Re: 6tsch BoF

2013-08-05 Thread Randy Bush
What did you think of Pete Resnick's draft about hums. i like it a lot and have used it in other fora which are somewhat loose or confused about consensus. randy

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Peter Saint-Andre
On 8/4/13 4:41 PM, Hadriel Kaplan wrote: On Aug 3, 2013, at 7:25 PM, John C Klensin john-i...@jck.com wrote: First, probably to the when meetings begin part, but noting that someone who gets onto the audio a few minutes late is in exactly the same situation as someone who walks into the

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Dave Cridland
On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Peter Saint-Andre stpe...@stpeter.imwrote: I don't want to promise too much, but in time for Vancouver I'll probably finish some code that sends you all sorts of helpful information when you join the jabber room. There is a standardized room subject message but

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 08/05/2013 10:07 AM, Dave Cridland wrote: One such hoop might be acknowledging the (privately sent) Note Well message (thus equating XEP-0045 Participant with IETF Participant to some degree). Another might be that we tell them to go away if their XEP-0054 vCard doesn't include sufficient

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread SM
At 13:10 04-08-2013, Hadriel Kaplan wrote: OK, I'll bite. Why do you and Michael believe you need to have the slides 1 week in advance? One generation's bad behavior becomes the next generation's best practice. It would be appreciated if those slides could be made available in advance.

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Scott Brim
Right, but Fuyou was talking about *spoken* English being more challenging than written English (if you can't *read* English fairly quickly, drafts and mailing lists are impenetrable, and you're done in the IETF). I'm told that it's easier for non-native English speakers to read slides than to

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Aaron Yi DING
On 05/08/13 10:38, Scott Brim wrote: Right, but Fuyou was talking about *spoken* English being more challenging than written English (if you can't *read* English fairly quickly, drafts and mailing lists are impenetrable, and you're done in the IETF). I'm told that it's easier for

Re: Community Feedback: IETF Trust Agreement Issues

2013-08-05 Thread Olaf Kolkman
On Aug 3, 2013, at 8:48 AM, Chris Griffiths cgriffi...@gmail.com wrote: IETF Community, The IETF Trust Trustees would like feedback from the community on several issues: - We have received requests that we cannot accommodate and have consulted legal counsel to review our options

Re: [87attendees] procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Spencer Dawkins at IETF
On Monday, August 5, 2013, Aaron Yi DING wrote: On 05/08/13 10:38, Scott Brim wrote: Right, but Fuyou was talking about *spoken* English being more challenging than written English (if you can't *read* English fairly quickly, drafts and mailing lists are impenetrable, and you're done in

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Hadriel Kaplan
On Aug 5, 2013, at 5:28 AM, Stephen Farrell stephen.farr...@cs.tcd.ie wrote: I hope folks who invest effort in tooling try to make it all easier and not harder. Right now we don't have good tools that allow remote folks to easily provide live input (and maybe that's just because its a hard

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Scott Brim
On 08/05/13 07:31, Hadriel Kaplan allegedly wrote: Yup, afaict we were doing ok until IETF 87... but at least one anonymous jabber participant (named Guest) did remotely speak multiple times at the mic on one of the RAI working group sessions this past week (at RTCWEB if I recall). I was

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Yoav Nir
On Aug 5, 2013, at 2:43 PM, Scott Brim scott.b...@gmail.com wrote: On 08/05/13 07:31, Hadriel Kaplan allegedly wrote: Yup, afaict we were doing ok until IETF 87... but at least one anonymous jabber participant (named Guest) did remotely speak multiple times at the mic on one of the RAI

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Scott Brim
On 08/05/13 07:51, Yoav Nir allegedly wrote: On Aug 5, 2013, at 2:43 PM, Scott Brim scott.b...@gmail.com wrote: On 08/05/13 07:31, Hadriel Kaplan allegedly wrote: Yup, afaict we were doing ok until IETF 87... but at least one anonymous jabber participant (named Guest) did remotely speak

Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)

