Re: [OT] Flecktones in London next month

2001-05-02 Thread Nathan Torkington

Neil Ford writes:
 I can now confirm this is at The Pizzaexpress Jazz Club, 10 Dean
 Street, Soho, London W1 - Reservations: 020 7439 8722 (the new
 listings arrived this morning!).

 Of course, this being the evening the tube strike starts, getting
 there and back could be fun.

I saw them play on Thursday.  I'd say it's worth venturing out if
you're a jazz fan or a bass player.

Nat





RE: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Cross David - dcross

From: Dave Hodgkinson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 9:28 AM

 Dave Cross [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
  Current version is at
  http://www.dave.org.uk/scripts/notmatt/formmail.pl.txt but it needs
  some tightening up and peer review.
 
 Remind me, what was the mission here? To so somethign that flows like
 A Matt's script but is done right?

Drop in replacements for Matt's scripts using best practices - but no
external modules.

 And didn't we have the argument(s) about sendmail vs. Net::SMTP and
 inline HTML vs. template?

Yep. But Net::SMTP is not a stadard module and therefore sendmail wins.

Dave...

-- 


The information contained in this communication is
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Re: Stuffed camel

2001-05-02 Thread Dominic Mitchell

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 12:00:11AM +0100, Dave Cross wrote:
 At 19:25 29/04/2001, Leon Brocard wrote:
 Can *someone* please pick a date to go visit the camel?
 
 Can't be done until a) the foot and mouth stuff has died down and b) I've 
 worked out exactly who has paid for slices.

homerMmmm... Sliced camel!/homer

As a side note, when we do get it together, would it be alright to come
along as an ordinary paying zoo entrant?  Or does being a camelite
confer extraordinary priviliges within the confines of the zoo?

-Dom



Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Dave Hodgkinson

Dave Cross [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 At 19:53 30/04/2001, Dave Hodgkinson wrote:
 
 I've got someone needing a form to mail script. Where's ours[0]?
 
 Ta,
 
 Dave
 
 [0] Oh, all right, yours since I bottled out.
 
 Current version is at
 http://www.dave.org.uk/scripts/notmatt/formmail.pl.txt but it needs
 some tightening up and peer review.

Well hurry up, I'm in the middle of an argument and I want to slap
some people with a this is how they _Should_ look cluestick...


-- 
Dave Hodgkinson, http://www.hodgkinson.org
Editor-in-chief, The Highway Star   http://www.deep-purple.com
  Interim CTO, web server farms, technical strategy
   



RE: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Matthew Byng-Maddick

On Wed, 2 May 2001, Cross David - dcross wrote:
 Yep. But Net::SMTP is not a stadard module and therefore sendmail wins.

That wasn't the reason. The reason was the same as one of the reasons for
rewriting matt's scripts in the first place - that the error handling
sucks. You can't sensibly error handle with Net::SMTP. This is why there
was discussion, however, on widnoze, (not sure about vanilla mac (rather
than os x)) there is no sensible way to do a queued message.

MBM

-- 
Matthew Byng-Maddick  [EMAIL PROTECTED] +44 20  8980 5714  (Home)
http://colondot.net/ +44 7956 613942  (Mobile)
I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it. -- Mae West




Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Paul Makepeace

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 10:06:46AM +0100, Matthew Byng-Maddick wrote:
 was discussion, however, on widnoze, (not sure about vanilla mac (rather
 than os x)) there is no sensible way to do a queued message.

open EMAIL, c:\webmas~1.txt;

Paul



RE: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Cross David - dcross

 From: Matthew Byng-Maddick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 10:07 AM
 
 On Wed, 2 May 2001, Cross David - dcross wrote:
  Yep. But Net::SMTP is not a stadard module and therefore sendmail wins.
 
 That wasn't the reason. The reason was the same as one of the reasons for
 rewriting matt's scripts in the first place - that the error handling
 sucks. You can't sensibly error handle with Net::SMTP. This is why there
 was discussion, however, on widnoze, (not sure about vanilla mac (rather
 than os x)) there is no sensible way to do a queued message.

Feel free to believe what you want, but as far as I'm concerned, not
expecting people to install extra CPAN modules is of overriding importance
in writing replacements for Matt's scripts.

Dave...


