Re: Two svg import filters
Hi Armin, Armin Le Grand píše v St 23. 12. 2015 v 10:04 +0100: > > I would have thought the difference between "open" and "insert" was > > pretty clear (yes, I know there are plenty of clueless lusers out > > there). But it applies to pretty much ALL objects - if you "insert" > > then LO keeps the object unaltered, if you "open" then LO converts the > > object to a form that it can edit. > > That is a good argument to stay on that difference. But - when opening > and we have the possibility by doing this using the same filter as when > inserting - wouldn't it be better to use that and additionally 'break' > the SVG? With my UX hat on, I wouldn't break it on load, it's OK enough when there is a possibility to do so. When not broken, I suspect the move / resize etc. behaves more naturally (moves / resizes the entire picture). > This would lead to the same 'open' behaviour, guarantee SVG looking the > same despite of insert/open, deliver better quality and reduce number of > filters to maintain to one. I think the breaking (ie. loading the svg in a way it can be editable) was the biggest concern blocking this... So I guess if the fidelity (in the sense of shapes / gradients etc.) of a svg loaded via svgio and broken into shapes is similar / same (or even better) than the fidelity of svg loaded via filter/source/svg, I'd vote for removing filter/source/svg ;-) Can you please take this topic to the ESC? Thank you, Kendy ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi Wol, Am 21.12.2015 um 22:53 schrieb Anthonys Lists: On 18/12/2015 09:29, Armin Le Grand wrote: Despite the quality being quite different, even when this would be fixed, there will alwyas be slight differences. How do you explain a user that the quality of the SVG he wants to use depends on the way he uses it? Does anyone expect users to know the difference between opening and inserting an SVG? How much do users like answers as 'yes, but you added it in the 'wrong' way...'? There should be no wrong way. You should not need expertise know-how to be able to use SVG in the best possible quality. I would have thought the difference between "open" and "insert" was pretty clear (yes, I know there are plenty of clueless lusers out there). But it applies to pretty much ALL objects - if you "insert" then LO keeps the object unaltered, if you "open" then LO converts the object to a form that it can edit. That is a good argument to stay on that difference. But - when opening and we have the possibility by doing this using the same filter as when inserting - wouldn't it be better to use that and additionally 'break' the SVG? This would lead to the same 'open' behaviour, guarantee SVG looking the same despite of insert/open, deliver better quality and reduce number of filters to maintain to one. Just my 2ct... This is the way I understood MS originally intended inserting to work - okay they didn't bother implementing it properly... but that is the way LO should work across the board. Think of putting spreadsheet data into a Word document - do you embed/insert an Excel spreadsheet, or cut-n-paste into a Word table? I don't know to what extent it's been fixed, but I think a lot of user confusion is down to various Office apps being inconsistent in how they behave - LO is (or was) a big offender imho, but then MS Office was likely worse ... Cheers, Wol ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
On 18/12/2015 09:29, Armin Le Grand wrote: Despite the quality being quite different, even when this would be fixed, there will alwyas be slight differences. How do you explain a user that the quality of the SVG he wants to use depends on the way he uses it? Does anyone expect users to know the difference between opening and inserting an SVG? How much do users like answers as 'yes, but you added it in the 'wrong' way...'? There should be no wrong way. You should not need expertise know-how to be able to use SVG in the best possible quality. I would have thought the difference between "open" and "insert" was pretty clear (yes, I know there are plenty of clueless lusers out there). But it applies to pretty much ALL objects - if you "insert" then LO keeps the object unaltered, if you "open" then LO converts the object to a form that it can edit. This is the way I understood MS originally intended inserting to work - okay they didn't bother implementing it properly... but that is the way LO should work across the board. Think of putting spreadsheet data into a Word document - do you embed/insert an Excel spreadsheet, or cut-n-paste into a Word table? I don't know to what extent it's been fixed, but I think a lot of user confusion is down to various Office apps being inconsistent in how they behave - LO is (or was) a big offender imho, but then MS Office was likely worse ... Cheers, Wol ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
