Re: Templating Solutions

2001-06-18 Thread Richard Clamp

On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 07:54:36PM +0100, David Cantrell wrote:
 It is NOT POSSIBLE to completely divorce presentation/application.

You're missing a word from the end of the sentence, and that's Ilogic.
If you add it you're obviously wrong though...

 So you end up with all sorts of languages made up to be mixed in with
 the presentation - like PHP and the mini-language of TT.  Why are
 those OK (I'm thinking specifically of TT - we all know PHP sucks for
 other reasons) but plain ol' perl isn't?

TT's toy language is a presentation language, not a programming one.
It's different enough so that you can't easily put too much
programming logic into it, IME at least.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]
so we've got a deadline.
 we can do deadlines.



Re: early peek at a bit of fun

2001-06-15 Thread Richard Clamp

On Fri, Jun 15, 2001 at 10:02:04PM +0100, Dave Cross wrote:
 And, of course, not all modules on CPAN are in the module list 
 (see, for example, Symbol::Approx::Sub).

Yeah but if you did just parse 02packages blindly then Leon would have
a bigger headstart with all of the Graphviz::GraphMyAunt modules.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]
so we've got a deadline.
 we can do deadlines.



Re: Training anyone ?

2001-06-13 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 01:15:17PM +0100, Simon Wilcox wrote:
 Just saw this linked from a hugely obvious banner ad on the Register :
 
 http://training.gbdirect.co.uk/courses/perl/for_the_register.html
 
 Great idea to tie it in to a success story I thought.

Grumble grumble.

At least they only claim to be the maintenance team.  Almost like
boasting about being the team sent in to fetch the team sent in to
rescue the hostages.

If on the other hand you want the dev team, I'm sure Barbie and I
could figure something to tell you for the right amount of beer.

I'm half tempted to see what they'd teach me though... :)

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Training anyone ?

2001-06-13 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, Jun 13, 2001 at 03:43:27PM +0100, Dave Thorn wrote:
  I'm half tempted to see what they'd teach me though... :)
 
  personal hygiene? ;)

So that's why you never come home anymore...

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: YAPC::Europe Registration

2001-06-12 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 07:41:48PM +0100, Neil Ford wrote:
 So who's registered then? ;-)

I have, now to write[0] the talks.

[0] always with the writing!

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Persistent Perl

2001-06-12 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Jun 12, 2001 at 09:54:01PM +0100, Robin Szemeti wrote:
 is this anything like wot FastCGI does .. or is that summat different?

Since 'this' is a bit muddy I couldn't say, though I do know that 
FastCGI works as a constantly running coprocess, so maybe

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: London.pm posting stats

2001-06-09 Thread Richard Clamp

On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 09:57:52PM +0100, Simon Cozens wrote:
 On Sat, Jun 09, 2001 at 09:10:53PM +0100, Dave Hodgkinson wrote:
  And how about a signal/noise bias? ;-)
 
 The noise *is* signal.

I'll have what he's drinking.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Decompression

2001-05-31 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, May 31, 2001 at 06:28:44PM +0100, Dean wrote:
 Question for the unix people on the list. I have an archive that's gzipped
 up and contains either a number of small files or a single large file.

Umm, *strokes beard* by archive you mean tar file, right?  If so then
Archive::Tar looks likely, and it even automagically deals with .gz
files via Compress::Zlib (or so it says in the readme)

 What's the easiest way to extract any given file? It has to use core modules
 and anyone with a sample script can earn a pint ;)

No non-core modules though?  Can't you just create a local lib path
with Archive::Tar in it and say you didn't cheat?

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Forthcoming Meetings

2001-05-31 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, May 29, 2001 at 02:09:56PM +0100, Cross David - dcross wrote:
 Technical Meeting: Thursday 21st June
 
 Need a venue for this please people. And speakers. If any speakers want to
 practise TPC or YAPC::E talks, then this might be a good time to do it.

Sure, I'd like to do Itcpbug as a teaching tool as a 5-minute thingy.

Also assuming Mark doesn't bonk me over the head we'll do IWax::On
Wax::Off - A Discussion of Cognitive Transfer Techniques As Taken From
Mr Miyagi's Dojo, which is 25 minutes, with projector, audio and a
brandy glass full of brown MMs.

