Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

2009-01-21 Thread Scott Calvin
Hi Umesh, At first, that seems to me like a very odd thing to do. What motivates it in your case? I say that because the cumulant expansion is a series expansion like, for example, a Taylor expansion: each successive term is typically supposed to be a smaller correction than the previous

Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

2009-01-21 Thread Frenkel, Anatoly
Hi Scott, Third cumulant in your example will not be zero because this arrangement is symmetric only on the average. Locally, the interatomic pair potential (and the cumulants are the measures of the effective pair potential) which is the sum of the two potentials - between the interestitial

Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

2009-01-21 Thread Scott Calvin
Hi Anatoly, Your example is a slightly different model than the one I just suggested. I'm taking the limit in which the lattice atoms are fixed in place. In that case, symmetry demands the third cumulant to be zero. In a case such as you describe, the lattice atoms themselves can move

Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

2009-01-21 Thread Scott Calvin
Thanks, Matt--you said that much more clearly than I did. I'd add that, personally, I avoid using cumulants to account for unresolved features when possible. For example, suppose that a central metal atom is coordinated to six oxygen atoms in an octahedral arrangement. But suppose also that

Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

2009-01-21 Thread Frenkel, Anatoly
Matt, Scott: There is a situation in one dimensional world, not so practically useful though, where the third cumulant is zero. It describes the 1st nearest neighbor interaction between a central atom (x) in the group of three atoms: A-x-A. Indeed, here the third cumulant is zero, the

Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

2009-01-21 Thread Scott Calvin
Anatoly, You're right--3 dimensions ruins my symmetry argument. My mistake. On the other hand, I still suspect that there exists a realistic case where forcing the third cumulant to zero cause a much smaller increase in chi-square than forcing the fourth cumulant to zero; e.g., a broad,

Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

2009-01-21 Thread Frenkel, Anatoly
Hi Scott, It could be an interesting direction, to use these type of lattice calculations to predict, as you suggested, what type of structures (or host compounds, for dopands), will, if not make it zero, which is probably impossible, but minimize third cumulant. Thus, it may be a rational