Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
> On Saturday 21 December 2013 18:45:13 Bruce Byfield wrote: > > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > > Choice Awards. > > > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you > > think it has over other desktop environments? > > > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux > > Pro Magazine. > > > > My thanks in advance for any replies. Excellent applications like dolphin, kmail, korganizer, akregator. Outstanding workspace ─ i consider kwin to be the best window manager (effects, scripts, features like window tabbing and window shading, good set of key-bindings) and plasma provides helpful flexibility, allowing us to have both new features (like folder view, both on the desktop and on the panel) and elements that were here for years, like good old pager. In other words: the great thing about KDE is it's ability to fit into needs of various users, even if seems to have very little in common. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Saturday 21 December 2013 18:45:13 Bruce Byfield wrote: > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > Choice Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think > it has over other desktop environments? > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux > Pro Magazine. > > My thanks in advance for any replies. * Almost all tools a very well integrated into the GUI. * It ships with the excellent email client Kmail. * It has a professional and clear Look&Feel (in contrast I consider GNOME to have a more simple and more „colorful“ interface addressed to beginners (like Windows does)). Best regards, Bernhard signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Sunday 05 January 2014 02:14:51 PM Kevin Krammer wrote: > On Saturday, 2013-12-21, 18:45:13, Bruce Byfield wrote: > > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > > Choice Awards. > > > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you > > think it has over other desktop environments? > > > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux > > Pro Magazine. > > Bruce has now published that article: > http://www.datamation.com/open-source/why-do-users-choose-kde.html > > > My thanks in advance for any replies. > > Indeed! > And thank you Bruce for combining them! :) > Thanks! I meant to mention the publication on the list. -- Bruce Byfield 604-421-7189 (on Pacific time) blog: https://brucebyfield.wordpress.com website: http://members.axion.net/~bbyfield/ ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On 22/12/13 04:45, Bruce Byfield wrote: As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' Choice Awards. That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think it has over other desktop environments? My reasons: * It looks nicer to me. I mean visually. I like eye candy. * I am very used to KDE's GUI conventions, from button order and keyboard shortcuts, to configuration dialog semantics, context menus and the "start menu." * Many of my favorite applications are written with Qt. As a result, they look and behave better in KDE (though in recent years this isn't much of a problem with Gtk-based desktops.) * The Dolphin file manager. I like it very, very much. * Extremely configurable keyboard shortcuts, like for suspending desktop compositing. Last time I checked, I couldn't see how to do that in Gnome. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Saturday, 2013-12-21, 18:45:13, Bruce Byfield wrote: > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > Choice Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think > it has over other desktop environments? > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux > Pro Magazine. Bruce has now published that article: http://www.datamation.com/open-source/why-do-users-choose-kde.html > My thanks in advance for any replies. Indeed! And thank you Bruce for combining them! :) Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
Well unfortunately an initial hopeful start has turned completely to custard. Kmail is now duplicating multiple messages every time it checks mail and then gives me an error when I try to "Remove duplicate messages". Looks like I'll be uninstalling it again. Obviously the Akonadi thing again and now all of the subfolders of my inbox have disappeared. I swear it gets more broken every time I try to use it again. On Sat, Dec 28, 2013 at 3:02 AM, Graham Lauder wrote: > On Thursday 26 Dec 2013 22:06:48 Pavel Volkov wrote: > > On Saturday 21 December 2013 23:10:30 Doug wrote: > > > (On the other hand, I would never again trust > > > KMail. I used it on SuSE back around 2009/10, when it started > > > printing incoming messages in some Asian font, and they could not be > > > recovered!) > > > > I'd suggest to give KMail another try nevertheless, it certainly has some > > issues but it's quite usable and had major rewrites since 2009. > > > > Some great features are not found in other software: Sieve server-side > > filters support (and an editor for it), selecting different display > styles > > for different folders (e. g. mailing list folders display as threaded and > > other folders in your favourite style) > > I don't think anyone has denied KMail's usability. That's probably the > reason > it pained people so much when it all went wrong. It was an excellent > solution and IMO far better than Evolution or any of the others but the > issues > were so bad that it could not be trusted and trust is critical with any PIM > that one is using in a business context. That trust is going to take some > rebuilding. > > However, I still miss it and so taking your positive comments on board I'm > giving it another run and we'll see how it goes. I hope I'm not > disappointed. > Thus far, the import feature has worked well if somewhat slower than I > would > prefer and that was a major issue for me in the past, the import managed to > destroy several years of archived mails following a system upgrade, > thankfully I had several backups and those have been imported seemingly > without problem at this stage. We will see, I have everything crossed for > success. > > Cheers > GL > > > > > ___ > > This message is from the kde mailing list. > > Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. > > Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. > > More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html. > > ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