Now to write the thing, rather than just playing with magicpoint.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: crazy golf

2001-05-31 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, May 31, 2001 at 07:40:46PM +0100, Jonathan Stowe wrote:
 I'm still up for organizing it - its just herding you cats up in one place
 is the problem.

If you book it, they will come.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Election Manifestos

2001-05-24 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, May 24, 2001 at 09:13:12AM +0100, Robert Shiels wrote:
 Typical quotes from Simon this week:

Ah, he'd be fine if it weren't for those fucking mood swings.


-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Another Perl Question

2001-05-24 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, May 24, 2001 at 04:13:35PM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Any suggestions?

use Scalar::Util qw( blessed );

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: London.pm List Weekly Summary 2001-05-07

2001-05-10 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, May 09, 2001 at 05:30:59PM +0100, Leon Brocard wrote:
 Paul Mison wrote a quick thanks / report of the London.pm - New York
 trip, with links to photos:

And seconds too late I put my photos online:
http://www.unixbeard.net/~richardc/Photos/

It's all the photos that have ever passed through my camera, so don't
go saying rude things about my nan.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Apocalypse Two

2001-05-04 Thread Richard Clamp

On Fri, May 04, 2001 at 10:25:07AM +0100, Struan Donald wrote:
 i kind of like - from a visual point of view.

Your eyes will be adapted to server perl6.
/borg

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Not Matt's Scripts

2001-05-02 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 01:45:19AM -0700, Paul Makepeace wrote:
 Hey! You think this 5K script is enough? Wrong, you've gotta configure
 CPAN, get these suite of modules that is a prerequisite for these suites
 of modules which include something like Data::Dumper which makes you
 pull down the latest f**king perl distribution which doesn't f**cking
 compile on your machine!

step 1: configure CPAN
step 2: upgrade CPAN
step 3: configure the new CPAN
step 4: use CPAN

yes it sucks mildly, it's still a helluva lot more convinient than
doing it by hand, imo

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Tech mtg?

2001-04-18 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, Apr 18, 2001 at 02:24:34PM +0100, Robin Houston wrote:
 Do we yet know if there's going to be a data projector for
 the tech meeting?

Yes, the Fords kindly dontated the use of theirs again, which I picked
up from them on Friday.

Now all that remains is me remebering to bring it tomorrow.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Technical Meeting - 19th April

2001-04-10 Thread Richard Clamp

On Mon, Apr 09, 2001 at 10:31:11PM +0100, Dave Cross wrote:
 At 22:10 09/04/2001, Neil Ford wrote:
 On Mon, Apr 09, 2001 at 04:09:14PM +0100, dcross - David Cross wrote:
  
   If anyone doesn't know (or has forgotten), there will be a technical 
  meeting
   on Thursday 19th April. It will be at State 51[1] and we'll start at about
   7pm. Details on how to get to State 51 will appear on the web site... er...
   soon.
  
 Ummm forewarned is forearmed Nat and I might not be able to make this
 which means getting hold of the projector might be a problem :-(
 
 If someone wants to pop down to West Sussex to collect it they are more than
 welcome, unfortunately I'm not travelling into London as much as I was.
 
 Neil,
 
 Thanks for warning me.
 
 Does anyone want to take on the task of being projector monitor and picking 
 it up from Sussex?

Sure, I'll polish up the terrorist-mobile[1].

Someone mail me off-list with some instructions.

[1] Which contrary to what Micheal J Fox thinks, will do 90, eventually.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Crazy Idea

2001-04-03 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Apr 03, 2001 at 03:29:04PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote:
 
 
 How would people in London.pm like a one night camp out, subject
 to the FM issue going away. The plan would be - we bundle into
 vehicles on a given afternoon (probably saturday), go to a farm
 shop and get lots of cider, and then spend the night around a
 camp fire, drinking and talking.

Cool, it may even spur me into getting the van a little more habitable
than it currently is.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Crazy Idea

2001-04-03 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Apr 03, 2001 at 04:48:15PM +0100, Simon Wistow wrote:
 
 Volunteers for a rescue party step forward.

Do we get guns, lots of guns?

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Kevin Smith Film Fest

2001-03-07 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, Mar 07, 2001 at 11:27:38AM +, Jon Eyre wrote:
 Miramax made Jason Mewes audition to play *himself*...

