Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-26 Thread pmh

On Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:51:08 +0100, Philip Newton wrote:
 I see your whois graffiti and raise you the domain where you can do a zone
 transfer, chop off the first bit, sort, MIME-decode and get a program. (Or
 something like that.)
 
 Unfortunately, I don't remember the domain. I think it was in France
 somewhere.

You mean this? Unfortunately, it doesn't work anymore, but when it did, you ended up 
with DeCSS code:

dig @138.195.138.195 goret.org. axfr | grep '^c..\..*A' | sort \
  | cut -b5-36 | perl -e 'while(){print pack("H32",$_)}' | gzip -d

-- 
Peter Haworth   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"Perl should only be studied as a second language.
 A good first language would be English."
-- Larry Wall



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-26 Thread Philip Newton

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:51:08 +0100, Philip Newton wrote:
  I see your whois graffiti and raise you the domain where 
  you can do a zone transfer, chop off the first bit, sort,
  MIME-decode and get a program. (Or something like that.)
 
 You mean this? Unfortunately, it doesn't work anymore, but 
 when it did, you ended up with DeCSS code:
 
 dig @138.195.138.195 goret.org. axfr | grep '^c..\..*A' | sort \
   | cut -b5-36 | perl -e 'while(){print pack("H32",$_)}' | gzip -d

That's probably what I had in mind, yes.

Cheers,
Philip
-- 
Philip Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED]
All opinions are my own, not my employer's.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-23 Thread pmh

On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:54:50 -0500 (EST), Dave Cross wrote:
 Unfortunately, as it's a very primitive webmail (written by me) it
 doesn't store the outgoing mails, so I can't see what I'm doing 
 wrong.

Why call it "ms-webmail"? Makes it sound like MicroSoft wrote it.

Also, you're just copying the References: header from the message you're
replying to, when you should be appending its Message-id: too. If you're not
going to do that, then at least stick an In-reply-to: header in, so threading
algorithms work properly. (Well, threading algorithms which aren't broken,
like mine, which manages to put the same message in the thread tree multiple
times under conditions known only to itself)

-- 
Peter Haworth   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"I washed a sock.  Then I put it in the dryer.
 When I took it out, it was gone."
-- Steven Wright



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-23 Thread Dominic Mitchell

On Fri, Feb 23, 2001 at 11:50:44AM +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Also, you're just copying the References: header from the message you're
 replying to, when you should be appending its Message-id: too. If you're not
 going to do that, then at least stick an In-reply-to: header in, so threading
 algorithms work properly. (Well, threading algorithms which aren't broken,
 like mine, which manages to put the same message in the thread tree multiple
 times under conditions known only to itself)

JWZ has a good discussion on threading algorithms:

http://www.jwz.org/doc/threading.html

-Dom



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-23 Thread Dave Cross

At Fri, 23 Feb 11:50:37 2001 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:54:50 -0500 (EST), Dave Cross wrote:
  Unfortunately, as it's a very primitive webmail (written by me) it
  doesn't store the outgoing mails, so I can't see what I'm doing 
  wrong.
 
 Why call it "ms-webmail"? Makes it sound like MicroSoft wrote it.

That's semi-intentional. My company is called Magnum Solutions so we
have as much right to use the initials as Microsoft. It amuses me that
my Perl doodlings might be mistaken for Microsoft software.

 Also, you're just copying the References: header from the message 
 you're replying to, when you should be appending its Message-id: too. 

Hmm... thought I was doing that. I'll check the code tonight.

 If you're not going to do that, then at least stick an In-reply-to: 
 header in, so threading algorithms work properly. (Well, threading 
 algorithms which aren't broken, like mine, which manages to put the 
 same message in the thread tree multiple times under conditions known 
 only to itself)

Or, I suppose, I could do both. OR would that break stuff?

Cheers,

Dave...



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-23 Thread pmh

On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 11:53:24 +, Dominic Mitchell wrote:
 JWZ has a good discussion on threading algorithms:
 
 http://www.jwz.org/doc/threading.html

Thanks very much. From a quick skim, that looks somewhat similar to the scheme I've 
come up with through trial and error. However, I currently allow empty containers at 
any point in the tree which isn't a leaf, and which doesn't only have one empty 
container child. I'll look through it in detail when I haven't just been getting 
annoyed with my own algorithm so much.