As to why I prefer KDE and have used KDE almost exclusively as a desktop since 2001. First I will preface this with a disclaimer as what I have to say is a bit controversial. There are many good desktops. Initially I was dismayed when I heard Knoppix was moving away from KDE. However using LDXE on Knoppix I was pleasantly surprised by LDXE and if I were to use another desktop at this point and time LDXE would be my choice. Linux is freedom and power, the choice of desktops is part of this. Different desktop managers appeal to different people because of their different needs. No desktop is perfect by any means. I gripe lots about certain things in KDE. 1. KDE offered me a chance to step into the power of Linux with a low learning curve. I started with Tandy, CPM & the other primitive PC operating systems of the mid-80s. By the time I moved to Linux in 2000 I was suffering serious IDE fatigue. Tired of learning yet another set of keystrokes, shortcuts and menu configurations to do things I'd been doing for 15+ years at that point. Multi-Mate, Word Perfect, Borland programming IDEs, Watcom, Microsoft, and a zillion other programs. KDE software is very good about a consistent UI across the software. One that usually matched what I had been using for years in previous software. Thus with KDE I spent far more time doing things and far less time trying to memorize yet another set of keystrokes, shortcuts and menu configurations. 2. Best of breed apps. While I use several Gnome apps as well as many apps which are desktop independent, at least seven times out of ten, if I had a strong favourite for an app it was a KDE app which was my favourite. For example, at the time I discovered K3b there was no burner software which compared in power and ease of use. Prior to switching to K3b I burned from the command line as other Linux burners were buggy, unfriendly, seriously lacked features and had such a horrific interface that the command line was far easier to use. Today most Linux burner software mimics K3b but it was a KDE app which set the standard for not just Linux but other operating systems which eventually came to include features K3b had for years. 3. Community. The old school Unix crowd may not realize it but they come off as arrogant, unfriendly and contrite. The RTFM mantra is often a substitute for actual discourse when it comes to providing feedback, suggestions and getting help. When I first started using Linux I had many questions and I got good answers from the KDE community. What I got from the Gnome community was contempt. I was a noob and thus unworthy of their knowledge and help. This left me with a really bad taste for Gnome. This attitude has driven many potential Linux users back to Microserfdom. The KDE community lacks that elitist attitude found in certain distros, in particular among the Gnome crowd. Instead it is the friendly brawls that are normal for any gathering of geeks to rejoice in our favourite bit crusher at this time. 4. Practical innovation While I see a lot of things tried in other desktop managers, just because you can do it, does not mean you should. Unity for example. Whoever designed that should be shot, drawn and quartered, then burned at the stake and their ashes scattered to the 4 winds just so they never touch a computer again. The only good thing about Unity is that Microsoft could not help but steal it and call it Windows 8. For once Microsoft's kleptomania is biting them hard enough to really hurt. Other desktops have pioneered some good ideas which found their way into KDE but more often than not it's KDE which comes up with the practical new way of doing things which winds up in other desktops. 5. Graphics. KDE has always been sleek and sexy. An electronic seductress if I've ever known one. Gnome's graphics seem like an afterthought. Inconsistent and toyish. Almost as primitive as Microsoft's lame efforts to look modern. If I want to see what Microsoft and everyone else will be imitating 5 years from now I need only look at what KDE is today. 6. Customization. I like how easy it is to create a very customized desktop with Linux. There are very few configuration options which only live in obscure files residing in /etc or even deeper in some desktop specific dir. I can create a desktop which is uniquely mine with ease. On Sat, Dec 21, 2013 at 8:45 PM, Bruce Byfield wrote: > > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > Choice > Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you > think > it has over other desktop environments? > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux > Pro > Magazine. > > My thanks in advance for any replies. > > -- > Bruce Byfield 604-421-7189 (on Pacific time) > blog: https://brucebyfield.wordpress.com > website: http://members.axion.net/~bbyfield/ > ___ > This message is from the kde ma
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On 12/27/2013 08:15 AM, Jay DeKing wrote: On 12/27/2013 07:00 AM, kde-requ...@mail.kde.org wrote: Send kde mailing list submissions to kde@mail.kde.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to kde-requ...@mail.kde.org You can reach the person managing the list at kde-ow...@mail.kde.