Re: Edition Engraver question

[Craig Dabelstein]

Got it. I understand now. Thanks Keiren!

Craig


On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 at 07:51, Kieren MacMillan <
kieren_macmil...@sympatico.ca> wrote:

> Hi Craig,
>
> > I'm trying to use the EE to add a simple text markup but can't get it to
> work. I musn't be referencing the voice correctly. Can anyone give me some
> pointers?
>
> You’ve made a couple of errors:
>
> 1. You need to have DrumVoice in your \consistToContexts list.
>
> 2. You need to address DrumVoice, and not Voice.
>
> 3. You need to identify which DrumVoice (in this case, the first, so
> DrumVoice.A).
>
> And, although it technically still works, it’s a little odd to generate an
> \editionMod against an edition that you haven’t added yet!  =)
>
> Here’s a modified snippet that works, I believe.
>
> Hope this helps!
> Kieren.
>
> \version "2.19.80"
>
> \include "oll-core/package.ily"
> \loadPackage edition-engraver
> \consistToContexts #edition-engraver Score.Staff.Voice.DrumVoice.DrumStaff
>
> snaredrumNotes = \drummode {
>   \repeat unfold 3 { sn4 sn sn sn }
> }
>
> bassdrumNotes = \drummode {
>   \repeat unfold 3 { bd4 r bd r }
> }
>
> \addEdition parts
>
> \editionMod parts 2 0/4 leipzig.orchI.partI.percussion.DrumVoice.A
> <>^\markup { "Der oesterreichische Grenadiermarsch!" }
>
>
> \score {
>   \layout {
> \context {
>   \Score
>   \editionID ##f leipzig.orchI.partI
> }
> \context {
>   \Voice
> }
>   }
>   \new DrumStaff = "Percussion" \with { \editionID percussion }
>   <<
> \new DrumVoice { \voiceOne \snaredrumNotes }
> \new DrumVoice { \voiceTwo \bassdrumNotes }
>   >>
> }
> 
>
> Kieren MacMillan, composer
> ‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
> ‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info
>
>

-- 
*Craig Dabelstein*
Maxime's Music
craig.dabelst...@gmail.com
*http://maximesmusic.com *
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Re: A Midi question

[Vaughan McAlley]

On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 at 09:46, H. S. Teoh  wrote:
>
> On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 03:15:48PM -0700, foxfanfare wrote:
> [...]
> > So I guess there is no solution for my first problem than re-write all
> > the nuances and pedal markings with the notes input instead of
> > variables if I want to improve the audio output?
> [...]
>
> Generally, the way I've been dealing with Lilypond and midi output is to
> separate generate the layout score and the midi score.  Of course,
> nobody wants to type in the same music twice just to be able to make the
> midi not make your ears bleed without making the printed score a mess,
> so I generate both from the same input.  Here's how I do it:
>
> music = {
> % Stuff that works for both printed score and midi:
> a4 b c d e f g
>
> % Stuff that requires extra midi markings, e.g. manual
> % dynamics to control expression that you don't want to
> % actually print in the score:
> a-\tag #'midi \fff\> b-\tag #'midi \ff
>
> % Stuff that basically requires completely different
> % inputs to make the midi sound sane (e.g., spelling
> % exactly how you want a trill played instead of
> % fighting with Lilypond and/or articulate.ly):
> \tag #'layout { a1\trill }
> \tag #'midi { \tuplet 17/16 \repeat unfold 7 { a16 b } a
gs a }
>
> % More stuff in common
> g8 a b c d e f
> }
>
> % This score is only for layout. Remove all midi-specific stuff.
> \score {
> \removeWithTag #'midi \music
> \layout {}
> }
>
> % This score is only for midi. Remove all layout-only stuff.
> \score {
> \removeWithTag #'layout \music
> \midi {}
> }
>
> Depending on your needs, you can do more than just \tag-ging midi vs.
> layout stuff in your input.  For example, I compose polyphonic music
> that I want to typeset in a 2-staff piano score, but for better midi
> control I prefer to split the voices into separate staves in the midi
> output. Generally, this is so that I can apply dynamics separately to
> each voice (Lilypond has a tendency of messing up midi dynamics
> otherwise) that in the printed score should only be printed once.
>
> voiceA = ...
> voiceB = ...
> voiceC = ...
> voiceD = ...
> dynPart = {
> s1\ff
> s1\p
> % ... etc.
> }
>
> % For printed score, use 2 staves shared between pairs of
> % voices.
> \score {
> \removeWithTag #'midi
> \new PianoStaff <<
> \new Staff = "rhs" <<
> \voiceA
> \voiceB
> >>
> \new Dynamics \dynPart
> \new Staff = "lhs" <<
> \voiceA
> \voiceB
> >>
> >>
> \layout { }
> }
>
> % For midi output, output each voice in a separate Staff.
> \include "articulate.ly"
> \score {
> \articulate
> \removeWithTag #'layout
> <<
> \new Staff = "rhs" << \voiceA \dynPart >>
> \new Staff << \voiceB \dynPart >>
> \new Staff = "lhs" << \voiceC \dynPart >>
> \new Staff << \voiceD \dynPart >>
> >>
> \midi { }
> }
>
> In extreme cases, esp. in orchestral music, sometimes I set it up so
> that each voice / instrument is output as a separate midi, and played by
> a software synth with different parameters (e.g., for individually
> controlling reverb, panning, and other effects, and also as a workaround
> for the 15-channel limit in midi when I have more than 15 parts), then
> blended together with a post-processing tool.
>
>
> T
>
> --
> Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting
different results.
>
> ___
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Hmmm...

Has anyone tried

  \midi {
\context {
  \Staff
  \remove "Staff_performer"
}
\context {
  \PianoStaff
  \consists "Staff_performer"
}
}

% ??
(I haven't, but who knows?)
Vaughan
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Re: Cover page

[Simon Albrecht]

On 12.09.2018 00:48, Noeck wrote:

I guess the wording might be just a bit misleading, but I disagree with
that. Yes, LaTeX is good for scientific papers. But that's not because
looks don't matter. It's because of the beautiful look of mathematical
formulae, the clear and automatic structure of your text, the
cross-references, the automatic and consistent layout etc. Most of all
it is because the defaults and many documentclasses are made for
scientific papers. The author of TeX actually cares a lot about beauty.

