Mark;
As my mailer says;
[Charset utf-8 unsupported, skipping...]
you should learn that Unicode is not usable in international context
of IETF.
> > Unicode is not usable in international context.
> ...
>
> It would not be worth replying to these threadworn and repeated
> assertions by
James;
Trying to reply your mail, my mailer says:
[Charset Windows-1252 unsupported, skipping...]
so, could you learn not to Microsoft centric and to use proper charset
for the International discussion of IETF?
> While the discussion of the use of various character set is interesting
>
At 09:52 PM 3/20/2002 -0500, Edmon Chung wrote:
>An underlying question we must ask ourselves from all the discussions that
>have sprung up every now and then is:
and as luck would have it, the working group has asked itself that question
many times, so we need not pursue it again.
d/
---
While the discussion of the use of various character set is interesting
topic, one which is also of interest to IDN WG, such prolonged discussion
are better carried out in a forum which is dedicated to this, such as
[EMAIL PROTECTED], a list which is formed to talk about the
generic problem of I18
Erkki I. Kolehmainen;
> The use of local character sets (encoding) is doomed for particularly ww
> information interchange.
Interestingly enough, ww information interchange is working very
well with local character sets.
The reason is because only people sharing a language, a scripting
system a
We Should be Overcoming ICANN by Listening to Paul Baran
On June 23, 1995 Paul Baran, the inventor of packet networks gave a
talk at the MARCONI CENTENNIAL SYMPOSIUM Bologna, Italy. He end his
talk with four paragraphs that seven years later and after almost 4
years of ICANN read like prophecy
hows that?
joelja
On Wed, 20 Mar 2002, Ross Finlayson wrote:
> Could the people who are generating the multicast streams please increase
> the audio gain of the Channel 1 stream - it's a little low. (The Channel 2
> stream seems OK.)
>
> Ross.
>
--
-
Could the people who are generating the multicast streams please increase
the audio gain of the Channel 1 stream - it's a little low. (The Channel 2
stream seems OK.)
Ross.
So is teardown on a non-IETF day scheduled for 4am or 5am?
No, really: How long can the itnerant ex-attendee sit in the lounge and
be on line? Or, how long at the Britpub with the feed?
-George
PS I have been dying to ask: does anybody measure the size of the suspected
pool of local
Harald;
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Unicode is usable in some local context.
>
> Agreed. Note that "some" is changing to "many" as time goes on.
Irreleant, because some contexts are not compatible.
The point here is that there can be no universal context.
> > There is some unicode imp
Bluetooth SIG, Inc. is seeking a qualified candidate for the senior
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On Wed, Mar 20, 2002 at 08:23:15AM -0800, Tony Hain wrote:
>
> My question was directed at Noel's assertion that security requires a
> site border router as the implementation. Just because that may be
> cheaper than fixing all the current hosts, wouldn't we be better off in
> the long run if all
>From: "Peter Deutsch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> And if your objection to NATs ended there, I wouldn't have a problem
> with it. But instead of then working to change the protocols that break
> with NATs, you continue to insist, Canute-like, that you can turn back
> the tides and move the world back t
On Mar 20, "D. J. Bernstein" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> False. IDNA does _not_ work. IDNA causes interoperability failures. Mail
... with the current DNS resolvers in place...
OK, others have pointed out failures with things like SSL/HTTPS (which is
broken in several interesting way anyway f
> From: Peter Deutsch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Who was the Roman Senator who ended every speech with "Carthage must be
> destroyed"? You might take solace from the fact that eventually Carthage
> was destroyed, but the power struggles and cost of that conflict hurt
> Rome hugely in the process. Bett
> > if people understand that NATs allow them to run web and mail
> > clients from multiple machines but prevent them from running
> > most other apps, then I don't have any problem with it.
>
> And if your objection to NATs ended there, I wouldn't have a problem
> with it. But instead of then wo
g'day,
Keith Moore wrote:
>
> > But what do U say about people using it at home SOHO
>
> if people understand that NATs allow them to run web and mail
> clients from multiple machines but prevent them from running
> most other apps, then I don't have any problem with it.
And if your object
On Tuesday, March 19, 2002, at 07:17 PM, Keith Moore wrote:
>
> [...] The reason I'm upset about NATs is that they make it difficult to
> build distributed and peer-to-peer apps, and they encourage a model
> where the net is centrally controlled (not by a single center, but
> by a relatively small
> But what do U say about people using it at home SOHO
if people understand that NATs allow them to run web and mail
clients from multiple machines but prevent them from running
most other apps, then I don't have any problem with it.
again, the problem isn't that NATs exist, but that people
On Thu, Mar 21, 2002 at 03:07:53AM +0859, Masataka Ohta wrote:
> While marrying wih a Mexican woman is, if my wife and children allow,
> an fascinating idea, I'm saying, with your example (actually, European and
> Japanese contexts happen to be compatible, but to follow your
> example, let's assu
I agree
- Original Message -
From: "Meritt James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2002 9:11 AM
Subject: Re: Netmeeting - NAT issue
>
> See the problem? Lots of "That is not the problem, THIS is the REAL
> problem" and all too few doable solution
That sounds like running away from the problem .