On 16/12/2015 13:13, Dennis Roczek wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Hi SOS, Am 16.12.2015 um 10:54 schrieb SOS: Greetz Fernand ps. a filter who imports PDF in to Writer: +10 We do already such. File --> open --> PDF (open in writer) OK this is a filter who opens and makes a PDF "editable" in LO what i love to have is a filter who places the PDF (1 page) unchanged as a graphic in writer Greetz Regards, Dennis Roczek -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2 iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJWcVVrAAoJEM4+Qf3OKrbZpGgQAMvDiTGxu/6WbzAObsuEZhz7 5AMhoMB+CijXmyf50Xz3YYsp5VbeAHTw1P/3rADhKpyhmKNylm33ax0OtFnLg41D fJoQKtaEJcEcpOn0wz+1L9KMARj4OCsFpXw1Y93m1h0m14EQoROcUzNXC34JgblF 5b2Q/1dU27tB2BOGiKImHA9jJ7vGiFFEBzNJvIRIoGNvEM4LYPelw9J0JJgH1Guk JO+S9wWC6tl7dyhjrIogz7L2q7Q16FCA3q7UH9dWYZXDg8ENl+FzUMu1eH+SlNTe uKQRhYye1lJFnAJqELwVXLENFi7zpipZvriBxH2R8zcZS6n9PWbjPQtJVO3LVCa+ vmLWhN2I1KFGt9G1Y0tyAwKBOpukqQ2zspXcpLvTi/IrLT1HL32IE7Bu1i0pbdOo ZcBox1Bo0r7uDI6MLbOpHpOz3hCIrLlxfRbwsYlFrgwZ4WS5oNvIxFHyuTbkXDUG vWw3Rqd8VtGgUA4sVLVXb61qy6xciqzdM8wnKmeut35mo4PUHK9LZuMkLTh2UKCN //vx3tBKUzWNvE49NTSPOa99c97njnzo9SlcfsBlt2nq619n202whHlZOI3ZzTbQ LR8USESUID9FdKsLdSsLSHgYAGdiE3I53MCH7RbFoJISTtP0ZoPphjoCMy5zh8ps dbOGyFqDfUI8Pg8oglxM =6LGI -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi, Am 18.12.2015 um 11:56 schrieb Regina Henschel: Hi all, Thorsten Behrens schrieb: Michael Stahl wrote: i don't claim to know anything about SVG, but i just noticed that filter/source/svg uses boost::spirit, and therefore i am +1 for removing it. That's so far the strongest case for removal here. ;) Other than that, the two filters serve two very different purposes - the document filter actually tries to map svg as well as possible to ODF (it would work even better if LibreOffice's ODF filter would support more of the syntax and semantics of SVG), to get *editable* graphics. As such, replacing the document importer with something that sticks the image into a graphic object is missing the point IMO. I think, that one filter is enough and that LO should use svgio. In case of File>Open and if you really want to make the graphic immediately editable, then LO should insert the SVG in a new document as done by Insert>Image and then break it automatically. All effort and free time should be used to improve svgio and to implement the missing ODF parts. For example the lack of the ODF elements and is really bad. It does not only effect SVG import but the OOXML filter too. +1! Kind regards Regina ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi, Am 18.12.2015 um 12:12 schrieb Regina Henschel: Hi Armin, Armin Le Grand schrieb: [..] Both do not allow round-trip, good-quality SVG editing, that is not the role of LO. Why not? Don't get me wrong - I would love LO to be a SVG editor, in the same sense that I would love it to be a pixel editor when a pixel graphic is selected. Both would require much work to make it happen. In the case of the pixel editor the pragmatic answer is to use an external tool, evtl. triggered from the office. As long as we do not extensively add work to get a good SVG edit roundtrip, the answer for now is the same for SVG. At least, (b) keeps the orig SVG as reusable data (context menu, save graphic saves the *original* svg). Thus, you can edit it in an external editor and re-add (or is there nowadays even a 'edit in external editor', have seen that somewhere..?). The item "Edit with External Tool..." is in the context menu of the image. In my case the browser is started to open the svg image. But LO adds garbage in front of the svg source, so my browser shows an XML error. Despite of the ... in the item label, no dialog opens to choose the External Tool. The idea is good and this should be added to bugzilla as an error. This should be possible for SVG and pixel graphics. If this runs well (and opens the user's choosen default editor for the wnated purpose) we have a good solution. Kind regards Regina ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