The information contained in this communication is
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named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
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Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread will

- Original Message -
From: Cross David - dcross [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 4:12 AM
Subject: RE: Not Matt's Scripts


 Feel free to believe what you want, but as far as I'm concerned, not
 expecting people to install extra CPAN modules is of overriding importance
 in writing replacements for Matt's scripts.

 Dave...

Although we have Net::SMTP installed on our servers and there is a formail
program there, there is no way any member of support is going to tell an
average 'my first homepage' AOL customer that they need to use a script that
requires anything extra installed.  They have difficulty enough telling the
difference between binary and ascii mode let alone being able to handle
module installation.

If the script is meant to be a replacement for matts script then using
Net::SMTP negates this based on the target audience for matts scripts IMHO.

Will.




Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Robert Shiels

Just had a look, and apparently the Formmail scripts have been ported to
Win32 and use something called Blat instead of sendmail. Is there any reason
why we couldn't use Blat too? I'm looking into it to see if I can get it
working.

--
Robert


- Original Message -
From: Matthew Byng-Maddick [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 02 May 2001 10:06
Subject: RE: Not Matt's Scripts


 On Wed, 2 May 2001, Cross David - dcross wrote:
  Yep. But Net::SMTP is not a stadard module and therefore sendmail wins.

 That wasn't the reason. The reason was the same as one of the reasons for
 rewriting matt's scripts in the first place - that the error handling
 sucks. You can't sensibly error handle with Net::SMTP. This is why there
 was discussion, however, on widnoze, (not sure about vanilla mac (rather
 than os x)) there is no sensible way to do a queued message.

 MBM

 --
 Matthew Byng-Maddick  [EMAIL PROTECTED] +44 20  8980 5714  (Home)
 http://colondot.net/ +44 7956 613942  (Mobile)
 I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it. -- Mae West






Re: US$ bank account

2001-05-02 Thread Philip Newton

Dave Hodgkinson wrote:
 Barclays charge between £5 and £10 to bank a check. Which for a
 month's work is fine, but for an Amazon affiliates payment is in the
 realm of ouchie.

AllAdvantage, while it was still alive, sent me DEM cheques drawn on a
German bank (which had been prepared by a service in England). If they can
do it, why can't a global e-commerce leading-edge pioneer-type place like
Amazon? The mind boggles.

Cheers,
Philip
-- 
Philip Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED]
All opinions are my own, not my employer's.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.



Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Robert Shiels

From: Robin Szemeti [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 02 May 2001 11:02
Subject: Re: Not Matt's Scripts


 On Wed, 02 May 2001, you wrote:
  Just had a look, and apparently the Formmail scripts have been ported to
  Win32 and use something called Blat instead of sendmail. Is there any
reason
  why we couldn't use Blat too? I'm looking into it to see if I can get it
  working.
 ahh yes ...
 trouble is .. there must be half a dozen 'popular' mailers for win32
 ...blat is just one of many (or so I'm told) the only thing I remember is
 blat is a file based thing, you have to put your mail in a file on the
 disc and then tell blat to send it, at least thats the way formmial was
 using it.
 I did look at the said script many moons ago
 instead of
 if($win32){ send_win32($mail) }
 else { send_unix($mail) }
 it has
 sub send{
 do this ...
 err .. but not this bit if its unix.
 oh and this bit
 but add this bit for win32
 and take this bit off agin
 and this bit goes in for unix
 and then do this if its win32


Yes - it's a bit crap. And I'm having trouble with it (read: can't get it
working).

I think we should be able to put all the Win32 specific bits in one place,
and have separate places for each external mailer program such as blat; but
blat is as good a place to start as any I suppose.

/Robert

PS - has anyone done this one already on Win32, or shall I keep going.




Re: US$ bank account

2001-05-02 Thread Paul Makepeace

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 12:24:13PM +0200, Philip Newton wrote:
 do it, why can't a global e-commerce leading-edge pioneer-type place like
 Amazon? The mind boggles.

Because there aren't any other currencies besides the US $. amazon.co.uk
actually uses dollars and so do you. Hey, do they have electricity in
England yet? I heard foot n mouth is a venereal disease.

The UK has nothing on the US for isolationism...

