Re: YAPC::Europe
On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 06:56:35PM +, Redvers Davies wrote: Plane tickets are currently 37 quid return via easyjet... Are there any plans for a group of London PMer's to fly over together or is the whole thing going to be ad hoc? I know i asked this before but with the success of the NY trip i was hoping someone would be feeling ambitious and volenter... (Although i worked at Oven and hence can't organize a pissup in a brewery :)) Dean -- Profanity is the one language all programmers understand --- Anon
Re: YAPC::Europe
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:17:53AM +0100, Dean wrote: Although i worked at Oven and hence can't organize a pissup in a brewery That's odd, I'm sure I remember Oven doing at least that one thing well! -- David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/ Good advice is always certain to be ignored, but that's no reason not to give it-- Agatha Christie
Re: YAPC::Europe
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:17:53AM +0100, Dean wrote: On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 06:56:35PM +, Redvers Davies wrote: Plane tickets are currently 37 quid return via easyjet... Are there any plans for a group of London PMer's to fly over together or is the whole thing going to be ad hoc? Needing to get things sorted, we've booked our flights already. I know at least one other London.pmer is on the same flight as us (Easyjet from Gatwick, 14:45 Wednesday 1st). Neil. -- Neil C. Ford Managing Director, Yet Another Computer Solutions Company Limited [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.yacsc.com
YAB::London (was YAPC::Europe)
On Thu, 14 Jun 2001 23:44:02 +0100 David Cantrell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 07:46:56PM +0100, Lucy McWilliam wrote: So how many people are bringing partners to YAPC::Europe? Some of us can't afford YAPC. And some of us don't have partners :-( maybe we could have Yet Another Beer :: London at the same time then. That is the time of the Great British Beer Festival and Thursday is the night John Otway is playing... I'll be there all week again, slaving away at keeping the beer on the front right set of brewery bars in tip top condition. -- Tony Kennick TechnoPhobia Limited. Phone: +44 (0)114 2212123 Fax: +44 (0)114 2212124 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] WWW: http://www.technophobia.com Registered in England and Wales Company No. 3063669 VAT registration No. 598 7858 42 The contents of this e-mail are confidential to the addressee and are intended solely for the recipients use. If you are not the addressee, you have received this e-mail in error. Any disclosure, copying, distribution or action taken in reliance on it is prohibited and may be unlawful. Any opinions expressed in this e-mail are those of the author personally and not TechnoPhobia Limited who do not accept responsibility for the contents of the message. All e-mail communications, in and out of TechnoPhobia, are recorded for monitoring purposes.
LCN supplementary
Welcome to a supplementary issue of the LCN for the month of June. This post contains details that have changed or been announced since the June LCN that was dispatched at (gasp) the start of June. The User Groups: --- GLLUG Home Page: http://gllug.linux.co.uk/ Greater London Linux User Group's (GLLUG) purpose is to bring together London's Linux users so they can share experiences and expertise (or revel in their inexperience and quest for expertise), to chat about the state of the (Linux) world, that sort of thing. We try to arrange meets so that there is space for users to set up their equipment, so you are welcome to bring your kit along, either to go through the problems you are having or just to show off what you are up to. Next GLLUG (Greater London Linux User Group) will be at the same place (FrameStore) CFC Preview Theatre, 19-23 Wells St., London W1, on 23/06/01 Starting at 1pm and ending at 6pm. We have three talks: Mike Brodbelt A discussion of mail systems, with particular reference to IMAP server implementations, and the advantages of using IMAP solutions. Technical detail on the specifics of an IMAP implementation using the Cyrus IMAP server. Richard Cohen Introduction to the Shell: Aimed at people who are either new to Linux, or who have spent most of their time in graphical environments. An attempt to introduce people to the richness and power of the Linux and Unix shell, and some of the more useful standard tools. Lots of examples, both useful and silly. Simon Trimmer An Introduction to Linux Kernel Debugging: A practical talk with information and techniques targeted at the mid range of Linux experience (i.e. comfortable systems administrator through to beginner developer). The talk will cover the basics and probe some more advanced areas of kernel debugging, in particular exploring the types of crashes/lockups with methods for diagnosing problems. There are no formalities to attending a GLLUG meeting, no