While I'm thinking about this (though I should leave it alone): who's
to say that PHP won't some day get inner classes? By deciding the
default inner member of a class will be a function, you're choosing
the one that has a global/procedural equivalent where the short syntax
won't work, instead of
On 20.02.2013, at 1:42, Sanford Whiteman
swhitemanlistens-softw...@cypressintegrated.com wrote:
Seems this would complicate the transplanting of (global) functions
into (default public) class methods and vice versa. This is a common
refactoring task -- at least IME -- and before I adjust
On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 08:02:36 -, Sanford Whiteman
swhitemanlistens-softw...@cypressintegrated.com wrote:
While I'm thinking about this (though I should leave it alone): who's
to say that PHP won't some day get inner classes? By deciding the
default inner member of a class will be a
Protip: use an IDE.
The IDE that i'm using may search for something like function \w to find
all the functions of my code. So I may have to wait for a new update of the
IDE to be able to use the index, and I also may have to pay to get the
update of my IDE. So why would I want all this if I can
Global functions remain its requirement for keyword, just methods
lose
I understand that. You didn't read my post carefully because I was
noting this exact inconsistency.
it. And it doesn't mean that you can't write
class Foo {
function bar() {}
}
No, it means you _have to_ write it that
Classes always should be declared with class keyword, because there could
be ambiguity whether it's class, interface or trait.
If only inner classes are allowed in a given PHP version, there's no
ambiguity about whether something{} just inside a a class is an
inner class.
That's the
On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 09:59:51 -, Sanford Whiteman
swhitemanlistens-softw...@cypressintegrated.com wrote:
Classes always should be declared with class keyword, because there
could
be ambiguity whether it's class, interface or trait.
If only inner classes are allowed in a given PHP
Sandy,
On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 11:59 AM, Sanford Whiteman
swhitemanlistens-softw...@cypressintegrated.com wrote:
Classes always should be declared with class keyword, because there could
be ambiguity whether it's class, interface or trait.
If only inner classes are allowed in a given PHP
So no you are not saying PHP is not Java or C#. I don't want to touch
any religious views but it's really funny to read :)
Not sure I get your remark... of those languages, I've said, in
essence [1] Don't *force* PHP to look less like Java, ECMAScript, C#,
or C++ without a good reason and a new
As for classes/interfaces/traits and so on, if they are ever added in PHP
to be declared inside classes and so on then I see no issues with this.
A class/interface or a trait keyword would still be needed to make the
difference between a them imho.
No, if you *only* allow inner classes at any
The key question for me is: does removing it hurt PHP in any way? And
for me,
the answer is a clear and resounding no.
This is completely the wrong question to ask (IMHO). I think the answer
is wrong too, but that's a different story.
The correct question is:
Does it bring substantial value
On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:12 AM, Nikita Nefedov inefe...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:10:22 -, Rasmus Lerdorf ras...@lerdorf.com
wrote:
On 02/19/2013 03:07 PM, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Are you grepping for all the functions or you are grepping just for some
specific
Hi!
As someone mentioned in the thread about short syntax for closures, we
could also drop requirement for `function` keyword when defining/declaring
methods in classes, interfaces or traits.
I have long noticed how redundant it is. The patch is pretty easy as it
was with commas :)
It is
Hi,
On Tue, 2013-02-19 at 21:44 +, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Hi!
As someone mentioned in the thread about short syntax for closures, we
could also drop requirement for `function` keyword when defining/declaring
methods in classes, interfaces or traits.
I proposed this in November '10:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 17:53:40 -, Johannes Schlüter
johan...@schlueters.de wrote:
I agreed to the conclusion that the function keyword provided a nice
way to grep for functions when handling foreign code and leaving it out
only provides little improvement in less typing.
Please provide new
On 02/19/2013 02:39 PM, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Hmm, I agree about grepping, but how often do you do it? Actually, last
time I grepped php files was half a year ago I think, when I had just
ssh connection and didn't want to mount sshfs. But usually there's IDEs
that can statically analyze your
Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:
On 02/19/2013 02:39 PM, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Hmm, I agree about grepping, but how often do you do it? Actually, last
time I grepped php files was half a year ago I think, when I had just
ssh connection and didn't want to mount sshfs. But usually there's IDEs
that can
On Tue, Feb 19, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk wrote:
Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:
On 02/19/2013 02:39 PM, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Hmm, I agree about grepping, but how often do you do it? Actually, last
time I grepped php files was half a year ago I think, when I had just
ssh
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 18:02:57 -, Christopher Jones
christopher.jo...@oracle.com wrote:
What about including a few basic examples aka test cases in your patch?