Actually, the biggest problem I have with threading is Gtk's behaviour. When you 
double click on a CTree branch, it toggles the expansion state, which is highly 
annoying. I can untoggle it in most cases, but that can result in strange scrolling, 
leading to weird selections being left behind. Also, if it's an empty container being 
double clicked, I want to display the first real message, but that prevents me from 
untoggling the branch, somehow.

I guess it would be a good idea to word-wrap message bodies, too...

-- 
Peter Haworth   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Vagueness is one of those things...



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-23 Thread pmh

On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 07:01:31 -0500 (EST), Dave Cross wrote:
 At Fri, 23 Feb 11:50:37 2001 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:54:50 -0500 (EST), Dave Cross wrote:
   Unfortunately, as it's a very primitive webmail (written by me) it
   doesn't store the outgoing mails, so I can't see what I'm doing 
   wrong.
  
  Why call it "ms-webmail"? Makes it sound like MicroSoft wrote it.
 
 That's semi-intentional. My company is called Magnum Solutions so we
 have as much right to use the initials as Microsoft. It amuses me that
 my Perl doodlings might be mistaken for Microsoft software.

I'd forgotten the name of your company. Makes sense now, and I appreciate the joke.

  If you're not going to do that, then at least stick an In-reply-to: 
  header in, so threading algorithms work properly. (Well, threading 
  algorithms which aren't broken, like mine, which manages to put the 
  same message in the thread tree multiple times under conditions known 
  only to itself)
 
 Or, I suppose, I could do both. OR would that break stuff?

Of course not, that's what you're supposed to do. I just stick In-reply-to: on the end 
of References: unless it was already there.

All I need is some decent (ie. existent) documentation, and I might be ready to 
release this thing.

-- 
Peter Haworth   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I did Modula-2 at university but I didn't inhale



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-23 Thread Merijn Broeren

Quoting Dave Cross ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
 
 That's semi-intentional. My company is called Magnum Solutions so we
 have as much right to use the initials as Microsoft. It amuses me that
 my Perl doodlings might be mistaken for Microsoft software.
 
On that note, in the javaworld it is the idea that you name your classes
starting with your domainname reversed. So com.shell.Business.RipofPrice.Petrol
etc. Microsoft has taken to naming their java stuff com.ms.* 

Guess who owns ms.com? 

That's right, and we are *not* inclined to sell it to them. They tried 
though. :-) 

Cheers,
-- 
Merijn Broeren | Sometime in the middle ages, God got fed up with us 
Software Geek  | and put earth at sol.milky-way.univ in his kill-file.
   | Pray all you want, it just gets junked.



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-23 Thread Merijn Broeren

Quoting Merijn Broeren ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
 
 Guess who owns ms.com? 
 
On checking who was first, I did a 

whois microsoft.com

What can I say but :

MICROSOFT.COM.WHOIS.RESULTS.MAKE.A.GREAT.HUMOUR-LIST.COM

DNS grafitti, who would have thought...
-- 
Merijn Broeren | Sometime in the middle ages, God got fed up with us 
Software Geek  | and put earth at sol.milky-way.univ in his kill-file.
   | Pray all you want, it just gets junked.



DMP Availability

2001-02-22 Thread dcross - David Cross

(this is dangerously close to spam, but I know there's a certain amount of
interest here :)

Just spoke to the local distributors about the availability of DMP in
Europe. Here are the bullet points:

* There are currently 100 copies in Europe.
* Another (larger) shipment from Manning ended up in Singapore somehow! They
will return at some point in the next week.
* The large Charing Cross Road bookshops (Foyles, Blackwells, Waterstones)
should all have 3 or 4 copies now.
* Amazon had (we think) 10 copies. Don't know how many they've sold.
* PC Bookshop were one of the unlucky stores whose supply went to Singapore.
Check again in two weeks.
* The person who told the PC Bookshop that it would be in stock in July was
quoting from a very old list (July 2000 was the original planned release
date).
* I will hopefully have copies of DMP and OOP to give away on Monday night.