All that makes a LaTeX paper much more beautiful than let's say a word
document. And you can actually influence the layout a lot (cf.
KOMA-Script etc.).


You’re right, my wording was misleading. What I was trying to say is 
that a scientific article doesn’t need an individual, characteristic 
look. Of course I’m aware of the aspects of typographic aesthetics and 
that Knuth’s prime incentive for starting the whole thing was good (and 
thus beautiful) typesetting of formulae. But I hope you get my point 
here: with a poster, the visual style is at the core of every specific 
one you make, and there’s a far greater need for the _immediate_ 
feedback of a WYSIWYG environment.
And, Urs, I understand (and probably needn’t tell you) that this is not 
completely black-and-white: with templates and styles many WYSIWYG 
programs certainly allow to reuse an existing design for new contents, 
at least if you use them properly.


Best, Simon

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Re: Cover page

[H. S. Teoh]

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 03:09:57PM -0700, foxfanfare wrote:
> Simon Albrecht-2 wrote
> > Maybe. LaTeX becomes less of a good choice the more you actually
> > want to design the visuals. In a scientific paper, looks don’t
> > matter at all, it’s only about the content; that’s where LaTeX is
> > perfect, no doubt. If you’re going to design a poster, LaTeX is most
> > certainly not the tool of choice, because you want to have total
> > control over where everything is placed; visuals are essential.  A
> > cover page is somewhere inbetween, but further to the poster side,
> > I’d say.
> 
> Interesting. The total control of the layout is very important for me
> to achieve this task.  Especially for the cover which (I agree with
> you) I'd like to be more of a poster than a simple text...  Maybe it
> is worth a try using LP and the markups for this... Although I'm a
> little worried that no one seems to use it that way!
[...]

I've used LP and markups for title pages before.  It's *possible*,
though somewhat klunky.  It entailed a lot of looking up various markup
commands in the LP reference, tweaking things, and doing tedious work
like wrapping paragraphs manually, etc..


T

-- 
What is Matter, what is Mind? Never Mind, it doesn't Matter.

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Re: A Midi question

[H. S. Teoh]

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 03:15:48PM -0700, foxfanfare wrote:
[...]
> So I guess there is no solution for my first problem than re-write all
> the nuances and pedal markings with the notes input instead of
> variables if I want to improve the audio output?
[...]

Generally, the way I've been dealing with Lilypond and midi output is to
separate generate the layout score and the midi score.  Of course,
nobody wants to type in the same music twice just to be able to make the
midi not make your ears bleed without making the printed score a mess,
so I generate both from the same input.  Here's how I do it:

music = {
% Stuff that works for both printed score and midi:
a4 b c d e f g

% Stuff that requires extra midi markings, e.g. manual
% dynamics to control expression that you don't want to
% actually print in the score:
a-\tag #'midi \fff\> b-\tag #'midi \ff

% Stuff that basically requires completely different
% inputs to make the midi sound sane (e.g., spelling
% exactly how you want a trill played instead of
% fighting with Lilypond and/or articulate.ly):
\tag #'layout { a1\trill }
\tag #'midi { \tuplet 17/16 \repeat unfold 7 { a16 b } a gs a }

% More stuff in common
g8 a b c d e f
}

% This score is only for layout. Remove all midi-specific stuff.
\score {
\removeWithTag #'midi \music
\layout {}
}

% This score is only for midi. Remove all layout-only stuff.
\score {
\removeWithTag #'layout \music
\midi {}
}

Depending on your needs, you can do more than just \tag-ging midi vs.
layout stuff in your input.  For example, I compose polyphonic music
that I want to typeset in a 2-staff piano score, but for better midi
control I prefer to split the voices into separate staves in the midi
output. Generally, this is so that I can apply dynamics separately to
each voice (Lilypond has a tendency of messing up midi dynamics
otherwise) that in the printed score should only be printed once.

voiceA = ...
voiceB = ...
voiceC = ...
voiceD = ...
dynPart = {
s1\ff
s1\p
% ... etc.
}

% For printed score, use 2 staves shared between pairs of
% voices.
\score {
\removeWithTag #'midi
\new PianoStaff <<
\new Staff = "rhs" <<
\voiceA
\voiceB
>>
\new Dynamics \dynPart
\new Staff = "lhs" <<
\voiceA
\voiceB
>>
>>
\layout { }
}

% For midi output, output each voice in a separate Staff.
\include "articulate.ly"
\score {
\articulate
\removeWithTag #'layout
<<
\new Staff = "rhs" << \voiceA \dynPart >>
\new Staff << \voiceB \dynPart >>
\new Staff = "lhs" << \voiceC \dynPart >>
\new Staff << \voiceD \dynPart >>
>>
\midi { }
}

In extreme cases, esp. in orchestral music, sometimes I set it up so
that each voice / instrument is output as a separate midi, and played by
a software synth with different parameters (e.g., for individually
controlling reverb, panning, and other effects, and also as a workaround
for the 15-channel limit in midi when I have more than 15 parts), then
blended together with a post-processing tool.


T

-- 
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different 
results.

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Re: A Midi question

[Guy Stalnaker]

Not saying this will work because I don't know your code, but can you 
use polyphonic voices to add the nuances/pedal marking variables (if 
you're not already using them)? Thinking here that the nuance directives 
are made a part of the resulting polyphonic music.


You can create one score for your present printout (no midi output) and 
a second that uses the polyphonic voices with midi output. I'm thinking 
of this:


http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/learning/explicitly-instantiating-voices

This code illustrates what I'm talking about. I confirm that using << { 
} \\ { } >> does NOT produce the desired output. But instantiating the 
second voice DOES produce midi with dynamic changes.


It might look ugly with a lot more notes, and you might get a lot of 
error output for note column issues, but the midi may be just fine.