> Why not? > Because there are better alternatives? Because we want to avoid feature creep; especially features that nobody seems to be ready to spend resources on? (My *private* opinions only.) --tml ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi Armin, Armin Le Grand schrieb: [..] Both do not allow round-trip, good-quality SVG editing, that is not the role of LO. Why not? At least, (b) keeps the orig SVG as reusable data (context menu, save graphic saves the *original* svg). Thus, you can edit it in an external editor and re-add (or is there nowadays even a 'edit in external editor', have seen that somewhere..?). The item "Edit with External Tool..." is in the context menu of the image. In my case the browser is started to open the svg image. But LO adds garbage in front of the svg source, so my browser shows an XML error. Despite of the ... in the item label, no dialog opens to choose the External Tool. Kind regards Regina ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi all, Thorsten Behrens schrieb: Michael Stahl wrote: i don't claim to know anything about SVG, but i just noticed that filter/source/svg uses boost::spirit, and therefore i am +1 for removing it. That's so far the strongest case for removal here. ;) Other than that, the two filters serve two very different purposes - the document filter actually tries to map svg as well as possible to ODF (it would work even better if LibreOffice's ODF filter would support more of the syntax and semantics of SVG), to get *editable* graphics. As such, replacing the document importer with something that sticks the image into a graphic object is missing the point IMO. I think, that one filter is enough and that LO should use svgio. In case of File>Open and if you really want to make the graphic immediately editable, then LO should insert the SVG in a new document as done by Insert>Image and then break it automatically. All effort and free time should be used to improve svgio and to implement the missing ODF parts. For example the lack of the ODF elements and is really bad. It does not only effect SVG import but the OOXML filter too. Kind regards Regina ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi, Am 16.12.2015 um 09:49 schrieb Jan Holesovsky: Hi Thorsten, Thorsten Behrens píše v Út 15. 12. 2015 v 23:46 +0100: Other than that, the two filters serve two very different purposes - the document filter actually tries to map svg as well as possible to ODF (it would work even better if LibreOffice's ODF filter would support more of the syntax and semantics of SVG), to get *editable* graphics. As such, replacing the document importer with something that sticks the image into a graphic object is missing the point IMO. Armin wrote that svgio can "'break' to process/use the contained geometries" - so my understanding was that it can be further editable; is it not the case? If not - how hard would it be to extend drawinglayer to be able to "make something editable out of the contained svg"? It is the case. Compare the following: (a) Start LO, file/open, choose any SVG you want -> Draw opens, the SVG gets represented as draw objects (b) Start LO, open Draw, insert same SVG as graphic (D&D or insert/graphic) -> SVG gets a single GraphicObject With (b) you may now select, and choose 'break' in the context menu -> SVG gets decomposed to draw objects. Compare the two results with your SVG. Despite the quality being quite different, even when this would be fixed, there will alwyas be slight differences. How do you explain a user that the quality of the SVG he wants to use depends on the way he uses it? Does anyone expect users to know the difference between opening and inserting an SVG? How much do users like answers as 'yes, but you added it in the 'wrong' way...'? There should be no wrong way. You should not need expertise know-how to be able to use SVG in the best possible quality. Both do not allow round-trip, good-quality SVG editing, that is not the role of LO. At least, (b) keeps the orig SVG as reusable data (context menu, save graphic saves the *original* svg). Thus, you can edit it in an external editor and re-add (or is there nowadays even a 'edit in external editor', have seen that somewhere..?). Even if someone wants to have the filter to 'edit' SVG the better solution would be to automate (b) what means add the last step of breaking up the object after load. I would not do that - let the user choose if he wants to 'edit' the SVG. As long as we have no dedicated SVG editing options, I doubbt many will use LO for that. What is indeed useful is to re-use graphic data from SVGs for draw objects, that is what 'break' offers. Maybe the problem is more that only view people seem to know about 'break' - what about adding that more prominent/additionally under 'ungroup'...? Still, I would opt for using one SVG filter/importer only. All the best, Kendy ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Hi SOS, Am 16.12.2015 um 10:54 schrieb SOS: > > Greetz Fernand ps. a filter who imports PDF in to Writer: +10 We do already such. File --> open --> PDF (open in writer) Regards, Dennis Roczek -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2 iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJWcVVrAAoJEM4+Qf3OKrbZpGgQAMvDiTGxu/6WbzAObsuEZhz7 5AMhoMB+CijXmyf50Xz3YYsp5VbeAHTw1P/3rADhKpyhmKNylm33ax0OtFnLg41D fJoQKtaEJcEcpOn0wz+1L9KMARj4OCsFpXw1Y93m1h0m14EQoROcUzNXC34JgblF 5b2Q/1dU27tB2BOGiKImHA9jJ7vGiFFEBzNJvIRIoGNvEM4LYPelw9J0JJgH1Guk JO+S9wWC6tl7dyhjrIogz7L2q7Q16FCA3q7UH9dWYZXDg8ENl+FzUMu1eH+SlNTe uKQRhYye1lJFnAJqELwVXLENFi7zpipZvriBxH2R8zcZS6n9PWbjPQtJVO3LVCa+ vmLWhN2I1KFGt9G1Y0tyAwKBOpukqQ2zspXcpLvTi/IrLT1HL32IE7Bu1i0pbdOo ZcBox1Bo0r7uDI6MLbOpHpOz3hCIrLlxfRbwsYlFrgwZ4WS5oNvIxFHyuTbkXDUG vWw3Rqd8VtGgUA4sVLVXb61qy6xciqzdM8wnKmeut35mo4PUHK9LZuMkLTh2UKCN //vx3tBKUzWNvE49NTSPOa99c97njnzo9SlcfsBlt2nq619n202whHlZOI3ZzTbQ LR8USESUID9FdKsLdSsLSHgYAGdiE3I53MCH7RbFoJISTtP0ZoPphjoCMy5zh8ps dbOGyFqDfUI8Pg8oglxM =6LGI -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