subscription or entry fees, you can just turn up on the day. We welcome and encourage new and inexperienced users, young and old. The GLLUG venue this month is an indoor private preview Theatre owned by CFC and Framestore and once again our thanks go out for letting us use it for the day. --- London Perl Mongers Home Page: http://www.london.pm.org Contact Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] London PM are a group who are dedicated to the encouragement of all things Perl-like in London. The technical meeting is on the 21/06/01 and is being held once more at the very kind and understanding State51. Outside London Events: --- YAPC::Europe: YAPC is yet another Perl conference, with apologies to The Perl Conference. This is an inexpensive, grassroots Perl conference with its roots in the Perl Mongers Perl users groups, and is supported by Yet Another Society. This years conference is Thursday, 02/08/2001 -- 04/08/2001 and is located in Amsterdam. More details can be found here: http://www.yapc.org/Europe/ The conference registration has now opened and tickets are available (While stocks last) so make sure you don't wait too long. I don't know of any plans to send a London delegation (ala last years OSDEM) so make your plans quick :) UKUUG Linux Developers' Conference: This is on 29 June - 1 July 2001. It looks like one of the most fun events this year and with the list of speakers attending it should be on your essential list. http://www.ukuug.org/events/linux2001/ Today is the last day to get a discount on entry fees so don't forget. Other Stuff: --- London Geeknic John Spare time Hearns has bravely organised the first London Geeknic for this weekend. Expect much humour, laptops and coders bursting into dust under the rays of the day star. What - the Geeknic is a Geek Picnic. Date - Sunday 17th June Time - 12:30 onwards Place - General Wolff's Statue, adjacent to the Observatory, Greenwich Park (this is a terrace overlooking London, right next to the one o'clock time signal) Bring - picnic food, cool drinks, and lashings of ginger beer Plus sun screen and hats (ha! bet it rains) Activities - bring frisbees, softball, kites, nerf guns and any other fun things to do. Alternate activities - there is a craft market in Greenwich, and nice restaurants and pubs for later on. Computing - palmtops and laptops OK, but these shouldn't form the focus of the day. I may well have a car there, so we could consider hauling in a power supply. How to find us - follow the sign of the Inflatable Penguin (seriously though, we should be in the vicinity of the observatory. IT won't be too hard to spot a bunch of geeks and inflatable penguins in Greenwich Park) (Thanks to SuSE for a six foot inflatable penguin!) --- HTH and can someone bring a football to the geeknic... Dean -- Profanity is the one
Re: YAPC::Europe
* Neil Ford ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:17:53AM +0100, Dean wrote: On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 06:56:35PM +, Redvers Davies wrote: Plane tickets are currently 37 quid return via easyjet... Are there any plans for a group of London PMer's to fly over together or is the whole thing going to be ad hoc? Needing to get things sorted, we've booked our flights already. I know at least one other London.pmer is on the same flight as us (Easyjet from Gatwick, 14:45 Wednesday 1st). i'm also booking that flight, my only problem is it wont accept my switch card at the moment for some unknown reason -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: YAPC::Europe
On 15/06/2001 at 09:17 +0100, Dean wrote: Are there any plans for a group of London PMer's to fly over together or is the whole thing going to be ad hoc? Not yet, no. (Oh, and what are the cheapest flights from London City? Living in skanky East London's got to be good for *something*.) I know i asked this before but with the success of the NY trip i was hoping someone would be feeling ambitious and volenter... (Although i worked at Oven and hence can't organize a pissup in a brewery :)) Organising anything for London.pm once a year is enough. (Oh, did the pub evaluation sessions happen this week, or did I miss something?) Anyway, I thought Oven's pissup/brewery exercise went very well, although it could be no-one remembers because of absinthe poisoning. On 15/06/2001 at 09:17 +0100, David Cantrell wrote: That's odd, I'm sure I remember Oven doing at least that one thing well! See, that absinthe's powerful stuff. -- :: paul :: 'aggressive is a big M - and the misses generally :: don't survive aeroplane crashes.' dadadodo
Re: YAB::London (was YAPC::Europe)
On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Tony Kennick wrote: Some of us can't afford YAPC. maybe we could have Yet Another Beer :: London at the same time then. That is the time of the Great British Beer Festival Just realised that. YAB :: London @ Olympia? L. Busy doin' nothing
Re: YAPC::Europe
