[LEAPSECS] (no subject)

2008-12-20 Thread Steve Allen
In addition to what John Cowan said, I'd also point out that planning is the one of the biggest issues with leap seconds. In terms of planning for the future, if an application cares about local time, not knowing whether a leap second is going to happen outside a six month window can be a much

Re: [LEAPSECS] (no subject)

2008-12-20 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message 006d7a34-31d9-4492-9014-667c7b926...@ucolick.org, Steve Allen writ es: Please identify the operations which need one second predictability over a time span of six months. Wrong question. Try: Please identify computer communications where it is not guaranteed that all involved

Re: [LEAPSECS] Schedule for success (was Re: (no subject))

2008-12-20 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message d754ef5c-767a-4ff0-ac64-6e9543aaa...@noao.edu, Rob Seaman writes: Instead of building computer hardware, operating systems and applications that pretend the relentless update cycle doesn't exist, build such systems to expect scheduled updates to software and key data structures.

Re: [LEAPSECS] Schedule for success (was Re: (no subject))

2008-12-20 Thread Greg Hennessy
Why don't you take that idea to to Airbus, Boeing, Lockheed, the FAA, NRC and the nuclear powerplant industry ? When they complain, we will. ___ LEAPSECS mailing list LEAPSECS@leapsecond.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/leapsecs

Re: [LEAPSECS] (no subject)

2008-12-20 Thread M. Warner Losh
In message: 006d7a34-31d9-4492-9014-667c7b926...@ucolick.org Steve Allen s...@ucolick.org writes: : I want to know why I should give up the notion of civil time being : based on mean solar time, for myself and for posterity. Leap-seconds, as implement, are unworkable. You can see

Re: [LEAPSECS] Schedule for success

2008-12-20 Thread M. Warner Losh
In message: 494d2886.5020...@cox.net Greg Hennessy greg.henne...@cox.net writes: : Why don't you take that idea to to Airbus, Boeing, Lockheed, the : FAA, NRC and the nuclear powerplant industry ? : : When they complain, we will. When you do business with these sorts of people,

Re: [LEAPSECS] Schedule for success

2008-12-20 Thread M. Warner Losh
You are under the fundamental misimpression that all systems are or can be upgraded every 6 months. That simply isn't possible for a large class of systems. So everything else that follows this fundamental flaw in reasoning is therefore fundamentally flawed. Warner

Re: [LEAPSECS] Schedule for success

2008-12-20 Thread Rob Seaman
Scroll down for my response. Context seemed important. On Dec 20, 2008, at 11:33 AM, M. Warner Losh wrote: In message: d754ef5c-767a-4ff0-ac64-6e9543aaa...@noao.edu Rob Seaman sea...@noao.edu writes: : Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: : : Steve Allen writes: : : Please identify the

Re: [LEAPSECS] (no subject)

2008-12-20 Thread Rob Seaman
Dude, I'm not representing your position at all. Assertions are made. I respond. The current system for instance, is simply the mechanics of the solar system. It will remain the underlying system whatever the ITU decides. What is your position on the solar system? I don't know.

Re: [LEAPSECS] Schedule for success

2008-12-20 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message 4957dfe1-9c18-4941-aa87-79e5dd429...@noao.edu, Rob Seaman writes: Again - why are engineering best practices regarded as an annoyance? Rob, They are not, but they are far different from what you think they are, and they are slavishly adhered to. I know several astronomers,

Re: [LEAPSECS] Schedule for success

2008-12-20 Thread Rob Seaman
Poul-Henning Kamp wrote to start this thread: Please identify computer communications where it is not guaranteed that all involved computers will have their software updated every six months. Presumably this was at least half humorous, but I took the chance to point out that if this were

Re: [LEAPSECS] (no subject)

2008-12-20 Thread Ashley Yakeley
On Sat, 2008-12-20 at 08:03 -0800, Steve Allen wrote: I want to know why I should give up the notion of civil time being based on mean solar time, for myself and for posterity. I believe the answer being argued is the aerospace and nuclear industries would save money. -- Ashley Yakeley

Re: [LEAPSECS] (no subject)

2008-12-20 Thread Steve Allen
On 2008 Dec 20, at 10:55, M. Warner Losh wrote: Either we kill them entirely, since they are going away eventually anyway, or we put them on a regular schedule like leap years. The current system sucks too bad to be allowed to continue. Pardon me, but I'm missing something in this about the