Cheers,

Dave...
[still posting from Acxiom as the list is still eating mails I send from my
dave.org.uk webmail]

-- 



The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
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Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-22 Thread Michael Stevens

On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 10:34:06AM -, dcross - David Cross wrote:
 * There are currently 100 copies in Europe.
 * Another (larger) shipment from Manning ended up in Singapore somehow! They
 will return at some point in the next week.
 * The large Charing Cross Road bookshops (Foyles, Blackwells, Waterstones)
 should all have 3 or 4 copies now.
 * Amazon had (we think) 10 copies. Don't know how many they've sold.

There are two copies here. I *think* they both came from amazon.

Michael



RE: DMP Availability

2001-02-22 Thread dcross - David Cross


From: Michael Stevens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 22 February 2001 10:46

 On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 10:34:06AM -, dcross - David Cross wrote:
  * There are currently 100 copies in Europe.
  * Another (larger) shipment from Manning ended up in Singapore somehow!
They
  will return at some point in the next week.
  * The large Charing Cross Road bookshops (Foyles, Blackwells,
Waterstones)
  should all have 3 or 4 copies now.
  * Amazon had (we think) 10 copies. Don't know how many they've sold.
 
 There are two copies here. I *think* they both came from amazon.

I don't know what disturbs me more - my books being sold by Amazon or my
books
being bought by III :)

Dave...


The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.  
If you have received this communication in error, please 
re-send this communication to the sender and delete the 
original message or any copy of it from your computer
system.



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-22 Thread Robert Shiels


 I don't know what disturbs me more - my books being sold by Amazon or my
 books
 being bought by III :)

 Dave...

I want to buy a book "Code" by Charles Petzold.

streetsonline - not available
whsmith 12.45 + 2.74 = 15.19 delivery 1-2 weeks
bol.com 12.59 + 2.95 = 15.54 delivery 3-7 days
pcbooks 13.99 + 3.50 = 17.49 next day delivery
amazon 11.13 + 2.75 = 13.88 dispatched within 24 hours

And the Amazon website has a good review of the book, and several comments
by other people who have bought it, whereas the other sites have no details
at all. No one I've found matches Amazon's service and price for books, if
the others want to compete online they are going to have to do much better.

I boycotted Amazon for a while, and stopped being an Associate, but found I
was buying less books because they were too expensive and hard to get. So I
guess I'm back to them again now.

/Robert




Amazon (was: RE: DMP Availability)

2001-02-22 Thread dcross - David Cross


From: Robert Shiels [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 22 February 2001 11:59

 I want to buy a book "Code" by Charles Petzold.
 
 streetsonline - not available
 whsmith 12.45 + 2.74 = 15.19 delivery 1-2 weeks
 bol.com 12.59 + 2.95 = 15.54 delivery 3-7 days
 pcbooks 13.99 + 3.50 = 17.49 next day delivery
 amazon 11.13 + 2.75 = 13.88 dispatched within 24 hours

 And the Amazon website has a good review of the book, and several comments
 by other people who have bought it, whereas the other sites have no
details
 at all. No one I've found matches Amazon's service and price for books, if
 the others want to compete online they are going to have to do much
better.

Well no-one's saying you can't use the Amazon site to get reviews and info
about a book :)

 I boycotted Amazon for a while, and stopped being an Associate, but found
I
 was buying less books because they were too expensive and hard to get. So
I
 guess I'm back to them again now.

Since I gave up Amazon, I've found myself going into bookshops more.
Browsing in a bookshop is still _by far_ the best way to buy books.

And I end up buying more books. Because for each book that I got into the
shop looking for, I find another two that seem really interesting. Amazon's
"readers who bought this book..." feature really doesn't achieve the same
thing.

Dave...

-- 


The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.  
If you have received this communication in error, please 
re-send this communication to the sender and delete the 
original message or any copy of it from your computer
system.