Which he did so well. 

Miramax did a very good thing though, they dumped the original start
sequence.

 Chasing Amy 
  But she has such an annoying voice.
 
 Rings a bell... raspy, throaty, Captain-Janeway-type voice?

Only higher, so when they argue at the hockey ground it makes me think
of breaking glass.

 Dogma was good, but a little tame after the Jay  Silent Bob comics - pity 
 they couldn't persuade Neil Patrick Harris to appear...

Yeah, but I imagine he's too busy with his directing career.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Kevin Smith Film Fest - Jason Lee

2001-03-07 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, Mar 07, 2001 at 01:12:22PM -, Hamlet D'Arcy wrote:
 professional skateboarding and videography. It was directed by Spike Jones 
 (the same who directed Being John Malkovitch).

nitpick ref="http://us.imdb.com/Name?Jonze,+Spike"/ more
(in)correctly spelt Spike Jonze, though imdb does seem to also call
him Spike Jones, for which I blame the contributors.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Kevin Smith Film Fest

2001-03-06 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Mar 06, 2001 at 07:17:06PM +, Jon Eyre wrote:
 On Tue, 6 Mar 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote:
   Mallrats, 
  
  His best film
 
 No! Smith pimpz his talents out to the Mouse, 
 and the end result: A John Hughes movie with 
 buttfscking jokes...

Which is exactly what makes it his best film.  

If it makes you feel any better he claims he had to make it so that he
could keep those influences out of:

   Chasing Amy 
  
  His ``worst'' film
 
 This is *real cinema* - mind you it has extra resonance fr me, because I
 used to date a lesbian (or at least that was the excuse she gave me...)

But she has such an annoying voice.  The first time I saw it I didn't
notice and got wrapped up in the story.  The second time I just about
made it through, and though I can watch it again, but it's never my
first choice.

 Anyone else drink too much and wake up on a train in the middle of 
 Hampshire thursday night? Or was it just me..?

I didn't, but I did have this terrible habit of getting mildly tipsy
with london.pm, and then waking up the next morning in Birmingham.  I
managed to reduce the ugliness by moving.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: t-shirts

2001-02-22 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 10:43:10AM +, Michael Stevens wrote:
 On Wed, Feb 21, 2001 at 09:53:24PM +, Jonathan Stowe wrote:
  On Wed, 21 Feb 2001, Michael Stevens wrote:
   Pony::Pony
  Only if it has the open sourced code of the module on the back :)
 
 I think Mr Clamp has been doing initial development on this, but
 has not yet released his code.

Okay, it's pre pre alpha, it does nothing, and it's not even an
very good way of doing the nothing it does.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]


#!/usr/bin/perl -w
use Pony;
print "Wanna = ", Pony::-new-wanna(), "\n";


 Pony.pm


Re: t-shirts

2001-02-22 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 12:27:07PM +, Michael Stevens wrote:
 On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 12:24:46PM +, Richard Clamp wrote:
  Okay, it's pre pre alpha, it does nothing, and it's not even an
  very good way of doing the nothing it does.

I haven't even recieved this mail yet - hmmm.

 Perhaps a sourceforge project to allow open collaboration? :)

Or the london.pm server, on which we could do straight cvs, or even
install the lumbering beast that is sourceforge.

I nominate dadadodo as the pumpking for this.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Car giveaway

2001-02-22 Thread Richard Clamp

This is very off-topic, but it's too late now :)

I have a B registered Sierra to get shot of[1], no tax, no mot, runs
(though right now the battery is very flat)

Any takers?  Email me off-list.

[1] As I now have an old old camper van :)

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Car giveaway

2001-02-22 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 01:33:45PM +, Dave Thorn wrote:
 have you *seen* the car?! :)

Shush, I'm trying to get rid of it :)

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: No http://london.pm/ :-(

2001-02-22 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 05:07:31PM +0100, Philip Newton wrote:
 So, no http://london.pm/ right now :-(
 
 But maybe in the future![1]

Deja-Vu.  We (being other people on the list, and not actually me)
tried this about 2 years ago, with almost exactly the same results.
Back then they were going to do it 'in the future' or 'never' too.

