Re: Templating Solutions

2001-06-19 Thread Leo Lapworth

True, DW monkey can crap anything up, but not True that
H::T is better to DW edit than T::T (You can set your tags
to be !-- TT_CODE -- just as with H::T.


On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 05:34:44PM +0100, Struan Donald wrote:
 * at 18/06 17:21 +0100 Roger Burton West said:
  On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 04:36:00PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote:
  The main reason I prefer H::T to T::T is that H::T templates can be
  given to Dreamweaver monkeys to edit without my having to worry that
  they'll screw them up.
 That is an important consideration although in my experience a
 taleneted dreamweaver mokey can screw up pretty much anything that
 isn't created by dreamweaver in the first place.

Re: Templating Solutions

2001-06-19 Thread Leo Lapworth


Have a look at this, TT2 based solution, it's a bit
bloated (as it includes page numbering and various other
the key line is: 
my $results = Emap::HolidayFinder::Tod::do_search(\%form_input,$dbh); 

This is then merged with the template by parsing it
in as a reference in %vals.

The template used (depending on number of results) would
either be:

Hope these examples make it clearer how design logic can
be seperated. Especially note that the code does not have
to worry about how to get a drop down list value selected
or whether an error message is to be shown (just if it
should be set).


On Tue, Jun 19, 2001 at 07:45:26AM +0200, Philip Newton wrote:
 Matthew Byng-Maddick wrote:
  It is possible to write embedded perl templates well, but a
  lot more difficult than if they are separated out.
 How does non-embedded Perl look like, then?

Re: Technical Meeting - 21st June

2001-06-19 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 07:15:32PM +0100, Dave Cross wrote:
 Oh... er... it's only three days to the technical meeting and so far I don't
 seem to have any talks for it.

Thursday.. what, this thursday where does the time go.

Assuming I can make it (have to check something), I'll give a little
update on the new web site.

If you are really desperate I can talk through my
XML - DB schema and docs thingy, but it's not ready
for release so only if people are interested.

- Both short talks.


Re: Templating Solutions

2001-06-19 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Tue, Jun 19, 2001 at 10:11:47AM +0100, Robert Price wrote:
 At 08:36 AM 6/19/01 +0100, Leo wrote:,
 the key line is: 
 my $results = Emap::HolidayFinder::Tod::do_search(\%form_input,$dbh); 
 Hope that's not copyrighted Emap code you have there :-)

Was part of what I got permission to 'open source' :)

- It's not as if they're going to want to use it any more :)


Re: Government Websites

2001-06-18 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 09:59:52AM +0100, Cross David - dcross wrote:
 Tired of government websites that only cater for browsers with non-standard
 proprietary extensions (cf Don't jsut sit there
 complaining - do something positive about it!,1755,100124337,00.html

An understanding of HTML and applications such as Dreamweaver, Photoshop, 
Fireworks, Flash, Perl, JavaScript, ASP and XML is essential, as is the 
ability to see the web through users' eyes

How many errors in one paragraph!

1) Interesting, Perl is now an application as are all the others.

2) Oh, yea, make your designers code and your coders design, 
   that'll make for a good site - honest.

3) see the web through users' eyes - easy, they can't all 
   see it - does that mean you don't have to do anything ?



Re: Templating Solutions

2001-06-18 Thread Leo Lapworth


I did this (just for TT2 and HTML::Template) for torrington,
results (REALLY badly formatted *blushes to admit it was done
in word and saved to HTML*) can be seen at:

No (c) on it.. so feel free to hack and copy as you will.

Hope it's of some use, obviously it's aimed at a specific
audience, e.g. the Agency and trying to get them to move
from HTML::Template to TT2 (personally I think that's why
they went under - not using TT, but it's just my consipricy theory) 


I'd also like to mention HTML::Mason - Euuu, No, no and thrice no!
(ok, has some nice 'bits' but NO - thou shalt not put thy
HTML and thy Perl in the same file).


On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 04:36:00PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote:
 In a moment of stupidity[1] I agreed to write an article for lathos on
 templating solutions for Perl. 

Re: Templating Solutions

2001-06-18 Thread Leo Lapworth



What's this, 

Home grown (and not smokable), 

I left Emap too early if your not a TT2 convert yet.

We can 'do lunch' later this week and I'll bash you
with some TT2 docs or something :)


On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 04:57:17PM +0100, Robert Price wrote:
 It may be a good idea to compare
 the templating systems available on CPAN to a home grown one. What
 advantages they give and what are the disadvantages etc

YAPC::Europe: flights, hotels and minigolf.

2001-06-17 Thread Leo Lapworth

Well, I'm now 'official' all the way, flights and hotel.

Easyjey seem to have worked it out and have put up the flight
costs by a couple of quid (£71 inc card charg of 3 quid)!