* Neil Ford ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:17:53AM +0100, Dean wrote: On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 06:56:35PM +, Redvers Davies wrote: Plane tickets are currently 37 quid return via easyjet... Are there any plans for a group of London PMer's to fly over together or is the whole thing going to be ad hoc? Needing to get things sorted, we've booked our flights already. I know at least one other London.pmer is on the same flight as us (Easyjet from Gatwick, 14:45 Wednesday 1st). if anyone else is booking the gatwick departure on the 1/8 and the return to gatwick on the 5/8 from easyjet (total cost 62.50) could they book an extra ticket and i'll do a funds transfer to their account or something easyjet don't seem to like switch well at least not a switch card that expires this month or the one that starts next month hmmm -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: crazy golf
On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 05:41:43PM +0100, Chris Heathcote wrote: Beware, it's in Flash (or Shockwave) http://www.electrotank.com/lab/minigolf.html Hole 17 is a bugger How much time did it take you to find out this incredible fact? -Dom -- | Semantico: creators of major online resources | | URL: http://www.semantico.com/ | | Tel: +44 (1273) 72 | | Address: 33 Bond St., Brighton, Sussex, BN1 1RD, UK. |
Re: *Buffy's Not Included
On Thu, 14 Jun 2001, Leo Lapworth (on topic, for a change) wrote: XML - do it because you need it, not because of the Buzz. Indeed ;-) XML is cool for handeling complex (or varied) data and sharing this info with others (but if CSV will do, then use that!). I'll soon be implementing an annotation/transformation tool to produce large, *complicated* XML files containing information about microarray experiments. Would be grateful if anyone could suggest any useful tools/modules. L. www.gen.cam.ac.uk/~flychip
Re: YAPC::Europe (Ignore this request)
Ok, ignore this request now. Also thanks to Simon Wilcox. for helping me out here. I also believe others are flying on this flight, so it looks like we have the official flight for London.pm ;-) and thanks to Jouke we can claim to have an official London.pm hotel - with minibars and minigolf * Greg McCarroll ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: * Neil Ford ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:17:53AM +0100, Dean wrote: On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 06:56:35PM +, Redvers Davies wrote: Plane tickets are currently 37 quid return via easyjet... Are there any plans for a group of London PMer's to fly over together or is the whole thing going to be ad hoc? Needing to get things sorted, we've booked our flights already. I know at least one other London.pmer is on the same flight as us (Easyjet from Gatwick, 14:45 Wednesday 1st). if anyone else is booking the gatwick departure on the 1/8 and the return to gatwick on the 5/8 from easyjet (total cost 62.50) could they book an extra ticket and i'll do a funds transfer to their account or something easyjet don't seem to like switch well at least not a switch card that expires this month or the one that starts next month hmmm -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/ -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: YAPC::Europe (Ignore this request)
* at 15/06 14:41 +0100 Greg McCarroll said: Ok, ignore this request now. Also thanks to Simon Wilcox. for helping me out here. I also believe others are flying on this flight, so it looks like we have the official flight for London.pm ;-) and thanks to Jouke we can claim to have an official London.pm hotel - with minibars and minigolf somehow i just can't see offical hotel of london.pm being used in the marketing material... struan
Re: YAPC::Europe (Ignore this request)
* Struan Donald ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: * at 15/06 14:41 +0100 Greg McCarroll said: Ok, ignore this request now. Also thanks to Simon Wilcox. for helping me out here. I also believe others are flying on this flight, so it looks like we have the official flight for London.pm ;-) and thanks to Jouke we can claim to have an official London.pm hotel - with minibars and minigolf somehow i just can't see offical hotel of london.pm being used in the marketing material... site of the 2001 mini golf riot may not go down well either, i'm not curious how much of the hotel we can take up will we get our own floor? do we have enough airports to give us a private lan? Greg -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: YAPC::Europe (Ignore this request)