Don't start holding your breath just yet.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: the list

2001-01-31 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, Jan 31, 2001 at 11:50:45AM +, Michael Stevens wrote:
 It's oh so quiet.
 
 After recent activity this is somewhat disconcerting.

I don't know, before it was fast as lightning.

Which was a little bit frightening.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: .emacs

2001-01-30 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Jan 30, 2001 at 09:55:58AM +, Dominic Mitchell wrote:
 On Mon, Jan 29, 2001 at 08:13:11PM +, Mark Fowler wrote:
  Robin said:
   On Mon, Jan 29, 2001 at 07:53:00PM +, Mark Fowler wrote:
 2) Got any nice bits of your .emacs file to share?
   
   Hmm, well this:
   
   (add-hook 'ange-ftp-process-startup-hook
 '(lambda ()
(ange-ftp-raw-send-cmd proc "passive on")))
   
   enables ange-ftp mode to work from inside our firewall.
   Not very exciting unless you have the same problem...
 
 I can't get this to work.  At least not with efs under xemacs.  It just
 hangs after issuing the command.  Unfortunately, my elisp debugging
 skills aren't up to sorting it out.  :-(

That cause efs != angeftp.  M-x apropos efs-.*-process would be my best
guess for where to start tweaking.

Either that or look for something like ftp-command, and change the value of
that from ftp to pftp[0]

[0] YMMV is you're not using the same ftp doohicky as my box does.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Damian's Latest

2001-01-30 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Jan 30, 2001 at 05:23:41AM -0500, Dave Cross wrote:
 It's the usual Damian brain-stretching stuff - and this time he 
 manages to find a good use for the $; variable which is _so_
 deprecated that I can't even find it mentioned in the latest Camel.

From p674 
quote
Although we haven't deprecated this feature, you should instead consider
using "real" multidimension hashes now, such as $foo{$a}{$b}{$c} instead of
$foo{$a,$b,$c}.  The fake ones may be easier to sort, however, and are much
more amenable to use as DBM files.
/quote

Richard - who also found a good use for it (Algorithm::MarkovChain)

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Technical Meeting Venues

2001-01-29 Thread Richard Clamp

On Mon, Jan 29, 2001 at 02:28:07PM +, David Cantrell wrote:
 On Mon, Jan 29, 2001 at 02:27:41PM -, Matthew Jones wrote:
 
  So how do That.pm feel about some northern tyke scuttling down to join you
  for the odd beer and tech meeting on a sort of semi-regular basis?
 
 You will, of course, be assimilated and ultimately move to That London.
 Just like that northern tyke Mr. Clamp did.

Northern, why I oughta!

I'm from Birmingham damnit[0], which though north of the M25, is nowhere near
as grim as proper up north.

[0] It's full name being 'Birmingham - damnit, now how do I get through this
sodding one way system'

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Another Template Toolkit Q

2001-01-29 Thread Richard Clamp

On Mon, Jan 29, 2001 at 03:17:10PM -, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 So TT nicely allows a filename, a filehandle or blank for STDOUT.
 
 So how to I capture the output to "some variable" so I could, say,
 manipulate that output
 without having to read the file I've outputted?
 
 Is that possible?

istr if you give it a scalar reference, as the 3rd parameter, then it puts
it in there.

Hang on, isn't there an actual Template Toolkit mailing list.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: .emacs

2001-01-29 Thread Richard Clamp

On Mon, Jan 29, 2001 at 08:26:32PM +, Robin Houston wrote:
 On Mon, Jan 29, 2001 at 08:13:11PM +, Mark Fowler wrote:
  
  Hmm. Can you do something to save directly via scp?
 
 http://ls6-www.informatik.uni-dortmund.de/~grossjoh/emacs/tramp.html

See, that's what you get for posting before/while your modem connection
messes you about as you download mail.

D'oh

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Mailing List Archive

2001-01-26 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, Jan 25, 2001 at 08:20:28PM +, Dave Cross wrote:
 It seems that mail-archive.com have been archiving our list for some
 time and anyone who knows about mail-archive can find anything posted
 to our list.

I've got no real problem with having my contributions publically archived,
the list being open to all anyway.