2013-08-05 Thread Abdussalam Baryun
I agree with you John, I also not objecting it but wanted more meaning into the report when I receive it, as I suggested before for clarifications. I don't think majority in IETF think it is meaningless so that is why I want to clarify the meaning and discuss what most may not want to discuss. If

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Hadriel Kaplan
On Aug 5, 2013, at 5:26 AM, SM s...@resistor.net wrote: At 13:10 04-08-2013, Hadriel Kaplan wrote: You have the agenda and drafts 2 weeks in advance. The slides aren't normative. Even I do not have the agenda two weeks in advance. Huh. Sounds like a WG Chair problem. I believe draft

Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)

2013-08-05 Thread Scott Brim
If one or two people are doing most of the posting to a list, that means something is out of balance. Summary statistics can be used as an indicator that something should be done to encourage diversity, or get people back on topic, etc.

Gen-ART IETF LC review of draft-allen-dispatch-imei-urn-as-instanceid-10

2013-08-05 Thread Roni Even
I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. For background on Gen-ART, please see the FAQ at http://wiki.tools.ietf.org/area/gen/trac/wiki/GenArtfaq. Please resolve these comments along with any other Last Call comments you may receive. Document:

Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)

2013-08-05 Thread Hadriel Kaplan
On Aug 5, 2013, at 8:03 AM, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with you John, I also not objecting it but wanted more meaning into the report when I receive it, as I suggested before for clarifications. It's just a weekly posting summary of raw stats - it's not a

Re: Community Feedback: IETF Trust Agreement Issues

2013-08-05 Thread Paul Hoffman
On Aug 5, 2013, at 4:08 AM, Olaf Kolkman o...@nlnetlabs.nl wrote: Does the community feel these are reasonable reasons to update the trust agreement? The answer to that question is: yes. It seems reasonable to open up the agreement in order to fulfill its purpose in reasonable,

Re: Community Feedback: IETF Trust Agreement Issues

2013-08-05 Thread Tobias Gondrom
+1 Tobias Gondrom Paul Hoffman paul.hoff...@vpnc.org wrote: On Aug 5, 2013, at 4:08 AM, Olaf Kolkman o...@nlnetlabs.nl wrote: Does the community feel these are reasonable reasons to update the trust agreement? The answer to that question is: yes. It seems reasonable to open up the

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Michael Richardson
Spencer Dawkins spencerdawkins.i...@gmail.com quoted Hadiel really poorly, which confused me as you who said this, but I think it was Hadriel now: OK, I'll bite. Why do you and Michael believe you need to have the slides 1 week in advance? 1) As a WG chair, I'd like to see the slides

Re: [Trustees] The Trust Agreement

2013-08-05 Thread Paul Hoffman
On Aug 5, 2013, at 7:29 AM, John C Klensin john-i...@jck.com wrote: As far as CC is concerned, I'm not persuaded that it meets out need but not persuaded that it would cause great harm for non-standards documents either. At the risk of opening up the paint cabinet inside the bike shed: what

Re: Community Feedback: IETF Trust Agreement Issues

2013-08-05 Thread Chris Griffiths
On Aug 5, 2013, at 7:08 AM, Olaf Kolkman o...@nlnetlabs.nl wrote: On Aug 3, 2013, at 8:48 AM, Chris Griffiths cgriffi...@gmail.com wrote: IETF Community, The IETF Trust Trustees would like feedback from the community on several issues: - We have received requests that we cannot

Re: [Trustees] The Trust Agreement

2013-08-05 Thread Noel Chiappa
From: Brian E Carpenter brian.e.carpen...@gmail.com Thanks for the careful explanations. I'll second that; it does seem that some tweaking may be in order. Clearly the Trust shouldn't have blanket permission to abandon or dispose of assets When the time comes to draft

Re: Anonymity versus Pseudonymity (was Re: [87attendees] procedural question with remote participation)

2013-08-05 Thread John C Klensin
--On Sunday, August 04, 2013 19:31 + Ted Lemon ted.le...@nominum.com wrote: If you came to the IETF and were working for company X, registered pseudonymously, and didn't disclose IPR belonging to you or company X, and then later company X sued someone for using their IPR, you and

