Re: [Haskell-cafe] how to write an haskell binding
Quoting Brian Hulley [EMAIL PROTECTED]: It is defnitely *a* haskell. There is actually no word in English with a silent 'h', though this statement is unfortunately controversial and news to whoever wrote the spell checker used in many printed publications. There is no English word with a silrnt 'h'... What kind of English do you speak? What about words like 'hour' and 'honest'? -- Lennart ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re[2]: [Haskell-cafe] how to write an haskell binding
Hello Brian, Tuesday, June 27, 2006, 2:43:15 AM, you wrote: achieve a goal. One other thing to bear in mind is that foreign calls are extremely slow, so for example it is much faster to use the Foreign.Marshal.Array and Foreign.C.String functions to allocate and populate a temporary array with the contents of a list, and send the pointer to this array to C with one foreign call, than to send each element of the list with multiple foreign calls (eg to paste only 19K of text from the Windows clipboard to my app took over 1 minute!!! he-he-he :) just add unsafe specifier: foreign import ccall unsafe Compression.h CanonizeCompressionMethod c_CanonizeCompressionMethod :: CMethod - CMethod - IO Int afair, it was 60k or 600k calls/second on my 1 GHz CPU in http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~chak/haskell/ghc/comm/rts-libs/multi-thread.html there is description why safe calls are so slow: Presently, GHC handles 'safe' C calls by effectively emitting the following code sequence: ...save thread state... t = suspendThread(); r = foo(arg1,...,argn); resumeThread(t); ...restore thread state... return r; After having squirreled away the state of a Haskell thread, Schedule.c:suspendThread() is called which puts the current thread on a list [Schedule.c:suspended_ccalling_threads] containing threads that are currently blocked waiting for external calls to complete (this is done for the purposes of finding roots when garbage collecting). In addition to putting the Haskell thread on suspended_ccalling_threads, suspendThread() now also does the following: - Instructs the Task Manager to make sure that there's a another native thread waiting in the wings to take over the execution of Haskell threads. This might entail creating a new worker thread or re-using one that's currently waiting for more work to do. The Task Manager section presents the functionality provided by this subsystem. - Releases its capability to execute within the RTS. By doing so, another worker thread will become unblocked and start executing code within the RTS. See the Capability section for details. - suspendThread() returns a token which is used to identify the Haskell thread that was added to suspended_ccalling_threads. This is done so that once the external call has completed, we know what Haskell thread to pull off the suspended_ccalling_threads list. Upon return from suspendThread(), the OS thread is free of its RTS executing responsibility, and can now invoke the external call. Meanwhile, the other worker thread that have now gained access to the RTS will continue executing Concurrent Haskell code. Concurrent 'stuff' is happening! -- Best regards, Bulatmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Win32 GUI bindings
Hello Jason, Tuesday, June 27, 2006, 8:48:53 AM, you wrote: but it turned out to be a real pain. I'm using visual haskell so that I have COM support (I need the version of H/Direct that ships with VisualHaskell and VisuallHaskell only ships with ghc 6.5) and that means I have to compile the less mainstream haskell libraries myself. can't you ask library maintainers to compile their libs for ghc 6.5. it should come out in several months and i think it's the time when library maintainers can start to check whether new ghc version can work with their libs -- Best regards, Bulatmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Win32 GUI bindings
On 6/26/06, Bulat Ziganshin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Jason, [snip] can't you ask library maintainers to compile their libs for ghc 6.5. it should come out in several months and i think it's the time when library maintainers can start to check whether new ghc version can work with their libs Ah, good idea. It never occured to me. I'll have to ask the wxHaskell maintainer(s). Thanks, Jason ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Win32 GUI bindings