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of kde digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Why do you prefer KDE? (Pavel Volkov) -- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2013 22:06:48 +0400 From: Pavel Volkov To: kde@mail.kde.org Subject: Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE? Message-ID: <3242348.s2aFlBQAH4@melforce> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" On Saturday 21 December 2013 23:10:30 Doug wrote: (On the other hand, I would never again trust KMail. I used it on SuSE back around 2009/10, when it started printing incoming messages in some Asian font, and they could not be recovered!) I'd suggest to give KMail another try nevertheless, it certainly has some issues but it's quite usable and had major rewrites since 2009. Some great features are not found in other software: Sieve server-side filters support (and an editor for it), selecting different display styles for different folders (e. g. mailing list folders display as threaded and other folders in your favourite style) /snip/ Many thanks to the KDE community, and keep the goodness coming, Jay DeKing Château Cruso, NC, USA I'm very happy with Thunderbird for my mail. I do not need or want anything that it doesn't do. --doug ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Thursday 26 Dec 2013 22:06:48 Pavel Volkov wrote: > On Saturday 21 December 2013 23:10:30 Doug wrote: > > (On the other hand, I would never again trust > > KMail. I used it on SuSE back around 2009/10, when it started > > printing incoming messages in some Asian font, and they could not be > > recovered!) > > I'd suggest to give KMail another try nevertheless, it certainly has some > issues but it's quite usable and had major rewrites since 2009. > > Some great features are not found in other software: Sieve server-side > filters support (and an editor for it), selecting different display styles > for different folders (e. g. mailing list folders display as threaded and > other folders in your favourite style) I don't think anyone has denied KMail's usability. That's probably the reason it pained people so much when it all went wrong. It was an excellent solution and IMO far better than Evolution or any of the others but the issues were so bad that it could not be trusted and trust is critical with any PIM that one is using in a business context. That trust is going to take some rebuilding. However, I still miss it and so taking your positive comments on board I'm giving it another run and we'll see how it goes. I hope I'm not disappointed. Thus far, the import feature has worked well if somewhat slower than I would prefer and that was a major issue for me in the past, the import managed to destroy several years of archived mails following a system upgrade, thankfully I had several backups and those have been imported seemingly without problem at this stage. We will see, I have everything crossed for success. Cheers GL > ___ > This message is from the kde mailing list. > Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. > Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. > More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On 12/27/2013 07:00 AM, kde-requ...@mail.kde.org wrote: > Send kde mailing list submissions to > kde@mail.kde.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > kde-requ...@mail.kde.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > kde-ow...@mail.kde.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of kde digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > >1. Re: Why do you prefer KDE? (Pavel Volkov) > > > -- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2013 22:06:48 +0400 > From: Pavel Volkov > To: kde@mail.kde.org > Subject: Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE? > Message-ID: <3242348.s2aFlBQAH4@melforce> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > On Saturday 21 December 2013 23:10:30 Doug wrote: >> (On the other hand, I would never again trust >> KMail. I used it on SuSE back around 2009/10, when it started >> printing incoming messages in some Asian font, and they could not be >> recovered!) > > I'd suggest to give KMail another try nevertheless, it certainly has some > issues but it's quite usable and had major rewrites since 2009. > > Some great features are not found in other software: Sieve server-side > filters > support (and an editor for it), selecting different display styles for > different > folders (e. g. mailing list folders display as threaded and other folders in > your favourite style) > > > -- I first encountered KDE in 2000, when I switched from Red Hat 6 to Mandrake 7. KDE was a joy after using Gnome, and I found it eminently usable and wonderfully configurable. I was sold. I've tried many other DE's but have always come back to KDE. I depended upon XFCE when I was using a 10-year-old laptop; as soon as I acquired a modern machine, Debian with KDE was installed upon it. KMail has always had problems. I was hesitant to try it after reading the constant complaints on the mailing lists, but gave it a shot for a while in 2002-2003 because I heard that it was getting better. This was over ten years ago, mind you. Lost mails (sound familiar?) and various other issues drove me to give it up. Never again. Major rewrites? You'd have to start from scratch in my opinion. Email isn't rocket science, but KMail has had the same issues for at least 14 years. There are plenty of fully-functional mail clients that won't lose your mail. But KMail/kdepim is not the entirety of KDE. The rest of the DE makes up for it. I use none of kdepim or strigi, but overall, KDE does what I want a DE to do, does it well, and I have a lot of control over the user experience. I always customize colors and fonts and KDE makes that easy. Many thanks to the KDE community, and keep the goodness coming, Jay DeKing Château Cruso, NC, USA ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Saturday 21 December 2013 23:10:30 Doug wrote: > (On the other hand, I would never again trust > KMail. I used it on SuSE back around 2009/10, when it started > printing incoming messages in some Asian font, and they could not be > recovered!) I'd suggest to give KMail another try nevertheless, it certainly has some issues but it's quite usable and had major rewrites since 2009. Some great features are not found in other software: Sieve server-side filters support (and an editor for it), selecting different display styles for different folders (e. g. mailing list folders display as threaded and other folders in your favourite style) ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Sunday, December 22, 2013 01:49:13 PM Duncan wrote: > In a sentence: I use kde for exactly the same reason I run gentoo, and > to some extent, exactly the same reason I