Oh, Grep, I'm up for that AD  D one evening, though haven't
played for years.


On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 02:41:23PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote:
 I also believe others are flying on this flight, so it looks like we have
 the official flight for ;-) and thanks to Jouke we can claim
 to have an official hotel - with minibars and minigolf

Re: *Buffy's Not Included

2001-06-14 Thread Leo Lapworth

XML - do it because you need it, not because of the Buzz.

XML is cool for handeling complex (or varied) data and sharing
this info with others (but if CSV will do, then use that!).

I'd suggest it VERY much depends on why you want to use it,
what is the ASCII data ?

If it was worth putting the data into XML and you were
worried about the speed of searching, you could always write a 
script (with one of the _many_ XML:: modules) to slurp keywords 
or whatever in from the XML so that you can search it in a DB and have
that point to a file rather than trawling all the XML files
for every search.

XML in a Nutshell is a very good book. 


- Who's only actually used XML for 2 projects and is proud of that fact.

On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 09:25:25AM +0100, Robert Thompson wrote:
 I was wondering what the pro's and con's are of using XML to structure ASCII
 based data files.
 What are peoples experience of using XML - particularly where you may have
 to trawl through lots of files to get at the data you want? - FAQ for web site (was books or something).

2001-06-14 Thread Leo Lapworth

Well, as has been muttered about I am redoing the website.

And yes it DOES need a faq, I have the start of one, but would very much 
love someone else to finish it off.

So, If anyone is up for it give me a yell and I'll email you the XML 
that needs populating.

The website development is a dictatorship (e.g. we want it done this year 
so I'm not taking any comments or suggestions until after it's gone live), 
so no starting of huge discussions about what should go in a FAQ, if your 
interested and have an opinion, contact me and you can do it! :)

Infact now I think about it, 2 faq's would be good.

1) - the FAQs
2) General - like where to buy books online / hardware etc

So maybe there are two people out there who want to write these.


On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 02:42:30PM +0100, Lucy McWilliam wrote:

  I think we need a FAQ, I'm sure this has come up a few times. 
 You volunteering? ;-)

The meaning of life...

2001-06-10 Thread Leo Lapworth

I thought you lot might appreciate this...


A philosophy professor stood before his class and had some items in front of
 him. When the class began, wordlessly he picked up a large empty
mayonnaise  jar and proceeded to fill it with rocks, rocks about 2 in
diameter. He then asked the students if the jar was full? They agreed that
it was.

So the professor then picked up a box of pebbles and poured them into the
jar. He shook the jar lightly. The pebbles, of course, rolled into the  open
areas between the rocks. He then asked the students again
if the jar was full. They agreed it was. The students laughed. The
professor picked up a box of sand and  poured it into the jar. Of course,
the sand filled up everything else.

Now, said the professor, I want you to recognise that this is your  life.
  The rocks are the important things - your family, your partner, your
health,  your children - things that if everything else was lost and  only
they remained, your life would still be full.  The pebbles are the other
things that matter like your job, your house,  your  car. The sand is
everything else. The small stuff. If you put the sand  into the jar first,
there is no room for the pebbles or  the rocks. The same goes for your life.
If you spend all your time and  energy on the small stuff, you will never
have room for the things that  really matter.  Pay attention to the things
that are critical to your happiness. Play with  your children. Take time to
get medical checkups. Take your partner out  dancing. There will always be
time to go to work, clean the house, give a  dinner party and fix the
disposal. Take care of the rocks first ? the  things that really matter.
Set your priorities. The rest is just sand.

But then...

A student then took the jar which the other students and the professor
agreed was full, and proceeded to pour in a glass of beer. Of course the
beer filled the remaining spaces within the jar making the jar truly full.

The moral of this tale is: that no matter how full your life is, there is
always room for BEER


2001-06-02 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Sat, Jun 02, 2001 at 08:19:56AM +0100, Dave Cross wrote:
 On Sat, Jun 02, 2001 at 07:47:00AM +0100, Greg McCarroll 
  Well what about last night? Buffy no more? Well I'm pretty sure she
  will be back, my reasoning - they played the normal end of show credits/
  theme tune, if they had of killed the character off, there would of been
  a special ending. Mind you, when I explained this theory to the wife she
  used the phrase ``clutching at straws''
 Well, how about the argument that SMG has singed up for two more series?
I've been told (*prays this is not true*) that SMG signed up for two
more series but has a clause that if Univeral Pictures produce it she
is not oblidged to do them (as apparently she didn't want to work for

So, this could be an ending to make sure she and Univeral have
time to work it out...

i just hope I have been mis-informed.

Dave, U still need last weeks video ?


JOB: There's one going here!!!

2001-05-15 Thread Leo Lapworth

I thought there might be some people out there
interested in this.

