Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 17 May 2013, at 20:28, "Duncan Garland" wrote: > Do you want to come out to Thames Ditton? It's a bit of a hike, but if > you're interested I'll see what I can do. Historically, London.pm events outside of vaguely central london tend to have poor attendance ('vaguely' here means the BBC and

RE: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Perl M[ou]ngers Subject: Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers On 15 May 2013, at 23:04, Tom Hukins wrote: > I'm pleased that you enjoy your involvement in our community, but > please don't spread the rumour that anything we used to do stopped > happening. > >

RE: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

When we want a PHP programmer, we only have to whistle. Anyway, that's the background. Thanks for all your replies. A fascinating read. Duncan -Original Message- From: london.pm-boun...@london.pm.org [mailto:london.pm-boun...@london.pm.org] On Behalf Of Mark Stringer Sent: 14 May 2

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 17.05.2013 06:35, Aaron Trevena wrote: Hi Duncan, On 15 May 2013 22:37, Duncan Garland wrote: I didn't mention the company because I was (and still am) using my personal email and it didn't seem appropriate. Anyway, the company is Motortrak (www.motortrak.com). I visited the site, the

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 16/05/2013 19:20, Peter Corlett wrote: The agent added "OPUS WILL PAY £300 TO ANYONE WHO CAN RECCOMEND A SUCCESSFUL CANDIDATE" in a double-size font, which showed a certain amount of desperation to fill the role, another red flag. Also, it will not help to recruit Perl programmers who are ge

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Hi Duncan, On 15 May 2013 22:37, Duncan Garland wrote: > I didn't mention the company because I was (and still am) using my personal > email and it didn't seem appropriate. Anyway, the company is Motortrak > (www.motortrak.com). I visited the site, the jobs page renders really badly in my old br

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 10:37:08PM +0100, Duncan Garland wrote: [...] > I didn't mention the company because I was (and still am) using my personal > email and it didn't seem appropriate. Anyway, the company is Motortrak > (www.motortrak.com). Now I know which role you were referring to, I can fol

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Yes, we were a co-sponsor of the 2012 London Perl Workshop. Sorry for the typo. As far as I know, the last London PM tech meeting was in October 2012. It's great news if they are starting again. On 16 May 2013 09:16, Dave Cross wrote: > Quoting Duncan Garland : > > We sponsored the last Londo

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 09:16:15AM +0100, Dave Cross wrote: > Quoting Duncan Garland : >> We sponsored the last London PM and I ran a beginner's workshop on TT. > Just to be clear here, I suspect you mean that you sponsored the last London > Perl Workshop. As I understand it, the last London Perl M

RE: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Quoting Duncan Garland : We sponsored the last London PM and I ran a beginner's workshop on TT. Just to be clear here, I suspect you mean that you sponsored the last London Perl Workshop. As I understand it, the last London Perl Mongers meeting was sponsored by a recruitment company. D

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 15 May 2013, at 23:04, Tom Hukins wrote: > I'm pleased that you enjoy your involvement in our community, but > please don't spread the rumour that anything we used to do stopped > happening. > > With a small group of volunteers and a large group of followers and > mailing list subscribers, r

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 10:37:08PM +0100, Duncan Garland wrote: > I attended most of the London PM tech meetings until they stopped. I'm pleased that you enjoy your involvement in our community, but please don't spread the rumour that anything we used to do stopped happening. With a small group o

RE: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

When we want a PHP programmer, we only have to whistle. Anyway, that's the background. Thanks for all your replies. A fascinating read. Duncan -Original Message- From: london.pm-boun...@london.pm.org [mailto:london.pm-boun...@london.pm.org] On Behalf Of Mark Stringer Sent: 14 May 2

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 15/05/2013 19:42, Abigail wrote: On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 12:06:33AM +0800, AJ Dhaliwal wrote: Damian (and Dave cross) disagree with you on that one. A week with them is worth more than a year's actual experience. Doubtful. There's a lot more to making a good programmer than knowing the lang

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Thu, May 16, 2013 at 12:06:33AM +0800, AJ Dhaliwal wrote: > Damian (and Dave cross) disagree with you on that one. A week with them > is worth more than a year's actual experience. Doubtful. There's a lot more to making a good programmer than knowing the language, just like being a spelling

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 15 May 2013 18:28, Uri Guttman wrote: > the real problem is getting shops to PAY for any sort of training. i was > producing damian classes successfully for 3 or so years. then the economy > bottomed out (this was before the great recession) and training budgets > dried up. they still haven't c