run Linux: all three respect > the user's right to choose exactly what and how they want things far more > than most alternatives. I'm with Duncan so far, except I use Fedora rather than Gentoo. I used to use Gentoo, I even worked on the Gentoo documentation, but nowadays I don't have the time to install and maintain something like Gentoo. So basically, while I've tried to like how Gnome works I simply can't. To me it's not logical or customizable enough. KDE is so much easier to get to do exactly what I want it to do. I'm even perverted enough to kind of like kdepim and Kontact (probably because I'm perverted enough to like Outlook). I tried stop using kdepim going for Thunderbird and extensions, but then I discovered that Thunderbird ate a couple of mails, and KMail has never done that so I went back to the, admittedly, sometimes rater clunky piece of software that is Kontact. /Martin S -- Martin Skjöldebrand www.skjoldebrand.org 0707948667 ### PGP-key available on request ### ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
Hi Bruce, On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 3:45 AM, Bruce Byfield wrote: > > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' Choice > Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think > it has over other desktop environments? > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux Pro > Magazine. > > My thanks in advance for any replies. Thank you for asking and first a disclaimer: I am part of the KDE community and totally biased :) My reasons to use KDE software are many, but these are the most important ones: 1. I can configure it to look the way I want it to, so it just suits my way of using computers. Every time I try another window manager and/or desktop environment I hit a "you can't do that" very fast, so KDE it is :) 2. The community is made of awesome people who are nice to work with. It is very open and welcomes everybody, regardless of their skills, origins or gender. Being a woman I never felt the need of having a separate group to "include" me, as the community doesn't make a different in treating its members. I am not a software developer, but I am part of KDE nonetheless, as there is no separation made between developers and non-developers. "The KDE way" is to treat everybody as being part of the community, and this also extends to the users. I guess I could go on for hours in citing more reasons why I am part of KDE, but I guess it all comes down to these two points above. Regards, Myriam -- Proud member of the Amarok and KDE Community Protect your freedom and join the Fellowship of FSFE: http://www.fsfe.org Please don't send me proprietary file formats, use ISO standard ODF instead (ISO/IEC 26300) ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
I use kde because: 1 i tried gtk desktops and they liked me but kde is more flexible i feel free to use it like i want. 2 kubuntu has worked out of the box so kde it was running nice on my machine. 3 for me is very neat system 4 but i would say that the most important thing is that kde's people helped me : example aseigo, i was totally new and he helped me to develop some little stuff losing his time. in gnome destkop i felt like : gnome.jpg - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxy7Wd7ZYDezZllZZFZEWVY5WGc/edit?usp=sharing 2013/12/23 james Abtahi : > > On 12/22/2013 06:15 AM, Bruce Byfield wrote: >> >> As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' >> Choice >> Awards. >> >> That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you >> think >> it has over other desktop environments? >> >> Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux >> Pro >> Magazine. >> >> My thanks in advance for any replies. >> > > In addition to much superior *configurability* of KDE compared to other DEs, > I personally prefer it because it's written in C++ and is based on Qt which > makes it -- from a software engineering point of view -- vastly superior to > DEs written in C using weird hacks to incorporate the idea of object > oriented programming. > > ___ > This message is from the kde mailing list. > Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. > Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. > More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On 12/22/2013 06:15 AM, Bruce Byfield wrote: As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' Choice Awards. That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think it has over other desktop environments? Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux Pro Magazine. My thanks in advance for any replies. In addition to much superior *configurability* of KDE compared to other DEs, I personally prefer it because it's written in C++ and is based on Qt which makes it -- from a software engineering point of view -- vastly superior to DEs written in C using weird hacks to incorporate the idea of object oriented programming. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
Frank Steinmetzger posted on Mon, 23 Dec 2013 01:05:02 +0100 as excerpted: > To me it's unbelievable that there are desktops out there that don't > even let you choose another base font. Back in 2001 when I switched to Linux instead of allowing MS their demanded remote-root ability with eXPrivacy, it was kde2 vs gnome1. I could not /believe/ that gnome didn't have a way to set desktop and widget colors -- you had to do it via setting an entire theme, and to edit one color, you had to hand-edit the config-files for that theme. Even servant-ware MS allowed /that/, but gnome didn't. For me, that was the single deciding factor. Any DE that wouldn't let you set a simple color wasn't a desktop I was interested in using! Luckily, kde was available, with its policy of user choice! =:^) But that said, I'm /extremely/ glad there's a project such as gnome around, if only because were it not there, some of those devs might get the idea of turning kde into an "our way or you're an idiot" DE, and that'd be horrible. Let each have their own playground to work and play in, and they're less likely to do damage to one of the major target points for both users and devs, of the other one. =:^) > KWin window rules are great, like “put mplayer always on top and on all > desktops”. 