Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-14 Thread Adrian Neumann
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 I heard only rumors, but isn't Lisp supposed to be just that? A programmable programming language? Peter Verswyvelen schrieb: This is all very cool stuff, but sometimes I wander if it isn't possible to drop the special languages for fiddling

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-14 Thread Peter Verswyvelen
I'm not sure, I don't know LISP in detail, but as far as I know, LISP is a fully dynamic language. I actually meant a static language where you build your own strong types using the language itself. On the micro level, the language only knows abouts bits and bytes without semantics, just like

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Pepe Iborra
On 13/09/2007, at 0:06, Don Stewart wrote: ok: In Monad.Reader 8, Conrad Parker shows how to solve the Instant Insanity puzzle in the Haskell type system. Along the way he demonstrates very clearly something that was implicit in Mark Jones' Type Classes with Functional Dependencies paper

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Pepe Iborra
For a taste, see Instant Insanity transliterated in this functional language: http://hpaste.org/2689 I thought I'd better paste here the code for Instant Insanity with Type Families. Otherwise it will vanish in a short time. I took the opportunity to clean it up a bit. Although AT are

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Don Stewart
Better here means better -- a functional language on the type system, to type a functional language on the value level. -- Don For a taste, see Instant Insanity transliterated in this functional language: http://hpaste.org/2689 NB: it took me 5 minutes, and that was my first

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Peter Verswyvelen
This is all very cool stuff, but sometimes I wander if it isn't possible to drop the special languages for fiddling with types, and introduce just a single language which has no types, only raw data from which you can built your own types (as in the old days when we used macro assemblers ;-),

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Derek Elkins
On Thu, 2007-09-13 at 11:12 -0700, Don Stewart wrote: Better here means better -- a functional language on the type system, to type a functional language on the value level. -- Don For a taste, see Instant Insanity transliterated in this functional language:

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread ok
I wrote: Since not all Turing machines halt, and since the halting problem is undecidable, this means not only that some Haskell programs will make the type checker loop forever, but that there is no possible meta- checker that could warn us when that would happen. On 13 Sep 2007, at 4:27 pm,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Thomas Schilling
On Fri, 2007-09-14 at 10:42 +1200, ok wrote: I wrote: Since not all Turing machines halt, and since the halting problem is undecidable, this means not only that some Haskell programs will make the type checker loop forever, but that there is no possible meta- checker that could warn us

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Manuel M T Chakravarty
Pepe Iborra wrote, For a taste, see Instant Insanity transliterated in this functional language: http://hpaste.org/2689 I thought I'd better paste here the code for Instant Insanity with Type Families. Otherwise it will vanish in a short time. I took the opportunity to clean it up a bit.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Manuel M T Chakravarty
Derek Elkins wrote, On Thu, 2007-09-13 at 11:12 -0700, Don Stewart wrote: Better here means better -- a functional language on the type system, to type a functional language on the value level. -- Don For a taste, see Instant Insanity transliterated in this functional language:

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Stefan O'Rear
On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 11:05:34AM +1000, Manuel M T Chakravarty wrote: Just to complete transferring the discussion from the ephemeral hpaste to the mailing list. My response to the lack of being able to display normalised types was that GHC actually goes to considerable trouble to

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-13 Thread Thomas Conway
On 9/14/07, Thomas Schilling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The type system doesn't help you avoid writing non-terminating programs, so i see no problem with it being possible giving programmers the power to express and check more complex properties of their programs -- as long as type-checking

[Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-12 Thread ok
In Monad.Reader 8, Conrad Parker shows how to solve the Instant Insanity puzzle in the Haskell type system. Along the way he demonstrates very clearly something that was implicit in Mark Jones' Type Classes with Functional Dependencies paper if you read it very very carefully (which I hadn't,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-12 Thread Albert Y. C. Lai
ok wrote: So we have C++ : imperative language whose type system is a Turing-complete functional language (with rather twisted syntax) Haskell: functional language whose type system is a Turing- complete logic programming language (with rather twisted

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-12 Thread Don Stewart
ok: In Monad.Reader 8, Conrad Parker shows how to solve the Instant Insanity puzzle in the Haskell type system. Along the way he demonstrates very clearly something that was implicit in Mark Jones' Type Classes with Functional Dependencies paper if you read it very very carefully (which I

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monad.Reader 8: Haskell, the new C++

2007-09-12 Thread Stefan Holdermans
C++ : imperative language whose type system is a Turing-complete functional language (with rather twisted syntax) Haskell: functional language whose type system is a Turing- complete logic programming language (with rather twisted syntax)