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 05/15/2013 12:06 PM, AJ Dhaliwal wrote: Damian (and Dave cross) disagree with you on that one. A week with them is worth more than a year's actual experience. On 14/05/13 22:10, Uri Guttman wrote: also even a week of training by damian (or dave cross) won't give actual experience. the traine

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Damian (and Dave cross) disagree with you on that one. A week with them is worth more than a year's actual experience. On 14/05/13 22:10, Uri Guttman wrote: also even a week of training by damian (or dave cross) won't give actual experience. the trainees might do better but still have a steep

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Joel Bernstein j...@fysh.org wrote > > And if you turned up without your Trema Finance Kit did you have to do it > in your underwear? I wear underwear on all my assignments however... I am cycling off road from London to Paris on behalf of the British Heart Foundation at the end of June. I will

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 12:48:50PM +0200, Paul Weaver wrote: > I'm looking forward to my next long haul day flight as I'll get a change to > get my teeth into writing some new code (Perl of course). The lack of > distraction from email and phones is really useful, but it makes network > develop

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

I work in a variety of offices around the world. This year my most frequent office has been Jerusalem, about 12 days there, and a couple more up the road in Ramallah and a bit further in Gaza, but I've been to another 8 or 9 on top of that. I'm almost up to 70,000 miles this year, and on my 51

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 03:54:07PM +0100, Aaron Trevena wrote: > On 14 May 2013 15:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: > > On 14 May 2013 15:02, Dominic Humphries wrote: > > > >> 50 miles? Luxury! I have to do sixty! :) > >> > > Indeed. My previous contract was 223 miles, each way! (I became Travelodge > > gu

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 09:23, Graham Feegan wrote: > The candidate market is very tough. Over the last 3-6 months there hasn't > been many > new candidates making themselves available or open to new opportunities, > therefore > I can probably understand why your agent might be struggling. Your agent >

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Yeah, I realised this (and discussed on IRC) almost as soon as I posted it. Still, I managed to be a smartarse, and that's the main thing. On 14 May 2013 18:26, Dirk Koopman wrote: > On 14/05/13 17:04, Joel Bernstein wrote: > >> Your estimates are wonky, the relevant distance is a (section of a

RE: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

7787 227 079 Office Line: 01908 506506 LinkedIn IT Executive - Twitter IT Executive - Facebook -Original Message- From: london.pm-boun...@london.pm.org [mailto:london.pm-boun...@london.pm.org] On Behalf Of Duncan Garland Sent: 13 May 2013 22:22 To: 'London.pm Perl M[ou]ngers' Sub

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14/05/13 17:04, Joel Bernstein wrote: Your estimates are wonky, the relevant distance is a (section of a) great circle, not ATCF: http://www.gcmap.com/dist?P=LHR-CPH,+BRS-ZRH *From* *To* Initial *Heading* *Distance* LHR (51°28'39"N 0°27'41"W)CPH

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

And if you turned up without your Trema Finance Kit did you have to do it in your underwear? On 14 May 2013 18:18, Chris Jack wrote: > On 14 May 2013 16:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: > > > Indeed. My previous contract was 223 miles, each way! (I became > Travelodge > > guest of the year during that g

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 16:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: > Indeed. My previous contract was 223 miles, each way! (I became Travelodge > guest of the year during that gig!! lol) > I commuted from England to Finland (around 1200 miles each way) on a weekly basis for about a year back in my Trema Finance Kit co

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Your estimates are wonky, the relevant distance is a (section of a) great circle, not ATCF: http://www.gcmap.com/dist?P=LHR-CPH,+BRS-ZRH *From* *To* Initial *Heading* *Distance* LHR (51°28'39"N 0°27'41"W)CPH (55°37'05"N 12°39

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 10:22:05PM +0100, Duncan Garland wrote: > We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are > struggling. It's a shame because we've got quite a lot of development work in > the offing, mostly using Catalyst, DBIx::Class, Moose and the like. It seems that

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 16:40, Paul Johnson wrote: > On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 03:54:07PM +0100, Aaron Trevena wrote: >> On 14 May 2013 15:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: >> > On 14 May 2013 15:02, Dominic Humphries wrote: >> > >> >> 50 miles? Luxury! I have to do sixty! :) >> >> >> > Indeed. My previous contract w

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

No Contractors heer in the Netherlands ? Verstuurd vanaf onze gratis iPad Op 14 mei 2013 om 16:54 heeft Aaron Trevena het volgende geschreven: > On 14 May 2013 15:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: >> On 14 May 2013 15:02, Dominic Humphries wrote: >> >>> 50 miles? Luxury! I have to do sixty! :) >> Inde