Re: Amazon (was: RE: DMP Availability)

2001-02-22 Thread Dominic Mitchell

On Thu, Feb 22, 2001 at 12:06:32PM -, dcross - David Cross wrote:
 Since I gave up Amazon, I've found myself going into bookshops more.
 Browsing in a bookshop is still _by far_ the best way to buy books.
 
 And I end up buying more books. 

That's the problem!

-Dom



Re: Amazon (was: RE: DMP Availability)

2001-02-22 Thread Aaron Trevena

On Thu, 22 Feb 2001, dcross - David Cross wrote:
 Since I gave up Amazon, I've found myself going into bookshops more.
 Browsing in a bookshop is still _by far_ the best way to buy books.

AOL
 
 And I end up buying more books. Because for each book that I got into the
 shop looking for, I find another two that seem really interesting. Amazon's
 "readers who bought this book..." feature really doesn't achieve the same
 thing.

/me spent 100 quid on books last weekend in skoob books, PC bookshop and
Books etc (walked from goswell road to charing cross street where I spent
another 30 quid on prints and postcard prints, via holborn - quite
pleseant walk as the city and its outskirts are nice and quiet at the
weekend).

A.

-- 
A HREF = "http://termisoc.org/~betty" Betty @ termisoc.org /A
"As a youngster Fred fought sea battles on the village pond using a 
complex system of signals he devised that was later adopted by the Royal 
Navy. " (this email has nothing to do with any organisation except me)






Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-22 Thread Philip Newton

Dave Cross wrote:
 Ah. An idea. I'll send a test to the list and cc you and me, so that 
 we can see what's going on. In fact, I'll do it with this mail.

Looks fine from over here. Here are the headers, in case you're interested:

Received: from mailgw5.gedas.de (139.1.44.13 [139.1.44.13]) by
exchange.datenrevision.de with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail
Service Version 5.5.2650.21)
id 1BHBQXMW; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 16:01:14 +0100
Received: from lists.dircon.co.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by mailgw5.gedas.de (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA04106
for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:51:45
+0100 (MET)
Received: (from majordom@localhost)
by lists.dircon.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA04238
for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:56:17 GMT
X-Authentication-Warning: lists.dircon.co.uk: majordom set sender to
[EMAIL PROTECTED] using -f
Received: from zeus.powerhost.co.uk ([209.207.238.96])
by lists.dircon.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA03952
for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:55:51 GMT
Received: (from nobody@localhost)
by zeus.powerhost.co.uk (8.9.3/(dn/norelay)) id JAA00915
for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:54:50 -0500
(EST)
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:54:50 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: DMP Availability
References:  
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Dave Cross [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Jonathan Stowe [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
X-Mailer: ms-webmail
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Precedence: bulk
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Cheers,
Philip
-- 
Philip Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED]
All opinions are my own, not my employer's.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.



Re: DMP Availability

2001-02-22 Thread Dave Cross

At Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:32:39 + (GMT), Jonathan Stowe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Thu, 22 Feb 2001, dcross - David Cross wrote:
 
  Dave...
  [still posting from Acxiom as the list is still eating mails I send 
  from my dave.org.uk webmail]
 
 I havent seen any bounces from the list here ... What ails you Dave ?

Hmmm that _is_ weird then. Everything that I've sent to the list
in the last week or so from this webmail account has failed to appear
on the list. Mails have got thru to individuals and other lists without
a problem.

Unfortunately, as it's a very primitive webmail (written by me) it
doesn't store the outgoing mails, so I can't see what I'm doing 
wrong.

Ah. An idea. I'll send a test to the list and cc you and me, so that 
we can see what's going on. In fact, I'll do it with this mail.

Cheers,

Dave...



DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Michael Stevens

amazon uk have started shipping data munging with perl. I have my
copy.

Michael



Re: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Mark Fowler

Micheal claimed that:

 amazon uk have started shipping data munging with perl. I have my
 copy.

Indeed they have.  I've got mine now.  They're also shipping the mod_perl
pocket reference.

[% UNLESS office_policy_to_use_amazon %]
 [% INCLUDE standard_reasons_not_to_use_amazon_text %]
[% END %]

Later.