Paul



Re: Stuffed camel

2001-05-02 Thread David Cantrell

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 10:00:44AM +0100, Dominic Mitchell wrote:
 
 As a side note, when we do get it together, would it be alright to come
 along as an ordinary paying zoo entrant?  Or does being a camelite
 confer extraordinary priviliges within the confines of the zoo?

Yes, we get to ride the camel and take it to conferences!  

-- 
David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/

   Rip, Mix, Burn, unless you're using our latest and greatest
 operating system which we couldn't be arsed to complete



RE: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Simon Batistoni

 On Wed, 02 May 2001, you wrote:
  Just had a look, and apparently the Formmail scripts have been ported to
  Win32 and use something called Blat instead of sendmail. Is
 there any reason
  why we couldn't use Blat too? I'm looking into it to see if I can get it
  working.

 ahh yes ...
 trouble is .. there must be half a dozen 'popular' mailers for win32
 ...blat is just one of many (or so I'm told) the only thing I remember is
 blat is a file based thing, you have to put your mail in a file on the
 disc and then tell blat to send it, at least thats the way formmial was
 using it.

Blat can be used the command-line way, by specifying '-' as the input file
(hey - a unix convention!)

The following snippet works like a dream.

$mail_program='c:\winnt\system32\blat.exe';
$from_field='My Lovely Site [EMAIL PROTECTED]';

open (MAIL, |$mail_program - -t \$recipient\ -i \$from_field\ -s
\$subject\);

Then just print to MAIL, and close the filehandle when you're done.

Of course, this comes back to the fact that the user will need to have
control of/know where the NT mailer exists, but I believe most NT hosting
services do install blat, and tell people where it is.




RE: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Simon Batistoni

more on blat/win32 mailers

Arse, apologies for the two messages - I remembered the following and
pressed send simultaneously...

IMHO (and I've looked into this in some depth for various projects over the
past 2 years), there aren't that many command-line mailers for win32. The
only other anywhere-near-prolific one is W3JMail, which is an absolute arse
to configure, and is only used in most outfits because it plugs very well
into ASP pages. All the cheap hosting companies I've ever seen who do NT and
offer mail-out facilities do blat.

Any other command-line mailers which exist are generally unstable,
unconfigurable or downright obscure.

My advice would be to configure Win32 systems to use blat out of the box,
and (possibly) invite input from people who use anything different. That's
the OSS way, after all!




Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread David Cantrell

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 12:22:39PM +0100, Simon Batistoni wrote:

 Of course, this comes back to the fact that the user will need to have
 control of/know where the NT mailer exists, but I believe most NT hosting
 services do install blat, and tell people where it is.

If the purpose of this is to make it utterly drool-proof, then why not
re-write File::Find (can't make them install it of course, that would be
expecting too much) so that it finds their mailer for them.  We'd have to
re-write Digest::MD5 too, so that we could compare the found file with
a signature just in case someone has been messing with filenames.
Wouldn't want to accidentally start Back Orifice instead of blat.

Yeah, silly isn't it.  That's what happens when you aim for the lowest
common denominator.

-- 
David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/

   Rip, Mix, Burn, unless you're using our latest and greatest
 operating system which we couldn't be arsed to complete



Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Robin Szemeti

so ..  who is the FormMail csar? ... I lost track of who was dealing with
what. I spotted a few things in there and have comments .. or should i
just post em on the list .. ???

-- 
Robin Szemeti

The box said requires windows 95 or better
So I installed Linux!



Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Simon Wilcox

At 13:27 02/05/2001 +0100, David Cantrell wrote:
If the purpose of this is to make it utterly drool-proof, then why not
re-write File::Find (can't make them install it of course, that would be
expecting too much)

Is there a reason why we can't distribute our own versions of modules with 
the scripts ?

MWF Forum (as an example) has modules in the same directory as the scripts 
which seem to just get useed in the usual way.

Could we not ship our own version of File::Find, and have the code use it 
if it can't use the real File::Find because it's not installed ?

OK, so it would eat up disk space but if it were clever, there would be 
some run once code that would figure out what's there and what isn't and 
tell the user which files they could safely remove.

Ideally it would rewrite itself and do the deletes automatically but I 
suspect that clueful ISPs will have removed write permissions for the 
webserver to write to cgi-bin !

Just a thought.

Simon.




Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Robert Shiels


 Yes - it's a bit crap. And I'm having trouble with it (read: can't get it
 working).

 I think we should be able to put all the Win32 specific bits in one place,
 and have separate places for each external mailer program such as blat;
but
 blat is as good a place to start as any I suppose.


Well, finally got the formmail.pl script to work on win32 with blat. Tracked
my major difficulty down to a problem created by the person who ported it to
windows, $CONFIG has been used instead of the correct case which is $Config.
Can't imagine it's ever worked.

I'll have a look at Dave's later.

/Robert, needing to pretend to do some real work now!




RE: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Cross David - dcross

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 12:57 PM

 so ..  who is the FormMail csar? ... I lost track of who was dealing with
 what. 

Er... me. I think.

 I spotted a few things in there and have comments .. or should i
 just post em on the list .. ???

Just post 'em to the list. Let's hold up as much as possible of my code to
the derision of the world!

Dave...

-- 


The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
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If you have received this communication in error, please 
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Re: Stuffed camel

2001-05-02 Thread Martin Ling

  
  As a side note, when we do get it together, would it be alright to come
  along as an ordinary paying zoo entrant?  Or does being a camelite
  confer extraordinary priviliges within the confines of the zoo?
 
 Yes, we get to ride the camel and take it to conferences!  

... m/conventions/ ?

You all know where I'm going with this :-)


Martin



TPC Travel

2001-05-02 Thread Cross David - dcross


It's that time of year again boys and girls. I know it all fell apart last
year, but I'm an optimist and am going to try again.

Who's going to TPC? Shall we see if we can get a group together and perhaps
get a discount on the flight?

Dave...

-- 


The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
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If you have received this communication in error, please 
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Re: TPC Travel

2001-05-02 Thread Leon Brocard

Cross David - dcross sent the following bits through the ether:
 
 It's that time of year again boys and girls. I know it all fell apart last
 year, but I'm an optimist and am going to try again.

It's passed that time, actually ;-) Trailfinders found me, and I've
confirmed, the following Northwest Airlines flights:

21st July 12:10 Gatwick - Minneapolis - San Diego 18:55
28th July 12:10 San Diego - Minneapolis - Gatwick 09:00

... for a grand total of 539.50 squid (inc everything). There were
direct flights for a bit more, but I was trying to keep it
cheap. Anyone found a cheaper way to get there just to spite me?

Leon
-- 
Leon Brocard.http://www.astray.com/
Iterative Software..http://yapc.org/Europe/

... All life's answers are on TV. - Bart Simpson



Re: TPC Travel

2001-05-02 Thread Barbie

From: Cross David - dcross [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Who's going to TPC? Shall we see if we can get a group together and
perhaps
 get a discount on the flight?

I'm not sure at the moment due to the cost involved. However, I have done
some prelimary checking and there is a British Airways flight direct from
Heathrow to San Diego for just over £680 for the month of July. Discovered
that I can get an extra 20% off the cost of the tuts and stuff though, so an
extra discount on the flight and some cheap accomodation and I'll be in for
definite.

Barbie.





RE: TPC Travel

2001-05-02 Thread Chris Devers

At 03:34 PM 2001.05.02 +0100, you wrote:
From: Leon Brocard [EMAIL PROTECTED]?
 It's passed that time, actually ;-) Trailfinders found me, and 
 I've confirmed, the following Northwest Airlines flights:
 
 21st July 12:10 Gatwick - Minneapolis - San Diego 18:55
 28th July 12:10 San Diego - Minneapolis - Gatwick 09:00

That's about the same prices that I'm seeing on ebookers, deckchair and
expedia. I may be prepared to pay a little more for a) a direct flight
and b) a better known airline :)

Whaddya talking about? 

Northwest had an Alfred Hitchcock movie named after it! 
-- and possibly the best Hitchcock movie, at that. Pfft. ;)

So are any of you still thinking of going to NYC, while we're at it?



--
Chris Devers [EMAIL PROTECTED]




RE: TPC Travel

2001-05-02 Thread Cross David - dcross

From: Chris Devers [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 3:49 PM

 So are any of you still thinking of going to NYC, while we're at it?

Er... yeah. We got back yesterday!

Dave...

