Thanks, Rawat ji. Yes, you may be right (though I am not sure) as per GBIF <https://www.gbif.org/occurrence/gallery?taxon_key=5404227> specimens (nothing in it from India): https://www.gbif.org/occurrence/2563638673 (this looks the closest) https://www.gbif.org/occurrence/437793964 https://api.gbif.org/v1/image/unsafe/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kew.org%2Fherbcatimg%2F366640.jpg
On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 at 17:34, D.S Rawat <drdsrawat.alpin...@gmail.com> wrote: > To me the images posted by Narendra Joshi Ji are closer to *S. glacialis* > or allied species in which plants are woolly in appearance. > *S. bracteata* as I understand and as mentioned in indian floristic > literature and also in the book by Stainton (Supplement to Flowers of the > Himalaya, plate-55), is a plant with distinct erect stem and long > lanceolate leaves. It resembles *S. obvallata* in habit. > *S. bracteata* and *S. schultzii* may be two separate species but Indian > literature has merged them into *S. bracteata*. These may be different > species but must be closer in morphology based on which indian literature > merges them together. > Both of these species (*S.bracteata* or *S. schultzii*) do not resemble > the images posted by Joshi Ji. > > DSRawat, Pantnagar > > ------------------------------------------------------- > Dr D.S. Rawat > Department of Biological Sciences, G.B. Pant University of Agriculture & > Technology Pantnagar-263 145 Uttarakhand, INDIA > *eflorapantnagar* <https://sites.google.com/site/eflorapantnagar/home> > displaying wild flora of Pantnagar > > > On Sat, Nov 21, 2020 at 5:14 PM J.M. Garg <jmga...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Saussurea bracteata >> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 at 16:52, D.S Rawat <drdsrawat.alpin...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Is the species posted by Narendra Joshi Ji is *Saussurea bracteata/ S. >>> shultzii* ? >>> >>> DSRawat Pantnagar >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Dr D.S. Rawat >>> Department of Biological Sciences, G.B. Pant University of Agriculture & >>> Technology Pantnagar-263 145 Uttarakhand, INDIA >>> *eflorapantnagar* <https://sites.google.com/site/eflorapantnagar/home> >>> displaying wild flora of Pantnagar >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Nov 21, 2020 at 4:43 PM Saroj Kasaju <kasajusa...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> Thank you Mr. Garg. Finally ID is resolved! Now we have to separate two >>>> sp. >>>> >>>> Saroj Kasaju >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sat, Nov 21, 2020 at 3:24 PM J.M. Garg <jmga...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> After going through the specimens in GBIF >>>>> <https://www.gbif.org/occurrence/gallery?country=IN&taxon_key=9576936> >>>>> from >>>>> India, I think it is Saussurea bracteata (Pl. ignore the specimens of S >>>>> schultzii shown here in GBIF): >>>>> https://www.gbif.org/occurrence/2620000459 >>>>> https://www.gbif.org/occurrence/2873912368 >>>>> >>>>> https://api.gbif.org/v1/image/unsafe/https%3A%2F%2Fquod.lib.umich.edu%2Fcgi%2Fi%2Fimage%2Fapi%2Fimage%2Fherb00ic%3A1539372%3AMICH-V-1539372%2Ffull%2Fres%3A0%2F0%2Fnative.jpg >>>>> >>>>> https://api.gbif.org/v1/image/unsafe/https%3A%2F%2Fquod.lib.umich.edu%2Fcgi%2Fi%2Fimage%2Fapi%2Fimage%2Fherb00ic%3A1539387%3AMICH-V-1539387%2Ffull%2Fres%3A0%2F0%2Fnative.jpg >>>>> *Saussurea nana* (Pamp.) Pamp. >>>>> <http://www.plantsoftheworldonline.org/taxon/urn:lsid:ipni.org:names:242472-1> >>>>> is >>>>> treated as a syn. of *Saussurea bracteata *DC. by POWO >>>>> <http://www.plantsoftheworldonline.org/taxon/urn:lsid:ipni.org:names:242115-1> >>>>> (They >>>>> have wrongly shown specimen of S schultzii here). >>>>> Also matches the description as given in the book link sent by Tabish >>>>> ji and Saroj ji (I think from FBI). >>>>> >>>>> Specimens of S schultzii from India look different as per GBIF >>>>> <https://www.gbif.org/occurrence/gallery?country=IN&taxon_key=5404606> >>>>> : >>>>> >>>>> https://api.gbif.org/v1/image/unsafe/https%3A%2F%2Fquod.lib.umich.edu%2Fcgi%2Fi%2Fimage%2Fapi%2Fimage%2Fherb00ic%3A1539366%3AMICH-V-1539366%2Ffull%2Fres%3A0%2F0%2Fnative.jpg >>>>> >>>>> https://api.gbif.org/v1/image/unsafe/http%3A%2F%2Fmediaphoto.mnhn.fr%2Fmedia%2F1444240236496zVd9dnPkf7ZrLca3 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, 19 Nov 2020 at 18:22, Saroj Kasaju <kasajusa...