+1 for Thorsten For editing graphics there is Draw and we need a filter who makes the original graphic editable For publishing graphics there is Writer and we need a filter who just imports and do not touch the original graphic if the "one" filter can do both: OK Greetz Fernand ps. a filter who imports PDF in to Writer: +10 On 15/12/2015 23:46, Thorsten Behrens wrote: Michael Stahl wrote: i don't claim to know anything about SVG, but i just noticed that filter/source/svg uses boost::spirit, and therefore i am +1 for removing it. That's so far the strongest case for removal here. ;) Other than that, the two filters serve two very different purposes - the document filter actually tries to map svg as well as possible to ODF (it would work even better if LibreOffice's ODF filter would support more of the syntax and semantics of SVG), to get *editable* graphics. As such, replacing the document importer with something that sticks the image into a graphic object is missing the point IMO. Cheers, -- Thorsten ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi Thorsten, Thorsten Behrens píše v Út 15. 12. 2015 v 23:46 +0100: > Other than that, the two filters serve two very different purposes - > the document filter actually tries to map svg as well as possible to > ODF (it would work even better if LibreOffice's ODF filter would > support more of the syntax and semantics of SVG), to get *editable* > graphics. > > As such, replacing the document importer with something that sticks > the image into a graphic object is missing the point IMO. Armin wrote that svgio can "'break' to process/use the contained geometries" - so my understanding was that it can be further editable; is it not the case? If not - how hard would it be to extend drawinglayer to be able to "make something editable out of the contained svg"? All the best, Kendy ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Michael Stahl wrote: > i don't claim to know anything about SVG, but i just noticed that > filter/source/svg uses boost::spirit, and therefore i am +1 for > removing it. > That's so far the strongest case for removal here. ;) Other than that, the two filters serve two very different purposes - the document filter actually tries to map svg as well as possible to ODF (it would work even better if LibreOffice's ODF filter would support more of the syntax and semantics of SVG), to get *editable* graphics. As such, replacing the document importer with something that sticks the image into a graphic object is missing the point IMO. Cheers, -- Thorsten signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
On 15.12.2015 10:16, Armin Le Grand wrote: > Imagine (a) creating a draw doc with one page and placing the SVG as > GraphicObject there, all done. For MultiPage SVGs that should be changed > to create one page per SVG page with the adapted single-page SVGs as > GraphicObject content. That would allow fast conversion, keeping generic > and use a single SVG filter. the removal of code duplication sounds great! > Due to this situation I would propose to: > > - work on changing the SVG importer (a) to creating simple docs with > GraphicObjects containing the SVG as gereric format, not do own SVG > conversion any longer > - put thus created free time in improving/fixing (b) > > ...What do you think? i don't claim to know anything about SVG, but i just noticed that filter/source/svg uses boost::spirit, and therefore i am +1 for removing it. ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
On 15/12/15 09:16, Armin Le Grand wrote: > Due to this situation I would propose to: > > - work on changing the SVG importer (a) to creating simple docs with > GraphicObjects containing the SVG as gereric format, not do own SVG > conversion any longer > - put thus created free time in improving/fixing (b) > > ...What do you think? Why exactly are we doing (b)? Because we've got an LO editor for XML graphics? Then surely it makes sense to separate embedding graphics into a document, from editing an embedded graphic. The SVG->XML converter should be tied to the XML editor. And could probably be deprecated as in "you should use an SVG editor if your graphic is SVG". Yes, I know, lusers will say "I don't want to learn another editor and I know the XML one" :-) But imho it makes solid