Hi Jason, As far as I am aware, the Win32 bindings are not that well maintained currently, and programming against the Win32 API is quite painful since it is a very low level, and very C like API. Gtk2Hs does require additional dependancies, but seems to be the most actively developed version. When a friend of mine was doing GUI development work in Haskell he found that having all the Gtk2Hs maintainers on the haskell IRC channel meant he could get advice and fixes really really easily. As for the additional dependancies, which Gtk2Hs definately does have, there are plenty of exe packers which will take an executable and all its dependancies and bundle them into a single .exe. I guess using this any option would pass 1. As for 2, I found wxWindows to be more native feeling that Gtk2Hs, but Gtk2Hs is reasonably close so its not the end of the world. Thanks Neil ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] A question about stack overflow
hankgong: Hi, all I'm just a newbie for Haskell and functional programming world. The idea I currently read is quite different and interesting. I have one general question about the recursively looping style. For example: myMax [ ] = error empty list myMax [x] = x myMax [x:xs] = if x= (myMax xs) then x else (myMax xs) I just list out this kind of very simple program. However, if the list size if a big number such as 1000, the Does it mean that the functional programming is lacking of scalability? I do know that we can manually change the stack size for it. But that's not a good solution according to my opinion. No, your code is just really inefficient (think about how many times its traversing the list). Try rewriting it as a simple accumulating pass over the list, carrying the largest element you've seen so far. mymax [] = undefined mymax (x:xs) = f x xs where f x [] = x f x (y:ys) | y x = f y ys | otherwise = f x ys However, 'f' is just a foldl inlined: import Data.List mymax [] = undefined mymax (x:xs) = foldl' (\a b - if b a then b else a) x xs And the lambda is just 'max': import Data.List mymax [] = undefined mymax (x:xs) = foldl' max x xs Now, we already check for the empty list, so avoid checking again: import Data.List mymax [] = undefined mymax xs = foldl1' max xs And that'll do. -- Don ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] A question about stack overflow
Hi, mymax [] = undefined mymax (x:xs) = f x xs where f x [] = x f x (y:ys) | y x = f y ys | otherwise = f x ys Or if you don't want to go for a fold next, in a style more similar to the original: maximum [] = undefined maximum [x] = x maximum (a:b:xs) = maximum (max a b : xs) Thanks Neil ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
[Haskell-cafe] Re: [GHC/Base.A_o] Error 1
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone can help me? I did some changes in the .mk and makefile files in order to integrate it with the Haskell.NET code generator but when I try to compile the following error appears: .../../ghc/compiler/ghc-inplace -H32m -O -W -fno-warn-unused-matches -fwarn-unuse d-imports -fglasgow-exts -cpp -Iinclude -#include HsBase.h -Icbits/regex -funbox -strict-fields -package-name base -O -dcore-lint -W -fno-warn-unused-matches -fw arn-unused-imports -fglasgow-exts -keep-msil-files -fvia-il -hisuf A_hi -hcsuf A_hc -osuf A_o -fvia-il -keep-msil-file -c GHC/Base.lhs -o GHC/Base.A_o -ohi GHC/Base.A_hi GHC/Base.lhs:296: parse error on input `.' make[3]: *** [GHC/Base.A_o] Error 1 make[2]: *** [all] Error 1 make[1]: *** [all] Error 1 make[1]: Leaving directory `/cygdrive/c/Guilherme/ghc-6.2.2/libraries' make: *** [build] Error 1 Without knowing what changes you've made, this will be hard to diagnose. But since you've made a bunch of changes, presumably you have some idea where the problem might be? Have you changed the parser, perhaps? Cheers, Simon ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] A question about stack overflow
Neil Mitchell wrote: Or if you don't want to go for a fold next, in a style more similar to the original: maximum [] = undefined maximum [x] = x maximum (a:b:xs) = maximum (max a b : xs) It even reproduces the stack overflow, though for a different reason. Better write it this way: maximum [] = undefined maximum [x] = x maximum (a:b:xs) = let m = max a b in m `seq` maximum (m : xs) Udo. -- The condition of man is already close to satiety and arrogance, and there is danger of destruction of everything in existence. -- a Brahmin to Onesicritus, 327 BC, reported in Strabo's Geography signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
[Haskell-cafe] Re: Cabal and linking with static libs (.a files)
