From http://www.ietf.org/meetings/0mtg-sites.txt:
Spring 2002 - 53rd IETF
March 17-22, 2002
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Host: TBD
Cheers,
Andy
From http://www.ietf.org/meetings/0mtg-sites.txt:
Spring 2002 - 53rd IETF
March 17-22, 2002
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Host: TBD
We could have wished for nicer weather, but everything else went
pretty well there.
At 07:18 AM 3/29/2001, Randy Bush wrote:
when will you be hosting?
I've done it 1.5 times myself. How about you?
2002, i believe. working on it now.
Good for you. I should mention that the one I hosted was a heck of a lot of
work. One of the results was that I now have a awful lot of
Kuala Lumpur which we just used for APRICOT 2001. Five-star hotel, the Pan
Pacific $63 per night. Pay $93 and you're on the Executive floor with free
breakfast, etc. The hotel is next to a convention center. Food was very
inexpensive, with the exception of alcohol (Muslim country so you'd
At 11:20 28/03/2001 -0500, Melinda Shore wrote:
The cost thing is, I think, misleading. Having
had the experience of having to go to many ETSI
meetings, I've found that apart from a few
incredibly expensive cities it's generally cheaper
to go to Europe than it is to travel in the US.
strangely,
Let's see, the price is right, the convention center has plenty of room,
there are loads of hotel rooms nearby. Hmm. Sounds great!
OK, I'll bite:
Kuala Lumpur which we just used for APRICOT 2001. Five-star hotel, the Pan
Pacific $63 per night.
Let's see, with the higher airfare and
At 07:32 PM 3/28/2001, Randy Bush wrote:
So Ole, Cisco will be hosting an IETF there when?
i think they co-hosted with qualcomm in san diego justthe other month.
when will you be hosting?
I've done it 1.5 times myself. How about you?
P.S., it was a joke Randy.
I have been reading these many excellent points for eleven days now. However, I note
that similar discussions occur after most IETFs. My own preference is that these
conversations not occur, since their (almost predictable) recurrence suggests that
this is more "venting" than "problem
Eric-
I therefore suggest that we
either discontinue these many threads or else we establish
something like POISED to actually do something to scratch
these nagging itches.
Not a bad idea on the face of it. However, I believe that the hosts play a
large role in determining where we
when will you be hosting?
I've done it 1.5 times myself. How about you?
2002, i believe. working on it now.
randy
a direct flight to Minneapolis from outside the
USA ? or San Diego ? It's not easy.
Regards,
Graham
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 12:31 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Deja Vu
[EMAIL PROTECTED
? It's not easy.
Regards,
Graham
-Original Message-
From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:Saturday, March 24, 2001 12:31 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Deja Vu
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Day) wrote on 20.03.01 in
v04220801b6dd4a484c1a
As long as about 2/3 of the IETF attendees are from North
America, 2/3 of the meetings should be in North America.
similar logic might apply to havana.
or, as long as 2/3 of the meetings are held in north america,
2/3 of the attendees will be from north america.
randy
From: Randy Bush [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "Donald E. Eastlake 3rd" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
References: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 08:26:15 -0500
As long as about 2/3 of the IETF attendees are from
--On Wednesday, 28 March, 2001 11:41 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
OK, so when are we going to move from having 2 meetings per
year in the USA ?
How about 1 per year in North / South America, 1 per year in
Asia / Australasia and 1 per year in Europe / Africa ?
Graham,
Subject to
To: Donald E. Eastlake 3rd
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Deja Vu
As long as about 2/3 of the IETF attendees are from North
America, 2/3 of the meetings should be in North America.
similar logic might apply to havana.
or, as long as 2/3 of the meetings are held in north america,
2/3
IETF meetings are held because they are beneficial to accomplishing
the work of the IETF, not to promoate some sort of internationalism.
Hmm. I thought the Internet was for everyone.
Keith
I reject this and believe the IETF should continue to optimize for the
accomplishment of its goals of good Internet Engineering rather than
political correctness.
of course. but part of good Internet Engineering is developing protocols
that meet the diverse needs of the entire Internet
h 24, 2001 12:31 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Deja Vu
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Day) wrote on 20.03.01 in
v04220801b6dd4a484c1a@[208.192.102.20]:
sorry, but this is a US centric comment. IETF is international, so
centrally located is an interesting question: center of
On Wed, Mar 28, 2001 at 09:30:50AM -0500, in message 2224339706.985771850@P2, John C
Klensin ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Re: RE: Deja Vu
[...]
on working-engineer attendance. To by cynical about it, one of
the attractions of Minneapolis in February or March, or (to pick
on a place we
with air fares as illogical as they are, it
isn't even a cost issue.
