Re: Windows 8 (or, more likely, UEFI) warning.
UEFI is why I switched to Fedora. It was the only distro at the time that supported UEFI out of the box, and even then, it was a little clunky. On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ken D'Ambrosio wrote: > > Wouldn't boot to Linux. Well, okay. Let's try Windows 8. Wouldn't > boot to *Windows*. First it tried to do a repair of some sort -- failed > miserably. Then it wouldn't get further than the "Dell" splash screen. > Eventually wound up disabling UEFI secure boot, which allowed it to go > into Windows -- whereupon I gave it back to the by-now very nervous > laptop owner, and let the damn WiFi be. Lucky you! I bought a new system from Best Buy (I know, I know...) and tried to dual boot it to Mandriva. Somehow I ended up bricking it. Bottom line -- I think we, as Linux weenies, are gonna have to play > with damn UEFI and get a feel for it. Is it uniform across vendors? > Yes, we will. Right now, I know of no decent boot editor utilities and none at all that run from within Linux. > Can I always go for the "disable secure boot" option (which would, > presumably, allow me to boot Linux)? > I think that may be vendor specific and possibly even windows installation specific. At the moment UEFI documentation is junk. Cross platform implementation is even worse. Brian ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: Windows 8 (or, more likely, UEFI) warning.
On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ken D'Ambrosio wrote: > Bottom line -- I think we, as Linux weenies, are gonna have to play > with damn UEFI and get a feel for it. Is it uniform across vendors? It isn't even uniform within vendors. UEFI is still new enough that the industry hasn't settled on best practices yet. I've seen radical differences between UEFI implementations on workstations and servers from Dell in the past year or so. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: Windows 8 (or, more likely, UEFI) warning.
Brian Chabot writes: > > UEFI is why I switched to Fedora. It was the only distro at the time that > supported UEFI out of the box, and even then, it was a little clunky. It's why I switched to buying Linux preinstalled. -- "Don't be afraid to ask (λf.((λx.xx) (λr.f(rr." > On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ken D'Ambrosio wrote: > > Wouldn't boot to Linux. Well, okay. Let's try Windows 8. Wouldn't > boot to *Windows*. First it tried to do a repair of some sort -- failed > miserably. Then it wouldn't get further than the "Dell" splash screen. > Eventually wound up disabling UEFI secure boot, which allowed it to go > into Windows -- whereupon I gave it back to the by-now very nervous > laptop owner, and let the damn WiFi be. > > Lucky you! > > I bought a new system from Best Buy (I know, I know...) and tried to dual boot > it to Mandriva. Somehow I ended up bricking it. > > Bottom line -- I think we, as Linux weenies, are gonna have to play > with damn UEFI and get a feel for it. Is it uniform across vendors? > > Yes, we will. Right now, I know of no decent boot editor utilities and none > at all that run from within Linux. > > > > Can I always go for the "disable secure boot" option (which would, > presumably, allow me to boot Linux)? > > I think that may be vendor specific and possibly even windows installation > specific. > > At the moment UEFI documentation is junk. Cross platform implementation is > even worse. > > Brian ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: Windows 8 (or, more likely, UEFI) warning.
I'm confused about UEFI. So let me ask a couple of basic questions. 1. If UEFI is the "boot up system" does this mean that if I buy a modern "Runs on Windows 8" high end mother board i7 + gpu and a blank hard drive (SSD) I can't install linux distros at all? Or distros with kernel < 3.0? or ? 2. Why would motherboard manufacturers do this? Don't they sell world wide where there other OS's? Please don't launch into a flame-fest, I'm merely curious as to what the motivation would be for the mfgrs behavior. 3. If 1 is true, what are the 'grass-roots' aka 'cheap' work a rounds ? a. wait and use less modern stuff <-- not desirable b. magic incantations / offerings <-- possible c. Subject for a GNHLUG meeting ? Local expert? At some point I need to modernize my computing platforms to get into GPU computing, so I'd like to get a lot more capable machine. I am still harboring the fantasy that it is still possible to "assemble one's own desktop computer" running linux. Is it still possible? Or are those days over? Bruce On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 8:54 PM, Joshua Judson Rosen wrote: > Brian Chabot writes: > > > > UEFI is why I switched to Fedora. It was the only distro at the time > that > > supported UEFI out of the box, and even then, it was a little clunky. > > It's why I switched to buying Linux preinstalled. > > -- > "Don't be afraid to ask (λf.((λx.xx) (λr.f(rr." > > > On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ken D'Ambrosio wrote: > > > > Wouldn't boot to Linux. Well, okay. Let's try Windows 8. Wouldn't > > boot to *Windows*. First it tried to do a repair of some sort -- > failed > > miserably. Then it wouldn't get further than the "Dell" splash > screen. > > Eventually wound up disabling UEFI secure boot, which allowed it to > go > > into Windows -- whereupon I gave it back to the by-now very nervous > > laptop owner, and let the damn WiFi be. > > > > Lucky you! > > > > I bought a new system from Best Buy (I know, I know...) and tried to > dual boot > > it to Mandriva. Somehow I ended up bricking it. > > > > Bottom line -- I think we, as Linux weenies, are gonna have to play > > with damn UEFI and get a feel for it. Is it uniform across vendors? > > > > Yes, we will. Right now, I know of no decent boot editor utilities and > none > > at all that run from within Linux. > > > > > > > > Can I always go for the "disable secure boot" option (which would, > > presumably, allow me to boot Linux)? > > > > I think that may be vendor specific and possibly even windows > installation > > specific. > > > > At the moment UEFI documentation is junk. Cross > platform implementation is > > even worse. > > > > Brian > > ___ > gnhlug-discuss mailing list > gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org > http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/ > ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: Windows 8 (or, more likely, UEFI) warning.