Please contact Ed directly, but feel free to ask me 
questions (off list or on IRC) if you want, I've been here 3 weeks.




Cloudband was set up in 1998 to provide online services to a niche within
the international art and antiques business - carpets, texiles, Asian and
tribal art. The company has 20 employees in its premises in Fitzroy Square,
London W1. Staff include a number of  prominent figures from the specialist
marketplace as well as a software team of 5. All software development is
done in-house, using tools including mod_perl, mason and postgres in a linux

Job Description: Web Developer

Software Development Duties

Involvement in projects such as:

- Advanced search facility
- Enhancements to Arcade product such as Featured Items
- Directory Product
- Banner ad management system
- Personalisation / agent systems for pushing content
- Ecommerce transaction processing
- Management Information Systems (Accounts, Marketing etc)
- Online Auction software

Core Tools

- Perl
- javascript
- modPerl / Apache internals
- Unix
- mason
- Postgres


Possibilities exist for training and / or skills development in:
- programming languages
- design methodologies
- team leadership

If you would like to know more, please write, with your CV, to

Thank you.

Re: Dim Sum?

2001-05-09 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Wed, May 09, 2001 at 02:30:13PM +0100, Dave Hodgkinson wrote:
 Leon Brocard [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
  Dave Hodgkinson sent the following bits through the ether:
   Anyone up for Dim Sim at 1 O'clock?
  Yes. New World, Gerrard Street. I may be very on time.
 ARGH! Sorry, I got PHB-ed.

Well, lucky I turned up then wasn't it.. or it'd have been
poor Leon on his own in a strange town.

You also missed the best Dim Sim ever, they liked us
so much we got free saki and a 50% of the meal.

And the women they provided (hmm, think I'm going too far ?)

Anyway, PHB-ed (what ever it is) is no excuse!

action=use red pen Could do better, E - /action



2001-04-29 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Sat, Apr 28, 2001 at 09:09:21PM -0700, Paul Makepeace wrote:
 Anyone here have this working on OS X client? The OS X Server one didn't
 complaining about some pthreads error:
 # ./scripts/mysql_install_db 
 dyld: ./bin/my_print_defaults can't open library:
 /usr/lib/libpthread.A.dylib  (No such file or directory, errno = 2)

check out
- search for mysql - someone has done an unofficial package which worked
for me (client not server). There is a server version on there, which
will _not_ work with the client.

 How many people here use OS X? Develop for it? (Even vaguely). Recommend
 any small-ish clued in lists to join? The omnigroup ones are too huge.
 If anyone's interested, I'll host the list if nothing's out there.
 (I just bought a cool(ish) domain for it too, :-)

Heh, I'd be interested in lurking :)


Re: JOB: Anyone still looking?

2001-04-19 Thread Leo Lapworth

I'm glad to say I am now employed *cheer*.

Was a rather nice birthday present to get today.

Anyway, probably see you folks tonight.


Job: I'm looking for one..

2001-03-26 Thread Leo Lapworth

Just to let you all know I'm on the market again.

Looking for Senior Developer, permanent position in London.

CV at:

Please feel free to forward to anyone looking.



Re: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender

2001-03-23 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Thu, Mar 22, 2001 at 10:26:35PM +, Jonathan Stowe wrote:
 Oi! stop testing your filters on the list 

Well, if (server) was set up correctly.. e.g. had Mail::Audit
installed then it wouldn't have been a problem! (it does now btw - thanks Jo)

Seriously, sorry, I wasn't testing (just copied the code from another
server), but made the mistake of assuming that it was installed.

I know, assumptions are the root of all evil, or was the Mr Gates ?

Sticky plasters and bandade have now been applied, 
system ready for crash landing, umm I mean take off..


Re: Matt's Scripts - Rand image..

2001-03-16 Thread Leo Lapworth

Hi Guys,

I've created a random image generator (not Matt complient)
that I needed for a friend. Please feel fee to put it
in the collection.

This is not the same as those which daveh is writting,
main difference is it doesn't have configuration files
or code!

Thanks to the folks on IRC for some tidying ideas.



Re: Matt's Scripts (SCP)

2001-03-14 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Wed, Mar 14, 2001 at 02:57:41PM +, Roger Burton West wrote:
 On or about Wed, Mar 14, 2001 at 02:34:32PM +, Jon Eyre typed:
 is there an idiot-proof graphical front-end for scp? windows 

SCP for Windoz = 
SCP for Linux = well, command line scp or what ever else there is. 
SCP for OSX = download Rbrowser 
SCP for Mac = download NiftyTelnet (the open option 
has an SCP radio button) 

The Mac one is NASTY! - the OSX and Windoz ones are just like
standard FTP clients (your computer on the left, remove server one the right).

If anyone hears of a good gui SCP client for non-OSX mac's I'd
really like to know (I've got users on my machine that need it!).



