[IAEP] [SLOBS] meeting reminder: Tuesday, 28 September

2010-09-27 Thread Walter Bender
We will be holding a Sugar Oversight Board meeting at 15UTC (11EST) on irc.freenode.net #sugar-meeting. Topics: finalizing the election details -walter -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a

[IAEP] New Virtualbox Appliances available please test. Feedback appreciated

2010-09-27 Thread Thomas C Gilliard
Announcement: I have listed a number of Sugar Virtualbox and VMplayer Appliances [1] on the wiki. These should be easy to install and use and be especially useful for Mac Users. Feedback is appreciated. Tom Gilliard satellit [1]

Re: [IAEP] [Sur] Hablemos claro y en voz alta - Le t´s speak loud and clear

2010-09-27 Thread Carlos Rabassa
Tomeu, nuevamente, muchísimas gracias! He leído todo el material que nos enviaste y me fue muy útil, muchas gracias. Una vez más expreso mi preocupación proveniente de lo que he oído en reuniones presenciales y lo que he leído en los foros. Las ideas más importantes en la historia de

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Caroline Meeks
Gerald did some interesting work last year introducing both Scratch and eToys to 5th and 8th graders. Gerald please correct me if I am misremembering. I think the results were the 8th graders took to Scratch more and the 5th graders took to eToys more. Our hypothesis is that the first thing you

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Alan Kay
Hi Caroline, I think this is a good observation. And it's interesting because Etoys and Scratch were both done on top of Squeak, and by some of the same people. Originally Etoys was aimed at 5th graders and Scratch at high schoolers who dropped into afternoon computer clubs. There is a lot of

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Walter Bender
On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com wrote: Hi Caroline, I think this is a good observation. And it's interesting because Etoys and Scratch were both done on top of Squeak, and by some of the same people. Originally Etoys was aimed at 5th graders and Scratch at high

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Alan Kay
Hi Walter, Yes, we experimented with this in the early days of the XO (using Alpha blending to put two virtual screens over each other). It worked pretty well (done by Scott Wallace) but the XO in those days was not so great at graphics. Maybe just having a mode is good enough (didn't seem

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Dr. Gerald Ardito
Caroline, You are remembering well. And I agree with your hypothesis. The 5th graders took pretty well to Etoys. It is the drawing piece that hooks them, and then the scripting part that really challenges them. And the 7th and 8th graders love Scratch. It is interesting to me because they also

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Alan Kay
I'd be curious to hear what the process is with the 5th graders. These were our main subjects. We worked only through regular classroom teachers (who had been carefully coached). You will not see any challenged 5th graders if you use a one on one session with them for about 20-30 minutes. The

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Dr. Gerald Ardito
Alan, First, I just want to clarify that I meant challenged in a positive way. The 5th graders dove into Etoys first through painting, and then through scripting. However, I agree with what you say about artifacts of a pedagogical approach. We saw this, too. Our learning situation involved 4-6

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Caroline Meeks
First let me say that based on my experience working with second and third graders in an inner city public school, eToys, Scratch and Turtle Art, none of them are inherently too difficult for elementary school children, especially with 1:1 help at the start and all of them have the potential to be

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Alan Kay
Hi Gerald, Yes, I think the experts approach is a good one also -- we first saw it used by Betty Edwards (the drawing teacher) and it works very well if the ratio is about 1 expert to 6 or 7 learners or better. And we have tried this with Etoys (mostly on adult teachers). However, of all the

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Alan Kay
Hi Caroline, I think that each of them is at its best for just a few years. Each of them was specifically designed (for different reasons) for relatively short term use. Etoys can be used longer, but mostly because it also has a particle system, and an integrated media system. Still, I think

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Edward Cherlin
Can we add your dissertation to the Bibliography? On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at 19:31, Dr. Gerald Ardito gerald.ard...@gmail.com wrote: Alan, First, I just want to clarify that I meant challenged in a positive way. The 5th graders dove into Etoys first through painting, and then through scripting.

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Dr. Gerald Ardito
Alan, Thanks for this. I am just beginning to work with our 5th grade students and teachers and will put this into action. One question for you, if I may. Can you tell me about the first Etoys lesson you mentioned (with 35 things in 30 minutes)? Thanks again. Gerald On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Dr. Gerald Ardito
Edward, Sure thing. The citation for the dissertation would be: Ardito, G. (2010). The shape of disruption: xo laptops in the fifth grade classroom (Doctoral dissertation). Available from Pace University. I hope my work will be of some service to your projects. Please let me know if there is

Re: [IAEP] Etoys, is it difficult or easy?

2010-09-27 Thread Alan Kay
It's the make a car you can drive yourself one which starts with the painting of a car, scripting it to go in a circle, steering by modifying the script on the fly, adding a steering wheel, moving the steering wheel's heading to the car turn by, making a gear by dividing the heading by 3,