On 01/19/2013 01:32 PM, Bruce Labitt wrote: > I'm confused about UEFI. So let me ask a couple of basic questions. > > 1. If UEFI is the "boot up system" does this mean that if I buy a > modern "Runs on Windows 8" high end mother board i7 + gpu and a blank > hard drive (SSD) I can't install linux distros at all? Or distros > with kernel < 3.0? or ? > > 2. Why would motherboard manufacturers do this? Don't they sell > world wide where there other OS's? Please don't launch into a > flame-fest, I'm merely curious as to what the motivation would be for > the mfgrs behavior. > > 3. If 1 is true, what are the 'grass-roots' aka 'cheap' work a rounds ? > a. wait and use less modern stuff <-- not desirable > b. magic incantations / offerings <-- possible > c. Subject for a GNHLUG meeting ? Local expert? > > At some point I need to modernize my computing platforms to get into > GPU computing, so I'd like to get a lot more capable machine. I am > still harboring the fantasy that it is still possible to "assemble > one's own desktop computer" running linux. Is it still possible? Or > are those days over? AFAIK, the UEFI itself would not prevent a Linux book, but the Secure Boot section may affect you, but you should be able to disable that. It is really only on consumer class products with Windows 8 pre-installed that you can run into issues. Please take a look at this URL for more information: http://blog.fpmurphy.com/2012/11/list-secure-boot-certificates.html I would possibly check with the motherboard manufacturer for specifics, but I would doubt that a stand-alone mother board would have the Secure-boot enabledat all. -- Jerry Feldman Boston Linux and Unix PGP key id:3BC1EB90 PGP Key fingerprint: 49E2 C52A FC5A A31F 8D66 C0AF 7CEA 30FC 3BC1 EB90 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: Windows 8 (or, more likely, UEFI) warning.
> I'm confused about UEFI. So let me ask a couple of basic questions. > At some point I need to modernize my computing platforms to get into > GPU computing, so I'd like to get a lot more capable machine. I am > still harboring the fantasy that it is still possible to "assemble > one's own desktop computer" running linux. Is it still possible? Or > are those days over? I recently built a SnowLinux (think Ubuntu with Gnome V2) system on an ASUS P8H77-M PRO motherboard. I chose it mainly because I saw some reference somewhere to its RS232 and parallel port, both which I use). It has a UEFI BIOS, but I pretty much ignored that and was able to set it up as a pure Linux system with no trouble at all. SSD main disk, USB3.0 everything, Intel i5 CPU (55w) idle power draw much less. Antec Sonata case, like the old system. Very, very quiet system. Much quieter than my laptop. Software setup was easier than on my old system six years ago. An amazing amount of old crap is available through apt-get. Some things I thought I'd have to finally replace, like a convertor between Asthon-Tate "xbase" files and MySQL is out there and has fixes for newer libraries and stuff. I was half hoping I'd have to replace some really old crap, but didn't. Still should. -- r...@wermenh.comhttp://WermeNH.com/ ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: Windows 8 (or, more likely, UEFI) warning.
On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 1:32 PM, Bruce Labitt wrote: > 2. Why would motherboard manufacturers do this? Don't they sell world wide > where there other OS's? There are a couple of motivations for Secure Boot I'm aware of: Anti-Malware - The typical computer user cannot be trusted to make good decisions about the software they try to install. More and more malware is attacking the system before the OS proper even boots. The industry is locking things down for to protect people from themselves. This is the primary driving force. Tivoization Enforcement - Embedded systems manufacturers who want to prevent anyone from modifying their products without permission. This is a much smaller driving force. Your typical embedded systems manufacture can already do this with custom firmware; UEFI just provides a more standard way to do it. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
