Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-25 Thread Dick Visser 
On 13 February 2014 21:23, James Small jim.sm...@mail.com wrote:
 Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:


 A) Using Postfix on Ubuntu, for mailing lists
 B) Using Google Apps for Education for MX/SMTP



-- 
Dick Visser
System  Networking Engineer
TERENA Secretariat
Singel 468 D, 1017 AW Amsterdam
The Netherlands

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-19 Thread Daniel Roesen 
On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 10:54:14AM +0100, Gert Doering wrote:
 Blocking by /64 by default is likely to get collateral damage.  Enough
 people do shared subnets with multiple customers in the same /64 - while
 I won't recommend it, it is *done*, and blocking the whole /64 because
 you have seen SPAM from a single IP out of it is hurting the wrong
 people.

This is btw standard setup in the DOCSIS world. All CPEs get a single IP
out of a shared /64. In case the CPE is not a customer PC but a router
(most customers have that), of course DHCPv6-PD is used to issue
prefixes. Nevertheless, there is a non-insignificant amount of people
directly attaching their PCs directly to cable modems.

The assumption everyone inside a /64 is the same subject is flawed,
indeed.

Best regards,
Daniel

-- 
CLUE-RIPE -- Jabber: d...@cluenet.de -- dr@IRCnet -- PGP: 0xA85C8AA0

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-19 Thread Marco d'Itri 
On Feb 19, Daniel Roesen d...@cluenet.de wrote:

 This is btw standard setup in the DOCSIS world. All CPEs get a single IP
 out of a shared /64. In case the CPE is not a customer PC but a router
 (most customers have that), of course DHCPv6-PD is used to issue
 prefixes. Nevertheless, there is a non-insignificant amount of people
 directly attaching their PCs directly to cable modems.
This does not really matter wrt mail since nobody sane accepts it from 
dynamically-assigned addresses, but:

 The assumption everyone inside a /64 is the same subject is flawed,
 indeed.
Operators who do this should use the assignment-size attribute.

-- 
ciao,
Marco


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Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-19 Thread Noel Butler 
Hi Gert,

On Wed, 2014-02-19 at 10:54 +0100, Gert Doering wrote:

 Hi,
 
 On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 02:45:33PM +1000, Noel Butler wrote:
  We block only by IP from whatever spam source is used (4, or 6), and
  rbldnsd handles ipv6 nicely (albeit in /64's - fair enough too, since
  most end users get that, typically), so your MTA's query would get a
  response from your DNSBL if it has an entry. 
 
 Blocking by /64 by default is likely to get collateral damage.  Enough
 people do shared subnets with multiple customers in the same /64 - while
 I won't recommend it, it is *done*, and blocking the whole /64 because
 you have seen SPAM from a single IP out of it is hurting the wrong
 people.
 


But, since pretty much every end user gets a /64 (I accept some web
hosts and vps services do not work that way - including one of my vps
providers), blocking a /64 would be identical to blocking a single IPv4
address with NAT, so should be overall, no worse than what we've been
doing for decades.

I would prefer it if rbldnsd allowed smaller, or even singular, but it
does not, and the reasoning that was given was fair enough, it only
allows a single IPv6 address if it is an exclusion, you may know this
already, but for others, as an eg to take out fdid:c01d:1ce:ab/64   but
allow real mail server  fdid:c01d:1ce:ab::10you use

fdid:c01d:1ce:ab
!fdid:c01d:01ce:ab00::::0010
It accepts no other approaches

(note: If I block an IPv6 address in postfix's access files, I usually
only block singular, unless I end up with a few addresses in same /64,
then I'll change to /64 and clear out the singles)


 And yes, I've seen that in the wild, Ironport reputation for a very
 well-behaved machine going down the drain because of bad neighbourhood.
 


ironport  *shudders*  I never let external orgs decide who I can trust,
what's that saying... trust is earned, not bought

Cheers




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Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-18 Thread SM 

Hi Doug,
At 17:52 18-02-2014, Doug Barton wrote:
My point is that all the hooha about We can't do mail over IPv6 
because we can't do IP address reputation seems to be nonsense. 
There are plenty of ways to do spam filtering that don't involve 
keeping a log of every single IP address that sends spam.


People are used to blocking spam by IPv4 address.  That makes it 
difficult to explain that it is no longer the better way for IPv4 
connections, and nowadays for IPv6 connections.


I don't have any problems with SMTP over IPv6.

Regards,
-sm

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-18 Thread Doug Barton 

On 02/18/2014 07:55 PM, SM wrote:

Hi Doug,
At 17:52 18-02-2014, Doug Barton wrote:

My point is that all the hooha about We can't do mail over IPv6
because we can't do IP address reputation seems to be nonsense. There
are plenty of ways to do spam filtering that don't involve keeping a
log of every single IP address that sends spam.


People are used to blocking spam by IPv4 address.  That makes it
difficult to explain that it is no longer the better way for IPv4
connections, and nowadays for IPv6 connections.


Sorry I wasn't clear, but my post was already long enough. I understand 
that blocking spam by IPv4 address hasn't been an effective solution by 
itself for many years now, and I understand that the vendors are crying 
foul because IPv6 makes their snake oil sales harder.


