Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Peter Vince
Hello Paul, I'd be interested if you have some examples of of Y2K bugs that were fixed before they became a problem. In my very limited experience, I wasn't affected by any, nor aware of them. Peter On 10 December 2010 01:55, Paul Sheer p...@2038bug.com wrote: Everybody said y2k

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Warner Losh
On 12/09/2010 17:35, Rob Seaman wrote: On Dec 9, 2010, at 3:53 PM, Steve Allen wrote: This is the first example I've come across where a widely used API will break if UTC does not continue to have leap seconds. Has anyone even considered a Y2K style inventory? Absence of evidence is

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Gerard Ashton
On 12/10/2010 10:15 AM, Peter Vince wrote: Hello Paul, I'd be interested if you have some examples of of Y2K bugs that were fixed before they became a problem. In my very limited experience, I wasn't affected by any, nor aware of them. Peter On 10 December 2010 01:55, Paul

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Richard B. Langley
USNO predicts UT1-UTC. In Bulletin A http://maia.usno.navy.mil/ser7/ser7.dat, they predict daily values for a year in advance but only provide an error estimate up to 40 days in advance. Elsewhere http://maia.usno.navy.mil/ser7/deltat.preds, longer-term predictions are given; supposedly

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Paul Sheer
It's very concerning if Y2K has been recast as a myth among technical professionals, [...] Concerning indeed: KCBI a Christian radio chanel recently proclaimed: The Y2K is an example of scientists predicting disaster when there was none. This is just like global warming. There have been

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Paul Sheer
I'm getting emotional to prepare for Y2038 Please don't take offense -paul On Fri, 2010-12-10 at 16:21 +, p...@2038bug.com wrote: WH-WH-Wht Contractors spent millions of hours wading through hundreds of millions of lines of code adding missing century digits. Thousands

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Rob Seaman
On Dec 10, 2010, at 9:18 AM, Richard B. Langley wrote: USNO predicts UT1-UTC. In Bulletin A http://maia.usno.navy.mil/ser7/ser7.dat, they predict daily values for a year in advance but only provide an error estimate up to 40 days in advance. Elsewhere

[LEAPSECS] New Horizons in Time Domain Astronomy

2010-12-10 Thread Rob Seaman
Timekeeping is a means to an end. We've often discussed logistical issues. There are more fundamental issues, many of which will be topics of IAU Symposium 285 at Oxford (UK), 19-23 Sep 2011: http://www.physics.ox.ac.uk/timedomainconf The Astronomer Royal, Martin Rees, will deliver a

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message 4d024bb8.9060...@bsdimp.com, Warner Losh writes: On 12/09/2010 17:35, Rob Seaman wrote: Rob, First, a point of semantics: I don't think leap seconds can break php further than it already is. Second, there is no basis for claiming that php breaks when you are talking about some

[LEAPSECS] Leap Sec vs Y2K

2010-12-10 Thread Finkleman, Dave
Ken Seidelmann, John Seago, and I addressed this in our papers and in the recent editorial in Space News. The Y2K effort was necessary. Everyone knew that we could not just watch what might happen and catch up afterwards. In the case of leap seconds, no one knows what the real consequences

Re: [LEAPSECS] Leap Sec vs Y2K

2010-12-10 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message 3b33e89c51d2de44be2f0c757c656c8809cda...@mail02.stk.com, Finklema n, Dave writes: We can just let things be as they have been for nearly 40 years. Sure, no argument from here: Please shut down your Internet connection and any cell-phones you might have, and don't use them ever again

Re: [LEAPSECS] Leap Sec vs Y2K

2010-12-10 Thread p
very much need to know and agree what time it is. Yes but mostly only to an accuracy of minutes. -paul Sent from my BlackBerry® by Boost Mobile -Original Message- From: Poul-Henning Kamp p...@phk.freebsd.dk Sender: leapsecs-boun...@leapsecond.com Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 18:42:42 To:

Re: [LEAPSECS] Leap Sec vs Y2K

2010-12-10 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message 211674-1292007095-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-4042 478...@bda950.bisx.prod.on.blackberry, p...@2038bug.com writes: very much need to know and agree what time it is. Yes but mostly only to an accuracy of minutes. Pray tell what authority you have for this

[LEAPSECS] Affect of Y2K on programmers' attitude toward time documents

2010-12-10 Thread Gerard Ashton
One effect I recall from the Y2K prevention effort actually relates to 29 February 2000. There was considerable discussion among programmers as to whether that date existed or not, and there was enough disagreement among the computer language manuals and the like that programmers lost

Re: [LEAPSECS] php breaks if UTC has no leap seconds?

2010-12-10 Thread Rob Seaman
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:22 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: Third, you have whined and complained about all the breakage for years now, this is the first piece of concrete code you have ever presented. It wasn't my example. The responsibility for due diligence doesn't rest with those supporting

Re: [LEAPSECS] Affect of Y2K on programmers' attitude toward time documents

2010-12-10 Thread Steve Allen
On Fri 2010-12-10T14:03:08 -0500, Gerard Ashton hath writ: I suspect this rude awakening to the need to inspect primary sources may be adding to the present discontent with the lack of transparency of the ITU, and the inability to obtain what public documents they have for free or for

Re: [LEAPSECS] Leap Sec vs Y2K

2010-12-10 Thread Rob Seaman
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:42 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: In message 3b33e89c51d2de44be2f0c757c656c8809cda...@mail02.stk.com, Finklema n, Dave writes: We can just let things be as they have been for nearly 40 years. Sure, no argument from here: Please shut down your Internet connection

Re: [LEAPSECS] Leap Sec vs Y2K

2010-12-10 Thread Daniel R. Tobias
On 11 Dec 2010 at 0:40, Paul Sheer wrote: At the ISP I consult for there are about 20 servers serving 60,000 customers. Their clocks routinely go out of sync and it doesn't affect service. I have a script that dumps the timestamps of each of a number of servers where I work; this is a recent