Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Lubos Pintes via Lazarus]

Hmm... But if I disable my UIA code then the form works as expected.
Also If I place some standard control to a form like TButton. But I will 
try the MainFormInTaskbar property to see what happens.

Dňa 26. 11. 2017 o 18:13 Ondrej Pokorny via Lazarus napísal(a):

On 26.11.2017 16:09, Martin Frb via Lazarus wrote:
I am not 100% sure, but maybe this is because (afaik) there is a 
hidden form for the task button. This hidden form can be disabled 
somewhere, then the main form will be responsible for the task button.


On 20/11/2017 09:54, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:


I can confirm that Inspect can see the object(s). But one symptom I 
am receiving that a screen reader is unable to register that a form 
receives the focus. If I alt-tabbing, I hear "Project1", instead of 
"Form1".


Correct. Use Application.MainFormOnTaskbar := True to register the form 
for the taskbar.


Ondrej




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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Ondrej Pokorny via Lazarus]

On 26.11.2017 16:09, Martin Frb via Lazarus wrote:
I am not 100% sure, but maybe this is because (afaik) there is a 
hidden form for the task button. This hidden form can be disabled 
somewhere, then the main form will be responsible for the task button.


On 20/11/2017 09:54, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:


I can confirm that Inspect can see the object(s). But one symptom I 
am receiving that a screen reader is unable to register that a form 
receives the focus. If I alt-tabbing, I hear "Project1", instead of 
"Form1".


Correct. Use Application.MainFormOnTaskbar := True to register the form 
for the taskbar.


Ondrej

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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Martin Frb via Lazarus]

I am not 100% sure, but maybe this is because (afaik) there is a hidden 
form for the task button. This hidden form can be disabled somewhere, 
then the main form will be responsible for the task button.


On 20/11/2017 09:54, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:


I can confirm that Inspect can see the object(s). But one symptom I am 
receiving that a screen reader is unable to register that a form 
receives the focus. If I alt-tabbing, I hear "Project1", instead of 
"Form1".


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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Lubos Pintes via Lazarus]

And now I tested this and I am sure, only TBitBtn doesn't expose the 
name. And because TBitBtn is used mostly in the IDe, most buttons are 
not accessible.Dňa 9. 10. 2017 o 9:41 Lubos Pintes via Lazarus napísal(a):
I reported this problem years ago. If I remember properly, only TBitBtn 
has this behaviour.
Of course not all buttons in the IDE have empty names, but those on 
options dialog, or welcome page.

Dňa 9. 10. 2017 o 9:14 Juha Manninen via Lazarus napísal(a):

*I wonder ...







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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Lubos Pintes via Lazarus]

I reported this problem years ago. If I remember properly, only TBitBtn 
has this behaviour.
Of course not all buttons in the IDE have empty names, but those on 
options dialog, or welcome page.

Dňa 9. 10. 2017 o 9:14 Juha Manninen via Lazarus napísal(a):

*I wonder ...




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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus]

On 2017-10-09 07:49, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:

For example, even buttons are not accessible, on the IDE welcome page,
screen reader reports only "button", instead of "StartIDE button", "Help
button", etc. Yes, the button itself is native, but is broken.


It seems it is very LCL-widgetset dependent then. If using LCL-fpGUI 
widgetset, then accessibility works fine when using SAK (Speech 
Assistive Kit). Nothing special is required by LCL itself. At least that 
is how it worked last time I tested back in 2015.



Regards,
  Graeme

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fpGUI Toolkit - a cross-platform GUI toolkit using Free Pascal
http://fpgui.sourceforge.net/

My public PGP key:  http://tinyurl.com/graeme-pgp
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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Juha Manninen via Lazarus]

On Sun, Oct 8, 2017 at 11:09 PM, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus
 wrote:
> Also, how can I rebuilt the package when I modify/add some unit? Do I need
> to always rebuild the IDe, or there is a quicker way?

You can test with any small application. No need to build the whole IDE.
The dependent LCL is compiled automatically when you compile your app.
It goes fast enough.