%% snippet %%
%% \notePartI does NOT work
%% \notePartII DOES work

\version "2.19"
\language "english"

\header {
  title = "Testing"
  tagline = ##f
}

global = {
  \time 4/4
  \tempo 4 = 80
}

nuance = {
  s2\p s2\mp |
  s2\mf s2\f |
  s2\mf s2\mp |
  s2\> s2\!
}

notes = {
  e'8 d' c' d' e' e' e'4 |
  d'8 d' d'4 e'8 g' g'4 |
  e'8 d' c' d' e' e' e' e' |
  d' d' e' d' c'2 \bar "||"
}

notesPartI = \new Staff {
  \global <<
{ \notes } \\
{ \nuance }
  >>
}

notesPartII = \new Staff {
  \global <<
{ \voiceOne \notes }
\new voice { \voiceTwo \nuance }
  >>
}

\score {
 <<
 \notesPartI
 >>
 \layout { }
 \midi {
 }
}

\score {
 <<
 \notesPartII
 >>
 \layout { }
 \midi {
 }
}


On 9/11/18 5:15 PM, foxfanfare wrote:

Mr Tim wrote

A friend of mine uses Anvil Studio for midi on Windows. I think they have
a free version, but even the premium is not much.

Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately Anvil Studio isn't cross-platform. I
should have been more specific, but I'm looking for something which could
also work with linux in the future.

So I guess there is no solution for my first problem than re-write all the
nuances and pedal markings with the notes input instead of variables if I
want to improve the audio output?




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--

"There is only love, and then oblivion. Love is all we have
to set against hatred." (paraphrased) Ian McEwan

Guy Stalnaker
jimmyg...@gmail.com

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Re: Cover page

[Noeck]

Hi,

Am 11.09.2018 um 23:53 schrieb Simon Albrecht:
> On 11.09.2018 17:50, foxfanfare wrote:
>> - Is Latex a good replacement for Word?
> 
> Maybe. LaTeX becomes less of a good choice the more you actually want to
> design the visuals. In a scientific paper, looks don’t matter at all,
> it’s only about the content; that’s where LaTeX is perfect, no doubt. If
> you’re going to design a poster, LaTeX is most certainly not the tool of
> choice, because you want to have total control over where everything is
> placed; visuals are essential.


I guess the wording might be just a bit misleading, but I disagree with
that. Yes, LaTeX is good for scientific papers. But that's not because
looks don't matter. It's because of the beautiful look of mathematical
formulae, the clear and automatic structure of your text, the
cross-references, the automatic and consistent layout etc. Most of all
it is because the defaults and many documentclasses are made for
scientific papers. The author of TeX actually cares a lot about beauty.

All that makes a LaTeX paper much more beautiful than let's say a word
document. And you can actually influence the layout a lot (cf.
KOMA-Script etc.).

What is difficult, is to create a completely customized layout or to
break the rules of the defined layout.

At least that's how I would put it.

Cheers,
Joram




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Re: Cover page

[Urs Liska]

Am 12.09.2018 um 00:09 schrieb foxfanfare:

Simon Albrecht-2 wrote

Maybe. LaTeX becomes less of a good choice the more you actually want to
design the visuals. In a scientific paper, looks don’t matter at all,
it’s only about the content; that’s where LaTeX is perfect, no doubt. If
you’re going to design a poster, LaTeX is most certainly not the tool of
choice, because you want to have total control over where everything is
placed; visuals are essential.
A cover page is somewhere inbetween, but further to the poster side, I’d
say.

Interesting. The total control of the layout is very important for me to
achieve this task.
Especially for the cover which (I agree with you) I'd like to be more of a
poster than a simple text...


That's a two-sided thing here. LaTeX *does* give you total control over 
the visuals, just like LilyPond does. And just like it is more intuitive 
and "fast" to move things around in Sibelius than LilyPond it's more 
intuitive to move around page elements in InDesign than in LaTeX.


The power comes for example with consistency and programmability. If you 
are going to do multiple editions with cover pages and want them to look 
consistently throughout your "house style" you will come to love the 
power to doing it the LaTeX way. For example I once designed business 
cards, which is similarly to covers something you might say is not 
LaTeX's best area. But I ended up with a situation where the (complete) 
file for producing a new card would look something like


  \documentclass{mybusinesscard}
  \begin{document}
  \card[name={Urs Liska},
    phone=0123-456789,
    email=my.em...@dot.com]
  \end{document}

Urs


Maybe it is worth a try using LP and the markups for this... Although I'm a
little worried that no one seems to use it that way!



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Re: A Midi question

[foxfanfare]

Mr Tim wrote
> A friend of mine uses Anvil Studio for midi on Windows. I think they have
> a free version, but even the premium is not much. 

Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately Anvil Studio isn't cross-platform. I
should have been more specific, but I'm looking for something which could
also work with linux in the future.

So I guess there is no solution for my first problem than re-write all the
nuances and pedal markings with the notes input instead of variables if I
want to improve the audio output?




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Re: Cover page

[foxfanfare]

Simon Albrecht-2 wrote
> Maybe. LaTeX becomes less of a good choice the more you actually want to 
> design the visuals. In a scientific paper, looks don’t matter at all, 
> it’s only about the content; that’s where LaTeX is perfect, no doubt. If 
> you’re going to design a poster, LaTeX is most certainly not the tool of 
> choice, because you want to have total control over where everything is 
> placed; visuals are essential.
> A cover page is somewhere inbetween, but further to the poster side, I’d 
> say.

Interesting. The total control of the layout is very important for me to
achieve this task.
Especially for the cover which (I agree with you) I'd like to be more of a
poster than a simple text...
Maybe it is worth a try using LP and the markups for this... Although I'm a
little worried that no one seems to use it that way!



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Re: Cover page

[Simon Albrecht]

On 11.09.2018 17:50, foxfanfare wrote:

- Is Latex a good replacement for Word?


Maybe. LaTeX becomes less of a good choice the more you actually want to 
design the visuals. In a scientific paper, looks don’t matter at all, 
it’s only about the content; that’s where LaTeX is perfect, no doubt. If 
you’re going to design a poster, LaTeX is most certainly not the tool of 
choice, because you want to have total control over where everything is 
placed; visuals are essential.
A cover page is somewhere inbetween, but further to the poster side, I’d 
say.



  What manager you'd recommend to use?