3D effects are not only nice (some of them anyway), but also > helpful, like seeing all open windows at once and filtering through > them. Absolutely! > Keyboard shortcuts allow for very fast interaction -- I assigned > almost the entire alphabet to some action or application via the Meta > key. And in almost every program you can assign keys to all sorts of > actions. I started out with something like that, but quickly found that I had more shortcuts I wanted to enable than keys, even with a fancy multimedia/inet keyboard with a bunch of "extra" keys! But that was back on kde3, where it was possible to setup multi-key hotkeys, and what I ended up doing was setting up a couple of the extra keys as effectively custom menu launchers, such that hitting one of them, then a second key, would launch the desired app based on the second key. Unfortunately kde4 broke that, tho apparently it was actually qt4 that didn't support the functionality that kde3/qt3 had. There's still an open bug on it[1], but while apparently it wasn't easily fixed in qt4/ kde4, I've read that the kde devs made very sure qt5 supported that functionality early on, so hopefully it'll be back with kde5. =:^) Which was one of the big issues I had with the kde4 upgrade, since it broke all my multikey hotkeys! But while trying one of several third party hotkey apps that was supposed to support multi-key (which it did, tho I found out configuration was a major pain), it suddenly occurred to me that a serially invoked single- key hotkey solution would be enough. Once I had that insight, I set right to work hacking up such a thing in bash, which I happen to know reasonably well. What I ended up with was a single kde4 hotkey assignment, triggered by one of those "extra" keys, that launched a special konsole profile, with my bash-based hotkey script in turn launched in that konsole window. That script, in turn, displays a list of options along with associated hotkeys, then takes a single key as input, which it uses to select the desired action from the list, launching that action and then disowning it so it won't close along with the launcher window. Using that script, I ended up with a three-key (or occasionally four-key) solution. The first key is the "extra" key, configured in khotkeys to launch my script with my "category" menu. There I hit a single key (g=games, c=config, p=power-control, f=file-management, etc), which reinvokes the script with the menu for that category. So say I hit g=games, I then get a menu listing all my favorite games (p=kpat, P=palapeli, kde's jigsaw puzzler, etc), where I hit a third key that actually launches the selected game. So it's , in my head effectively: launch, game, patience. For the configuration category, one choice is hotkeys, which simply pops up a menu that will load the selected hotkey menu file into my favorite text editor (mcedit in a konsole window), so that one sequence is four keys deep instead of three, effectively: launch, config, hotkeys, games, to load the game menu in the editor, for instance. And I have a kwin rule setup to force that particular konsole profile to center-screen, always-on-top, specific size, so my hotkey menu always pops up in the same location at center-screen, so it doesn't interfere too much with normal "smart" window placement. The biggest down side is that it's a bash implementation, and initializing the bash script at each menu launch isn't as fast as it'd be were it natively coded. But I don't know C/C++/etc, only bash, and bash (plus the initial khotkeys launcher altho if kde were to break it like they broke my last solution with kde4,
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Monday, 2013-12-23, 01:05:02, Frank Steinmetzger wrote: > In recent time my interaction became more console-based: mc/ranger, vim, > mutt. Historically I never used graphical network setups, instead always > did it using system services. Plus I don't really like the network > manager applet, mostly b/c it's no real window that can be alt-tabbed > to. Plasma applets, such as the one for network management, can also be run in their own window: plasma-windoed org.kde.networkmanagement > scrolling in Dolphin, Plasma layout bugs, drag+drop to Gimp, Kiosk mode > missing from KDE3 (would be nice for a throw-away guest login similar to > what Ubuntu offers).. ;-) Kiosk is still available. It is a feature of KDE's configuration framework KConfig and has not been changed during the Qt4 porting. Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Saturday 21 Dec 2013 18:45:13 Bruce Byfield wrote: > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you > think it has over other desktop environments? Freedom of choice, configurable to the Nth degree, it works ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On 2013-12-21 18:45 (GMT-0800) Bruce Byfield composed: As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' Choice Awards. That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think it has over other desktop environments? Originally it became my DE of choice because it was pleasant looking, in contrast to the ugliness that was Gnome when I was first exposed to both over a decade ago. The more I learned, the more I came to value KDE's ability to be adapted to me instead of me adapting to its writers' ideas how things ought to be. KDE4 lost some of its adaptability when it was rewritten to exclude various KDE3 features, some of which KDE4 still lacks[1], are poorly implemented[2], or are hampered by misfeatures[3], while imposing its difficult to disable or eradicate "semantic desktop". I have only KDE3 installed on my 24/7 system, while my other systems are about a 50/50 split between KDE3 & KDE4, not counting a nominal representation of selected other non-Gnome-derived DEs. [1] e.g. https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=158556 https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=229984 [2] e.g. https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=297217 [3] e.g. https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=318061 https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=297219 Feel free to quote. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Sat, Dec 21, 2013 at 06:45:13PM -0800, Bruce Byfield wrote: > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > Choice > Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? Back in the days of KDE 3, when I started using Linux (2006), I liked it because of the digital (7-segment) clock. :-D I detested the Gnome look back then, but really enjoyed the KDE3 look, most prominently the Cyrstal SVG icons. I clinged on KDE3 for a long time. (Though not for Konqueror as a browser, it lagged behind even then). Gentoo allowed me to keep it far longer than many other distros would have. KDE3 was just the snappiest thing ever. Eventually I moved over to 4, still because I hated the Gnome 2 look (they waste far too much screen space). I also like the application ecosystem, like the editor component, the KIO stack, KDE-wide password storage, some nice (external) tools: Filelight, KCharSelect, kmplot, Krusader, Kile, Gwenview (the KDE3 version), Okular and Konversation. I, too, fell victim to Akonadi tiredness, so I switched to mutt 2 years ago, but I still have KMail at hand, it does look nice and it gets better again over time (but still no match in speed to mutt, especially for mailing lists with 100s or 1000s of mails). > What advantages do you think it has over other desktop environments? One word: Customisability. I am also a heavy customiser and like adopting my computing environment to *my* needs and wishes. I like that you can put your panel (any number of panels) anywhere you want. You don't have to see a stupid panel that constantly tells you your own name. To me it's unbelievable that there are desktops out there that don't even let you choose another base font. KWin window rules are great, like “put mplayer always on top and on all desktops”. 3D effects are not only nice (some of them anyway), but also helpful, like seeing all open windows at once and filtering through them. Keyboard shortcuts allow for very fast interaction -- I assigned almost the entire alphabet to some action or application via the Meta key. And in almost every program you can assign keys to all sorts of actions. I am also grateful that not all of the “good old stuff” is thrown away just because some hipster-inspired paradigm-of-the-month emerged from another project. One example is the kickoff-style menu -- to many animations, too much waiting, scrolling and clicking. I prefer the old-style menu and apreciate it still being there. And while I (think I) understand the notion of activities, I'm fine with virtual desktops. In recent time my interaction became more console-based: mc/ranger, vim, mutt. Historically I never used graphical network setups, instead always did it using system services. Plus I don't really like the network manager applet, mostly b/c it's no real window that can be alt-tabbed to. Plasmoids are nice on the one hand -- they allow for a very flexible setup of panel and desktop -- on the other hand the Plasma UI sometimes is very annonying (e.g. non-standard behavior of scrollbars). There are of course some nags... Konsole font replacement bug (though a Qt problem), Power profiles on laptops, multi-monitor glitches, scrolling in Dolphin, Plasma layout bugs, drag+drop to Gimp, Kiosk mode missing from KDE3 (would be nice for a throw-away guest login similar to what Ubuntu offers). But that wasn't your question, so unlike Duncan, I leave it at that one paragraph. ;-) -- Gruß | Greetings | Qapla’ Please do not share anything from, with or about me with any Facebook service. Guillotine operator wanted. Chance to get ahead. signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Saturday, 2013-12-21, 18:45:13, Bruce Byfield wrote: > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > Choice Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think > it has over other desktop environments? I can't really answer that in terms of advantages over other offering since I haven't been using any of them since about 1998 when I switched to full time Linux. But I think, as far as KDE's desktop goes, my personal preference is the good combination of classic elements (panels, window lists, pager, etc) with great configurability. For example I use a rather classic bottom panel, i.e. it holds the launcher menu button, the virtual desktop switcher/pager, the window list (showing only the open windows of the active desktop) and the notification area (a.k.a. system tray). I've customized it a little by adding a quick laucher with my top used four apps after the menu button, followed by the Kate session applet, and the lock/logout applet at the end. Additional to that a narrow panel at the top right of the screen, switched to stay-on-top mode (windows go below it), showing current system stati (CPU and memory meters, battery, network connection and time/date. Another thing I like regarding the desktop product is the window manager's capabilities. For example being able to move any window by clicking-and- holding anywwhere in the window when ALT is pressed as well. Same for resizing without having to move to the windows's border (ALT+right mouse button drag). Or vertical-only maximizing by right clicking the maximize button. As I said before I can't really gauge whether those are advantages over offerings from other vendors, they might very well allow all those things as well. While your question was targetted at the desktop, I saw that a couple of other respondents have also touched the area of KDE's application offerings. Again I can't really tell if there is a lot of difference to other vendors' applications, but at the time when I started using them they were just better than anything comparable. E.g. back then no other terminal (as far as I know) had tabs and the capability of sending input to multiple tabs at the same time. Or KMail's great handling of mailinglists (reply to list, new to list, filtering, per-folder identities), its offline-IMAP support (I travel a lot, usually reading less important list backlogs while disconnected/airbourne/etc). Generally the great consistency across applications, but I guess that is also true for other vendors with multiple applications. Anyway, the question on why people use KDE applications is a very different one, but it is just so tempting to mention their respective highlights even when the topic at hand is the desktop or workspace product :) Cheers, Kevin -- Kevin Krammer, KDE developer, xdg-utils developer KDE user support, developer mentoring signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On 12/22/13 08:15, Bruce Byfield wrote: As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' Choice Awards. That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think it has over other desktop environments? Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux Pro Magazine. My thanks in advance for any replies. Looking at the new bugs created at every release and despite that I'm not leaving it, I would say the features (like that RSS widget which just stopped working in 4.11.3). You get a habit of it. ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
Bruce Byfield posted on Sat, 21 Dec 2013 18:45:13 -0800 as excerpted: > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > Choice Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you > think it has over other desktop environments? > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for > Linux Pro Magazine. > > My thanks in advance for any replies. In a sentence: I use kde for exactly the same reason I run gentoo, and to some extent, exactly the same reason I run Linux: all three respect the user's right to choose exactly what and how they want things far more than most alternatives. I've never seen either a desktop environment or distro I was satisfied with straight as it came out of the box, and I doubt I ever will. I have quite particular demands and expectations about my ability to make the tools I choose to use work /my/ way, and I don't take very well to either my tools or their creators saying there is only one right way to do something, it's their way, and if I don't agree, I'm simply wrong, when it's my box I'm working on and my time I'm spending on it! So I tend to be a HEAVY customizer, to the point that other users of the same tools don't even recognize my customized configuration as the same tools they're running too. Both kde and gentoo tend to support my level of customization far better than most alternatives, so they're the choices I've made. And Linux, of course, is built and thrives on that level of freedom as well. =:^) It should be obvious from the above that don't always agree with all choices made, but the great part is that in general, all three projects respect the user's ability to make their own decisions, and that's what I value. As an example, both Doug and Graham mentioned how badly kontact, kmail, and basically the entire kdepim module has been screwed up during kde4. I won't argue a bit with that as I had exactly the same sort of issues with it. One day after kmail had eaten yet another email, I asked myself why I tolerated that sort of behavior from an app tasked with handling a set of basic network mail protocols that have been around in some form longer than the internet itself -- email is NOT rocket science and it hasn't been rocket science for some time! It's a stable set of protocols with all sorts of stable choices for handling them, and there's absolutely no reason people should be expected to tolerate the kind of mail handling issues kmail/kontact/akonadi brought them! That day I set about changing things, for me anyway! Within a few weeks I'd found my chosen alternative (claws-mail, both as a kmail alternative and with its feed-reader plugin, as an alternative for akregator as well, since akregator is part of the same kdepim suite and was in line to get akonadified as well). But I didn't stop there. With that gone, I decided I didn't need akonadi or even for that matter, the entire semantic-desktop thing, at all! And because I run gentoo, I wasn't simply limited to turning off semantic- desktop at runtime. I switched a few build-and-install-time USE flags and entirely uninstalled a whole SET of dependencies. Akonadi, nepomuk, redland, rasqal, virtuoso, soprano, mysql, kdepimlibs, kdepim-common- libs, libkdepim... all gone along with kmail, akregator, and kaddressbook, the bits of kdepim I had been using. (Strigi remained a dependency as part of kde required it to build, but it's a tiny package by itself and without a data backend installed, it couldn't actually do anything... it was purely a build-time dep of a few other kde packages including I believe kdelibs.) And not only did I have them entirely off my system, I was actually rather astonished at how much FASTER my system ran without all that junk loading it down, too. Even with nepomuk turned off at runtime, the system had been rather laggy since I had installed kde4 in the first place. But removing it was like getting all the viruses cleaned off of somebody's MS Windows machine (when they don't know/care enough about security to keep it clean in the first place)... or like I had just added a couple extra cores to my CPU! It really WAS that dramatic, and it's something that really surprised me, as I hadn't expected any benefit but not having those packages around to keep updated any longer! Since then I've come to the conclusion that at least some of the slowdown people still often say they have with kde4 in comparison to kde3 is due to all that semantic-desktop junk. Too bad few distros offer a proper kde-lite option without that stuff even installed. =:^( But exposing that sort of choice to the end user is exactly what gentoo does /by/ /default/ at the distro level, and exactly what kde does /by/ /default/ at the desktop level. It's part of their design philosophy -- part of the point they even /exist/! There are certainly exceptions, but that's the po