That said I would have liked to have been informed of it when subscribing to
the list (or for those of us that have been here for donkeys, when it
started getting archived,) just so that I could be sure it was happening.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Mailing List Archive

2001-01-26 Thread Richard Clamp

On Fri, Jan 26, 2001 at 11:50:35AM +, Greg McCarroll wrote:
 * Richard Clamp ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
  That said I would have liked to have been informed of it when subscribing to
  the list (or for those of us that have been here for donkeys, when it
  started getting archived,) just so that I could be sure it was happening.

 how about if we notified the list everytime someone subscribed or 
 unsubscribed

Eh, don't quite follow.

Personally I like to be able to get mbox archives in preference to web
archives, but then I like my mail client much more than my web broswer.

Richard - hoarder, with no use of a web archive anyhow :)

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Mailing List Archive

2001-01-26 Thread Richard Clamp

On Fri, Jan 26, 2001 at 12:27:02PM +, David Cantrell wrote:
 On Fri, Jan 26, 2001 at 12:00:24PM +, Richard Clamp wrote:
 
  Personally I like to be able to get mbox archives in preference to web
  archives, but then I like my mail client much more than my web broswer.
 
 Same here.  I'm starting to archive all the lists I serve.  With archives
 on webpages, protected by passwords.  The archives are stored in mbox
 format with no pretty printing whatsoever.

Woohoo :)

  Richard - hoarder, with no use of a web archive anyhow :)
 
 Got a complete archive of this list?  I don't but would like.

Not complete, but I think I subscribed pretty early.  The earliest post I
have is: fx sound="rummage"/ 

 From: "Cross, David" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: "'London.pm List'" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1998 10:14:38 +0100
 Subject: [london_pm] FW: [london_pm] Arranging a date for the meet.

And I think I have all to this point in time.

Maybe I should bounce them all to the mailing-lists.com archiver?

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: odd -w effect

2001-01-24 Thread Richard Clamp

On Wed, Jan 24, 2001 at 12:08:50PM +, Michael Stevens wrote:
 
 Emacs is available for windows. Now if I can just persuade it to save
 with unix line ending conventions...

Having recently done this, the thing you want is
set-buffer-file-coding-system, the default keybinding being 'C-x RET f'.  I
can highly recommend undecided-unix.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Holy War

2001-01-19 Thread Richard Clamp

On Fri, Jan 19, 2001 at 03:44:42PM +, Roger Burton West wrote:
 I'd use Debian 'cos I like it. Downside: latest versions of stuff
 aren't usually available as packages.

Untrue, if you're following the testing/unstable branch and have sufficient
bandwidth that is.


-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: apologies

2001-01-18 Thread Richard Clamp

On Thu, Jan 18, 2001 at 11:41:29AM +, Neil Ford wrote:
 Well I have both The Matrix and MIB with me on DVD and a DVD capable 
 powerbook..
 
 Movie intermission anyone?

Cool, 20 minutes is plenty enough to watch all the good bits in The Matrix.
God bless chapter-seek.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Choke - The Register is working for the enemy

2001-01-06 Thread Richard Clamp

On Sat, Jan 06, 2001 at 01:05:47PM -, Simon Batistoni wrote:
 I quote:
 
 "A majority of Websites that incorporate user interaction and
 personalization rely on PHP"
  ^^

I'm getting a strong feeling of deja-vu, pointing back to the survey of used
modules.

Of course it's interesting to note that the reg site itself is a twisted
heap of mod_perl spewed forth from the fevered brains of Birmingham.pm.

Which is nice.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



copious free time

2001-01-05 Thread Richard Clamp

Well it's now official, and if I didn't tart around you last night then I'm
available for work due to the unfortunate explodingness of oven.

Reach me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you've got anything for a senior
programmer, with 2-3 years Perl, a bag of unix/sql hammers, and a (silly)
module in the CPAN.

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Re: Getting keys of mapped hash?

2001-01-02 Thread Richard Clamp

On Tue, Jan 02, 2001 at 03:21:15PM -, Jonathan Peterson wrote:
 
  my @sort=sort keys %{ +{ map { $_ = undef } @list } };
 ^^
 
 ??
 
 What does +{} do??? 

It says 'Yes damnit, I want an anonymous hash here, not one of those pesky
block thingies'

-- 
Richard Clamp [EMAIL PROTECTED]