When I was writing my bachelor’s thesis and other papers for university 
(which also make use of including pdf’s generated from LilyPond), I 
found that I liked Kile the most.


Best, Simon

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Re: Edition Engraver question

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi Craig,

> I'm trying to use the EE to add a simple text markup but can't get it to 
> work. I musn't be referencing the voice correctly. Can anyone give me some 
> pointers?

You’ve made a couple of errors:

1. You need to have DrumVoice in your \consistToContexts list.

2. You need to address DrumVoice, and not Voice.

3. You need to identify which DrumVoice (in this case, the first, so 
DrumVoice.A).

And, although it technically still works, it’s a little odd to generate an 
\editionMod against an edition that you haven’t added yet!  =)

Here’s a modified snippet that works, I believe.

Hope this helps!
Kieren.

\version "2.19.80"

\include "oll-core/package.ily"
\loadPackage edition-engraver
\consistToContexts #edition-engraver Score.Staff.Voice.DrumVoice.DrumStaff

snaredrumNotes = \drummode {
  \repeat unfold 3 { sn4 sn sn sn }
}

bassdrumNotes = \drummode {
  \repeat unfold 3 { bd4 r bd r }
}

\addEdition parts

\editionMod parts 2 0/4 leipzig.orchI.partI.percussion.DrumVoice.A <>^\markup { 
"Der oesterreichische Grenadiermarsch!" }


\score {
  \layout {
\context {
  \Score
  \editionID ##f leipzig.orchI.partI
}
\context {
  \Voice
}
  }
  \new DrumStaff = "Percussion" \with { \editionID percussion }
  <<
\new DrumVoice { \voiceOne \snaredrumNotes }
\new DrumVoice { \voiceTwo \bassdrumNotes }
  >>
}


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: Cover page

[foxfanfare]

Aaron Hill wrote
> In fact, that is 
> probably a good strategy for any application you are using that is not 
> currently cross-platform.  Seek out an alternative and start getting 
> used to it now while you can still use your current setup.
> 
> (Side note: Bear in mind you can start playing around with Linux in a 
> VM, such as VirtualBox, which gives you the chance to experience the 
> "other side of life" while still having access to Windows at the same 
> time.)

That's definitely what I was planning to do. I still have some softwares to
learn before taking the leap. For instance the audio player, as a big user
of Foobar2000 (I even wrote a skin back in my young days!), I'm so surprised
to see it isn't compatible with linux...


Aaron Hill wrote
> Another option to consider is one of the many extensible text editors 
> out there, such as Atom and Sublime Text.  My personal favorite is 
> Visual Studio Code.  All have extensions that support TeX, ranging from 
> basic syntax coloring to interactive previewing.  For Code, there is 
> LaTeX Workshop, which seems to have earned a pretty decent user rating.  
> I cannot, unfortunately, give any personal recommendation here, as I do 
> not currently use TeX in my day-to-day workflow.  But should you find 
> yourself needing to work with other text-based file formats, it could be 
> beneficial to look for a more general-purpose editor.

Good idea too. Is it the same than VIM? I discovered this some time back
thanks to Luke Smith YouTube channel. I have to confess I was impressed by
it. If I understand correctly, with some training, I could even write
everything in there, LP, LateX, etc...?


David Kastrup wrote
> Perhaps Denemo?  Gets you hooked on the results.

I also tried it at the beginning. But I wasn't conviced at all. I found it a
lot more unstable than Frescobaldi, and frankly, I don't think the Windows
95 look would help to convice my colleagues (typically user of Finale on a
Mac). But that's another debate :)





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Re: Cover page

[David Kastrup]

foxfanfare  writes:

> David Wright wrote
>> Judging from your posts here, I'm kind of surprised that you aren't
>> already using it, as you would seem to have the aptitude for it.
>
> Thanks David. But it is not as easy as it seems :) It is quite difficult to
> change all your habits, to learn everything again, even if I'm convinced
> about the necessities to do so. 
>
> It is exactly the same with LP, I'm truely conviced about the software. As a
> music teacher, I never succed to conviced my colleagues to try it.

Perhaps Denemo?  Gets you hooked on the results.

-- 
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Re: A Midi question

[Mr Tim]

A friend of mine uses Anvil Studio for midi on Windows. I think they have a 
free version, but even the premium is not much. 

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 11, 2018, at 1:06 PM, foxfanfare  wrote:
> 
> Karlin High wrote
>>> On 9/11/2018 11:05 AM, foxfanfare wrote:
>>> 2. What do you do with the default midi file?
>> 
>> I often convert MIDI to audio formats via VLC Media Player and the 
>> GeneralUser GS soundfonts by S. Christian Collins. Full details here:
>> 
>> http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2017-04/msg00764.html;
>> 
>> Only change is that newer versions of VLC again have the FluidSynth 
>> codec. Using an older version is no longer required.
>> 
>> That's all I know on the topic of getting improved sound from LilyPond's 
>> MIDI files.
>> -- 
>> Karlin High
>> Missouri, USA
>> 
>> ___
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>> lilypond-user@
> 
>> https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
> 
> Thanks for the tip, I just try and it is effectively really better!
> Rosegarden works on Linux only, but I'll keep in mind when I'll get rid of
> my Windows (soon I hope ;-)
> 
> 
> 
> --
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> 
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Re: Cover page

[Aaron Hill]

On 2018-09-11 1:07 pm, foxfanfare wrote:
Thanks David. But it is not as easy as it seems :) It is quite 
difficult to
change all your habits, to learn everything again, even if I'm 
convinced

about the necessities to do so.


There are a number of cross-platform TeX-centric editors out there.  (A 
quick web search turns up TeXmaker, TeXstudio, and TeXworks.)   You can 
certainly start using one of them now and then you'll find it much 
easier to transition operating systems down the road.  In fact, that is 
probably a good strategy for any application you are using that is not 
currently cross-platform.  Seek out an alternative and start getting 
used to it now while you can still use your current setup.


(Side note: Bear in mind you can start playing around with Linux in a 
VM, such as VirtualBox, which gives you the chance to experience the 
"other side of life" while still having access to Windows at the same 
time.)