Re: Strange Request

2001-03-13 Thread Leo Lapworth

Ok, this is obviously a good idea, some comment / ideas:

1) Create nms server (Not Matt Scripts).
- setup mailing list(s).
- I'm happy to host in a couple of weeks

2) Review and work out a 'core' module which
   can be part of the distrobution and impliment equiv stuff for ALL modules.
- referer checker
- CGI parser
- Security stuff ?
- Other.. ?
   - Maybe there should be a user 'sys_conf' file
 where all the user configurations go, making
 it easier than Matt's having to edit each file.

3) Create a 'standard' - methods, documentation etc.

4) Put someone in charge of each script:
responsible for:
- Review of current code
- Creating a doc with all features
- current (rand_image
- which could be added. (rand_image support image size!s)
- Sending this to the mailing list
- Following up all comments.
- Re-coding (either with others or not).

- Test procedure for platforms / configurations.

5) Workout how we will catagroies these pieces of code,
keywords, requirements, tests done etc..

5) Create web site with:
- Easy to use 'standard' aka Matt esk section
- Other modules which need more installs (e.g. TT based)
- Complex modules (require configuration / mod_perl)

6) Repeat for other non-Matt code, e.g. forums / BBS's

Does anyone know if CPAN's pause system available,
could we impliment it for this project ? - or would
a new system be better ?

Anyway, as I said I'll give it a go setting something
up in a couple of weeks if someone hasn't got there first.



Re: Am I going nutts ? - read before answering!

2001-03-08 Thread Leo Lapworth

On Thu, Mar 08, 2001 at 02:59:27PM +, Robert Price wrote:
 I think the answer is that both the modules where the BEGINS are called
 twice have "use" in them. "use" means "BEGIN {require Module}", so BEGIN is
 being called once when the module is entered, and once when it is used. 
- SNIP -

Fraid not.. tried moving the use out of the BEGIN before and it
made no difference:

package LTest;

use Test2;

warn "Test is beginning\n";

print "Here\n";




Re: Am I going nutts ? - read before answering!

2001-03-08 Thread Leo Lapworth

Oh, actually do you mean it is the same at:

pageage LTest;

BEGIN {require Test2}
BEGIN { warn "." }

print "Here\n"


Ok, that kind'a make sence..


Leo - who is slowly getting there.

On Thu, Mar 08, 2001 at 02:52:48PM +, Leo Lapworth wrote:
 On Thu, Mar 08, 2001 at 02:59:27PM +, Robert Price wrote:
  I think the answer is that both the modules where the BEGINS are called
  twice have "use" in them. "use" means "BEGIN {require Module}", so BEGIN is
  being called once when the module is entered, and once when it is used. 
 - SNIP -
 Fraid not.. tried moving the use out of the BEGIN before and it
 made no difference:
 package LTest;
 use Test2;
 warn "Test is beginning\n";
 print "Here\n";

Re: Buffy/Angel

2001-03-02 Thread Leo Lapworth

I'm assuming your talking Sky 1.

I'll _probably_ be recording it, but don't rely on me.

If I do get home in time - sure you can borrow it.


On Fri, Mar 02, 2001 at 09:05:39AM -0500, Dave Cross wrote:
 Bit of an off-topic begging letter this...
 I'm going out tonight and I forgot to set the video for Buffy  Angel
 before leaving the house this evening. Is there any kind person out 
 there who is videoing it and can let me borrow the tape at some point 
 next week?

RE:Consultancy company was [Job] BOFH wanted was: Re: Red Hat worm discovered

2001-01-18 Thread Leo Lapworth

People (no particular order):

 = Pimp   =   =  Accountant  =

 ==   =
 = BOFH   =   = Security Guru =
 ==   =

 ===  ===
 = Perl Gurus' =  = Perl Trainee Gurus  =
 ===  ===

 Out source to other similar companies for:
- design
- mass HTMLing

Base salary and split proffit according to which category your in.

Open source / clients:
Create projects for open source community (sell to clients
with support). When not assigned to a specific money 
making project or client create next project to OS and 
make money from.

Create client base with support contracts.

Long term@ pimp out to only the best companies.

A big pub in central London.
Top floors: development
Ground floor Pub: with comedy stand and terminal points for laptops
Basement: disco / conference room, big flat screens etc..

I've got a contact who says he can get hold of a million or 
so VC if this was an actually business plan, but then you 
have to pay them back with interest and stuff.

Ok, it's all a pipedream.. but what a nice one.


I'm looking for a job!

2001-01-02 Thread Leo Lapworth

Hi Folks...

As you may have heard there have been some alterations
here at Emap so I thought I'd test the market and
see what else is out there.

If you know of any decent jobs please could you
give me a yell ([EMAIL PROTECTED]), and if anyone is
interested my CV, with phone number, can be found at: