Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Bron Gondwana]

What does the syslog say?

Since you're on 2.4.x, you an add 'auditlog: yes' to the imapd.conf and get even
more syslog goodness.

Bron.

On Thu, Sep 10, 2015, at 01:33, Patrick Boutilier wrote:
> On 09/09/2015 12:03 PM, Robert T. Covell wrote:
> > We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content
> > in a mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes).
> >
> > CentOS release 6.5
> >
> > Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6
> >
> > A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail
> > repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared
> > across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.
> >
> > At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the
> > action is denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the
> > mailbox (cached).  Upon further review everything is gone for that
> > mailbox including: cyrus.cache, cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups
> > contain everything including past emails and the core Cyrus files.  If
> > the mailbox contained other mailboxes they are not affected.
> > Reconstructing it corrects the issue, luckily our backups do not
> > propagate deletes.
> >
> > Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.
> > The content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and
> > have never seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but
> > I can’t identify what that would be.
> >
> > Any insight would be appreciated.
> >
> > ___
> > Robert Covell
> > Rolet Hosting & Interactive
> > www.rolet.com
> >
> 
> 
> 
> My first thought was that somebody was downloading and deleting all the 
> mail using POP but the fact that the cyrus.* files disappear suggests 
> that something is deleting at the OS level.
> 
> Cyrus Home Page: http://www.cyrusimap.org/
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> Email had 1 attachment:
> + boutilpj.vcf
>   1k (text/x-vcard)


-- 
  Bron Gondwana
  br...@fastmail.fm

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Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Paolo Cravero]

Hello.

> A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail
> repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared
> across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.

Have you checked the size of your cyrus.cache and other metadata files? See
.
Even if the reporting process was squatter, mailbox was behaving
erratically.

Probably not the solution, but worth checking since account is large.
Paolo

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Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Patrick Boutilier]

On 09/09/2015 12:03 PM, Robert T. Covell wrote:

We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content
in a mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes).

CentOS release 6.5

Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6

A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail
repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared
across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.

At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the
action is denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the
mailbox (cached).  Upon further review everything is gone for that
mailbox including: cyrus.cache, cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups
contain everything including past emails and the core Cyrus files.  If
the mailbox contained other mailboxes they are not affected.
Reconstructing it corrects the issue, luckily our backups do not
propagate deletes.

Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.
The content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and
have never seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but
I can’t identify what that would be.

Any insight would be appreciated.

___
Robert Covell
Rolet Hosting & Interactive
www.rolet.com





My first thought was that somebody was downloading and deleting all the 
mail using POP but the fact that the cyrus.* files disappear suggests 
that something is deleting at the OS level.
<>
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Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[signaldeveloper]

Is the user in the RC db still? Are the folders displaying properly in 
Roundxube and they are just empty?



> On Sep 9, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Robert T. Covell  wrote:
> 
> We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content in a 
> mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes). 
>  
> CentOS release 6.5
> Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6
>  
> A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail 
> repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared 
> across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.
>  
> At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the action 
> is denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the mailbox (cached). 
>  Upon further review everything is gone for that mailbox including: 
> cyrus.cache, cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups contain everything including 
> past emails and the core Cyrus files.  If the mailbox contained other 
> mailboxes they are not affected.  Reconstructing it corrects the issue, 
> luckily our backups do not propagate deletes.
>  
> Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.  The 
> content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and have never 
> seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but I can’t 
> identify what that would be.
>  
> Any insight would be appreciated.
>  
> ___
> Robert Covell
> Rolet Hosting & Interactive
> www.rolet.com
>  
> 
> Cyrus Home Page: http://www.cyrusimap.org/
> List Archives/Info: http://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/pipermail/info-cyrus/
> To Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/info-cyrus

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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Robert T. Covell]

I have verified that the user is allowed to delete the mailbox.  If I change it 
at the root level will it propagate down?  If not how can this be done without 
writing a script?  As stated before they have thousands of folders.

___
Robert Covell
Rolet Hosting & Interactive
www.rolet.com 

-Original Message-
From: info-cyrus-bounces+rcovell=rolet@lists.andrew.cmu.edu 
[mailto:info-cyrus-bounces+rcovell=rolet@lists.andrew.cmu.edu] On Behalf Of 
Joseph Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2015 2:09 PM
To: info-cyrus@lists.andrew.cmu.edu
Subject: RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content



--On September 9, 2015 at 13:49:40 -0500 "Robert T. Covell" 
<rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:

> That is the problem.  I cannot reproduce (reliably or at all).  It 
> might be months before we hear about it.  It has been happening for 
> about two years.  Always chalked it up to user error.  But I can't say 
> that it is or isn't.
>

Check the ACL on the mailbox and make sure no user has permission to delete the 
mailbox-- no "x" right. Loss of all content including the cyrus* files is 
mailbox deletion. (This is the voice of experience talking)

Too bad you didn't implement delayed delete. You can just rename the deleted 
folder to its original name.


Joseph Brennan
Columbia University Information Technology




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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Joseph Brennan]

--On September 9, 2015 at 5:06:34 PM -0500 "Robert T. Covell" 
 wrote:

> I have verified that the user is allowed to delete the mailbox.  If I
> change it at the root level will it propagate down?  If not how can this
> be done without writing a script?  As stated before they have thousands
> of folders.


In cyradm you can use * as a wildcard.

If the names start with "foo" and "." is the separator and "user" is the 
user, you can do:

> sam foo.* user lrswikte

Possibly you have "/" not "." but it's the same idea. "lrswikte" is 
everything except "x".

Joseph Brennan
Columbia University Information Technology





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Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Dan White]

If you can reliably reproduce the problem on a test account, enable
telemetry logging to capture what the client is doing.

On 09/09/15 13:07 -0500, Robert T. Covell wrote:
>Nope.  On the original user they might have a cached view.  So to them it 
>looks like there is no issue until they try to interact with the folder.  If 
>you were to go to a new/fresh client it is empty (minus potential sub-folders).
>
>-Original Message-
>From: signaldevelo...@gmail.com [mailto:signaldevelo...@gmail.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2015 1:02 PM
>To: Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com>
>Cc: info-cyrus@lists.andrew.cmu.edu
>Subject: Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content
>
>And if you connect some type of IMAP client up to the account do the messages 
>show?
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 9, 2015, at 1:18 PM, Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:
>>
>> Is the user in the RC db still? Are the folders displaying properly in 
>> Roundxube and they are just empty?
>>
>>
>> On Sep 9, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:
>> We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content in a 
>> mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes).
>>
>> CentOS release 6.5
>> Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6
>>
>> A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail 
>> repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared 
>> across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.
>>
>> At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the action 
>> is denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the mailbox 
>> (cached).  Upon further review everything is gone for that mailbox 
>> including: cyrus.cache, cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups contain 
>> everything including past emails and the core Cyrus files.  If the mailbox 
>> contained other mailboxes they are not affected.  Reconstructing it corrects 
>> the issue, luckily our backups do not propagate deletes.
>>
>> Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.  The 
>> content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and have 
>> never seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but I can’t 
>> identify what that would be.
>>
>> Any insight would be appreciated.

-- 
Dan White

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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Robert T. Covell]

That is the problem.  I cannot reproduce (reliably or at all).  It might be 
months before we hear about it.  It has been happening for about two years.  
Always chalked it up to user error.  But I can't say that it is or isn't.

-Original Message-
From: Dan White [mailto:dwh...@olp.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2015 1:44 PM
To: Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com>
Cc: signaldevelo...@gmail.com; info-cyrus@lists.andrew.cmu.edu
Subject: Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

If you can reliably reproduce the problem on a test account, enable telemetry 
logging to capture what the client is doing.