Another option to consider is one of the many extensible text editors 
out there, such as Atom and Sublime Text.  My personal favorite is 
Visual Studio Code.  All have extensions that support TeX, ranging from 
basic syntax coloring to interactive previewing.  For Code, there is 
LaTeX Workshop, which seems to have earned a pretty decent user rating.  
I cannot, unfortunately, give any personal recommendation here, as I do 
not currently use TeX in my day-to-day workflow.  But should you find 
yourself needing to work with other text-based file formats, it could be 
beneficial to look for a more general-purpose editor.


-- Aaron Hill

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Re: Cover page

[foxfanfare]

David Wright wrote
> Judging from your posts here, I'm kind of surprised that you aren't
> already using it, as you would seem to have the aptitude for it.

Thanks David. But it is not as easy as it seems :) It is quite difficult to
change all your habits, to learn everything again, even if I'm convinced
about the necessities to do so. 

It is exactly the same with LP, I'm truely conviced about the software. As a
music teacher, I never succed to conviced my colleagues to try it. Even if
they were conviced when I showed them how it works and the possibilities, I
think they didn't have the courage to learn it. It takes time and energy. I
think it is the same with me and Linux right now... As we say, all habits
die hard!

But when I read about your workflow, although a bit chinese to me, my eyes
shine! And you all conviced me about LateX. To be frank, I tried in june to
make working lyluatex but without any success at the time. I fear it is not
that easy, at least without a proper tutorial (if SoundsFromSound read this,
it would be a great idea for a video ;-)


Urs Liska-3 wrote
> That's where lyluatex comes in (as mentioned by Malte). It handles nearly
> everything in this regard, even protrusion.
> The cool thing is: it doesn't only *scale* a pdf to fit into the margin,
> but makes sure LilyPond compiles with the right layout to begin with. It
> can even make LilyPond use the text fonts of the surrounding document, and
> automatically caches the score and recompiles when. the score or the
> layout changes.

Does this mean that you don't even have to generate the PDF with LP, you
just copy all your code in latex and it handle the engraving of the score by
itself?



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Re: Cover page

[David Wright]

On Tue 11 Sep 2018 at 13:20:34 (-0400), Kieren MacMillan wrote:
> Hi fox,
> 
> > Does this means the PDF is imported in LaTex, a bit like with inDesign?
> 
> Not exactly… It’s included at PDF generation time, a bit like an \include 
> file in Lilypond.

Because both LP and LaTeX are text-sourced, it's really up to you how
you do this. Using my most integrated application for this sort of mix
as an example:

I have a collection of Anglican chants written in LP in their
canonical key, and each processed (automatically as required) in a
bash function to form a library of PDFs of each chant.

> > Don't you lose some margins precision?
> 
> Not that I’ve noticed. The file is simply included at full size.

The PDFs are automatically cropped to have a one-point margin, so
LaTeX is responsible for the whitespace, just as with any sort of
graphics inclusion.

> > Is it appropriate when you update your original score PDF?
> 
> It’s fabulous: I simply update the score, and then re-generate the LaTeX file.

Regenerating the PDFs when the source is edited is as easy as typing
$ chants
which is a bash function that reruns LP on any that have a newer .ly
timestamp than their PDF has. If I were to edit any of the .ily files
that control LP's chant production, then
$ chants x
will rerun LP on all of them (overriding the timestamp tests).

But that's the less useful part of the story. There's also a battery
of psalms and graduals, which are .tex files containing the pointed
words (like in psalters). These files contain macros with references
to the chants like {../chants/d-barnby-aminor} or indeed
{../chants/d-barnby-aminor@af} where the latter indicates that I
want the chant transposed into Aflat on this occasion.

A python program, makepsalm.py, scans the psalm.tex file picking
up references to the various chants, runs sed to set any necessary
transpositions (all the chants contain a line in the format
keysig = { \key a \minor } giving the key in the source), runs
LP to produce ephemeral PDFs, then runs lualatex to produce the psalm
PDF with the ephemeral versions of all the chants embedded in the
document.

As a bonus, it produces a shell script and MIDI files that play the
sequence of chants in the correct keys to help singers with the key
changes between chants.

What you can do is really only limited by your ingenuity.

Cheers,
David.

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Re: Cover page

[David Wright]

On Tue 11 Sep 2018 at 09:11:51 (-0700), foxfanfare wrote:
> Malte Meyn-3 wrote
> > What do you mean by “manager”? What OS are you using?
> 
> Thanks David & Malte for your first comments. What I meant by manager is a
> bit like Frescobaldi is to LilyPond to me! I'm still using Windows but
> probably going to change for Linux soon...

Judging from your posts here, I'm kind of surprised that you aren't
already using it, as you would seem to have the aptitude for it.

I've been using LaTeX for over 30 years and wouldn't pretend to have
more than scraped the surface to be able to satisfy my needs.
Apart from its main role of producing documents from text and images,
like LilyPond it integrates well into an environment where you want
to automate tasks by writing scripts in shell, python etc.
I use LuaLaTeX on Debian nowadays.

Better people than I write considered comparisons between Word and
LateX; here's are a couple which cover different aspects:
http://www-h.eng.cam.ac.uk/help/tpl/textprocessing/latex_advocacy.html
http://nitens.org/taraborelli/latex

I've never felt the need for a GUI (and it wouldn't have been
practical on DOS, or when I ran LaTeX on a mainframe 50 miles
away at 300 baud) but it sounds like Lyx might be worth your
trying out. It's included with linux distributions like Debian
so it's kosher.

Cheers,
David.

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Re: Cover page

[Urs Liska]

Am 11. September 2018 19:15:51 MESZ schrieb foxfanfare :
>Kieren MacMillan wrote
>> A decade ago, I tried to use Lilypond for the whole deal… but soon
>found
>> out it was not powerful or flexible enough.
>
>That's interesting! That's also what I fear, but I didn't try yet...
>
>
>Kieren MacMillan wrote
>> 2. Edit the "wrapper" in LaTeX, with the PDF score included at the
>> appropriate place.
>
>Does this means the PDF is imported in LaTex, a bit like with inDesign?
>Don't you lose some margins precision? Is it appropriate when you
>update
>your original score PDF?
>

That's where lyluatex comes in (as mentioned by Malte). It handles nearly 
everything in this regard, even protrusion.
The cool thing is: it doesn't only *scale* a pdf to fit into the margin, but 
makes sure LilyPond compiles with the right layout to begin with. It can even 
make LilyPond use the text fonts of the surrounding document, and automatically 
caches the score and recompiles when. the score or the layout changes.