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 3:45 PM, Bruce Byfield wrote: > > As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' > Choice > Awards. > > That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you > think > it has over other desktop environments? > > Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux > Pro > Magazine. > > My thanks in advance for any replies. > > -- > Bruce Byfield 604-421-7189 (on Pacific time) > blog: https://brucebyfield.wordpress.com > website: http://members.axion.net/~bbyfield/ > > Hi Bruce, I use KDE on OpenSuse and I've used it pretty much since around 2000 I think, maybe earlier. Initially on Mandrake. I have tried Gnome during a brief flirtation with Red Hat and later Ubuntu as well as on SuSE. On my AV appliance (Debian based) I run LXDE but in that setup the DE is pretty much meaningless and Blackbox or Windowmaker would work just as well, but LXDE came with that appliance, however I use Dolphin and Konqueror in that environment for file management both locally and via FTP to my webhost. My laptop and my main desktop use KDE. The main reasons are Flexibility and the application stack. I like to be able to set my desktop up to suit my way of working KDE has always been able to do that far better than any other DE. While the ability to change Desktop Environments easily was one of the things that converted me to Linux as my primary platform, I find that I've always come back to KDE because of the flexibility and ease of customisation. The application stack. Konqueror is an essential no matter what platform or DE I'm using. Nothing has the same broad range of abilities as a file manager, a web browser, an ftp client. It doesn't care if files are on the local machine or my webserver, it treats all files the same. I can chop it up into multiple windows in the same tab allowing me to manage multiple file storage facilities at the same time. Excellent, long may it continue. Dolphin is close but not the same. KATE: Best editor out there, very usable I used to be a big fan of Kontact, it was the Outlook killer, but of late I've had to stop using it as it's become a nightmare. Many issues on bugzilla have I commented on. Too bad, when I first stated using KDE, Kontact was a big reason. K3B: I've yet to find anything that matches it on any platform. I think OpenSUSE is a good indicator, the standard installation makes no preference toward KDE or Gnome, it is equally simple to install either Desktop Environment, but a significant majority of OpenSUSE users choose to use KDE. Cheers Graham Lauder ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
Re: [kde] Why do you prefer KDE?
On 12/21/2013 09:45 PM, Bruce Byfield wrote: As you may have heard, KDE recently topped the Linux Journal's Readers' Choice Awards. That got me thinking. Why do people prefer KDE? What advantages do you think it has over other desktop environments? Warning: If I get enough replies, I may use them in a blog entry for Linux Pro Magazine. My thanks in advance for any replies. I'm using KDE on PCLinuxOS. I'm not sure what "comes" with it, and what is added on, but one thing that definitely comes with it is Konqueror-Super User, which is really helpful in copying files between operating systems, particularly between Linux and Windows. K3b is surely a KDE app, and it works very nicely, even allowing you to check the mdsum of the text you are going to burn, and then verifying the result. (On the other hand, I would never again trust KMail. I used it on SuSE back around 2009/10, when it started printing incoming messages in some Asian font, and they could not be recovered!) KSnapshot has a nice array of output possibilities, and I use it when the devs have not broken it--which has happened more than once. KPatience Solitare, especially Klondike, is a really nice rendition of the game. I assume the Kate editor is a KDE creation, and it has features I haven't seen elsewhere. The capability of joining lines is wonderful for removing strange formatting. The Find Files/Folders app is indispensable, not only on Linux, but on the Windows version of KDE. Windows has nothing like it--Windows assumes when you find a file, you want to run it, never thinking that you might want to burn a copy, or email it. Finally, KDE has a great deal of visual similarity to Windows, on which virtually all of us learned graphical user interfacing. It has one "panel" or systray, and it's at the bottom, out of the way, where it belongs. It allows the placement of icons or widgets on the desktop. For those who like the Windows "Start" menu type of operation, KDE has a similar menu. At the same time, the KDE desktop is more versatile, allowing various icons to be placed in the "panel", left or right, at the user's preference, as well as on the desktop surface itself, and has a lot more options for these user spaces. If your desktop uses widgets, rather than icons, they can be modified in size, one at a time, so as to be more pleasing to the eye as well as more easily found. (Note that I make Windows comparisons to versions prior to Windows 8, an unmitigated disaster!) In addition to the items above, the system administration apps provided by KDE all work pretty well, with only a few exceptions. (The printer apps really need serious work, and have been in this state for the entire time I've used KDE. Also the display configuration when an NVidia card is used does not work right, without (undocumented) user modifications to Xorg.conf.) It is to KDE's credit that certain "eyecandy" type things can be turned off. Especially those that make windows do strange things when they hit up against a screen edge. And I can do without them ever becoming translucent! I don't know if Synaptic is a creation of the KDE people or not, but I think it is a more user-friendly file loader than the other programs used on distros other than PCLOS. I think I hear faint rumors that the PCLOS people are thinking of leaving KDE for some other system. When or if they do, I will be looking for another distro that continues to use KDE. If you print any of this review in a magazine or elsewhere, you have my permission to use my name. Doug McGarrett ___ This message is from the kde mailing list. Account management: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde. Archives: http://lists.kde.org/. More info: http://www.kde.org/faq.html.