The cost thing is, I think, misleading. Having
had the experience of having to go to many ETSI
meetings, I've found that apart from a few
incredibly expensive cities it's generally cheaper
to go to Europe than it is to
I don't think internationalization of the Internet ==
internationalization of IETF meetings. Sorry if I wasn't clear.
Donald
From: Keith Moore [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
X-URI: http://www.cs.utk.edu/~moore/
To: "Donald E. Eastlake 3rd" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc: [EMAIL
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 28.03.01 in
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
2. Have you tried getting a direct flight to Minneapolis from outside the
USA ? or San Diego ? It's not easy.
My trusty timetable lookup offers "Napoli" when I ask for "Minneapolis".
Though it might not cover flights, I've never
London is well known to be
one of the most expensive cities in the world for hotel accommodation.
It would be a bad thing if clue was excluded because of the total cost
of a meeting being very high.
But hopefully IETF attendies are of the mindset that can forgo the
ensuite hotel room for BB
Supposedly we have a preference for developing ideas
and consensus on mailing lists. Many people have actually
achieved things in the IETF by being active on the mailing
lists without going to each and every IETF meeting. Perhaps
this argues in favor of moving an additional IETF meeting
out of
Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
[..]
But hopefully IETF attendies are of the mindset that can forgo the
ensuite hotel room for BB accomodation or the like.
In my experience IETF attendees care little about the room
itself, only that it is within short(ish) walking distance
of the meetings
Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
For travel planning purposes it's important to me that the location
of the London meeting be announced as early as possible. I doubt
very much I'll be staying in the conference hotel (or anywhere near
it), which means I need to book alternate accomodation as early
Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
But hopefully IETF attendies are of the mindset that can forgo the
ensuite hotel room for BB accomodation or the like.
[...]
For travel planning purposes it's important to me that the location
of the London meeting be announced as early as possible. I doubt
very
leo vegoda wrote:
On Wed, Mar 28, 2001 at 09:30:50AM -0500, in message 2224339706.985771850@P2, John
C Klensin ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Re: RE: Deja Vu
there to meet in a nice place where many of the attendees would
come and not participate. While it would presumably be
convenient
But, if you're not going to be staying in the conference hotel, you have
more options, and you can book without knowing precisely where the
conference hotel is.
But to do that sanely I want to be within walking distance of a
tube station that's on a direct line to the conference venue, thus
March 28, 2001 2:24 PM
Subject: Re: IETF Travel Woes (was Deja Vu)
Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
[..]
But hopefully IETF attendies are of the mindset that can forgo the
ensuite hotel room for BB accomodation or the like.
In my experience IETF attendees care little about the room
itself, on
At 03:25 PM 3/28/01 -0500, John Stracke wrote:
Actually, I see what John means; for many Americans, London is pretty much an ideal
foreign vacation.
My wife thinks so... but she is really looking forward to Japan.
But she has no plans on becoming being an IETF "tourist". :-)
Kurt
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wednesday, March 28, 2001 9:44 PM
Subject: Re: Deja Vu
with air fares as illogical as they are, it
isn't even a cost issue.
The cost thing is, I think, misleading. Having
had the experience of having to go to many ETSI
meetings, I've
At 10:26 PM 3/28/01 +0400, Baree Sunnyasi wrote:
Could we have an idea of how much did a participant spend in Minneapolis ?
Less the $1000 (excluding transportation and registration).
2/3 of that is hotel (6 nights).
.
Baree
-Original Message-
From: Melinda Shore [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wednesday, March 28, 2001 9:44 PM
Subject: Re: Deja Vu
with air fares as illogical as they are, it
isn't even a cost issue.
The cost thing is, I think, misleading. Having
OK, I'll bite:
Kuala Lumpur which we just used for APRICOT 2001. Five-star hotel, the Pan
Pacific $63 per night. Pay $93 and you're on the Executive floor with free
breakfast, etc. The hotel is next to a convention center. Food was very
inexpensive, with the exception of alcohol (Muslim country
Let's see, the price is right, the convention center has plenty of room,
there are loads of hotel rooms nearby. Hmm. Sounds great!
So Ole, Cisco will be hosting an IETF there when?
At 05:41 PM 3/28/2001, Ole J. Jacobsen wrote:
OK, I'll bite:
Kuala Lumpur which we just used for APRICOT 2001.
From: Lyndon Nerenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: IETF Travel Woes (was Deja Vu)
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:30:30 -0700
[...]