-- 


The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.  
If you have received this communication in error, please 
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Re: US$ bank account

2001-05-02 Thread Dave Hodgkinson

Philip Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 AllAdvantage, while it was still alive, sent me DEM cheques drawn on a
 German bank (which had been prepared by a service in England). If they can
 do it, why can't a global e-commerce leading-edge pioneer-type place like
 Amazon? The mind boggles.

Hah! You try signing up for a US Zshop, or the Honour system!

-- 
Dave Hodgkinson, http://www.hodgkinson.org
Editor-in-chief, The Highway Star   http://www.deep-purple.com
  Interim CTO, web server farms, technical strategy
   



RE: TPC Travel

2001-05-02 Thread Chris Devers

At 03:50 PM 2001.05.02 +0100, Cross David - dcross wrote:
Er... yeah. We got back yesterday!

Doh! I thought you were all rioting for Mayday yesterday.
I can only assume your return date was not a coincidence



--
Chris Devers [EMAIL PROTECTED]




Re: tube strike / may meeting postponed til 10th

2001-05-02 Thread Leon Brocard

jo walsh sent the following bits through the ether:
 
 well, it looks like the tube strike (8pm Weds 2nd May - 8pm Thurs 3rd May)
 is still on, and this will scupper our May social meeting plans rather.

It's not anymore, but we shouldn't shift the date again:
http://www.thetube.com/content/pressreleases/

Where will the (delayed) meeting be? Have we booked a room? ;-)

Leon
-- 
Leon Brocard.http://www.astray.com/
Iterative Software..http://yapc.org/Europe/

... I always lie. In fact, I'm lying to you right now!



Re: tube strike / may meeting postponed til 10th

2001-05-02 Thread Matthew Byng-Maddick

On Wed, 2 May 2001, Leon Brocard wrote:
 jo walsh sent the following bits through the ether:
  well, it looks like the tube strike (8pm Weds 2nd May - 8pm Thurs 3rd May)
  is still on, and this will scupper our May social meeting plans rather.
 It's not anymore, but we shouldn't shift the date again:
 http://www.thetube.com/content/pressreleases/
 Where will the (delayed) meeting be? Have we booked a room? ;-)

PO?

MBM

-- 
Matthew Byng-Maddick  [EMAIL PROTECTED] +44 20  8980 5714  (Home)
http://colondot.net/ +44 7956 613942  (Mobile)
I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it. -- Mae West




RE: tube strike / may meeting postponed til 10th

2001-05-02 Thread Cross David - dcross

From: Leon Brocard [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 4:51 PM

 jo walsh sent the following bits through the ether:

  well, it looks like the tube strike (8pm Weds 2nd May - 8pm Thurs 3rd
May)
  is still on, and this will scupper our May social meeting plans rather.
 
 It's not anymore, but we shouldn't shift the date again:
 http://www.thetube.com/content/pressreleases/

Agreed. And I think that's what Jo said in her email.

 Where will the (delayed) meeting be? Have we booked a room? ;-)

Nothing booked. I therefore declare that we'll go to Penderels Oak.

Dave...

-- 


The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.  
If you have received this communication in error, please 
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Re: tube strike / may meeting postponed til 10th

2001-05-02 Thread Struan Donald

* at 02/05 16:51 +0100 Leon Brocard said:
 jo walsh sent the following bits through the ether:
  
  well, it looks like the tube strike (8pm Weds 2nd May - 8pm Thurs 3rd May)
  is still on, and this will scupper our May social meeting plans rather.
 
 It's not anymore, but we shouldn't shift the date again:
 http://www.thetube.com/content/pressreleases/

or

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/newsid_1307000/1307103.stm

for those who don't get a kick out of seeing server errors :)

struan



Re: tube strike / may meeting postponed til 10th

2001-05-02 Thread Dominic Mitchell

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 04:57:08PM +0100, Matthew Byng-Maddick wrote:
 PO?

dipsy ask po to do webby things like googling. He won't core dump.
Promise.
+or not dadadodo or not here while hitherto is on holiday
po Dom2?
dipsy hmmm... Dom2 is still annoyed by how bad emacs is at doing xml,
+actually, given how good psgml is.
dadadodo cat away plain colons include

-Dom



Re: Review of Data munging with Perl on Slashdot

2001-05-02 Thread David H. Adler

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 09:19:25AM +0100, Cross David - dcross wrote:
 
 Now, has anyone seen the June Web Techniques yet? There's supposed to be
 another good review in that.