Best
Urs

>
>Kieren MacMillan wrote
>> Hope that helps!
>> Kieren.
>
>Yes, thanks!
>
>
>
>
>--
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>
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Re: Cover page

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi fox,

> Does this means the PDF is imported in LaTex, a bit like with inDesign?

Not exactly… It’s included at PDF generation time, a bit like an \include file 
in Lilypond.

> Don't you lose some margins precision?

Not that I’ve noticed. The file is simply included at full size.

> Is it appropriate when you update your original score PDF?

It’s fabulous: I simply update the score, and then re-generate the LaTeX file.

Best,
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: Cover page

[foxfanfare]

Kieren MacMillan wrote
> A decade ago, I tried to use Lilypond for the whole deal… but soon found
> out it was not powerful or flexible enough.

That's interesting! That's also what I fear, but I didn't try yet...


Kieren MacMillan wrote
> 2. Edit the "wrapper" in LaTeX, with the PDF score included at the
> appropriate place.

Does this means the PDF is imported in LaTex, a bit like with inDesign?
Don't you lose some margins precision? Is it appropriate when you update
your original score PDF?


Kieren MacMillan wrote
> Hope that helps!
> Kieren.

Yes, thanks!




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Re: A Midi question

[foxfanfare]

Karlin High wrote
> On 9/11/2018 11:05 AM, foxfanfare wrote:
>> 2. What do you do with the default midi file?
> 
> I often convert MIDI to audio formats via VLC Media Player and the 
> GeneralUser GS soundfonts by S. Christian Collins. Full details here:
> 
> http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2017-04/msg00764.html;
> 
> Only change is that newer versions of VLC again have the FluidSynth 
> codec. Using an older version is no longer required.
> 
> That's all I know on the topic of getting improved sound from LilyPond's 
> MIDI files.
> -- 
> Karlin High
> Missouri, USA
> 
> ___
> lilypond-user mailing list

> lilypond-user@

> https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user

Thanks for the tip, I just try and it is effectively really better!
Rosegarden works on Linux only, but I'll keep in mind when I'll get rid of
my Windows (soon I hope ;-)



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Re: Cover page

[Kieren MacMillan]

Hi fox,

> I'd like now to go a bit further and create the "whole" score,
> with all the front and back pages, prefaces, etc.
> 
> I'd like to get your experiences about creating the front page cover for
> your scores. What really is your process for doing this.

A decade ago, I tried to use Lilypond for the whole deal… but soon found out it 
was not powerful or flexible enough.

Here’s my workflow:

1. Generate the score in Lilypond, saved as a PDF.

2. Edit the "wrapper" in LaTeX, with the PDF score included at the appropriate 
place.

3. Generate a final PDF (with title page, frontmatter, score, and endmatter) 
directly from LaTeX.

> What manager you'd recommend to use?

I’m on Mac, so I use TeXShop.

> - Would it be possible (or at least "convenient") to use LilyPond to make
> everything (front page, ToC, Preface, etc... ?)

It’s both possible and convenient… but the results are a little less satisfying 
(to my eye).

> - Is it possible to import Inskape files in LP for the cover?

Yes. That’s also possible in LaTeX, of course.

Hope that helps!
Kieren.


Kieren MacMillan, composer
‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info


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Re: A Midi question

[Karlin High]

On 9/11/2018 11:05 AM, foxfanfare wrote:

2. What do you do with the default midi file?


I often convert MIDI to audio formats via VLC Media Player and the 
GeneralUser GS soundfonts by S. Christian Collins. Full details here:




Only change is that newer versions of VLC again have the FluidSynth 
codec. Using an older version is no longer required.


That's all I know on the topic of getting improved sound from LilyPond's 
MIDI files.

--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

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Re: A Midi question

[Rick Kimpel]

>From your experience, what would you suggest for this task?
>(I'm still talking about open-software).


The only FOSS MIDI sequencer I've used is Rosegarden. It was not

quite up to the challenge back in the day, but from what I have seen,

it has improved quite a lot.


Rick
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Re: Cover page

[foxfanfare]

Malte Meyn-3 wrote
> What do you mean by “manager”? What OS are you using?

Thanks David & Malte for your first comments. What I meant by manager is a
bit like Frescobaldi is to LilyPond to me! I'm still using Windows but
probably going to change for Linux soon...




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A Midi question

[foxfanfare]

Hi all,

I'd like to know a bit more about your use of the midi file. First, I use
LilyPond for its engraving qualities, nothing else. But still, a good audio
output is sometimes very handy. I wonder if the average usage of LP is
making PDF only and nothing else, or if I'm missing something big here...

So, here are some questions I'd like to ask:

1. I find very useful to write piano music in different variables, all my
nuances and sustain-pedal marks aren't written with the notes. So, they
unfortunately don't get include in the midi file. How do you guys manage
this situation? It would be a bit silly to re-write everything with the
notes, breaking all the advantages of using variables!

2. What do you do with the default midi file? The french wikipedia page
(https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/LilyPond) said the midi could be improved by
a sequencer. From your experience, what would you suggest for this task?
(I'm still talking about open-software). 

3. About this, do you know if there is some good free VST?

I'm waiting for your comments and experiences about managing audio with
LilyPond.
Thanks!




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Re: Cover page

[David Kastrup]

foxfanfare  writes:

> All your comments really interest me, but here are some questions I'd also
> wish to ask:
>
> - Is Latex a good replacement for Word?

In the same manner as a CNC hand plane (if there is such a thing) is a
good replacement for a belt sander.  Similar basic purpose, totally
different means of control and not all that comparable results.  And
being skilled with one has little to do with the other.

> What manager you'd recommend to use?  - Would it be possible (or at
> least "convenient") to use LilyPond to make everything (front page,
> ToC, Preface, etc... ?)  - Is it possible to import Inskape files in
> LP for the cover?