Juha
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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Juha Manninen via Lazarus]

*I wonder ...
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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Juha Manninen via Lazarus]

On Mon, Oct 9, 2017 at 9:49 AM, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus
 wrote:
> screen reader reports only "button", instead of "StartIDE button", "Help
> button", etc. Yes, the button itself is native, but is broken.

O wonder why that is so. The button really is a native button. Why
does it not know its caption and name?

Juha
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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Lubos Pintes via Lazarus]

Thank for all replies, but my original question was overlooked. Can 
someone answer it?


Dňa 8. 10. 2017 o 22:09 Lubos Pintes via Lazarus napísal(a):

Hello,
If I want to add a functionality like accessibility to WidgetSet, which 
package could I use, lcl.lpk, or lclbase.lpk?
Also, how can I rebuilt the package when I modify/add some unit? Do I 
need to always rebuild the IDe, or there is a quicker way?
I am thinking about syntax check / quick compilation to incrementally 
check and fix semantic / syntax errors.


Thanks




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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Lubos Pintes via Lazarus]

Sorry I replied to wrong message. My thanks and my heart belongs just to 
you. :-)

Dňa 9. 10. 2017 o 4:43 Martin Frb via Lazarus napísal(a):

I think there was some work before. (Afaik only carbon, Mac)

Look at TControl properties AccessibleRole, AccessibleValue, 
AccessibleDescription.

lcl\controls.pp line 1639

They refer to  TLazAccessibleObject (line 990)

Then in control.inc line 150   procedure 
TLazAccessibleObject.SetAccessibleValue(const AValue: TCaption);

the widgetset is called
   WidgetsetClass := 
TWSLazAccessibleObjectClass(GetWSLazAccessibleObject());

   WidgetsetClass.SetAccessibleValue(Self, AValue);

TWSLazAccessibleObjectClass is at lcl\widgetset\wscontrols.pp line 80
TWSLazAccessibleObject is at line 71.

Search in files how it is sub-classed in carbon. Subclass it the same 
way in other widgetset.


If you want to subclass it in win32 go to 
lcl\interfaces\win32\win32wsfactory.pas line 131
   function RegisterLazAccessibleObject: Boolean; alias : 
'WSRegisterLazAccessibleObject';
see the commented code. only the gtk reference is a copy and paste. it 
needs to register the newly created class for win 32.


A few very short explanations:

Each widgetset (win, gtk, carbon, qt...) exports the methods for 
registration. the "alias" makes it visible to the linker.
The LCL refers to those as external functions. So the LCL can be linked 
against each widgetset.


Also each widgetset inherits from the classes in the parent folder 
(generic classes).

e.g. TWSLazAccessibleObject in lcl\widgetset\wscontrols.pp line 71
and carbon inherits: TCarbonWSLazAccessibleObject = 
class(TWSLazAccessibleObject)  in lcl\interfaces\carbon\carbonwscontrols.pp


The generic classes are also compiled into the lcl. So the widgetset can 
provide the sub classes, and lcl knows how to call them.




On 08/10/2017 21:09, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:

Hello,
If I want to add a functionality like accessibility to WidgetSet, 
which package could I use, lcl.lpk, or lclbase.lpk?
Also, how can I rebuilt the package when I modify/add some unit? Do I 
need to always rebuild the IDe, or there is a quicker way?
I am thinking about syntax check / quick compilation to incrementally 
check and fix semantic / syntax errors.


Thanks






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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Lubos Pintes via Lazarus]

You are quite wrong when you are talking about LCL.
For example, even buttons are not accessible, on the IDE welcome page, 
screen reader reports only "button", instead of "StartIDE button", "Help 
button", etc. Yes, the button itself is native, but is broken.
Another totally inaccessible component is, probably TTreeview. It is 
used in the options dialog where categories are displayed, in the 
package explorer etc. TCheckedListBox is yet another example. Code 
editor is totally inaccessible, etc, etc.

So again, you are wrong.