Simon Marlow [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: No idea, I'm afraid. ghc -v might help you. Try cut-and-pasting the linker command line and play around with ordering of -l options. I noticed the linker is incredibly picky about the sequence of options. Anyway, I suspected that, but I couldn't seem to work around it. I'm sure there are other Cabal packages out there that link to .a libraries, it's quite a common thing to do. I was going to post a long session trying to get things to work, but while doing the writeup, I think perhaps I spotted the problem: This command line, trying to link 'libafi.a' required by my package fmi-0.0: polarvier:~/work/rbr/src % ghc --make -O2 -W -fglasgow-exts RBR.lhs hooks.o -o rbr -lafi Chasing modules from: RBR.lhs Skipping Unslice ( ./Unslice.lhs, ./Unslice.o ) Skipping Stats( ./Stats.hs, ./Stats.o ) Skipping Util ( ./Util.hs, ./Util.o ) Skipping Main ( RBR.lhs, RBR.o ) Linking ... /home/ketil/lib/fmi-0.0/ghc-6.4.1/libHSfmi-0.0.a(FMIndex.o):(.text+0x642): undefined reference to `build_index' /home/ketil/lib/fmi-0.0/ghc-6.4.1/libHSfmi-0.0.a(FMIndex.o):(.text+0x78b): undefined reference to `count' /home/ketil/lib/fmi-0.0/ghc-6.4.1/libHSfmi-0.0.a(FMIndex.o):(.text+0xe95): undefined reference to `extract' collect2: ld returned 1 exit status ...didn't work, but examining the linking command from the -v output: gcc version 4.0.3 (Ubuntu 4.0.3-1ubuntu5) /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/collect2 --eh-frame-hdr -m elf_i386 -dynamic-linker /lib/ld-linux.so.2 -o rbr -u GHCziBase_Izh_static_info -u GHCziBase_Czh_static_info -u GHCziFloat_Fzh_static_info -u GHCziFloat_Dzh_static_info -u GHCziPtr_Ptr_static_info -u GHCziWord_Wzh_static_info -u GHCziInt_I8zh_static_info -u GHCziInt_I16zh_static_info -u GHCziInt_I32zh_static_info -u GHCziInt_I64zh_static_info -u GHCziWord_W8zh_static_info -u GHCziWord_W16zh_static_info -u GHCziWord_W32zh_static_info -u GHCziWord_W64zh_static_info -u GHCziStable_StablePtr_static_info -u GHCziBase_Izh_con_info -u GHCziBase_Czh_con_info -u GHCziFloat_Fzh_con_info -u GHCziFloat_Dzh_con_info -u GHCziPtr_Ptr_con_info -u GHCziPtr_FunPtr_con_info -u GHCziStable_StablePtr_con_info -u GHCziBase_False_closure -u GHCziBase_True_closure -u GHCziPack_unpackCString_closure -u GHCziIOBase_stackOverflow_closure -u GHCziIOBase_heapOverflow_closure -u GHCziIOBase_NonTermination_closure -u GHCziIOBase_BlockedOnDeadMVar_closure -u GHCziIOBase_BlockedIndefinitely_closure -u GHCziIOBase_Deadlock_closure -u GHCziWeak_runFinalizzerBatch_closure -u __stginit_Prelude /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/../../../../lib/crt1.o /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/../../../../lib/crti.o /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/crtbegin.o -L/usr/lib/ghc-6.4.1 -L/home/ketil/lib/fmi-0.0/ghc-6.4.1 -L/home/ketil/lib/bio-0.0/ghc-6.4.1 -L/home/ketil/lib/fps-0.7/ghc-6.4.1 -L/usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3 -L/usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3 -L/usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/../../../../lib -L/usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/../../.. -L/lib/../lib -L/usr/lib/../lib RBR.o ./Util.o ./Stats.o ./Unslice.o hooks.o -lafi -lHShaskell98 -lHSfmi-0.0 -lHSbio-0.0 -lHSfps-0.7 -lHSbase -lHSbase_cbits -lHSrts -lm -lgmp -ldl -lgcc --as-needed -lgcc_s --no-as-needed -lc -lgcc --as-needed -lgcc_s --no-as-needed /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/crtend.o /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/../../../../lib/crtn.o GHC puts the C library (-lafi) *before* Haskell library (-lHSfmi-0.0) that refers to it. Redoing the collect2 command but moving -lafi last does, in fact, work. Also, specifying extra-libraries in the cabal package works, as long as they are specified in the correct order. The remaining question is whether inserting command line specified libraries this early is a good choice. Perhaps one option that appears harmless is to specify it multiple times? BTW, for some reason, linking still fails when I'm using -optl-static, and I have to manually run collect2 tacking on '-lstdc++ -lc' at the end to make it link. -k -- If I haven't seen further, it is by standing in the footprints of giants ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
RE: [Haskell-cafe] A question about stack overflow