(BTW, if you want to reproduce the Minneapolis-in-winter
experience in Europe, I highly recommend Brighton in February.)
[...]
Just for the record
On Wed, 28 Mar 2001, Matt Holdrege wrote:
Let's see, the price is right, the convention center has plenty of room,
there are loads of hotel rooms nearby. Hmm. Sounds great!
So Ole, Cisco will be hosting an IETF there when?
That depends entirely on what is meant by "hosting." Events
Just to gild this particularly lily,
Breakfast came with the straight room fee and did not require the upgrade.
The 'budget' limo cost MYR66, which is roughly US$17. The budget cars are
plain and a bit run down, compared with the fancier limos.
Airfare to KL is notably cheaper than to
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Day) wrote on 20.03.01 in v04220801b6dd4a484c1a@[208.192.102.20]:
sorry, but this is a US centric comment. IETF is international, so
centrally located is an interesting question: center of the earth
(probably enough hot...;-))).
I'm not so sure. From what I hear
This is a rare case where I disagree with Phil. This is a good
location. Unfortunately, it wasn't cold enough to discourage the
usual gaggle of folks that haven't read the charter or the drafts
It seems pretty warm to me, and I'm walking down 6 blocks to the
cheaper hotel.
The real
At/ 12:52 2001-03-22 -0500, William Allen Simpson you wrote/vous criviez:
This is a rare case where I disagree with Phil. This is a good
location. Unfortunately, it wasn't cold enough to discourage the
usual gaggle of folks that haven't read the charter or the drafts
It seems pretty warm
The real problem has been DHCP (again).
use ipv6 ;-)))
i'm running IPv6-only laptop and having no problem at all.
there were issues with wireless basestations during the early part
of the week, but with help from John Richey "the wireless guy" of
Lucent, it works
At 12:52 PM -0500 3/22/01, William Allen Simpson wrote:
None of the Mac folks I've talked to have had any success with the
wireless DHCP. We have to hand configure.
You must run in a different circle of IETF Mac users. None of the
many that I know (including me) had any problem.
--Paul
On Thu, 22 Mar 2001, Paul Hoffman / IMC wrote:
At 12:52 PM -0500 3/22/01, William Allen Simpson wrote:
None of the Mac folks I've talked to have had any success with the
wireless DHCP. We have to hand configure.
You to set the ssid for the network you're on, it's not broadcast on this
None of the Mac folks I've talked to have had any success with the
wireless DHCP. We have to hand configure.
I had no problems with the DHCP on my Mac - often getting an address
long before many of the non-macs around me got addresses
Scott
Well, here I am at the Minneapolis IETF. And I'm overwhelmed by a sense
of deja vu.
Having to stay at the Marquette hotel 3+ blocks away because, living
on the west coast, I'm at least 50 milli-light-seconds farther away
than most of the people contending for the token number of on-site
hotel
The electronic outdoor temperature sign in the skyway reading
"39". The units aren't mentioned. Kelvins?
Wow!!! It must be Spring in Minneapolis. I hadn't realized it would
be so warm. Nice that it worked out that way.
The stockbroker's electronic sign showing the Dow trying to break
Even with Spring in MN, this is probably still a good idea. Or New
Orleans, at least it is warm and centrally located.
Central to population is probably somewhere in Asia. Do I need to
write an informational RFC documenting how the USA is not the
centre of the universe, let alone the
At/ 11:14 2001-03-20 -0500, John Day you wrote/vous criviez:
The electronic outdoor temperature sign in the skyway reading
"39". The units aren't mentioned. Kelvins?
Wow!!! It must be Spring in Minneapolis. I hadn't realized it would be so
warm. Nice that it worked out that way.
The
Can we please agree that there is no perfect place to hold the IETF and
stop this discussion?
Henk
On Tue, 20 Mar 2001, Marc Blanchet wrote:
At/À 11:14 2001-03-20 -0500, John Day you wrote/vous écriviez:
The electronic outdoor temperature sign in the skyway reading
"39". The units
Phil Karn writes:
The countless eateries in said skyway that (even when the skyway is
open) always seem to be closed whenever you're looking for food.
I think the best place to eat in Mpls is at Kypros Restaurant, 14th
and Nicollet...right by the convention center. It is Greek/Cypriot
John Day wrote:
[..]
Or New
Orleans, at least it is warm and centrally located.
Or for equally painful travel for almost everyone, yet
still well IP connected, can't beat Australia :)
cheers,
gja
Even with Spring in MN, this is probably still a good idea. Or New
Orleans, at least it is warm and centrally located.