On 09/09/15 13:07 -0500, Robert T. Covell wrote:
>Nope.  On the original user they might have a cached view.  So to them it 
>looks like there is no issue until they try to interact with the folder.  If 
>you were to go to a new/fresh client it is empty (minus potential sub-folders).
>
>-Original Message-
>From: signaldevelo...@gmail.com [mailto:signaldevelo...@gmail.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2015 1:02 PM
>To: Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com>
>Cc: info-cyrus@lists.andrew.cmu.edu
>Subject: Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content
>
>And if you connect some type of IMAP client up to the account do the messages 
>show?
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 9, 2015, at 1:18 PM, Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:
>>
>> Is the user in the RC db still? Are the folders displaying properly in 
>> Roundxube and they are just empty?
>>
>>
>> On Sep 9, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:
>> We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content in a 
>> mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes).
>>
>> CentOS release 6.5
>> Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6
>>
>> A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail 
>> repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared 
>> across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.
>>
>> At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the action 
>> is denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the mailbox 
>> (cached).  Upon further review everything is gone for that mailbox 
>> including: cyrus.cache, cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups contain 
>> everything including past emails and the core Cyrus files.  If the mailbox 
>> contained other mailboxes they are not affected.  Reconstructing it corrects 
>> the issue, luckily our backups do not propagate deletes.
>>
>> Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.  The 
>> content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and have 
>> never seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but I can’t 
>> identify what that would be.
>>
>> Any insight would be appreciated.

--
Dan White

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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Joseph Brennan]

--On September 9, 2015 at 13:49:40 -0500 "Robert T. Covell" 
 wrote:

> That is the problem.  I cannot reproduce (reliably or at all).  It might
> be months before we hear about it.  It has been happening for about two
> years.  Always chalked it up to user error.  But I can't say that it is
> or isn't.
>

Check the ACL on the mailbox and make sure no user has permission to delete 
the mailbox-- no "x" right. Loss of all content including the cyrus* files 
is mailbox deletion. (This is the voice of experience talking)

Too bad you didn't implement delayed delete. You can just rename the 
deleted folder to its original name.


Joseph Brennan
Columbia University Information Technology




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Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[signaldeveloper]

And if you connect some type of IMAP client up to the account do the messages 
show? 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 9, 2015, at 1:18 PM, Robert T. Covell  wrote:
> 
> Is the user in the RC db still? Are the folders displaying properly in 
> Roundxube and they are just empty?
> 
> 
> On Sep 9, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Robert T. Covell  wrote:
> We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content in a 
> mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes).  
>  
> CentOS release 6.5
> Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6
>  
> A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail 
> repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared 
> across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.
>  
> At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the action 
> is denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the mailbox (cached). 
>  Upon further review everything is gone for that mailbox including: 
> cyrus.cache, cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups contain everything including 
> past emails and the core Cyrus files.  If the mailbox contained other 
> mailboxes they are not affected.  Reconstructing it corrects the issue, 
> luckily our backups do not propagate deletes.
>  
> Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.  The 
> content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and have never 
> seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but I can’t 
> identify what that would be.
>  
> Any insight would be appreciated.
>  
> ___
> Robert Covell
> Rolet Hosting & Interactive
> www.rolet.com 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, the folders do still display but are empty.  If the folder had children 
> they are not affected, just the primary contents of the folder in question.

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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Robert T. Covell]

Is the user in the RC db still? Are the folders displaying properly in 
Roundxube and they are just empty?


On Sep 9, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Robert T. Covell  wrote:
We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content in a 
mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes).  
 
CentOS release 6.5
Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6
 
A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail repository 
for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared across all users 
in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.
 
At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the action is 
denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the mailbox (cached).  
Upon further review everything is gone for that mailbox including: cyrus.cache, 
cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups contain everything including past emails 
and the core Cyrus files.  If the mailbox contained other mailboxes they are 
not affected.  Reconstructing it corrects the issue, luckily our backups do not 
propagate deletes.
 
Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.  The 
content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and have never 
seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but I can’t identify 
what that would be.
 
Any insight would be appreciated.
 
___
Robert Covell
Rolet Hosting & Interactive
www.rolet.com 



Yes, the folders do still display but are empty.  If the folder had children 
they are not affected, just the primary contents of the folder in question.

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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Robert T. Covell]

Nope.  On the original user they might have a cached view.  So to them it looks 
like there is no issue until they try to interact with the folder.  If you were 
to go to a new/fresh client it is empty (minus potential sub-folders).  

