did similar for a Skeptics list a while back and
seems to have worked out OK. I will never scream that anything is "off-
topic" on my list, and thus no requirement for the "[OT]". 

Another benefit is that the list is not restricted to the local region.
Linux enthusiasts the world over are invited to join to chat about what
beer they like, what peeves them about politics, and the best way to
rebuild their kernels. ;-)

-- 
Come join The Linux Cafe:
http://mailman.puissante.com/mailman/listinfo/linux-cafe
Where no topic is "OT". 
All Linux die-hards, fans, and devotees are welcome.


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Re: The Linux Cafe

[Fred]

On Fri, 2005-01-07 at 11:42 -0500, Jon maddog Hall wrote:
...
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
> > The new list for Linux types to discuss politics, current events, and
> > everything else considered "Off topic":
> 
> And so if a "Microsoft Type" wanted to discuss birth control, would that be
> "OT" on the "Linux Cafe" list?  I see no benefit to a list where everyone
> discusses everything..but hey, it is like you sayit is their choice.

Like I said, this approach has worked out quite well for the Skeptics
Cafe list that I've been running for years alongside the main Skeptics
list sponsored by the Skeptics magazine. 

The whole idea is to "shoot the bull" with like-minded individuals. I,
for one, would love to know what beer my fellow Linux brethren like
drinking, for example. Or whether or not they find "Buffy" of interest. 

Here, even with the "OT" warning, there would be some hesitation to
bring up OT topics, even if no one is screaming not to. 

I have no problem with topic-oriented groups at all. However, with all
the topic groups I've been a member of, members always have the "itch"
to discuss off-topic issues. And so they do. And then the moderator
ascends from on high to say "cut that out!" Then all the members go
scurrying for cover...

-- 
Come join The Linux Cafe:
http://mailman.puissante.com/mailman/listinfo/linux-cafe
Where no topic is "OT". 
All Linux die-hards, fans, and devotees are welcome.


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Re: The Linux Foundation yummies

[Bill McGonigle]

On Jan 30, 2007, at 10:27, Thomas Charron wrote:

 Ok, earlier I wasn't sure about the OSDL merger, but now it would  
seem to

have bore a fruit which definatly deserves applause.

http://www.kroah.com/log/2007/01/29/#free_drivers


Wow.

Wow, wow, wow.

I'm not so naive to expect we'll have all drivers for all hardware  
but this will serve to winnow out the companies who really are  
resource constrained from those who are just using that as an excuse  
to stay proprietary or shun linux.  This will be especially  
beneficial to the little companies out there who really do have  
resource issues.


Things are going to get interesting!

-Bill
-
Bill McGonigle, Owner   Work: 603.448.4440
BFC Computing, LLC  Home: 603.448.1668
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Re: The Linux Foundation yummies

[Thomas Charron]

 Not only that, but in a way, this is almost like 'Linux Certified',
similar to windows hardware having the windows logo.

 I'd love to see them also add a program where kernel devs could evaluate a
driver to make sure it works 'as it should'.

 Would go a long way to having an entity looking out for the 'good of
linux' like Microsoft can, without bias towards a given commercial entity.

On 1/30/07, Bill McGonigle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


On Jan 30, 2007, at 10:27, Thomas Charron wrote:

>  Ok, earlier I wasn't sure about the OSDL merger, but now it would
> seem to
> have bore a fruit which definatly deserves applause.
>
> http://www.kroah.com/log/2007/01/29/#free_drivers

Wow.

Wow, wow, wow.

I'm not so naive to expect we'll have all drivers for all hardware
but this will serve to winnow out the companies who really are
resource constrained from those who are just using that as an excuse
to stay proprietary or shun linux.  This will be especially
beneficial to the little companies out there who really do have
resource issues.

Things are going to get interesting!

-Bill
-
Bill McGonigle, Owner   Work: 603.448.4440
BFC Computing, LLC  Home: 603.448.1668
[EMAIL PROTECTED]   Cell: 603.252.2606
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--
-- Thomas
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Re: The Linux Foundation yummies

[Bill McGonigle]

On Jan 30, 2007, at 12:40, Thomas Charron wrote:

 I'd love to see them also add a program where kernel devs could  
evaluate a

driver to make sure it works 'as it should'.


LTP:

  http://ltp.sourceforge.net/

may be what you're looking for.

It's very much dependent on having the appropriate hardware to run  
the test on, though.  I find this often means the end user (me) finds  
a kernel error, reports it, and somebody fixes it (on a sunny day).   
Props to Alan Cox for recently tracking down an ATI bug on my to-be- 
MythTV-box.


It would be nice if hardware vendors could further commit to having a  
test box at their facilities with one of each of their products in  
them, running LTP coverage.  Maybe that's the Silver Level badge, the  
Bronze going to supporting a driver developer as mentioned, and the  
Gold to doing your own drivers.


-Bill

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Re: The Linux Foundation yummies

[Jon 'maddog' Hall]

On Tue, 2007-01-30 at 15:11 -0500, Bill McGonigle wrote:
> On Jan 30, 2007, at 12:40, Thomas Charron wrote:
> 
> >  I'd love to see them also add a program where kernel devs could  
> > evaluate a
> > driver to make sure it works 'as it should'.
> 
> LTP:
> 
>http://ltp.sourceforge.net/
> 
> may be what you're looking for.
> 
> It's very much dependent on having the appropriate hardware to run  
> the test on, though.  I find this often means the end user (me) finds  
> a kernel error, reports it, and somebody fixes it (on a sunny day).   
> Props to Alan Cox for recently tracking down an ATI bug on my to-be- 
> MythTV-box.
> 
> It would be nice if hardware vendors could further commit to having a  
> test box at their facilities with one of each of their products in  
> them, running LTP coverage.  Maybe that's the Silver Level badge, the  
> Bronze going to supporting a driver developer as mentioned, and the  
> Gold to doing your own drivers.
> 

This was one of the original goals of OSDL, was to provide a laboratory
for FOSS developers to test their code on those
hard-to-stick-under-your-desk-systems (like an IBM mainframe, or a 1000
disk NAS array).

Perhaps they are going back to this model, or one like it.

md

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Re: The Linux Foundation yummies

[Bill Sconce]

On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:27:04 -0500
"Thomas Charron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>   Ok, earlier I wasn't sure about the OSDL merger, but now it would seem to
> have bore a fruit which definatly deserves applause.
> 
> http://www.kroah.com/log/2007/01/29/#free_drivers

"Yes, that's right, the Linux kernel community is offering all 
companies free Linux driver development.  ...

"As for support, the driver will be supported through email by the
original developers ... and by the "enterprise" Linux distributors
as part of their service agreements with their customers. ...

"If your company is worried about NDA issues surrounding your device's
specifications, we have arranged a program with OSDL/TLF's Tech Board 
to provide the legal framework where a company can interact with a 
member of the kernel community in order to properly assure that all
needed NDA requirements are fulfilled."

Wow. That's a GOOD message.  Particularly the last part: giving the
vendor's legal department someone to "hold responsible".  And Greg's
going to talking it up at WinHEC; even Nvidia is likely to attend...


Great news.  Thanks for the pointer, Thomas.

-Bill



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