H800 FACT was Re: ancient cobol applications
On 9 Feb 2015 19:37:57 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: In nlifdap0jlltnc68b83spng5la9i678...@4ax.com, on 02/08/2015 at 04:49 PM, Clark Morris cfmpub...@ns.sympatico.ca said: Honeywell 800 FACT FACT is fiction. And here I thought that I was the last person still alive to have heard of it. Complete with paging to tape and using 3 of the 8 CPUs as I recall. I think ZI still have a manual. Clark Morris -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: H800 FACT was Re: ancient cobol applications
In o7ekda5onbsdiumag0fk3bneqoa1e1k...@4ax.com, on 02/10/2015 at 01:01 PM, Clark Morris cfmpub...@ns.sympatico.ca said: Complete with paging to tape and using 3 of the 8 CPUs as I recall. There was only one CPU. The H-800 was the first machine that I'm aware of to use virtual multiporoceesing. See the Honeywell 800 Programmers' Reference manual http://bitsavers.org/pdf/Honeywell/h800/H800_programmersRefMan.pdf; you may have to fool around with the mirrors, which appear to be broken again. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
In nlifdap0jlltnc68b83spng5la9i678...@4ax.com, on 02/08/2015 at 04:49 PM, Clark Morris cfmpub...@ns.sympatico.ca said: Honeywell 800 FACT FACT is fiction. And here I thought that I was the last person still alive to have heard of it. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
On Sat, Feb 7, 2015 at 11:11 PM, Ed Gould edgould1...@comcast.net wrote: Scott: I am far from an expert in these areas but here are some thoughts. From what little I have seen here in IL here are some guesses: 1. Budgets are not only bare bones but are downright disgraceful. Year after year the budgets are FROZEN and that means doing less with no new equipment. The 3270's are cheap shells and are filthy due to smoking in most cases they aren't 3270's at all but are cheaply made replacements. 2. Politicians regularly rob peter to pocket the money in another budget leaving zero dollars for replacements. 3. Politicians stealing the money and pocketing it. 4. no one wants to raise taxes to pay for anything so equipment deteriates and the same goes for wages. 5. Working for the state is a dead end job money wise. ANd on and on Run your comments through the following regexp and I will agree: s/politicians/people in higher authority positions/gi I actually had a CIO tell me that we would _not_ be doing any mainframe software (CICS in particular) upgrades this (20 yrs ago, now) year, even though it was in the budget, because if he came in under that budget, he would get a nice bonus. And _that_ was his motivation, not doing a good job. IMO, this is why some really bright software developers work on FOSS projects, such as Linux. Yes, they need money. But they want to write good code too. Without the political hassles of just make it good enough to sell to the fools in the marketplace who don't know any better. I can't speak for others, but it appears to me that the average American consumer wants good enough so long at it is cheap. Like a wino does not really care what he drinks, so long as he get drunk _now_, and so gets the really cheap stuff. It reminds me of a real old Sci-Fi book These Savage Futurians, Philip E. High, in which our society collapsed because everything got centralized and made disposable products. And then that central site went down and the world fell apart because nobody could fix it or replace it. Ed -- He's about as useful as a wax frying pan. 10 to the 12th power microphones = 1 Megaphone Maranatha! John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
On 7 Feb 2015 21:04:11 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: http://www.king5.com/story/news/local/2015/02/06/old-computers-state-government-agencies/22953063/ On Sat, 7 Feb 2015 19:50:10 -0500, scott wrote: Which state agencies? Some out of work programmers would probably love to do some meaningful work. On 02/07/2015 01:01 PM, Anne Lynn Wheeler wrote: local news just had item about ancient software at state agencies, 619 major cobol applications developed in 80s ... frequent crashesoutages, almost impossible to maintain or change ... in part because of the lack of cobol programmers. The state is even considering setting up financial incentive for schools to produce cobol programmers. 18 months to code for a special license plate? As both an applications programmer analyst and a systems programmer, I find that absurd. May it is 10 months to create the test data, 1 day to code the change and 8 months to do the paperwork. As someone who learned Honeywell 800 FACT in a class and picked up COBOL by reading a Burroughs 5000 COBOL manual, it isn't that difficult to learn COBOL. Documenting the systems could help. Of course special license plates should be in an external table but that is another story. Clark Morris -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
