Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

Daniel P. Berrangé writes: > On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 03:13:22PM +0200, Markus Armbruster wrote: >> Daniel P. Berrangé writes: >> >> > On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 12:35:11PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: >> >> On Fri, 2018-08-17 at 10:29 +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: >> >> > On Thu, Aug 16,

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

Eduardo Habkost writes: > On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 05:26:47PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > [...] >> There are countless mistakes in both QEMU & libvirt, but only some of >> them are worth the cost of changing. Agreed. >> I'm not seeing a compelling

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 05:26:47PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: [...] > There are countless mistakes in both QEMU & libvirt, but only some of > them are worth the cost of changing. I'm not seeing a compelling reason > why this change is worthwhile. The impact of the design mistake is narrow >

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 06:08:55PM +0200, Markus Armbruster wrote: > Eduardo Habkost writes: > > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 01:26:01PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > >> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:01:35AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > >> > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM +0200, Andrea

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

Eduardo Habkost writes: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 01:26:01PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: >> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:01:35AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: >> > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: >> > > On Tue, 2018-08-21 at 14:21 -0400, Laine Stump wrote: >>

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:49:48PM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > The thing that has really tipped my mind this way is that even > > if we provide new device models, mgmt apps will be loathe to > > actually use them because it will prevent live migration of > > those guests to hosts with older

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 03:57:20PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 11:18:28AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 02:44:40PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: [...] > > > An explicit virtio-transitional device is still two separate > > > devices

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 10:37:12AM -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > On 08/22/2018 09:44 AM, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > > Even if someone is willing to implement it in libvirt, we have to > > consider the cost of supporting it in both libvirt and applications > > using libvirt and the complexity it

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 11:18:28AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 02:44:40PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:54:55AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 01:26:01PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > > > > On Wed, Aug

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On 08/22/2018 09:44 AM, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:54:55AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: >> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 01:26:01PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: >>> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:01:35AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 02:44:40PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:54:55AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 01:26:01PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:01:35AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > > > On Wed, Aug

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:54:55AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 01:26:01PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:01:35AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > > > On Tue,

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 01:26:01PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:01:35AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > > On Tue, 2018-08-21 at 14:21 -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > > > > On 08/17/2018 06:35 AM,

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 09:01:35AM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > On Tue, 2018-08-21 at 14:21 -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > > > On 08/17/2018 06:35 AM, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > > > If we decide we want to explicitly spell out

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > On Tue, 2018-08-21 at 14:21 -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > > On 08/17/2018 06:35 AM, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > > If we decide we want to explicitly spell out the options instead > > > of relying on QEMU changing behavior based on

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 12:36:27PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > On Tue, 2018-08-21 at 14:21 -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > > On 08/17/2018 06:35 AM, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > > If we decide we want to explicitly spell out the options instead > > > of relying on QEMU changing behavior based on

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Tue, 2018-08-21 at 14:21 -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > On 08/17/2018 06:35 AM, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > If we decide we want to explicitly spell out the options instead > > of relying on QEMU changing behavior based on the slot type, which > > is probably a good idea anyway, I think we should

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On 08/17/2018 06:35 AM, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > On Fri, 2018-08-17 at 10:29 +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: >> On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 06:20:29PM -0400, Laine Stump wrote: >>> 5) Some guest OSes that we still want to support (and which would >>> otherwise work okay on a Q35 virtual machine)

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Fri, 2018-08-17 at 11:43 +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 12:35:11PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > > If we decide we want to explicitly spell out the options instead > > of relying on QEMU changing behavior based on the slot type, which > > is probably a good idea

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 03:13:22PM +0200, Markus Armbruster wrote: > Daniel P. Berrangé writes: > > > On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 12:35:11PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > >> On Fri, 2018-08-17 at 10:29 +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > >> > On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 06:20:29PM -0400, Laine Stump

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

Daniel P. Berrangé writes: > On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 12:35:11PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: >> On Fri, 2018-08-17 at 10:29 +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: >> > On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 06:20:29PM -0400, Laine Stump wrote: >> > > 5) Some guest OSes that we still want to support (and which

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 12:35:11PM +0200, Andrea Bolognani wrote: > On Fri, 2018-08-17 at 10:29 +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > > On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 06:20:29PM -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > > > 5) Some guest OSes that we still want to support (and which would > > > otherwise work okay on a

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Fri, 2018-08-17 at 10:29 +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 06:20:29PM -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > > 5) Some guest OSes that we still want to support (and which would > > otherwise work okay on a Q35 virtual machine) have virtio drivers too > > old to support virtio-1.0

Re: [libvirt] [Qemu-devel] clean/simple Q35 support in libvirt+QEMU for guest OSes that don't support virtio-1.0

On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 06:20:29PM -0400, Laine Stump wrote: > Summary of the problem: > > 1) We want to persuade libvirt+QEMU users to move away from the i440fx > machinetype in favor of Q35. (NB: Someday this *might* lead to the > ability to deprecate and even remove the 440fx machinetype, but