-Original Message-
From: signaldevelo...@gmail.com [mailto:signaldevelo...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2015 1:02 PM
To: Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com>
Cc: info-cyrus@lists.andrew.cmu.edu
Subject: Re: Disappearing Mailbox Content

And if you connect some type of IMAP client up to the account do the messages 
show? 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 9, 2015, at 1:18 PM, Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:
> 
> Is the user in the RC db still? Are the folders displaying properly in 
> Roundxube and they are just empty?
> 
> 
> On Sep 9, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Robert T. Covell <rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:
> We have an odd situation that I cannot track down regarding all content in a 
> mailbox disappearing (minus sub mailboxes).  
>  
> CentOS release 6.5
> Cyrus IMAP v2.4.17-Invoca-RPM-2.4.17-6.el6
>  
> A while back we setup a Cyrus install for a client to use as a mail 
> repository for customer contact.  They have one account which is shared 
> across all users in the office.  Approximate size of the account is 85GB.
>  
> At times when a user tries to move email into a Customers mailbox the action 
> is denied.  On the client side they see do see email in the mailbox (cached). 
>  Upon further review everything is gone for that mailbox including: 
> cyrus.cache, cyrus.header, cyrus.index.  Backups contain everything including 
> past emails and the core Cyrus files.  If the mailbox contained other 
> mailboxes they are not affected.  Reconstructing it corrects the issue, 
> luckily our backups do not propagate deletes.
>  
> Problem is that we can’t find any record of the mailbox being deleted.  The 
> content just disappears.  We have been running Cyrus for years and have never 
> seen anything like this.  I am leaning towards user error but I can’t 
> identify what that would be.
>  
> Any insight would be appreciated.
>  
> ___
> Robert Covell
> Rolet Hosting & Interactive
> www.rolet.com 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, the folders do still display but are empty.  If the folder had children 
> they are not affected, just the primary contents of the folder in question.

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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Simon Matter]

>
>
> --On September 9, 2015 at 13:49:40 -0500 "Robert T. Covell"
>  wrote:
>
>> That is the problem.  I cannot reproduce (reliably or at all).  It might
>> be months before we hear about it.  It has been happening for about two
>> years.  Always chalked it up to user error.  But I can't say that it is
>> or isn't.
>>
>
> Check the ACL on the mailbox and make sure no user has permission to
> delete
> the mailbox-- no "x" right. Loss of all content including the cyrus* files
> is mailbox deletion. (This is the voice of experience talking)
>
> Too bad you didn't implement delayed delete. You can just rename the
> deleted folder to its original name.

But, since he's using our Invoca RPM, delayed delete should be used by
default. So yes, deleted folders should be there, are they?

Regards,
Simon


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RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content

[Robert T. Covell]

I will check the ACL, good call.  We do have delayed delete implemented but 
when we get there it has always been too late.

They have thousands of folders.  What would be the best way to propagate that 
change via cyradm?

Will report back.

-Original Message-
From: info-cyrus-bounces+rcovell=rolet@lists.andrew.cmu.edu 
[mailto:info-cyrus-bounces+rcovell=rolet@lists.andrew.cmu.edu] On Behalf Of 
Joseph Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2015 2:09 PM
To: info-cyrus@lists.andrew.cmu.edu
Subject: RE: Disappearing Mailbox Content



--On September 9, 2015 at 13:49:40 -0500 "Robert T. Covell" 
<rcov...@rolet.com> wrote:

> That is the problem.  I cannot reproduce (reliably or at all).  It 
> might be months before we hear about it.  It has been happening for 
> about two years.  Always chalked it up to user error.  But I can't say 
> that it is or isn't.
>

Check the ACL on the mailbox and make sure no user has permission to delete the 
mailbox-- no "x" right. Loss of all content including the cyrus* files is 
mailbox deletion. (This is the voice of experience talking)

Too bad you didn't implement delayed delete. You can just rename the deleted 
folder to its original name.


Joseph Brennan
Columbia University Information Technology




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