You can include EPS files I think.

-- 
David Kastrup

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Re: Cover page

[Malte Meyn]

Am 11.09.18 um 17:50 schrieb foxfanfare:

- Is Latex a good replacement for Word? What manager you'd recommend to use?


If you want a replacement similar to MS Word, use LibreOffice instead.

But LaTeX is good in another way: It’s text based and WYGIWYM like 
LilyPond. And there is lyluatex, a package that makes including LilyPond 
scores into LaTeX documents very easy.


What do you mean by “manager”? What OS are you using?


- Would it be possible (or at least "convenient") to use LilyPond to make
everything (front page, ToC, Preface, etc... ?)
- Is it possible to import Inskape files in LP for the cover?


You can use pdftk to concatenate several pdf files.

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Re: Does the layer property not work across systems?

[David Kastrup]

caagr98 caagr98  writes:

> That does indeed look a lot prettier, but it gives me an error saying
> unexpected \etc. Can \etc deal with markup like that?

Current master.  I thought that this was already in 2.19.82, to be
honest.

> So there's no way to get elements from the first system to draw over
> the second. Then I guess another option is to modify the volta's
> stencil to exclude those parts. Is there any way (either through
> Lilypond or postscript or similar) to subtract and/or intersect two
> stencils/paths?

I don't really think so.  I mean, one can likely convert a path to a
clipping mask in PostScript, but interweaving that with LilyPond is
going to be a pain.

-- 
David Kastrup

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Cover page

[foxfanfare]

Hi all,

I've ended the process of re-engraving several of my scores to LilyPond (and
I'm still astounded by it, the more I use it, the less I see myself using
again Sibelius or buying Dorico...). But I'd like now to go a bit further
and create the "whole" score, with all the front and back pages, prefaces,
etc.

I'd like to get your experiences about creating the front page cover for
your scores. What really is your process for doing this.

Usually, I made those with Word, or Photoshop, but I want to profit from the
fact I came to LilyPond to change little by little my habits and use only
open-source software.

All your comments really interest me, but here are some questions I'd also
wish to ask:

- Is Latex a good replacement for Word? What manager you'd recommend to use?
- Would it be possible (or at least "convenient") to use LilyPond to make
everything (front page, ToC, Preface, etc... ?)
- Is it possible to import Inskape files in LP for the cover?

Waiting for your advices,
Thanks!



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Re: Does the layer property not work across systems?

[caagr98 caagr98]

That does indeed look a lot prettier, but it gives me an error saying
unexpected \etc. Can \etc deal with markup like that?

So there's no way to get elements from the first system to draw over the
second. Then I guess another option is to modify the volta's stencil to
exclude those parts. Is there any way (either through Lilypond or
postscript or similar) to subtract and/or intersect two stencils/paths?


On Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 17:22 David Kastrup  wrote:

> caagr98 caagr98  writes:
>
> > I have a couple of scores with limited space. For readability, I
> > sometimes draw white outlines around overlapping elements (to cut out
> > parts of volta brackets or similar). This works fine within the same
> > system, but in some cases, the overlapping elements (an articulation
> > and a volta bracket) are in different systems. No matter what I do,
> > the volta in the second bracket draws above the articulation in the
> > first. Is there a) some way to draw things over subsequent systems,
> > and/or b) some better way to solve such overlaps without significantly
> > affecting the overall layout?
> >
> > Here's a small example of what I'm trying to do (the real version uses
> > edition engraver):
>
> I've used \etc for rewording the definition:
>
>
> Well no: systems are drawn sequentially; layering only works within a
> single system.
>
> --
> David Kastrup
>
>
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Re: Does the layer property not work across systems?

[David Kastrup]

caagr98 caagr98  writes:

> I have a couple of scores with limited space. For readability, I
> sometimes draw white outlines around overlapping elements (to cut out
> parts of volta brackets or similar). This works fine within the same
> system, but in some cases, the overlapping elements (an articulation
> and a volta bracket) are in different systems. No matter what I do,
> the volta in the second bracket draws above the articulation in the
> first. Is there a) some way to draw things over subsequent systems,
> and/or b) some better way to solve such overlaps without significantly
> affecting the overall layout?
>
> Here's a small example of what I'm trying to do (the real version uses
> edition engraver):

I've used \etc for rewording the definition:

\version "2.19.82"

whiteout =
-\tweak layer #0
 \tweak Y-offset #0
 \tweak outside-staff-priority ##f
 -\markup
   \with-color #red % Of course, this should be white, but this is more visible.
   \override #'(filled . #t)
   \path #0 \etc

\paper {
  #(set-paper-size "a8")
  system-system-spacing.padding = #-1000 % Makes vertical spacing more even, but encourages overlap
}

{
  \repeat volta 2 {
e1-^ -\whiteout #'(
  (moveto 0.3 -6.2)
  (rcurveto .8 -1.75 .6 -1.75 1.4 0)
  (closepath))
\break
  }
  \alternative { {
\once \override Score.VoltaBracket.layer = #-100
\once \override Score.VoltaBracket.color = #blue
R1
  } }
}

Well no: systems are drawn sequentially; layering only works within a
single system.

-- 
David Kastrup
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Re: [Frescobaldi] convert-ly don't work in 3.0.1 in Windows

[Anders Eriksson]

Importing MusicXML also does nothing!

Is there a log somewhere, nothing is displayed in the log window...

// Anders

On 2018-09-11 16:24, Urs Liska wrote:



Am 11.09.2018 um 02:06 schrieb Urs Liska:



Am 10.09.2018 um 19:07 schrieb Urs Liska:


Am 10. September 2018 18:29:32 MESZ schrieb Federico Bruni 
:

...


OK, I have put my hands on the code that calls convert-ly 
(https://github.com/wbsoft/frescobaldi/commit/ab9cda16d96564a86fd2580c05d3ec86c63b7e51) 
.


It turns out that indeed Frescobaldi just invokes 'convert-ly' (with 
the absolute path, according to the current LilyPond version) without 
any notion of Python2/Python3.