Yep.  As soon as I read that sentence my brain said hey, didn't I just
pull that out of my mailbox?

Yes, the review is good.  He even says he *learned* something from DMP!
:-)  Unfortunately, it's not on line yet. :-/

dha
-- 
David H. Adler - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.panix.com/~dha/
Please stop flirting with my canvas.- Damian Conway



YAPC::E abstract

2001-05-02 Thread Robin Houston

Any comments before I send this off?

 .robin.


Type: talk
Duration: 40 mins
Title: Mutagenic Modules
Slides (draft version): http://London.pm.org/~robin/semantic-talk/0.title.html
Abstract:

It's possible to write a Perl module which will change the meaning of
subsequent code in some way. Pragmas (eg use integer) alter meaning
in this way, but require significant co-operation from the perl
interpreter. However, there are many different ways that you can write
your own mutagenic modules. Mechanisms that make this possible include:

 * AUTOLOAD
 * CORE::UNIVERSAL::
 * overload::constant
 * source filters
 * CHECK blocks
 * tie()

...and many more.

You can do a lot of fun, interesting tricks using these mechanisms, and
I shall demonstrate several different examples; but there are limits to
what you can do. To take a simple example, there's no general way to
change the behaviour of the print function. I'll briefly mention the
difficulties I encountered trying to implement the mythical
Symbol::Approx::Scalar module.

Next I present a brief overview of the internal workings of the perl
interpreter: How it parses your code and compiles it into an optree,
and how the optree is then executed. A compiler backend (or, to speak
more generally, a CHECK block) interposes itself between these two
stages, and converts the optree into some other form. My favourite
compiler backend is B::Deparse, which just converts the optree back
into Perl source code!

Finally I'll describe some work (currently still in the planning phase)
to use a Deparse-like module to convert the optree into a structured
object model which represents the original code. This object model can
serialise itself as Perl code; but serialisation of any specific
construct can be over-ridden to produce different code. (The objects
will also have methods which enumerate the lexical variables which
are in-scope at that point in the program.)

This then amounts to a perfectly general mechanism for applying any
kind of semantic transformation to any Perl code.



Fwd: perl jobs page and list

2001-05-02 Thread Dave Cross


Envelope-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 18:15:40 -0400
From: Uri Guttman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: perl jobs page and list
Reply-to: Uri Guttman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


pm group leaders:

please forward this to your local pm groups.

as some of you may know there have been a perl jobs announce and wanted
lists hosted on pm.org. those lists have been merged and moved to the
perl.org site. there are now these two lists:

 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

which is moderated and is only for posting of both job openings and
situations wanted.

 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

which is not moderated and is meant to discuss the perl jobs list and
web site as well and any other perl job related topics.

go to jobs.perl.org for information on how to subscribe and the posting
guidelines. if your pm group has a home page you might want to link to
this page.

the page and list are for perl jobs worldwide. telecommuting, relocation
and other options are common so don't think you have to be in a
particular goegraphic location to participate. also agencies and HR
types are welcome too. spread the word about this page and list to any
of those you know who deal with the perl job market.

thanx,

uri

--
Uri Guttman  -  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  --  http://www.sysarch.com
SYStems ARCHitecture and Stem Development -- http://www.stemsystems.com
Learn Advanced Object Oriented Perl from Damian Conway - Boston, July 10-11
Class and Registration info: http://www.sysarch.com/perl/OOP_class.html

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http://www.dave.org.uk  SMS: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

plugData Munging with Perl http://www.manning.com/cross//plug




Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 01:45:19AM -0700, Paul Makepeace wrote:
 Hey! You think this 5K script is enough? Wrong, you've gotta configure
 CPAN, get these suite of modules that is a prerequisite for these suites
 of modules which include something like Data::Dumper which makes you
 pull down the latest f**king perl distribution which doesn't f**cking
 compile on your machine!

step 1: configure CPAN
step 2: upgrade CPAN
step 3: configure the new CPAN
step 4: use CPAN

yes it sucks mildly, it's still a helluva lot more convinient than
doing it by hand, imo

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]