Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Ian Batten
On 14 Jan 2014, at 23:53, Poul-Henning Kamp p...@phk.freebsd.dk wrote: It's not like Ken Dennis looked at leap-seconds and went Naah, who cares, or even braindead! We'll skip that. I think it would require slightly more software archaeology to determine who took what decisions about what.

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Tom Van Baak
This notion leaves open the question of the name UTC. In particular, can the delegates to the ITU-R RA be persuaded to vote for a new version of TF.460 if they are aware that the new wording will change the legal definition of the word day in every country which has adopted UTC as its time

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Ian Batten
On 16 Jan 2014, at 09:33, Tom Van Baak t...@leapsecond.com wrote: This notion leaves open the question of the name UTC. In particular, can the delegates to the ITU-R RA be persuaded to vote for a new version of TF.460 if they are aware that the new wording will change the legal definition

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message 2747cb51-6467-4a14-92be-229901755...@batten.eu.org, Ian Batten wri tes: That ship's already sailed. Days are the intervals between successive civil time midnights, ...except in Norway and Denmark, and a few other select countries where our language as a word for 24 hour period (døgn)

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Tom Van Baak
The Multics clock design (a fixed bin (71), ie double word, representing microseconds since 00:00 01-01-1900) clearly informs the Unix one. Was it 1900 or 1901? See: http://www.multicians.org/jhs-clock.html http://web.mit.edu/multics-history/source/Multics/ldd/bos/include/rdclock.incl.alm

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Tony Finch
Tom Van Baak t...@leapsecond.com wrote: When I developed email in 1976 I encoded the BCD date (mmddyy) and BCD time (hhmmss) into two 18-bit binary fields. This worked because the maximum possible date was 123199, the maximum time was 235959, which just fit in the maximum half-word (2^18 =

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message ead2cfb1-799e-4bc9-9a68-80aad893e...@batten.eu.org, Ian Batten wri tes: It would be interesting to know what proportion of computers 1975--2000 had their clocks aligned to within +/- 22 seconds of anything, such that ignoring leap second was anything other than a second-order effect.

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Warner Losh
On Jan 16, 2014, at 7:23 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: In message ead2cfb1-799e-4bc9-9a68-80aad893e...@batten.eu.org, Ian Batten wri tes: It would be interesting to know what proportion of computers 1975--2000 had their clocks aligned to within +/- 22 seconds of anything, such that

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Ian Batten
On 16 Jan 2014, at 15:03, Warner Losh i...@bsdimp.com wrote: I think the answer for 1970-1990 is that most of them were aligned to local time (even if the system ticked in virtual UTC/GMT time) with sub-minute accuracy. Time alignment started to matter as more computers were networked

[LEAPSECS] Bulletin C #47 2014-01-16

2014-01-16 Thread Zefram
INTERNATIONAL EARTH ROTATION AND REFERENCE SYSTEMS SERVICE (IERS) SERVICE INTERNATIONAL DE LA ROTATION TERRESTRE ET DES SYSTEMES DE REFERENCE SERVICE DE LA ROTATION TERRESTRE OBSERVATOIRE DE PARIS 61, Av. de l'Observatoire 75014 PARIS (France) Tel. : 33 (0) 1 40 51 22 29 FAX :

Re: [LEAPSECS] QB213 .R4 2013

2014-01-16 Thread Eric Fort
might there be a bit more simplicity added to this discussion. It would seem to me that what is and is not a clock is not and should not be the question. A clock tells time, whatever that is. Planetary rotation, Planetary orbit, A pendulum, A quartz crystal, or a cesium beam - none of these

Re: [LEAPSECS] LEAPSECS Digest, Vol 88, Issue 31

2014-01-16 Thread Dennis Ferguson
On 15 Jan, 2014, at 14:58 , Richard Clark rcl...@noao.edu wrote: And as for counting-- it's not always in the realm of mathematicians. When you enter a building on ground level and you go to a room on the 1st floor do you expect to use the stairs or elevator? The answer depends on wheather

Re: [LEAPSECS] QB213 .R4 2013

2014-01-16 Thread Daode
Eric Fort eric.f...@gmail.com wrote: |I'd be interested in the groups comments. Follow me across the sea. Where milky babies seem to be. Molded, flowing revelry. With the one that set them free. Tell all the people that you see. It's just me |[.]I think the mass public |would

Re: [LEAPSECS] QB213 .R4 2013

2014-01-16 Thread Steve Allen
On Thu 2014-01-16T09:58:52 -0800, Eric Fort hath writ: Maybe it's time for the minders of astronomical periodicity and the minders of atomic periodicity to simply agree to disagree about what time is at it's core and simply use the timescale that is appropriate and useful for their own use.

Re: [LEAPSECS] QB213 .R4 2013

2014-01-16 Thread Eric Fort
On Thu, Jan 16, 2014 at 10:18 AM, Steve Allen s...@ucolick.org wrote: On Thu 2014-01-16T09:58:52 -0800, Eric Fort hath writ: Maybe it's time for the minders of astronomical periodicity and the minders of atomic periodicity to simply agree to disagree about what time is at it's core and simply

[LEAPSECS] Common Calendar Time (CCT) -Brooks Harris

2014-01-16 Thread Brooks Harris
On 2014-01-15 11:36 PM, Steve Allen wrote: On Thu 2014-01-16T06:55:00 +, Clive D.W. Feather hath writ: Poul-Henning Kamp said: What *has* been proposed, where I have seen it, is to remove leap-seconds, and leave the keep civil time in sync with the sun up to local governments who can mess

Re: [LEAPSECS] presentations from AAS Future of Time sessions

2014-01-16 Thread Steve Allen
On Thu 2014-01-16T01:33:53 -0800, Tom Van Baak hath writ: What is a typical example of the legal definition of a day? Would that definition be affected if DUT1 were allowed to grow to 2 s or 10 s or 60 s instead of 0.9 s? In the United States one legal definition with significant financial