My purpose was to offer some actual concrete numbers from a mail server 
that's hit relatively hard with spam, to demonstrate that the entire 
argument of We can't filter spam on IPv6 is specious. :)


Doug

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-17 Thread S.P.Zeidler 
Thus wrote emilio brambilla (emi...@ngi.it):

 PS it's very odd to see so much sendmail on this list, where I would
 bet to see something more cutting-edge even on the software side!

for infrastructure, you run bleeding edge for two reasons:
a) you have no choice, it's the only thing that will meet the requirements
b) you are terminally bored and don't mind if stuff breaks, it'll
   relieve the boredom

It seems that not many run mail servers in category a, and there's even
less list participants in category b.

Sendmail, today, is mostly a meh, it's there choice, and does its job
reliably well enough, as do the other common open source MTAs.
Sendmail does have an advantage if/when you e.g. have uucp connections
or need to fold, spindle and mutilate mail headers in other exiting ways.

regards,
spz
-- 
s...@serpens.de (S.P.Zeidler)

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-17 Thread Nick Hilliard 
On 17/02/2014 15:16, Ignatios Souvatzis wrote:
 Not necessarily. All I'd imagine to do with UUCP can be done with
 postfix and maybe transport tables; I've run a connection that way
 for a couple of years.

This is rapidly turning into a contest of who's admitting to the greatest
MTA horrors.

Nick

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-17 Thread Ignatios Souvatzis 
On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 03:37:28PM +, Nick Hilliard wrote:
 On 17/02/2014 15:16, Ignatios Souvatzis wrote:
  Not necessarily. All I'd imagine to do with

I should maybe have added: e-mail over

  UUCP can be done with
  postfix and maybe transport tables; I've run a connection that way
  for a couple of years.
 
 This is rapidly turning into a contest of who's admitting to the greatest
 MTA horrors.

Anonymized:

@domain.example uucp:nexthop
@.domain.exampleuucp:nexthop
@another.exampleuucp:nexthop!targethost

-is

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Raoul Bhatia 

A) Using Postfix from Ubuntu.

Cheers,
Raoul
--
DI (FH) Raoul Bhatia M.Sc. |   E-Mail.  ra...@bhatia.at
Software Development and   |   Web. http://raoul.bhatia.at/
System Administration  |   Tel. +43 699 10132530

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Seth Mos 
On 13-2-2014 21:23, James Small wrote:
 Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:
 
 A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)
 
 B) Using  (service provider or “cloud solution”)
 
 C) Elected not to implement SMTP over IPv6 at this time because
 ___ (reason)

edge servers running Debian + sendmail + milter-greylist (with
optimistic whitelisting[1]) + spamassassin + mimedefang

Internal Exchange 2010 + OWA over IPv6

Kind regards,

Seth

[1] http://mailtoaster.coltex.nl/spam/mxhostcheck.php

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Matija Grabnar 
On 13 Feb 2014, at 20:23, James Small jim.sm...@mail.com 
mailto:jim.sm...@mail.com wrote:



Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:

A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)

B) Using  (service provider or “cloud solution”)

C) Elected not to implement SMTP over IPv6 at this time because 
___ (reason)






A. postfix (with Amavis/SpamAssassin)

RE: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Weber, Markus 
A) postfix on Solaris

In the user environment we introduced later Exchange 2010 (on Windows, what
a surprise ;-).

But we have v4 hubs in between as neither our great IPv6 supporting firewall
with content AV scanning nor commercial AV/SPAM filtering appliances / SW
products (at least not the ones we aimed for at that time) did support IPv6
years ago ... we tried to get some vendors moving or tried to participate in
their beta programs, but gave up after a while (at the end our IT is pretty
small and as our big mother didn't uses IPv6 internally at all, we had not the
power to push harder).
Since then nothing changed the basic setup beside the usual updates (or left
alone as it is) ... even though at least one of the deployed appliances boxes
finally does support IPv6 since one+ (or even more) years).

Markus

-- 
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Amtsgericht Frankfurt HRB56874, Geschäftsführer Jacobus Snijder  Bouke Hoving

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Mohacsi Janos 



Key 70EF9882: DEC2 C685 1ED4 C95A 145F  4300 6F64 7B00 70EF 9882

On Thu, 13 Feb 2014, James Small wrote:



Interested in what you?re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:

A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)


We are using postfix/exim from various Linux/*BSD distribution.