On Linux this is a shell script that explicitly starts the Python 
bundled with LilyPond,


I don't know what exactly happens with this on Windows, but I think 
it *should* work, since it relies on what is bundled with LilyPond, 
not the Python3 from Frescobaldi.


I think I'd need more information to give a better opinion.
Best
Urs


One question: IIUC this should not only affect convert-ly, but also 
importing MusicXML, MIDI or ABC. Could someone check that, please?


Urs

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Re: [Frescobaldi] convert-ly don't work in 3.0.1 in Windows

[Federico Bruni]

Il giorno mar 11 set 2018 alle 16:24, Urs Liska  
ha scritto:
One question: IIUC this should not only affect convert-ly, but also 
importing MusicXML, MIDI or ABC. Could someone check that, please?


Yes, just tried to import from MIDI and I got a silent fail.




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Re: [Frescobaldi] convert-ly don't work in 3.0.1 in Windows

[Federico Bruni]

Il giorno lun 10 set 2018 alle 18:29, Federico Bruni 
 ha scritto:
The best fix would be make LilyPond convert-ly work on python3 as 
well...


Fixing the single file may be relatively easier.

The problem is porting GUB from python2.4 to python2.7. See this PR 5 
year old (2013):

https://github.com/gperciva/gub/pull/6#issuecomment-24477663

Perhaps Frescobaldi may bundle a py2+py3 version of these scripts?




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Re: [Frescobaldi] convert-ly don't work in 3.0.1 in Windows

[Federico Bruni]

Il giorno mar 11 set 2018 alle 2:06, Urs Liska  ha 
scritto:



This is exactly a spot I'm currently working on (how Frescobaldi 
handles external jobs). I will have a look into how convert-ly is 
called too.


OK, I have put my hands on the code that calls convert-ly 
(https://github.com/wbsoft/frescobaldi/commit/ab9cda16d96564a86fd2580c05d3ec86c63b7e51) 
.


It turns out that indeed Frescobaldi just invokes 'convert-ly' (with 
the absolute path, according to the current LilyPond version) without 
any notion of Python2/Python3.


On Linux this is a shell script that explicitly starts the Python 
bundled with LilyPond,


I don't know what exactly happens with this on Windows, but I think 
it *should* work, since it relies on what is bundled with LilyPond, 
not the Python3 from Frescobaldi.




No, it cannot work in Windows, because Linux installers provide the 
lilypond-wrapper.LANGUAGE bash scripts, while there's not such a thing 
for Windows. It's the problem I'm currently trying to work around to 
make lilypond-invoke-editor work on Windows.

It's a GUB problem, see:
https://github.com/gperciva/gub/blob/master/sourcefiles/lilypond-sharhead.sh#L208


$ ls -l /usr/local/bin/convert-ly
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 38  1 ago 16.06 /usr/local/bin/convert-ly -> 
/usr/local/bin/lilypond-wrapper.python



$ cat /usr/local/bin/lilypond-wrapper.python
#!/bin/sh
export 
PYTHONPATH="/usr/local/lilypond/usr/lib/lilypond/current/python:/usr/local/lilypond/usr/share/lilypond/current/python:$PYTHONPATH"

export GUILE_LOAD_PATH="/usr/local/lilypond/usr/share/lilypond/current"
export LD_LIBRARY_PATH="/usr/local/lilypond/usr/lib:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH"
me=`basename $0`
exec "/usr/local/lilypond/usr/bin/python"  
"/usr/local/lilypond/usr/bin/$me" "$@"





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Re: [Frescobaldi] convert-ly don't work in 3.0.1 in Windows

[Urs Liska]

Am 11.09.2018 um 02:06 schrieb Urs Liska:



Am 10.09.2018 um 19:07 schrieb Urs Liska:


Am 10. September 2018 18:29:32 MESZ schrieb Federico Bruni 
:

...


OK, I have put my hands on the code that calls convert-ly 
(https://github.com/wbsoft/frescobaldi/commit/ab9cda16d96564a86fd2580c05d3ec86c63b7e51) 
.


It turns out that indeed Frescobaldi just invokes 'convert-ly' (with 
the absolute path, according to the current LilyPond version) without 
any notion of Python2/Python3.


On Linux this is a shell script that explicitly starts the Python 
bundled with LilyPond,


I don't know what exactly happens with this on Windows, but I think it 
*should* work, since it relies on what is bundled with LilyPond, not 
the Python3 from Frescobaldi.


I think I'd need more information to give a better opinion.
Best
Urs


One question: IIUC this should not only affect convert-ly, but also 
importing MusicXML, MIDI or ABC. Could someone check that, please?


Urs

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Does the layer property not work across systems?

[caagr98 caagr98]

I have a couple of scores with limited space. For readability, I
sometimes draw white outlines around overlapping elements (to cut out
parts of volta brackets or similar). This works fine within the same
system, but in some cases, the overlapping elements (an articulation
and a volta bracket) are in different systems. No matter what I do,
the volta in the second bracket draws above the articulation in the
first. Is there a) some way to draw things over subsequent systems,
and/or b) some better way to solve such overlaps without significantly
affecting the overall layout?

Here's a small example of what I'm trying to do (the real version uses
edition engraver):

```
\version "2.19.82"

whiteout =
#(define-event-function (shape) (list?)
   #{
 \tweak layer #0
 \tweak Y-offset #0
 \tweak outside-staff-priority ##f
 -\markup {
   \with-color #red % Of course, this should be white, but this is
more visible.
   \override #'(filled . #t)
   \path #0 #shape
 }
   #})

\paper {
  #(set-paper-size "a8")
  system-system-spacing.padding = #-1000 % Makes vertical spacing more
even, but encourages overlap
}

{
  \repeat volta 2 {
e1-^ -\whiteout #'(
  (moveto 0.3 -6.2)
  (rcurveto .8 -1.75 .6 -1.75 1.4 0)
  (closepath))
\break
  }
  \alternative { {
\once \override Score.VoltaBracket.layer = #-100
\once \override Score.VoltaBracket.color = #blue
R1
  } }
}
```

An image of the result is attached. As you can see, the volta bracket
(blue) is drawn over the note and outline (black + red), despite the
volta being layer #-100 and the outline #0.
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