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 03:30:36PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: * Struan Donald ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: * at 15/06 14:41 +0100 Greg McCarroll said: Ok, ignore this request now. Also thanks to Simon Wilcox. for helping me out here. I also believe others are flying on this flight, so it looks like we have the official flight for London.pm ;-) and thanks to Jouke we can claim to have an official London.pm hotel - with minibars and minigolf somehow i just can't see offical hotel of london.pm being used in the marketing material... site of the 2001 mini golf riot may not go down well either, i'm not curious how much of the hotel we can take up will we get our own floor? do we have enough airports to give us a private lan? If we did, who'd pick up the phone bill? If I pack enough laptops we could have our own irc server though :-) Neil. -- Neil C. Ford Managing Director, Yet Another Computer Solutions Company Limited [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.yacsc.com
Re: YAPC::Europe (Ignore this request)
* Neil Ford ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 03:30:36PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: * Struan Donald ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: * at 15/06 14:41 +0100 Greg McCarroll said: Ok, ignore this request now. Also thanks to Simon Wilcox. for helping me out here. I also believe others are flying on this flight, so it looks like we have the official flight for London.pm ;-) and thanks to Jouke we can claim to have an official London.pm hotel - with minibars and minigolf somehow i just can't see offical hotel of london.pm being used in the marketing material... site of the 2001 mini golf riot may not go down well either, i'm not curious how much of the hotel we can take up will we get our own floor? do we have enough airports to give us a private lan? If we did, who'd pick up the phone bill? we could always split it or do they have unmetered called in Holland? If so and we had a direct line we could beg a Dutch Monger to call in and set up ppp to their broadband or similar connection anyway just having a common Lan may be fun -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
NYC Pictures
A lot later that originally planned [insert bootsphoto.com rant here] I've finally got my photos of NYC back and am currently in the process of uploading them to http://www.dave.org.uk/ny/. Some semblance of order may well be imposed if I ever get some more spare time, but currently you'll just have to make do with a default index page. Whilst I'm quite happy to take the blame for the poor composition and lack of focus, the general washed-out colour is, I'm sure, the fault of Boots. I (or, more accurately, my camera) are usually better than that :) Caption competition anyone? Enjoy, Dave... -- Don't dream it... be it
early peek at a bit of fun
I was just playing around and wrote http://217.34.97.146/~gem/perl/lpm_cpan_lb.cgi It is a very alpha-ish cgi script that simply compiles a Leader Board of known London.pm people (including those who may be outside the UK but still in there heart are London.pmers) and ranks them according to the number of modules attributed to them in 03modlist.data.gz. !!! THIS IS JUST A BIT OF FUN !!! However if it does spur people to release the modules that have been sitting on their hard disks for ages, so be it. (Myself included). I'll cleanup/optimize/add error checking tommorow. but i thought i'd let you see it tonight for fun and advance warning. If i haven't got your CPAN id included in the list at the bottom please email me off list, i just skipped through the who's who very quickly getting a decent list of people who looked london.pm-ish to test it. Greg -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
Greg McCarroll sent the following bits through the ether: It is a very alpha-ish cgi script that simply compiles a Leader Board of known London.pm people The modules list is a bit out of date in this case (I'm at eight)... Leon -- Leon Brocard.http://www.astray.com/ Iterative Software...http://www.iterative-software.com/ ... The faster you go, the shorter you are
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
* Leon Brocard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Greg McCarroll sent the following bits through the ether: It is a very alpha-ish cgi script that simply compiles a Leader Board of known London.pm people The modules list is a bit out of date in this case (I'm at eight)... the blame the module list maintainer , not me ;-) -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:42:20PM +0100, Leon Brocard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Greg McCarroll sent the following bits through the ether: It is a very alpha-ish cgi script that simply compiles a Leader Board of known London.pm people The modules list is a bit out of date in this case (I'm at eight)... And, of course, not all modules on CPAN are in the module list (see, for example, Symbol::Approx::Sub). Dave... -- Drugs are just bad m'kay
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:02:04PM +0100, Dave Cross wrote: And, of course, not all modules on CPAN are in the module list (see, for example, Symbol::Approx::Sub). Yeah but if you did just parse 02packages blindly then Leon would have a bigger headstart with all of the Graphviz::GraphMyAunt modules. -- Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED] so we've got a deadline. we can do deadlines.