Re: Last Call: draft-ietf-weirds-rdap-sec-04.txt (Security Services for the Registration Data Access Protocol) to Proposed Standard

2013-08-05 Thread Murray S. Kucherawy
Hi SM, thanks for your comments. I'm shepherding the document, so replies inline: On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 12:21 PM, SM s...@resistor.net wrote: According to Section 1, the Registration Data Access Protocol is a Lookup Format, JSON Responses and HTTP usage. This looks like a weird protocol

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread John C Klensin
Hi. I seem to have missed a lot of traffic since getting a few responses yesterday. I think the reasons why slides should be available well in advance of the meeting have been covered well by others. And, as others have suggested, I'm willing to see updates to those slides if things change in

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread James Polk
At 12:38 PM 8/5/2013, John C Klensin wrote: Hi. I seem to have missed a lot of traffic since getting a few responses yesterday. I think the reasons why slides should be available well in advance of the meeting have been covered well by others. And, as others have suggested, I'm willing to see

Re: [Trustees] The Trust Agreement

2013-08-05 Thread Brian E Carpenter
On 06/08/2013 03:11, Noel Chiappa wrote: From: Brian E Carpenter brian.e.carpen...@gmail.com Thanks for the careful explanations. I'll second that; it does seem that some tweaking may be in order. Clearly the Trust shouldn't have blanket permission to abandon or

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 08/05/2013 12:31 PM, Hadriel Kaplan wrote: but at least one anonymous jabber participant (named Guest) did remotely speak multiple times at the mic on one of the RAI working group sessions this past week (at RTCWEB if I recall). I was personally ok with it, but it was awkward. Ah. I

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread John C Klensin
--On Tuesday, August 06, 2013 02:06 +0100 Stephen Farrell stephen.farr...@cs.tcd.ie wrote: ... On 08/05/2013 06:38 PM, John C Klensin wrote: The reasons to discourage anonymity aren't just patent nonsense (although that should be sufficient and I rather like the pun). Thanks. The pun

Re: procedural question with remote participation

2013-08-05 Thread John Curran
On Aug 4, 2013, at 2:20 PM, John C Klensin john-i...@jck.com wrote: I also note that the 1 week cutoff that Michael suggests would, in most cases, eliminate had no choice without impeding WG progress as an excuse. A week in advance of the meeting, there should be time, if necessary to find

Last Call: draft-ietf-storm-ipsec-ips-update-03.txt (Securing Block Storage Protocols over IP: RFC 3723 Requirements Update for IPsec v3) to Proposed Standard

2013-08-05 Thread The IESG
The IESG has received a request from the STORage Maintenance WG (storm) to consider the following document: - 'Securing Block Storage Protocols over IP: RFC 3723 Requirements Update for IPsec v3' draft-ietf-storm-ipsec-ips-update-03.txt as Proposed Standard The IESG plans to make a decision

Document Action: 'Problem Statement: Overlays for Network Virtualization' to Informational RFC (draft-ietf-nvo3-overlay-problem-statement-04.txt)

2013-08-05 Thread The IESG
The IESG has approved the following document: - 'Problem Statement: Overlays for Network Virtualization' (draft-ietf-nvo3-overlay-problem-statement-04.txt) as Informational RFC This document is the product of the Network Virtualization Overlays Working Group. The IESG contact persons are

JOSE WG Virtual Interim Meeting Monday, August 19, 2013

2013-08-05 Thread IESG Secretary
The JOSE wg will hold a one hour virtual interim meeting on: Monday, 19 August 2013 at 2300 UTC (1900 EDT, 1600 PDT) A detailed agenda and webex instructions will follow on the jose mailing list. http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/jose/current/maillist.html

JSON WG Virtual Interim Meeting Wednesday August 21, 2013

2013-08-05 Thread IESG Secretary
The JSON Working Group will hold a virtual interim meeting on Wednesday August 21, 2013, at 1500 UTC. It will last for up to three hours. The agenda will be published soon, but it will basically be how to incorporate the topics that are now active on the list into the main document. (FWIW,