Thank you very much for introducing tail recursion. It's my first time to hear this. :) However, I'm wondering whether every loop structure from C like language can be translated to this kind of tail recursion? Yours, Hank -Original Message- From: Chris Kuklewicz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 5:34 PM To: Huazhi (Hank) Gong Cc: haskell-cafe@haskell.org Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] A question about stack overflow Huazhi (Hank) Gong wrote: Hi, all I'm just a newbie for Haskell and functional programming world. The idea I currently read is quite different and interesting. I have one general question about the recursively looping style. For example: myMax [ ] = error empty list myMax [x] = x myMax [x:xs] = if x= (myMax xs) then x else (myMax xs) I just list out this kind of very simple program. However, if the list size if a big number such as 1000, the Winhug will report that the stack is overflow. Does it mean that the functional programming is lacking of scalability? I do know that we can manually change the stack size for it. But that's not a good solution according to my opinion. Yours, Hank The function is not tail recursive Think about unfolding the recursion: mymax [1,2,3,4] = if 1 = (if 2 = (if 3 = (4) then 3 else (4)) then 2 else (above)) then 1 else (above) If 4 is a long list, then the chain of if statements gets larger than size of the stack that the runtime will allow. The definition you have looks like a right fold where compare the head to the function applies to the remaining list and what you need is a left fold where you process the list so far then operate on the next element. -- Chris ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: Re[2]: [Haskell-cafe] how to write an haskell binding
Brian, Bulat, thank you, thu ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: Re[2]: [Haskell-cafe] how to write an haskell binding
Brian, mmm, no you wasn't missing the point : actually, i asked if we bind against c or c++. But that way, you answer the general guidelines part of the question. thx thu 2006/6/27, minh thu [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Brian, Bulat, thank you, thu ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
RE: [Haskell-cafe] A question about stack overflow
--- Huazhi (Hank) Gong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thank you very much for introducing tail recursion. It's my first time to hear this. :) However, I'm wondering whether every loop structure from C like language can be translated to this kind of tail recursion? Yes, as discovered by John McCarthy almost 50 years ago in Recursive functions of symbolic expressions and their computation by machine. Communications of the ACM, 3:184-195, 1960. Ciao, Janis Voigtlaender. ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
[Haskell-cafe] Re: Haskell-Cafe Digest, Vol 34, Issue 45
Hi Jason. My $0.02 On 27/06/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -- Forwarded message -- From: Jason Dagit [EMAIL PROTECTED] Requirements: Okay, so now that you know why I'm here, let me give you an idea of what my *ideal* GUI library would be for this project (roughly in order of importance): 1) Doesn't require the end user to install anything (no dependencies) 2) Looks and feels like windows 3) Robust (or mature) 4) A pleasure to program (boo @ swing) 5) ?? I don't really know the landscape, but this is my (uneducated) idea of my options: A) wxWidgets B) gtk2hs C) win32 api D) write the gui in C or C++ and use the FFI to invoke it E) write the gui in scala or java and use FFI + JNI to invoke it F) ?? you tell me I think (although I have yet to verify) that (A) satisfies #1-4, but (B) doesn't satisfy #1. Is this true? I tried to install wxHaskell but it turned out to be a real pain. I'm using visual haskell so that I have COM support (I need the version of H/Direct that ships with VisualHaskell and VisuallHaskell only ships with ghc 6.5) and that means I have to compile the less mainstream haskell libraries myself. I have yet to successfully install wxHaskell on my dev machine at work. I've developed a couple of projects with wxHaskell, along with a couple using the lablGtk2 library for Ocaml - in fact, the whole clunkiness and lack of Windows and (especially) Mac native feel of GTK on non-Linux platforms is a large part of what brought me to Haskell :-) My applications are mainly for internal use at my workplace, and come with Windows installers (I use Inno setup with wxHaskell - never managed to make it work with GTK2, so these applications were delivered as zip files which just had to be unzipped in a certain place). To distribute wxHaskell applications you need only two DLLs and an executable. All can be in the same directory. I think this covers 1) Look and feel is Windows native. As an added bonus (for me, at least) it also looks native on Mac and Linux. That's 2) wxHaskell is fairly robust, but you need to be aware that it does not have complete coverage of the wxWindows library. I have found layout behaviour to be incomprehensible at times (although I found this to be somewhat true of the native wxWindows sizers on which layout is built). Some of the more exotic