ancient cobol applications
local news just had item about ancient software at state agencies, 619 major cobol applications developed in 80s ... frequent crashesoutages, almost impossible to maintain or change ... in part because of the lack of cobol programmers. The state is even considering setting up financial incentive for schools to produce cobol programmers. -- virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
That's not the only causemanagement being cheap, an issue I have seen for years...experienced people are worth their weight on 'gold' . On Saturday, February 7, 2015, Anne Lynn Wheeler l...@garlic.com wrote: local news just had item about ancient software at state agencies, 619 major cobol applications developed in 80s ... frequent crashesoutages, almost impossible to maintain or change ... in part because of the lack of cobol programmers. The state is even considering setting up financial incentive for schools to produce cobol programmers. -- virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu javascript:; with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
and companies not looking to the future for requirements. There are probably a number of employees in the mid-40s that could be trained and let the newbies pick up the LUW support going forward. Mitch -Original Message- From: Scott Ford idfzos...@gmail.com To: IBM-MAIN IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Sent: Sat, Feb 7, 2015 2:48 pm Subject: Re: ancient cobol applications That's not the only causemanagement being cheap, an issue I have seen for years...experienced people are worth their weight on 'gold' . On Saturday, February 7, 2015, Anne Lynn Wheeler l...@garlic.com wrote: local news just had item about ancient software at state agencies, 619 major cobol applications developed in 80s ... frequent crashesoutages, almost impossible to maintain or change ... in part because of the lack of cobol programmers. The state is even considering setting up financial incentive for schools to produce cobol programmers. -- virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu javascript:; with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
http://www.king5.com/story/news/local/2015/02/06/old-computers-state-government-agencies/22953063/ On Sat, 7 Feb 2015 19:50:10 -0500, scott wrote: Which state agencies? Some out of work programmers would probably love to do some meaningful work. On 02/07/2015 01:01 PM, Anne Lynn Wheeler wrote: local news just had item about ancient software at state agencies, 619 major cobol applications developed in 80s ... frequent crashesoutages, almost impossible to maintain or change ... in part because of the lack of cobol programmers. The state is even considering setting up financial incentive for schools to produce cobol programmers. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
Scott: I am far from an expert in these areas but here are some thoughts. From what little I have seen here in IL here are some guesses: 1. Budgets are not only bare bones but are downright disgraceful. Year after year the budgets are FROZEN and that means doing less with no new equipment. The 3270's are cheap shells and are filthy due to smoking in most cases they aren't 3270's at all but are cheaply made replacements. 2. Politicians regularly rob peter to pocket the money in another budget leaving zero dollars for replacements. 3. Politicians stealing the money and pocketing it. 4. no one wants to raise taxes to pay for anything so equipment deteriates and the same goes for wages. 5. Working for the state is a dead end job money wise. ANd on and on Ed On Feb 7, 2015, at 6:50 PM, scott wrote: Which state agencies? Some out of work programmers would probably love to do some meaningful work. On 02/07/2015 01:01 PM, Anne Lynn Wheeler wrote: local news just had item about ancient software at state agencies, 619 major cobol applications developed in 80s ... frequent crashesoutages, almost impossible to maintain or change ... in part because of the lack of cobol programmers. The state is even considering setting up financial incentive for schools to produce cobol programmers. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: ancient cobol applications
Which state agencies? Some out of work programmers would probably love to do some meaningful work. On 02/07/2015 01:01 PM, Anne Lynn Wheeler wrote: local news just had item about ancient software at state agencies, 619 major cobol applications developed in 80s ... frequent crashesoutages, almost impossible to maintain or change ... in part because of the lack of cobol programmers. The state is even considering setting up financial incentive for schools to produce cobol programmers. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
