Re: [lace] Crochet and tatting?
Thank you Jean! I know much less about tatting than I do about other laces (I can make it, at least!), so this is very helpful. And thank you to everyone else who has replied to me for your input. What would we do without Arachne? :) Best, Elena - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lacemaker/sets/
Re: [lace] Devon's lace
Thanks to Jo Ann and all those who have responded to my questions about these puzzling pieces. I have extricated my book on Beveren and see that Jo Ann is correct about the holes. They do resemble the holes in the linen stitch in the second of the two "Tonder" pieces I posted. Also, before me is Ulrike's book in which she has elegantly diagrammed all the many ways of dealing with a large hole. They are probably more common than I had thought, existing as Lorelei says in Bucks and as Doris says in the Torchon Purse Pendents (unfortunately, I do not have that book.) I have examined the two fillings Jo Ann refers to. One of them, I believe is filling G from the OIDFA book which claims it was used in Tonder before 1900. The other one bears a resemblance to L, but that is not something found in Tonder, only Merletto aquilano. It also reminds me of the bobbin fillings you often see in Milanese where they are trying to copy the effect of the diaper patterns in Venetian Gros Point. Unfortunately, I don't have the Dutch Folk Costume study by OIDFA. (Clearly I need to buy more books after the pandemic.) One consideration is that the Dutch used Beveren on their caps, while the Danish made Tonder for Danish caps. Bobbi's book on the Danish Cross Cloths is very interesting on that point. So, both laces found an enthusiastic costumer base in the wearers of traditional caps. I am going to post on laceioli.ning some close ups of the fillings that Jo Ann mentions and photos from the OIDFA book of the fillings G and L for comparison. Here is the link: http://laceioli.ning.com/group/identification-history Devon > - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lacemaker/sets/
[lace] Crochet and tatting?
I’m sure Elena has already done abundant online research about tatting origins but just out of curiosity I looked and ran across this article. It cites sources and covers a lot of territory quickly so I thought I’d pass it on to the group. https://abctattingpatterns.com/history/ Jean Reardon in dreary western Pennsylvania - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lacemaker/sets/
Re: [lace] Crochet and tatting?
Hi Elena, I know only one thing relevant to your questions but I'll offer it in case it helps: the shuttles used in the 18th century for knotting were much larger than tatting shuttles, several times larger than the largest tatting shuttle I know of. I have one and embarrassingly cannot find it right now, and is of the same proportions as a tatting shuttle, but if memory serves me right, 4 to 5 inches long. Being so large, and with an elaborately carved 3-dimensional decoration on each side, it would serve very well to show off the graceful motions of the ladies' hands as they sat knotting. It would have been extremely hard if not impossible to tat with, however. I will send you pictures with a scale next to it when I find my knotting shuttle. (It is quite beautiful.) But the point is that the shuttles in the 18th century were knotting shuttles and quite distinct from the later tatting shuttles. HTH Nancy Ashford, Connecticut, USA On Thu, Apr 30, 2020, 13:06 Elena Kanagy-Loux wrote: > Dear Arachne, > > I am hoping to ask for your thoughts on the origin dates of tatting and > crochet and see if they line up with what I have gathered over the years. > > Tatting shuttles, of course are already depicted in 18th century portraits > as they were used for simpler knotting techniques, but what we now know of > tatting doesn't seem to have emerged until the 19th century. Even digging > through my handy Earnshaw and Levey books I don't seem to get a more > specific date than that, although Earnshaw dates the inclusion of picots to > the 1870s. Also, do we think it started in France, or elsewhere? > > For the origins of crochet I have seen references as specific as the 1830s, > in England, developed as a quicker imitation of needle lace (although the > resemblance of needle lace to crochet has led some to mistakenly believe it > dates back to the Renaissance). > > Do these timelines sound correct to you? I'd love to get your thoughts. > > Thank you as always! > Best Wishes, > Elena > > - > To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: > unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to > arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: > http://www.flickr.com/photos/lacemaker/sets/ > - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lacemaker/sets/
[lace] Crochet and tatting?
Dear Arachne, I am hoping to ask for your thoughts on the origin dates of tatting and crochet and see if they line up with what I have gathered over the years. Tatting shuttles, of course are already depicted in 18th century portraits as they were used for simpler knotting techniques, but what we now know of tatting doesn't seem to have emerged until the 19th century. Even digging through my handy Earnshaw and Levey books I don't seem to get a more specific date than that, although Earnshaw dates the inclusion of picots to the 1870s. Also, do we think it started in France, or elsewhere? For the origins of crochet I have seen references as specific as the 1830s, in England, developed as a quicker imitation of needle lace (although the resemblance of needle lace to crochet has led some to mistakenly believe it dates back to the Renaissance). Do these timelines sound correct to you? I'd love to get your thoughts. Thank you as always! Best Wishes, Elena - To unsubscribe send email to majord...@arachne.com containing the line: unsubscribe lace y...@address.here. For help, write to arachne.modera...@gmail.com. Photo site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lacemaker/sets/