Dňa 8. 10. 2017 o 23:15 Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus napísal(a):

On 2017-10-08 21:09, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:

If I want to add a functionality like accessibility to WidgetSet, which
package could I use, lcl.lpk, or lclbase.lpk?


I believe "accessibility" is beyond the scope of the LCL. It is expected 
that the underlying GUI toolkit (Qt, GTK, fpGUI etc) implement the 
accessibility and will magically be available in your application, if 
accessibility is enabled in your desktop environment.


Regards,
   Graeme




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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Martin Frb via Lazarus]

I think there was some work before. (Afaik only carbon, Mac)

Look at TControl properties AccessibleRole, AccessibleValue, 
AccessibleDescription.

lcl\controls.pp line 1639

They refer to  TLazAccessibleObject (line 990)

Then in control.inc line 150   procedure 
TLazAccessibleObject.SetAccessibleValue(const AValue: TCaption);

the widgetset is called
  WidgetsetClass := 
TWSLazAccessibleObjectClass(GetWSLazAccessibleObject());

  WidgetsetClass.SetAccessibleValue(Self, AValue);

TWSLazAccessibleObjectClass is at lcl\widgetset\wscontrols.pp line 80
TWSLazAccessibleObject is at line 71.

Search in files how it is sub-classed in carbon. Subclass it the same 
way in other widgetset.


If you want to subclass it in win32 go to 
lcl\interfaces\win32\win32wsfactory.pas line 131
  function RegisterLazAccessibleObject: Boolean; alias : 
'WSRegisterLazAccessibleObject';
see the commented code. only the gtk reference is a copy and paste. it 
needs to register the newly created class for win 32.


A few very short explanations:

Each widgetset (win, gtk, carbon, qt...) exports the methods for 
registration. the "alias" makes it visible to the linker.
The LCL refers to those as external functions. So the LCL can be linked 
against each widgetset.


Also each widgetset inherits from the classes in the parent folder 
(generic classes).

e.g. TWSLazAccessibleObject in lcl\widgetset\wscontrols.pp line 71
and carbon inherits: TCarbonWSLazAccessibleObject = 
class(TWSLazAccessibleObject)  in lcl\interfaces\carbon\carbonwscontrols.pp


The generic classes are also compiled into the lcl. So the widgetset can 
provide the sub classes, and lcl knows how to call them.




On 08/10/2017 21:09, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:

Hello,
If I want to add a functionality like accessibility to WidgetSet, 
which package could I use, lcl.lpk, or lclbase.lpk?
Also, how can I rebuilt the package when I modify/add some unit? Do I 
need to always rebuild the IDe, or there is a quicker way?
I am thinking about syntax check / quick compilation to incrementally 
check and fix semantic / syntax errors.


Thanks



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Re: [Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Sven Barth via Lazarus]

Am 08.10.2017 23:15 schrieb "Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus" <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org>:
>
> On 2017-10-08 21:09, Lubos Pintes via Lazarus wrote:
>>
>> If I want to add a functionality like accessibility to WidgetSet, which
>> package could I use, lcl.lpk, or lclbase.lpk?
>
>
> I believe "accessibility" is beyond the scope of the LCL. It is expected
that the underlying GUI toolkit (Qt, GTK, fpGUI etc) implement the
accessibility and will magically be available in your application, if
accessibility is enabled in your desktop environment.

Not quite as the LCL still nerds to feed the necessary information to the
widgetset's accessibility subsystem, especially with custom drawn controls.
AFAIK there had been some work in the past to principally prepare the LCL
for this...

Regards,
Sven
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[Lazarus] Developing a WidgetSet

[Lubos Pintes via Lazarus]

Hello,
If I want to add a functionality like accessibility to WidgetSet, which 
package could I use, lcl.lpk, or lclbase.lpk?
Also, how can I rebuilt the package when I modify/add some unit? Do I 
need to always rebuild the IDe, or there is a quicker way?
I am thinking about syntax check / quick compilation to incrementally 
check and fix semantic / syntax errors.


Thanks

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