logical sense to tie converters to the applications that use the conversion, and don't convert stuff that doesn't need it, like when just embedding one document in another. Cheers, Wol ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi List, this issue needs to be discussed. I put Regina and Xisco on direct CC to reach them. Xisco is so kind to fix errors on the SVG filter in the filter module and asks me for reviews (which I am happily ready to do), but this shows that eventually double work is done and we need to discuss. As you might know, we have two SVG importers, (a) the one in filter which you are working on, and (b) one in svgio.While (a) converts SVG to XML as input for loading it as ODF in the office, (b) loads a single SVG as graphic and adds/embeds it as such as content to a GraphicObject in any application. E.g. (a) is used when opeing an SVG, while (b) is used when D&D or insert graphic is used. Both have their usages, but there are differences. Let’s try to collect some: (a)Is -Less capable than (b) -More generic than (b) -Does not keep (a) internally and unchanged -Can support multiple-pages SVG docs (i guess?) (b)Is -More capable -Converts to Primitives -Further usable (paint, print, PDF export, 'break' to process/use the contained geometries, usable as FillStyle, generally in all office processing where GraphicObjects are used -Better integrated to the office ((everywhere where GraphicObjects are) -Keeps the orig SVG, can be saved anytime using context menu on GraphicObjects -Keeps the orig as graphic embedded in ODF (as all other graphics) It makes from my POV no sense to develop two SVG filters. It is extra work and users will be irritated when in one case the SVG looks different from other cases using the same SVG in te same program. It is also good to have a generic SVG filter like (a), but it culd use (b). Imagine (a) creating a draw doc with one page and placing the SVG as GraphicObject there, all done. For MultiPage SVGs that should be changed to create one page per SVG page with the adapted single-page SVGs as GraphicObject content. That would allow fast conversion, keeping generic and use a single SVG filter. Due to this situation I would propose to: - work on changing the SVG importer (a) to creating simple docs with GraphicObjects containing the SVG as gereric format, not do own SVG conversion any longer - put thus created free time in improving/fixing (b) ...What do you think? Am 04.11.2015 um 15:30 schrieb Regina Henschel: Hi Caolán, Caolán McNamara schrieb: We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in both places ? I suggest to use svgio in both cases (as Apache OpenOffice does) for following reasons: - It is double work to maintain two import filters. The filter used for File > Open has a lot of bugs, and no one has fixed them. - The file-open filter automatically converts the svg-file, but ODF is not able to describe all features of svg. If the svg-file is only rendered as svg, then it is possible to show it more correctly. - The svgio filter keeps the svg-file, therefore no data is lost. - Because converting a svg-file to ODF will loose information, such converting should not be done automatically, but only on explicit user request. Kind regards Regina ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi, it would be nice if this topic can be dicussed today at the ESC meeting. Regards 2015-11-05 12:22 GMT+01:00 Armin Le Grand : > Hi, > > Am 05.11.2015 um 10:30 schrieb Xisco Faulí: > > Hi all, > > Recently I've been working on some fixes for filter/source/svg/* and my > intention would be to spend some more time to fix other issues in this > filter as there's plenty of room for improvements. However, I'd like to > know if a decision is going to be make wrt this topic before I do other > fixes as I wouldn't like to work on something that, eventually, is going to > be drop. > From my point of view, I find svgio to support more svg elements and > atributtes than svg filter but, as mentioned before, they do different > things, svgio imports the file as svg and the filter as a draw document so > it can be edited afterwards, so either we drop one or the other we are > going to lose some already implemented features. On the other hand, it's > also a pain to have 2 filters that do more or less the same. > > > SVG added as GraphicObject using svgio can also be edited - that's why > there is a 'break' command in the context menu for this objects. Not sure > if this command is available in all Apps from the UI perspective (the core > can always break SVGs), but you may try in draw/impress. Breaking creates > all SdrObjects needed to represent the SVG. > > With regards to the missing support in svg filter, I don't think it > wouldn't be to difficult to improve it, as other filters already implement > similar features, so they can be taken as a guidance. > > Regards > > * > https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/q/owner:%22Xisco+Faul%25C3%25AD+Tarazona+%253Canistenis%2540gmail.com%253E%22 > > > ___ > LibreOffice mailing > listLibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.orghttp://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice > > > -- > ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) > > ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi, Am 05.11.2015 um 10:30 schrieb Xisco Faulí: Hi all, Recently I've been working on some fixes for filter/source/svg/* and my intention would be to spend some more time to fix other issues in this filter as there's plenty of room for improvements. However, I'd like to know if a decision is going to be make wrt this topic before I do other fixes as I wouldn't like to work on something that, eventually, is going to be drop. From my point of view, I find svgio to support more svg elements and atributtes than svg filter but, as mentioned before, they do different things, svgio imports the file as svg and the filter as a draw document so it can be edited afterwards, so either we drop one or the other we are going to lose some already implemented features. On the other hand, it's also a pain to have 2 filters that do more or less the same. SVG added as GraphicObject using svgio can also be edited - that's why there is a 'break' command in the context menu for this objects. Not sure if this command is available in all Apps from the UI perspective (the core can always break SVGs), but you may try in draw/impress. Breaking creates all SdrObjects needed to represent the SVG. With regards to the missing support in svg filter, I don't think it wouldn't be to difficult to improve it, as other filters already implement similar features, so they can be taken as a guidance. Regards * https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/q/owner:%22Xisco+Faul%25C3%25AD+Tarazona+%253Canistenis%2540gmail.com%253E%22 ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Two svg import filters
Hi all, Recently I've been working on some fixes for filter/source/svg/* and my intention would be to spend some more time to fix other issues in this filter as there's plenty of room for improvements. However, I'd like to know if a decision is going to be make wrt this topic before I do other fixes as I wouldn't like to work on something that, eventually, is going to be drop. >From my point of view, I find svgio to support more svg elements and atributtes than svg filter but, as mentioned before, they do different things, svgio imports the file as svg and the filter as a draw document so it can be edited afterwards, so either we drop one or the other we are going to lose some already implemented features. On the other hand, it's also a pain to have 2 filters that do more or less the same. With regards to the missing support in svg filter, I don't think it wouldn't be to difficult to improve it, as other filters already implement similar features, so they can be taken as a guidance. Regards * https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/q/owner:%22Xisco+Faul%25C3%25AD+Tarazona+%253Canistenis%2540gmail.com%253E%22 ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
From a users point of view: Inserting a SVG-image in Writer, Calc or Impress must been done "unchanged" because users will in 99% off all cases not edit a Image. Opening in Draw is a different game where in most cases the user has the intention tot edit a image and save back SVG or as a other format. A same sort of filter who import a PDF as Graphic in Writer, Calc and Impress would be very nice to. Currently we need a third party app to convert PDF to SVG before we can insert a PDF-file into writer, Calc or Impress Greetz Fernand On 4/11/2015 13:30, Armin Le Grand wrote: Hi, Am 04.11.2015 um 13:11 schrieb Caolán McNamara: We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in both places ? svgio: Imports SVG as Graphic, keeps SVG unchanged, embedded in ODF, can be exported again, can be broken to graphic objects to use/change geometrically filter/source/svg: New for me, seems to directly convert on XML-Base from SVG to ODF by breaking at import time future: Not sure, there are probably args for each. If you want to preserve the SVG unchanged, svgio and a resulting ODF with one graphic object and embedded original SVG might be preferred. Needs to be discussed. C. ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi, Am 04.11.2015 um 13:11 schrieb Caolán McNamara: We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in both places ? svgio: Imports SVG as Graphic, keeps SVG unchanged, embedded in ODF, can be exported again, can be broken to graphic objects to use/change geometrically filter/source/svg: New for me, seems to directly convert on XML-Base from SVG to ODF by breaking at import time future: Not sure, there are probably args for each. If you want to preserve the SVG unchanged, svgio and a resulting ODF with one graphic object and embedded original SVG might be preferred. Needs to be discussed. C. ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice -- ALG (PGP Key: EE1C 4B3F E751 D8BC C485 DEC1 3C59 F953 D81C F4A2) ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 04/11/15 13:11, Caolán McNamara wrote: > We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and > filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. The first is renderer of the svg files. If you insert the file as you mentioned, it will be stored as a svg file and svgio will render it using the drawing layer. The second is document importer. It imports the svg into Draw shape by shape and mappable style property by mappable style property. The result of such import (because there is no matching exporter) is basically an odg file, since our importer API is internally using flag ODF anyway. > Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in > both places ? There might be a possibility to share some code, I guess. Although, I am not sure whether the parsers use the same approach. The filter/source/svg one is basically constructing DOM and then several "visitors" are running through the structure and extracting useful information. Cheers F. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2 iEYEARECAAYFAlY6KPMACgkQu9a1imXPdA9+lgCeL+2A2ccg/VqX8LeXGlVKoa8Q fq8An3kNvcQz/A18dE3l33SPg4ocLd2c =D+56 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
On 4 November 2015 at 15:40, Tomaž Vajngerl wrote: > Hi, > > On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Caolán McNamara > wrote: > > We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and > > filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. > > > > Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in both > > places ? > > Both have its own uses. svgio is all about rendering fidelity and > supports more svg features however the "filter/source/svg" filter > tries to use standard features and attributes available in LO as much > as possible - which is useful when you want to edit the shapes . For > example you can see this with gradient shapes - svgio imports the > shape correctly but is useless if you want to change the gradient. > But even so, it seems unwise to have 2 implementations, for sure larger parts are identical. If there are significant differences in how the svg file is delivered into LO, it can be done with a simple switch. rgds jan i. > > > C. > > Regards, Tomaž > ___ > LibreOffice mailing list > LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org > http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice > ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi, On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Caolán McNamara wrote: > We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and > filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. > > Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in both > places ? Both have its own uses. svgio is all about rendering fidelity and supports more svg features however the "filter/source/svg" filter tries to use standard features and attributes available in LO as much as possible - which is useful when you want to edit the shapes . For example you can see this with gradient shapes - svgio imports the shape correctly but is useless if you want to change the gradient. > C. Regards, Tomaž ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Re: Two svg import filters
Hi Caolán, Caolán McNamara schrieb: We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in both places ? I suggest to use svgio in both cases (as Apache OpenOffice does) for following reasons: - It is double work to maintain two import filters. The filter used for File > Open has a lot of bugs, and no one has fixed them. - The file-open filter automatically converts the svg-file, but ODF is not able to describe all features of svg. If the svg-file is only rendered as svg, then it is possible to show it more correctly. - The svgio filter keeps the svg-file, therefore no data is lost. - Because converting a svg-file to ODF will loose information, such converting should not be done automatically, but only on explicit user request. Kind regards Regina ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
Two svg import filters
We have svgio which is being used for insert->image->from file and filter/source/svg which is being used for open file. Which one is "the future", and what prevents us from using it in both places ? C. ___ LibreOffice mailing list LibreOffice@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