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Jens Link 
James Small jim.sm...@mail.com writes:

 Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:

 A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)

postfix on Debian

Jens
-- 

| Foelderichstr. 40   | 13595 Berlin, Germany   | +49-151-18721264 |
| http://blog.quux.de | jabber: jensl...@jabber.quux.de | ---  |

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Emmanuel Thierry 

Le 13 févr. 2014 à 21:23, James Small a écrit :

 Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:
 A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)
 B) Using  (service provider or “cloud solution”)
 C) Elected not to implement SMTP over IPv6 at this time because 
 ___ (reason)
  

A) (Postfix or OpenSMTPd on Debian) x (multiple servers), with IPv4-only RBLs, 
without server-wide antispam
B) Using Gmail

Best regards

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Sascha Luck 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 03:23:21PM -0500, James Small wrote:

Interested in what you're using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:

A) Using Postfix 


rgds,
Sascha Luck

RE: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Andreas Schwarz 
 Interested in what you're using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:

 A) Using sendmail (product) from FreeBSD (vendor)



best regards,
Andreas

--
 Telefónica Germany GmbH  Co. OHG
 Andreas Schwarz, NT NO BOTA BOIPFA
 Überseering 33a, D-22297 Hamburg
 fon: +49-40-23726-3892, fax: +49-40-23726-37



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Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-14 Thread Sander Steffann 
A) Using Postfix (product) from Wietse (vendor)
B) Using AS57771 and AS12414 (service provider or “cloud solution”)
C) Elected not to implement SMTP over IPv6 at this time because N.A. Fully IPv6 
capable (reason)

Sander

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Pim van Pelt 
Hoi,

And for completeness ...

2014-02-13 12:31 GMT-08:00 Pim van Pelt p...@ipng.nl:
 2014-02-13 12:23 GMT-08:00 James Small jim.sm...@mail.com:
 Interested in what you're using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:
 Hard to answer your question. You are not giving a lot of context for
 your inquiry, but here goes:
 A) Using Sendmail from OpenBSD.
B) Using gmail from Google.

Received: from mail1.cluenet.de (mail1.cluenet.de. [2001:1440:201:101::5])
by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id h44si6155624eew.143.2014.02.13.12.23.35
for pim+i...@ipng.nl
(version=TLSv1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128);
Thu, 13 Feb 2014 12:23:35 -0800 (PST)


-- 
Pim van Pelt p...@ipng.nl
PBVP1-RIPE - http://www.ipng.nl/

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Daniel Austin 

On 13/02/2014 20:23, James Small wrote:

Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:


Using Sendmail from FreeBSD.


Thanks,

Daniel.

RE: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Jean-Francois . TremblayING 
C) Because our current vendor does not support it and anti-spam is seen as 
mandatory within the business. 

/JF

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Simon Perreault 
Postfix + Spamassassin

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Enno Rey 
Postfix 2.9.5 on FreeBSD

best

Enno


On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 03:23:21PM -0500, James Small wrote:
 Interested in what you're using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:
 
 A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)
 
 B) Using  (service provider or cloud solution)
 
 C) Elected not to implement SMTP over IPv6 at this time because
 ___ (reason)
 
  
 
 All responses greatly appreciated,
 
   --Jim
 
  
 

-- 
Enno Rey

ERNW GmbH - Carl-Bosch-Str. 4 - 69115 Heidelberg - www.ernw.de
Tel. +49 6221 480390 - Fax 6221 419008 - Cell +49 173 6745902 

Handelsregister Mannheim: HRB 337135
Geschaeftsfuehrer: Enno Rey

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Blog: www.insinuator.net || Conference: www.troopers.de
Twitter: @Enno_Insinuator
===

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Andre Tomt 

On 13. feb. 2014 21:23, James Small wrote:

Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:

A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)

B) Using  (service provider or “cloud solution”)

C) Elected not to implement SMTP over IPv6 at this time because
___ (reason)


A) Using Postfix from ___ vendor

A) Using Postfix from ___ vendor

(work, private)

--
André Tomt

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Phil Pennock 
On 2014-02-13 at 15:23 -0500, James Small wrote:
 Interested in what you're using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:
 
 A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)

Exim, from The Exim Maintainers; I'm one, and the mail between exim.org
and my own mail box routinely goes over IPv6.

To send, as a submission client, mutt, which works with IPv6, and I've
set up Thunderbird in years past, it just worked.  (I know this, because
I used GSSAPI for auth, so the hostname was set IPv6-only because I only
have enough IPs for per-service matching forward-reverse DNS, with
service-based names, if I use IPv6).

 B) Using  (service provider or cloud solution)

Gmail, to/from, works fine.

-Phil

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Валерий Солдатов 


Interested in what you’re using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6: 

A) Using Postfix + OpenBSD




Солдатов Валерий, ЗАО Бэст Телеком.

Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Luigi Rosa 
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Hash: SHA1

James Small said the following on 13/02/2014 21:23:

A) Using Postfix from CentOS




Ciao,
luigi

- -- 
/
+--[Luigi Rosa]--
\

Space travel is utter bilge.
  --Richard Van Der Riet Woolley, 1956
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Re: Poll on SMTP over IPv6 Usage

2014-02-13 Thread Ignatios Souvatzis 
On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 03:23:21PM -0500, James Small wrote:
 Interested in what you're using to send/receive SMTP over IPv6:
 
 A) Using  (product) from __ (vendor)

three systems where I'm (partially) responsible

1. A) Using postfix from NetBSD

2. partially A) (clients to sub-dept. server) , using Postfix from NetBSD
  (big dept. server not IPv6-enabled, because infrastructure not on v6 yet)

3. was A using postfix from Gentoo for some years; machine moved to a
  location where IPv6 is promised really soon now. 

Regards,
-is