widgets (Scintilla, wxGrid) are either not wrapped, or the wrapping is incomplete. I have not succeeded, in the general case, in getting sash wiondows to work as I would like them to (it's possible for some limiting cases, but that is not enough for my needs) My impression, sadly, is that little development now goes on on wxHaskell. The last compiled binaries available from the website are over a year old now and, as you've already discovered, it's really quite difficult to get wxHaskell to compile on Windows. For what it's worth, I gave up on 2.6.x and reverted to 2.4.2, which compiled cleanly for me. Because of the appearance that it's withering on the vine, I would be reluctant to recommend wxHaskell. However, despite the gripes above, I think it's a superb piece of work. I have managed to produce some very high performance applications with it - users assumed that I had written in hand-optimized C (FastPackedStrings also had a big hand in the performance). If the project were better documented, I really believe that there's a chance that the project would take off. As an example, I easily have the knowledge of C/C++ needed to contribute, and the Haskell is getting there, but the (lack of) documentation makes it hard for the end user at times - let alone the wannabe developer. In short, I'm not sure about 3). wxHaskell programming is something of a mix of Haskell idioms (layout, in particular) and C style imperative programming (in IO monad). In some respects the UI code looks quite similar to wxPython, but at least you get Haskell goodness for everything else. This is a big plus. Back in the day when I was using the Ocaml GTK2 binding, the following observations were true. I suspect they may be true of GTK2Hs (as they are mainly observations on GTK2 on Windows per se), but I am not certain. Installation of GTK2 on Windows is nothing short of revolting. It's a completely manual set of 'work out which DLL or library to download from where and install it in a suitable directory. Building from source is worse. I never managed to work out a small, sane set of DLLs which could just be packaged with the executable I was delivering. It may be possible, but I didn't manage it. That's a fail on 1), I suspect. Look and feel is adequate on Windows, for the most part. However, the file dialog, in particular, caused my users (mainly engineers, so pretty switched on, on the whole) no end of confusion, and was a major driver to my dropping Ocaml for this type of work. That's a failure on 2), at least for me. However, in its defence, GTK2 is stable and capable on Windows. I also have the impression
Re: [Haskell-cafe] how to write an haskell binding
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quoting Brian Hulley [EMAIL PROTECTED]: It is defnitely *a* haskell. There is actually no word in English with a silent 'h', though this statement is unfortunately controversial and news to whoever wrote the spell checker used in many printed publications. There is no English word with a silrnt 'h'... What kind of English do you speak? What about words like 'hour' and 'honest'? Ok apologies for forgetting about these 2 words (and their derivatives) - I agree they do have a silent 'h'. I suppose they are the exception that proves the rule... :-) Regards, Brian. ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
[Haskell-cafe] Are FunPtr's stable? (was: how to write an haskell binding)
Bulat Ziganshin wrote: Hello Brian, Tuesday, June 27, 2006, 2:43:15 AM, you wrote: achieve a goal. One other thing to bear in mind is that foreign calls are extremely slow, so for example it is much faster to use the Foreign.Marshal.Array and Foreign.C.String functions to allocate and populate a temporary array with the contents of a list, and send the pointer to this array to C with one foreign call, than to send each element of the list with multiple foreign calls (eg to paste only 19K of text from the Windows clipboard to my app took over 1 minute!!! he-he-he :) just add unsafe specifier: Thanks Bulat! It turns out nearly every foreign function I'm using doesn't make callbacks into Haskell so can be marked unsafe so your solution has saved me an enormous amount of refactoring... :-) On a related note, as I was reading the FFI specification again, I can't find any mention of whether or not FunPtr's are stable with respect to garbage collection. I'm assuming they are but am I correct? Thanks, Brian. -- Logic empowers us and Love gives us purpose. Yet still phantoms restless for eras long past, congealed in the present in unthought forms, strive mightily unseen to destroy us. http://www.metamilk.com ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: how to write an haskell binding