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> This specimen looks like S schultzii according to the book of Klimes >>>>>> and Dickore. >>>>>> Some links they have merged but POWO, Klimes and Dickore book and >>>>>> listing , >>>>>> IPNI and BHL treats them separately. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thank you. >>>>>> >>>>>> Saroj Kasaju >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Nov 19, 2020 at 6:30 PM D.S Rawat < >>>>>> drdsrawat.alpin...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> http://apps.kew.org/herbcat/getImage.do?imageBarcode=K000891799 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Saussurea bracteata specimen in Kew Herbarium >>>>>>> >>>>>>> DSRawat Pantnagar >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Thu, 19 Nov, 2020, 5:27 pm Saroj Kasaju, <kasajusa...@gmail.com> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Re: Saussurea bracteata >>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/g/indiantreepix/c/yg9ImvP4yTE/m/3XZA5wn0AgAJ> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Saroj Kasaju >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Thu, Nov 19, 2020 at 3:04 PM J.M. Garg <jmga...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Looks different from images at Saussurea bracteata >>>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/species/a---l/ar/asteraceae/carduoideae/saussurea/saussurea-bracteata> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Tue, 17 Nov 2020 at 15:51, J.M. Garg <jmga...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Saussurea bracteata Decne. ?? >>>>>>>>>> Thank you >>>>>>>>>> Saroj Kasaju >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >>>>>>>>>> From: J.M. Garg <jmga...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2016 at 20:48 >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Fwd: [efloraofindia:253131] Kailash-Manasarovar >>>>>>>>>> Yatra::Saussurea inversa NSJ-OCT 16/11 >>>>>>>>>> To: efloraofindia <indiantreepix@googlegroups.com> >>>>>>>>>> Cc: D.S Rawat <drdsrawat.alpin...@gmail.com>, < >>>>>>>>>> chrischadwell...@btinternet.com>, Narendra Joshi < >>>>>>>>>> narend...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Forwarding again for Id assistance please. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Some earlier relevant feedback: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Interesting Saussurea species. A trans-Himalayan one as I suppose. >>>>>>>>>> S. inversa is not known in Uttarakhand. >>>>>>>>>> DSRawat Pantnagar >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> This is a new 'species' for me but I am doubtful it is >>>>>>>>>> *S.inversa* on the basis of the image taken in Paddar Valley >>>>>>>>>> named as such on the FOI site see: >>>>>>>>>> http://www.flowersofindia.net/catalog/slides/Inverse%20Snow%20Lotus.html >>>>>>>>>> which is presumably where the provisional name came from matching >>>>>>>>>> with? >>>>>>>>>> Not recorded from Ladakh or known in Stewart's day (assuming it is >>>>>>>>>> found in >>>>>>>>>> W.Himalaya). Not in 'Enumeration of Flowering Plants of Nepal'. >>>>>>>>>> Many >>>>>>>>>> 'new' species have been described in the Himalaya in recent decades >>>>>>>>>> - a >>>>>>>>>> complicated genus (like so many). >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> As for existing species, there is much confusion between >>>>>>>>>> *S.simpsoniana* and *S.gossypiphora* in the W.Himalaya. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> As two of our members named the image on the FOI site they are in >>>>>>>>>> a much better position to comment further, especially as I do not >>>>>>>>>> recognise >>>>>>>>>> these images or the one from the Paddar Valley but the images do not >>>>>>>>>> come >>>>>>>>>> close to me. