Re: Availability of "Orphanware"?
Unfortunately no one can legally use such software or even have a copy of installation media. No one except those who really bought it (in legal way). Depending on local country law there are very few institutions which may collect such things as an exception to the common rules. Sometimes things are more complex - for example some software product contains other party's intellectual property. It was fine when the product was in sale - i.e. you bought it for $100 and $1 was send to subcontractor. However what about giving it for free? It is not a problem of software, it is also a problem of old movies or music records. Some very old silent movies will disappear, because the film will crumble to ashes. Nobody will digitalize it because of copyright. The problem and many other issues is well described in Free Culture book by Lawrence Lessig. BTW: the book is free - everyone may download it and read. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland W dniu 30.08.2023 o 18:05, Phil Smith III pisze: Wow, those names are blasts from the past! They raise some interesting questions: 1. If you could find a tape (and read it), would they still run? 2. If they did run, would you be legal using them without paying for them? 3. If not, would it matter? I.e., since the companies are gone, would anyone care? I guess the worry would be that some patent troll bought the IP and would come after you, though how they'd find you is a bit of a mystery too. It's not like stuff that old is sending out license requests on the Internet! ObAnecdote: In 1994 or so, VM Systems Group bought Microcom, the company that made the Relay/Gold terminal emulator. This was VMSG's first step in evolving from a mainframe software company to a dead^wPC software company (they sold out to NetDamage for pennies about five years later). Relay/Gold was written in a variant of x86 assembler from a long-dead company. The language itself was not compatible with other assemblers. I never worked on it, so I don't know what this means-does this suggest that, if this had been a z/Architecture assembler, the LR instruction might have been RL or something?!? Even that would lend itself to translation via an editor macro, you'd think. Anyway, it apparently wasn't convertible, so for the rest of its life (and prior to the acquisition, even), developers used bootleg copies of that assembler. Nobody was happy about it*, but we couldn't find anyone to pay! *Well, maybe our finance people. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Availability of "Orphanware"?
Wayne Bickerdike wrote: >I worked for ICI from 1969 to 1978. Do you know which division wrote >WRS? I found this article: https://wiki.edunitas.com/IT/en/114-10/Works-Records-System_4809_Copy_eduNitas.html That source claims that Works Records System was designed by Dr. Robert Mais, an employee of ICI's Mond Division, with an implementation team that included Ken Dakin. The article mentions that WRS used macro level CICS. If that's still true for the latest/last build of WPS then presumably it'd require MacKinney's CICS Macro Level Interpreter to run. There's a scanning utility called DFHMSCAN, available through CICS TS 5.5 (removed in 5.6 and higher), that can determine whether load modules use CICS macros. ...Kenneth Dakin has a LinkedIn profile! And his LinkedIn biography highlights his experience writing WRS. — Timothy Sipples Senior Architect Digital Assets, Industry Solutions, and Cybersecurity IBM zSystems/LinuxONE, Asia-Pacific sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Availability of "Orphanware"?
Tim, I worked for ICI from 1969 to 1978. Do you know which division wrote WRS? We had quite a few divisions that had mainframes. Central Management Services held sway for quite some time. I was at Fibres division and we used to time share until we installed our first 370 in 1975. There are not many folks around from those days, although I know of one guy who worked at Doncaster works before moving to Fibres HQ in Harrogate. I had stints in Harrogate, Wilton and Billingham. Fibres and petrochemicals. We also had dealings with Dyestuffs division in Huddersfield. We also ran works payroll for Pontypool on an IBM 1130. Took a while to run! On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 10:17 PM Timothy Sipples wrote: > I'm wondering what the status is of the following software: > > 1. The Works Record System (WRS), developed by ICI in the United Kingdom. > First version in 1974. One report suggests it was still used as late as > 2001. > > 2. ExecuCalc, developed by Parallax Systems and first released in 1982. > ExecuCalc was similar to VisiCalc – and file format compatible according to > the advertising. Available first for VM/CMS, then for MVS/TSO in 1983. > Apparently supported color GDDM graphics by about mid-1983. > > 3. WordPerfect/370. This version used the WordPerfect Version 4.2 base > plus some enhancements such as additional printer drivers. Available for > both VM/CMS and MVS. > > — > Timothy Sipples > Senior Architect > Digital Assets, Industry Solutions, and Cybersecurity > IBM zSystems/LinuxONE, Asia-Pacific > sipp...@sg.ibm.com > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- Wayne V. Bickerdike -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Availability of "Orphanware"?