How about San Antonio? We're a pretty serious convention city, and
I'd actually be able to attend a meeting for once. Plus, we have no
winter to speak of (although summer
At 10:10 AM -0500 3/20/01, Phil Karn wrote:
The stockbroker's electronic sign showing the Dow trying to break
10,000.
What's really ironic in your mentioning this (in a deju vu thread) is that
the Dow first hit and closed above 10,000 when we were here in 1999. I
remember watching for it on
"Phil" == Phil Karn [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Phil Having to stay at the Marquette hotel 3+ blocks away because,
Phil living on the west coast, I'm at least 50 milli-light-seconds
I'm one of the lucky...
One thing that people might consider is going more than one to a room.
From: "Grenville Armitage" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Or for equally painful travel for almost everyone, yet
still well IP connected, can't beat Australia :)
Please, no, not again. The ICANN meeting in Melbourne was
more than enough.
I second the Las Vegas idea :-)
Christopher
sorry, but this is a US centric comment. IETF is international, so
centrally located is an interesting question: center of the earth
(probably enough hot...;-))).
I'm not so sure. From what I hear from the EU and Pacific Rim
countries, the Internet is a US plot intended at further imposing
Lloyd Wood wrote:
Don't call it that. It's officially the area known as 'sub-polar'.
Lots of drafts if you leave the door open just a fraction too - they
get everywhere.
Certainly observed to be a feature of MPLS.
(122 of them in the current draft repository...)
Leslie.
--
At 11.14 -0500 01-03-20, John Day wrote:
Even with Spring in MN, this is probably still a good idea. Or New
Orleans, at least it is warm and centrally located.
Centrally of what?
Patrik -- Stockholm
PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 11:26 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Deja Vu
From: "Grenville Armitage" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Or for equally painful travel for almost everyone, yet
still well IP connected, can't beat Australia :)
Please, no, not again. The ICANN meeting in
You are absolutely right, and that's why we should continue this
discussion! I'm somewhat bored that I mostly only get to make trips
to the US. Most cities look pretty much the same, etc. I'd rather
have meetings in a changing continent principle, like I've never
been Africa or Asia or Southern
kinda dark... but they already have multicast.
joelja
On Tue, 20 Mar 2001, Bill Manning wrote:
Lule' in January anyone?
--
--
Joel Jaeggli [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Academic User Services
%
% At 11.14 -0500 01-03-20, John Day wrote:
% Even with Spring in MN, this is probably still a good idea. Or New
% Orleans, at least it is warm and centrally located.
%
% Centrally of what?
%
%Patrik -- Stockholm
%
Lule' in January anyone?
--
--bill
This discussion seems to get rehashed in one form or another everytime we
have a meeting it seems...
due consideration when hosting the meeting in the US (or anywhere else)
involves placing it in a location with major international air-routes to
the pacific rim and europe (and the US if
Bill Manning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Lule' in January anyone?
Jukkasjrvi. The Ice Hotel. I guess that we can have hotel rooms made
on order...
--bill
--Johnny
At 12.50 -0800 01-03-20, Bill Manning wrote:
%
% At 11.14 -0500 01-03-20, John Day wrote:
% Even with Spring in MN, this is probably still a good idea. Or New
% Orleans, at least it is warm and centrally located.
%
% Centrally of what?
%
%Patrik -- Stockholm
%
Lule' in January anyone?
FYI:
What's really ironic in your mentioning this (in a deju vu thread) is
that the Dow first hit and closed above 10,000 when we were here in
1999. I remember watching for it on (probably) the same sign.
Gee, you noticed this too, huh?
As for the "US-centric" accusations, I have no problem with
Guys,
I've lived in Lule a substantial part of my life.
Moved to Tucson, AZ after a winter with -43 C (about -47 F).
I fear we would lose a large fraction of the IETF crowd if we
did Lule in January. Seems like the wrong kind of darwinian
selection to apply!
Micke D
At 11:11 PM 3/20/01
[ From: Joel Jaeggli [EMAIL PROTECTED] ]
[ Date: 12:54 (-0800), Mar 20, 2001 ]
This discussion seems to get rehashed in one form or
another everytime we have a meeting it seems...
due consideration when hosting the meeting in the US
(or anywhere else) involves
At 03:14 PM 3/20/2001, Phil Karn wrote:
What's really ironic in your mentioning this (in a deju vu thread) is
that the Dow first hit and closed above 10,000 when we were here in
1999. I remember watching for it on (probably) the same sign.
Gee, you noticed this too, huh?
As for the
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