Mark.

-- 
print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} (
   Name  = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer'  ,
   Firm  = 'Profero Ltd',Web   = 'http://www.profero.com/'   ,
   Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]',   Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960'  )








Re: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Greg McCarroll

* Struan Donald ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
 
 why did amazon have to go and do things that make you not want to buy
 books from them? it's enormously inconvenient.
 

yip, i occasionally break my moral standpoint when i'm in a rush,
but my bill at amazon is now 10% of what it used to be

i think BN's appeal against them is going well for BN



-- 
Greg McCarroll  http://www.mccarroll.uklinux.net



Re: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Dave Hodgkinson

Struan Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 why did amazon have to go and do things that make you not want to buy
 books from them? it's enormously inconvenient.

Didn't BN get the 1-click thing overturned anyway?


-- 
Dave Hodgkinson, http://www.hodgkinson.org
Editor-in-chief, The Highway Star   http://www.deep-purple.com
  Apache, mod_perl, MySQL, Sybase hired gun for, well, hire
  -



RE: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread dcross - David Cross

From: Struan Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 20 February 2001 11:01
 
 * at 20/02 10:35 + Mark Fowler said:
  Micheal claimed that:
  
   amazon uk have started shipping data munging with perl. I have my
   copy.
  
  Indeed they have.  I've got mine now.  They're also 
 shipping the mod_perl
  pocket reference.
  
 mmm, pc bookshop tell me uk release not till july. is this kind of
 delay normal? 

That can't be right. How did you get that info? I'll get on to the UK
distributors and see why bookshops are getting such crap information.

I would imagine that it'll be in bookshops in the next week or two.

  [% UNLESS office_policy_to_use_amazon %]
   [% INCLUDE standard_reasons_not_to_use_amazon_text %]
  [% END %]
 
 why did amazon have to go and do things that make you not want to buy
 books from them? it's enormously inconvenient.

Yeah, but don't you get such a good feeling of moral superiority when
you don't buy from them.

Dave...
[posting from acxiom account as the last few messages from my other 
account seemed to go missing en route]

--


The information contained in this communication is
confidential, is intended only for the use of the recipient
named above, and may be legally privileged. If the reader 
of this message is not the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or
copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.  
If you have received this communication in error, please 
re-send this communication to the sender and delete the 
original message or any copy of it from your computer
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Re: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Simon Wilcox

At 10:13 20/02/2001 +, you wrote:
amazon uk have started shipping data munging with perl. I have my
copy.

Michael

Must be very popular, it's just dropped back to "On Order; is usually 
dispatched within 1-2 weeks" !

Simon




Re: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Roger Burton West

On or about Tue, Feb 20, 2001 at 11:26:02AM -, dcross - David Cross typed:

Nah. That's what it's said for the last two weeks. They haven't got round
changing it to '24 hours' yet.

Mine's "1 on hand", but there are other things in that order.

R



Re: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Mark Fowler

 [% UNLESS office_policy_to_use_amazon %]
  [% INCLUDE standard_reasons_not_to_use_amazon_text %]
 [% END %]

Someone tell Andy, this doesn't seem to be working.  Either that or you
lot felt the need to rehash it all again ;-)

Didn't anyone tell you guys that perl automatically rehashes stuff when it
gets too big to handle anyway...

Later.

Mark.

-- 
print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} (
   Name  = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer'  ,
   Firm  = 'Profero Ltd',Web   = 'http://www.profero.com/'   ,
   Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]',   Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960'  )








Re: DMP

2001-02-20 Thread Jonathan Stowe

On Tue, 20 Feb 2001, Roger Burton West wrote:

 On or about Tue, Feb 20, 2001 at 11:26:02AM -, dcross - David Cross typed:

 Nah. That's what it's said for the last two weeks. They haven't got round
 changing it to '24 hours' yet.

 Mine's "1 on hand",


Ooer, this is a family list you know ...

/J\
-- 
Jonathan Stowe   |
http://www.gellyfish.com |   I'm with Grep on this one
http://www.tackleway.co.uk   |