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orphan_work I would like IBM to allow Hobbyist use of Cobol85 via the Hercules group. On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 11:05 AM Phil Smith III wrote: > > Wow, those names are blasts from the past! They raise some interesting > questions: > > 1. If you could find a tape (and read it), would they still run? > 2. If they did run, would you be legal using them without paying for > them? > 3. If not, would it matter? I.e., since the companies are gone, would > anyone care? I guess the worry would be that some patent troll bought the IP > and would come after you, though how they'd find you is a bit of a mystery > too. It's not like stuff that old is sending out license requests on the > Internet! > > > > ObAnecdote: In 1994 or so, VM Systems Group bought Microcom, the company that > made the Relay/Gold terminal emulator. This was VMSG's first step in evolving > from a mainframe software company to a dead^wPC software company (they sold > out to NetDamage for pennies about five years later). > > Relay/Gold was written in a variant of x86 assembler from a long-dead > company. The language itself was not compatible with other assemblers. I > never worked on it, so I don't know what this means-does this suggest that, > if this had been a z/Architecture assembler, the LR instruction might have > been RL or something?!? Even that would lend itself to translation via an > editor macro, you'd think. Anyway, it apparently wasn't convertible, so for > the rest of its life (and prior to the acquisition, even), developers used > bootleg copies of that assembler. Nobody was happy about it*, but we couldn't > find anyone to pay! > > *Well, maybe our finance people. > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Availability of "Orphanware"?
Wow, those names are blasts from the past! They raise some interesting questions: 1. If you could find a tape (and read it), would they still run? 2. If they did run, would you be legal using them without paying for them? 3. If not, would it matter? I.e., since the companies are gone, would anyone care? I guess the worry would be that some patent troll bought the IP and would come after you, though how they'd find you is a bit of a mystery too. It's not like stuff that old is sending out license requests on the Internet! ObAnecdote: In 1994 or so, VM Systems Group bought Microcom, the company that made the Relay/Gold terminal emulator. This was VMSG's first step in evolving from a mainframe software company to a dead^wPC software company (they sold out to NetDamage for pennies about five years later). Relay/Gold was written in a variant of x86 assembler from a long-dead company. The language itself was not compatible with other assemblers. I never worked on it, so I don't know what this means-does this suggest that, if this had been a z/Architecture assembler, the LR instruction might have been RL or something?!? Even that would lend itself to translation via an editor macro, you'd think. Anyway, it apparently wasn't convertible, so for the rest of its life (and prior to the acquisition, even), developers used bootleg copies of that assembler. Nobody was happy about it*, but we couldn't find anyone to pay! *Well, maybe our finance people. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Availability of "Orphanware"?
Somewhat related, Lotus 1-2-3/M existed for VM/CMS and MVS as well, but apparently vanished from the surface of the earth. You cannot even find a screenshot of it. -Alex On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 12:17:15PM +, Timothy Sipples wrote: > I'm wondering what the status is of the following software: > > 1. The Works Record System (WRS), developed by ICI in the United Kingdom. > First version in 1974. One report suggests it was still used as late as 2001. > > 2. ExecuCalc, developed by Parallax Systems and first released in 1982. > ExecuCalc was similar to VisiCalc – and file format compatible according to > the advertising. Available first for VM/CMS, then for MVS/TSO in 1983. > Apparently supported color GDDM graphics by about mid-1983. > > 3. WordPerfect/370. This version used the WordPerfect Version 4.2 base plus > some enhancements such as additional printer drivers. Available for both > VM/CMS and MVS. > > — > Timothy Sipples > Senior Architect > Digital Assets, Industry Solutions, and Cybersecurity > IBM zSystems/LinuxONE, Asia-Pacific > sipp...@sg.ibm.com > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Availability of "Orphanware"?
I'm wondering what the status is of the following software: 1. The Works Record System (WRS), developed by ICI in the United Kingdom. First version in 1974. One report suggests it was still used as late as 2001. 2. ExecuCalc, developed by Parallax Systems and first released in 1982. ExecuCalc was similar to VisiCalc – and file format compatible according to the advertising. Available first for VM/CMS, then for MVS/TSO in 1983. Apparently supported color GDDM graphics by about mid-1983. 3. WordPerfect/370. This version used the WordPerfect Version 4.2 base plus some enhancements such as additional printer drivers. Available for both VM/CMS and MVS. — Timothy Sipples Senior Architect Digital Assets, Industry Solutions, and Cybersecurity IBM zSystems/LinuxONE, Asia-Pacific sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