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
Richard Clamp sent the following bits through the ether: Yeah but if you did just parse 02packages blindly then Leon would have a bigger headstart with all of the Graphviz::GraphMyAunt modules. Family graphs? Good call. What was that ancestry format again? Leon -- Leon Brocard.http://www.astray.com/ Iterative Software...http://www.iterative-software.com/ ... 1200 bps used to seem so fast
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:18:47PM +0100, Leon Brocard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Richard Clamp sent the following bits through the ether: Yeah but if you did just parse 02packages blindly then Leon would have a bigger headstart with all of the Graphviz::GraphMyAunt modules. Family graphs? Good call. What was that ancestry format again? Do you mean GEDCOM? I made a start at something to create data structures based on GEDCOM files and create web pages using TT2. Feel free to snarf code from http://www.dave.org.uk/scripts/webged.tar.gz Dave... -- Don't dream it... be it
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
* Dave Cross ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:42:20PM +0100, Leon Brocard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Greg McCarroll sent the following bits through the ether: It is a very alpha-ish cgi script that simply compiles a Leader Board of known London.pm people The modules list is a bit out of date in this case (I'm at eight)... And, of course, not all modules on CPAN are in the module list (see, for example, Symbol::Approx::Sub). hmmm, somehow that strengthens the argument for using the module list ;-) however if someone can suggest a better way to evaluate the CPAN contributions I'm all ears. I like the modlist, because theoretically its things that have went through some form of QA[1][2] and become part of the proper CPAN set. Greg [1] or KA [3] [2] albeit limited [3] [3] as someone once told me - Pratchett has a lot to answer for when it comes to footnotes (paraphrased) -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:18:47PM +0100, Leon Brocard wrote: Family graphs? Good call. What was that ancestry format again? GEDCOM. I wrote Gedcom.pm and I've actually had a couple of people asking about Graphviz, but I had to say I didn't know anything about it. Go to it. Please -- Paul Johnson - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pjcj.net
Re: YAPC::Europe (Ignore this request)
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 08:20:15PM +0100, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: Greg McCarroll [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: or do they have unmetered called in Holland? If so and we had a direct line we could beg a Dutch Monger to call in and set up ppp to their broadband or similar connection Demon have a PoP of course...and even in Holland it workd out at pennies. Don't forget to log in as hostname.demon.co.uk not just hostname otherwise it won't work... -Dom -- | Semantico: creators of major online resources | | URL: http://www.semantico.com/ | | Tel: +44 (1273) 72 | | Address: 33 Bond St., Brighton, Sussex, BN1 1RD, UK. |
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
* Paul Johnson ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:18:47PM +0100, Leon Brocard wrote: Family graphs? Good call. What was that ancestry format again? GEDCOM. I wrote Gedcom.pm and I've actually had a couple of people asking about Graphviz, but I had to say I didn't know anything about it. and you've now been associated on the page with us as well ;-) -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:38:44PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: and you've now been associated on the page with us as well ;-) Thanks. I'll have to be an honourary member since I'm in Switzerland at the moment, but at least it bumps up the percentages on the web page -- Paul Johnson - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pjcj.net
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 11:29:27PM +0200, Paul Johnson ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:18:47PM +0100, Leon Brocard wrote: Family graphs? Good call. What was that ancestry format again? GEDCOM. I wrote Gedcom.pm and I've actually had a couple of people asking about Graphviz, but I had to say I didn't know anything about it. Credit where credit is due. I should probably point out that I made very heavy use of Paul's GEDCOM.pm when writing webged. Dave... -- Drugs are just bad m'kay
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 11:53:30PM +0200, Paul Johnson ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:38:44PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: and you've now been associated on the page with us as well ;-) Thanks. I'll have to be an honourary member since I'm in Switzerland at the moment, but at least it bumps up the percentages on the web page That's just down the road in comparison to some of the people that consider themselves members of london.pm :) Dave... -- Don't dream it... be it
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
* Paul Johnson ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:38:44PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: and you've now been associated on the page with us as well ;-) Thanks. I'll have to be an honourary member since I'm in Switzerland at the moment, but at least it bumps up the percentages on the web page Currently we are at 0.94% of CPAN, but i'm sure we have more contributors than i have listed if dha supplies me with a list of cpan ID's and names for NY i'll do a similar page of NY and include the % of each on both pages -- Greg McCarrollhttp://217.34.97.146/~gem/
Re: early peek at a bit of fun
On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 09:49:24PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: * Leon Brocard ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Greg McCarroll sent the following bits through the ether: It is a very alpha-ish cgi script that simply compiles a Leader Board of known London.pm people The modules list is a bit out of date in this case (I'm at eight)... the blame the module list maintainer , not me ;-) The list doesn't get updated that often - it was something like six months after Data::Hexdumper was submitted to the modules mailing list and bunged on CPAN before an updated list was issued. -- David Cantrell | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/ Good advice is always certain to be ignored, but that's no reason not to give it-- Agatha Christie
Re: YAPC::Europe (Ignore this request)
Greg McCarroll [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: or do they have unmetered called in Holland? If so and we had a direct line we could beg a Dutch Monger to call in and set up ppp to their broadband or similar connection Demon have a PoP of course...and even in Holland it workd out at pennies. Of course, whoever owned the gateway would want some QoS in there to prevent FTPs and napster ;-) -- Dave Hodgkinson, http://www.hodgkinson.org Editor-in-chief, The Highway Star http://www.deep-purple.com Interim CTO, web server farms, technical strategy