U have enough IP addresses so not to worry about it ...
Deployment of that is going to take some time and how many ISP's
provide that ...???
IPV6 is running away from current problem not the solution ..
Vivek
- Original Messag
But what do U say about people using it at home SOHO
One is not going to buy 3 IP's if someone tries to use it at home.
The objective is to make Internet accessible to everybody at the least $ out
of pocket.
We should not forget that.
Vivek
- Original Message -
From: "Keith Moore" <[
> Just saying "unicode" is not enough to display "Ohta y Col_n" with
> japanese local unicode-based character set.
> Unicode is not useful in international context.
Most disagreements would disappear if all parties had identical
information in their posession. I belive that Unicode would cope wi
dropping a few mailing lists off the CC:
--On 21. mars 2002 00:57 +0859 Masataka Ohta
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Unicode is usable in some local context.
Agreed. Note that "some" is changing to "many" as time goes on.
>
> There is some unicode implementaion work in local contexts.
>
> Howeve
John;
> >Anyway, with the fix, there is no reason to prefer Unicode-based
> >local character sets, which is not widely used today, than existing
> >local character sets already used world wide.
>
> Of course there is. What do you do when someone wants to combine charsets
> from different natio
(caveat emptor: I have an end system^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H host bias)
There are several good reasons to have BOTH a border and end system
depth in defense.
>From an architectural view, the advantage of edge/border elements is
that they are in a better position to protect against
distributed/corre
>From: "james woodyatt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> I could be wrong about this, but I really believe this is the root cause
> of the NAT problem, not ignorant users or self-interested appliance
> vendors.
I don't believe that there's a NAT problem. There are many
NAT problems, and the opportunity t
>Since software doesn't have
>the same attention variability over time as humans,
The variability isn't as great, but it's certainly there. It's not that
the software's attention falters, but that the attention of the human who
has to maintain the system falters--and, when that happens, the so
>Anyway, with the fix, there is no reason to prefer Unicode-based
>local character sets, which is not widely used today, than existing
>local character sets already used world wide.
Of course there is. What do you do when someone wants to combine charsets
from different nations? For example, sa
Valdis.Kletnieks wrote:
> The host may be too stupid to protect itself - read Bugtraq
> or other similar
> lists for the gory details.
The fact that many hosts are too stupid to protect themselves is not a
reason to architecturally require that the border provide security. The
marketplace may fin
Kre;
> | IDNA does _not_ work, because Unicode does not work in International
> | context.
>
> This argument is bogus, and always has been. If (and where) unicode
> is defective, the right thing to do is to fix unicode.
Unicode is not usable in international context.
There is no unicode
>If there is a need to sponsor
>individual sessions so be it as long as that
[...]
>doesn't affect
>independance of technical discussions.
Howls Of Derisive Laughter, Bruce.
The one who pays the piper calls the tune. It might start out subtly, but
it would eventually degenerate into a pay-for-
>And many hotels *don't* include a free breakfast,
In fact, out of all the business trips I've ever made, I can remember only
one hotel (in London) that included breakfast (not counting "continental
breakfast", which is generally inedible). Getting breakfast in a hotel
restaurant usually take
Re attached:
The use of local character sets (encoding) is doomed for particularly ww
information interchange.
Local font crafting is quite another issue. With the newly introduced
capability in the UCS (ISO/IEC 10646) and Unicode to predefine sequences for
decomposed characters, font manufactur
Thus spake "Bonney Kooper" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> If the cost of running A PARTICULAR IETF meeting is
> concerned then it is true (this is what one would call
> the element view of the problem). But if you take the
> system view and consider the big picture, and try to
> see who is benefitting most
Ah, the WG items have low survivability. And what does THAT tell you?
Matt Crawford wrote:
>
> > > > essentially all of the work done at meetings happens in the hallways,
> > > > restaurants, and bars - when small groups of people get together ...
> > >
> > > Yes, I see. So much for the myth o
See the problem? Lots of "That is not the problem, THIS is the REAL
problem" and all too few doable solutions.
Throwing rocks is easy. Catching them is harder.
--
James W. Meritt CISSP, CISA
Booz | Allen | Hamilton
phone: (410) 684-6566
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