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Just noticed that an article on Research Gate, see: >>>>>>>>>> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/272383552_The_genus_Saussurea_Compositae_Cardueae_in_China_Taxonomic_and_nomenclatural_notes >>>>>>>>>> states that *S.sorocephala* var. glabrata is raised to specific >>>>>>>>>> rank as *S.inversa*. Stewart had *S.sorocephala* Schrenk as a >>>>>>>>>> synonym of *S.gnaphalodes* (which is common in Laadkh); he >>>>>>>>>> thought this variety seemed to be the same as *S.hypsipeta* >>>>>>>>>> Diels (yet does not list this species in his Catalogue) and probably >>>>>>>>>> should >>>>>>>>>> be considered only to be a glabrate form. *Saussurea hypsipeta* >>>>>>>>>> is listed by Dickore & Klimes from Ladakh - there is an excellent >>>>>>>>>> image of >>>>>>>>>> it by our member Miroslav: >>>>>>>>>> http://www.butbn.cas.cz/ladakh/fotky/flora/subnival_eng.html. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Clearly, Miroslav may be able to comment in a more informed way >>>>>>>>>> than me. >>>>>>>>>> --- from Chris Chadwell ji. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> To me it appears close to *Saussurea glacialis* Herder >>>>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/species/a---l/ar/asteraceae/carduoideae/saussurea/saussurea-glacialis> >>>>>>>>>> as >>>>>>>>>> per image herein. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>>>>>>>>> From: Narendra Joshi <narend...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>> Date: 6 October 2016 at 22:48 >>>>>>>>>> Subject: [efloraofindia:253131] Kailash-Manasarovar >>>>>>>>>> Yatra::Saussurea inversa NSJ-OCT 16/11 >>>>>>>>>> To: indiantreepix <indiantreepix@googlegroups.com> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Dear All, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Saussurea inversa for validation. Photo taken just after crossing >>>>>>>>>> Lipulekh pass (China border) on Aug 27, 2016. Height approx 15000 >>>>>>>>>> feet. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> With Regards, >>>>>>>>>> Narendra Joshi >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>>>> send an email to indiantreepix+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>>>>>> indiantreepix@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix >>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> With regards, >>>>>>>>>> J.M.Garg >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna' >>>>>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia >>>>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/award-for-efloraofindia> >>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of >>>>>>>>>> Indian Flora, please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group >>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/indiantreepix> (largest >>>>>>>>>> in the world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or >>>>>>>>>> Efloraofindia >>>>>>>>>> website <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/> (with a >>>>>>>>>> species database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images). >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The whole world uses my Image Resource >>>>>>>>>> <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg> of more >>>>>>>>>> than a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, >>>>>>>>>> Butterflies, >>>>>>>>>> Plants etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use >>>>>>>>>> them >>>>>>>>>> for free as per Creative Commons license attached with each image. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common >>>>>>>>>> Birds of India'. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> With regards, >>>>>>>>>> J.M.Garg >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> With regards, >>>>>>>>> J.M.Garg >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> With regards, >>>>> J.M.Garg >>>>> >>>> >> >> -- >> With regards, >> J.M.Garg >> > -- With regards, J.M.Garg -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to indiantreepix+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web, visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/indiantreepix/CA%2BiuSFC8UW3o-0Jo7CN7VTu_4M4Ffptu-9xinfcS2Rh9WLSUNA%40mail.gmail.com.