Aaron Denney wrote: On 2006-06-27, Brian Hulley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quoting Brian Hulley [EMAIL PROTECTED]: It is defnitely *a* haskell. There is actually no word in English with a silent 'h', though this statement is unfortunately controversial and news to whoever wrote the spell checker used in many printed publications. There is no English word with a silrnt 'h'... What kind of English do you speak? What about words like 'hour' and 'honest'? Ok apologies for forgetting about these 2 words (and their derivatives) - I agree they do have a silent 'h'. I suppose they are the exception that proves the rule... :-) Don't forget honor. From the Collins English dictionary: honest : not given to lying, cheating, stealing etc honour or U.S. honor : personal integrity, allegiance to moral principles ... So I'd say these two words are closely related, so the search is still on for another word with silent 'h' not related to time or integrity. Regards, Brian. -- Logic empowers us and Love gives us purpose. Yet still phantoms restless for eras long past, congealed in the present in unthought forms, strive mightily unseen to destroy us. http://www.metamilk.com ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: how to write an haskell binding
At Tue, 27 Jun 2006 20:36:30 +0100, Brian Hulley wrote: What about words like 'hour' and 'honest'? Don't forget honor. So I'd say these two words are closely related, so the search is still on for another word with silent 'h' not related to time or integrity. How about heir? Also, until recently, herb and humble? Got those from this page: http://www.askoxford.com/worldofwords/wordfrom/aitches/?view=uk Which also notes that sometimes we still use 'an' even though the 'h' is no longer silent. For example, 'an heroic effort', or 'an historic moment'. j. ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: how to write an haskell binding
Jeremy Shaw wrote: At Tue, 27 Jun 2006 20:36:30 +0100, Brian Hulley wrote: What about words like 'hour' and 'honest'? Don't forget honor. So I'd say these two words are closely related, so the search is still on for another word with silent 'h' not related to time or integrity. How about heir? Thanks - I'd not thought of that one! Also, until recently, herb and humble? I think these depend on one's dialect. I'd never think of saying an herb but of course many people would. Got those from this page: http://www.askoxford.com/worldofwords/wordfrom/aitches/?view=uk Which also notes that sometimes we still use 'an' even though the 'h' is no longer silent. For example, 'an heroic effort', or 'an historic moment'. This is what I meant by the evil spellchecker writer - I think this is just some particular dialect trying to take over the whole language... Still everyone will be pleased to know that I won't post any more about this subject now that the third true silent 'h' has been found :-) Best regards, Brian. -- Logic empowers us and Love gives us purpose. Yet still phantoms restless for eras long past, congealed in the present in unthought forms, strive mightily unseen to destroy us. http://www.metamilk.com ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: how to write an haskell binding
On Tue, 2006-06-27 at 13:35 -0700, Jeremy Shaw wrote: . . . How about heir? Also, until recently, herb and humble? I grew up in the southern US, and I was taught 'herb' with silent 'h' but 'humble' with aspirated 'h'. With the 'h' silent 'humble' sounds very Dickensian to my ear. -- Bill Wood ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
[Haskell-cafe] Re: [Haskell] Google SoC: Software Transactional Memory for Parrot
On Tue, Jun 27, 2006 at 08:29:21AM -0700, Jared Updike wrote: Am I the only one whose first instinct upon reading this is EW!? You are not the only one, judging from my own experience. I made my own sort of algebraic datatypes / abstract datatypes in C# by using Enums and Objects and runtime casts. It works, but the code itself is hairy. I guess the good news is that once I built the ADT the---in my case, ugly---implementation is hidden. When I first started using Haskell Sather was my language of choice. As I learned Haskell and all it's cool features I kept wanting to backport them to Sather... Algebraic data types was one of the things I proposed to the sather community, a wacky idea for an OO language of sathers heritage. but it was not long after then that I realized I should just be using Haskell to begin with and redirected my efforts here. :) John -- John Meacham - ⑆repetae.net⑆john⑈ ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