If the feature is accepted, you'll need to include a LOT of testcases.
Chris
Hi Chris,
this code could be a basic case
On 02/19/2013 03:07 PM, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Are you grepping for all the functions or you are grepping just for some
specific function? If so, you are likely already know what visibility
this function has, so couldn't you grep for `public %functionName%`
instead of `function
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:10:22 -, Rasmus Lerdorf ras...@lerdorf.com
wrote:
On 02/19/2013 03:07 PM, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Are you grepping for all the functions or you are grepping just for some
specific function? If so, you are likely already know what visibility
this function has, so
On Tue, 2013-02-19 at 23:07 +, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
At the end, you can always use `grep '(function|public|private|
protected)
You've forgotten abstract and static (mind that we don't force the
order of those)
It saves 9 key strokes (while many IDEs can assist) and helps when
looking
On 20 February 2013 00:12, Nikita Nefedov inefe...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:10:22 -, Rasmus Lerdorf ras...@lerdorf.com
wrote:
On 02/19/2013 03:07 PM, Nikita Nefedov wrote:
Are you grepping for all the functions or you are grepping just for some
specific function? If so,
Seems this would complicate the transplanting of (global) functions
into (default public) class methods and vice versa. This is a common
refactoring task -- at least IME -- and before I adjust visibility I
would expect the function to Just Work.
So this works in a class to define the function:
Are we really trying to look under ground now for ways to change the
language syntax?
Unless there's a strong case to adding/removing/changing syntax, that
goes well beyond 'because we can' or 'it shortens the code' it
shouldn't even be brought up for discussion.
Zeev
On 19 בפבר 2013, at 19:44,
2013/2/19 Nikita Nefedov inefe...@gmail.com:
Hmm, I agree about grepping, but how often do you do it? Actually, last time
I grepped php files was half a year ago I think, when I had just ssh
connection and didn't want to mount sshfs. But usually there's IDEs that can
statically analyze your
On Tue, Feb 19, 2013 at 4:01 PM, Zeev Suraski z...@zend.com wrote:
Are we really trying to look under ground now for ways to change the
language syntax?
Unless there's a strong case to adding/removing/changing syntax, that
goes well beyond 'because we can' or 'it shortens the code' it
On 02/19/2013 03:45 PM, Levi Morrison wrote:
The key question for me is: does removing it hurt PHP in any way? And
for me, the answer is a clear and resounding no. I do not grep code
for method definitions: I know exactly where they are and so will my
IDE if I happen to not be using vim. And
I am something of a language guru and to me syntax is *extremely*
important. Am I of the opinion that removing the function keyword from
the class definition will help? Yes, I am.
I'm missing the help. It saves 9 characters and creates a disjunction
between global function syntax and
The key question for me is: does removing it hurt PHP in any way? And
for me, the answer is a clear and resounding no. I do not grep code
for method definitions: I know exactly where they are and so will my
IDE if I happen to not be using vim. And for those who like to grep
for method
Protip: use an IDE.
Linux is my IDE.
--
Herman Radtke
@hermanradtke | http://hermanradtke.com
--
PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Let's stop pretending that the vast majority of PHP users actually
grep source code looking for `function foo`. They don't. *They don't
even know how to use grep.*
I don't grep as in `grep`, but as in regex search that is part of my
IDE but is not also tokenizing/whateverizing/PHP-aware.
My
On Tue, 2013-02-19 at 17:08 -0700, Levi Morrison wrote:
Let's stop pretending that the vast majority of PHP users actually
grep source code looking for `function foo`.
That was never said, but there's a big number of people who has to deal
with code produced by others and doing tasks where it
On Feb 19, 2013, at 6:01 PM, Zeev Suraski z...@zend.com wrote:
Are we really trying to look under ground now for ways to change the
language syntax?
Agree 100%. Not to mention, I plan on eventually convincing enough people to
replace that keyword with a type hint ;)
Unless there's a
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