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 03:54:07PM +0100, Aaron Trevena wrote: > On 14 May 2013 15:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: > > On 14 May 2013 15:02, Dominic Humphries wrote: > > > >> 50 miles? Luxury! I have to do sixty! :) > >> > > Indeed. My previous contract was 223 miles, each way! (I became Travelodge > > gu

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 03:31:52PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: > On 14 May 2013, at 14:43, Ben Vinnerd wrote: [...] >> I live in the North West and recently I saw a contract at Jobsite in >> Hampshire (i.e. a long way away). I spoke to the agent and they don't allow >> WFH (is this the agent not a

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14/05/13 15:36, Joel Bernstein wrote: Aha! Do you have any opinion on the pedestrianisation of Norwich city centre? I'll be honest, I'm dead against it. Yar a bit late for tha' Bor...

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 04:09:23PM +0200, Joel Bernstein wrote: > Jobsite have been very definite for over a year that the job is not WFH. They > are still plaintively asking for someone to come and work in their offices > somewhere[0] just East of Portsmouth. Presumably they're soon either going t

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 15:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: > On 14 May 2013 15:02, Dominic Humphries wrote: > >> 50 miles? Luxury! I have to do sixty! :) >> > Indeed. My previous contract was 223 miles, each way! (I became Travelodge > guest of the year during that gig!! lol) 223? Pah! my last contracting gig wa

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 16:20, Ben Vinnerd wrote: > Indeed. My previous contract was 223 miles, each way! (I became Travelodge > guest of the year during that gig!! lol) > Aha! Do you have any opinion on the pedestrianisation of Norwich city centre? I'll be honest, I'm dead against it.

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013, at 14:43, Ben Vinnerd wrote: I live in the North West and recently I saw a contract at Jobsite in Hampshire (i.e. a long way away). I spoke to the agent and they don't allow WFH (is this the agent not allowing me? Or Jobsite?). I don't want to unleash the dogs of war and al

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14/05/13 15:09, Joel Bernstein wrote: Jobsite have been very definite for over a year that the job is not WFH. They are still plaintively asking for someone to come and work in their offices somewhere[0] just East of Portsmouth. Presumably they're soon either going to crack and hire a telecomm

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 15:02, Dominic Humphries wrote: > 50 miles? Luxury! I have to do sixty! :) > > Indeed. My previous contract was 223 miles, each way! (I became Travelodge guest of the year during that gig!! lol)

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 05/14/2013 09:05 AM, Aaron Trevena wrote: You don't even need to train them youselves to start with - there are plenty of training courses available to get them started, or you could get a trainer onsite. i tried something like that a few years ago with damian conway. it was an offer to e

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Jobsite have been very definite for over a year that the job is not WFH. They are still plaintively asking for someone to come and work in their offices somewhere[0] just East of Portsmouth. Presumably they're soon either going to crack and hire a telecommuter, outsource the damn work entirely, or

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Tue, 2013-05-14 at 14:43 +0100, Ben Vinnerd wrote: > I have to travel > 50 miles per day to get to my clients office (and back) 50 miles? Luxury! I have to do sixty! :) > I live in the North West and recently I saw a contract at Jobsite in > Hampshire (i.e. a long way away). I spoke to the ag

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 14:37, Dave Cross wrote: > Quoting Aaron Trevena : > > >> Other perl trainers are available ;) >> > > Yebbut "Who ya gonna call?" > The Ghostbusters are doing perl training now? -- Unde venistis vos manebit, donec completa est. -- Tenax D.

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013, at 14:34, Aaron Trevena wrote: On 14 May 2013 14:10, Dave Cross wrote: Quoting Aaron Trevena : or you could get a trainer onsite. That sounds like a *fabulous* idea :-) Other perl trainers are available ;) I don't think training is the answer always here, i think what

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Quoting Aaron Trevena : On 14 May 2013 14:10, Dave Cross wrote: Quoting Aaron Trevena : or you could get a trainer onsite. That sounds like a *fabulous* idea :-) Other perl trainers are available ;) Yebbut "Who ya gonna call?"

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

As others have said, re: WFH. I'm a Perl contractor (about to finish a contract in a few weeks time), and it amazes me of the number of clients who do not like WFH. I have to travel 50 miles per day to get to my clients office (and back) - the overwhelming majority of the time I can do exactly the

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 14 May 2013 14:10, Dave Cross wrote: > Quoting Aaron Trevena : > >> or you could get a trainer onsite. > > That sounds like a *fabulous* idea :-) Other perl trainers are available ;) A -- Aaron J Trevena, BSc Hons http://www.aarontrevena.co.uk LAMP System Integration, Development and Consul

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

+1 (partly because this is the first thing I would have responded with) On 14 May 2013 14:10, Dave Cross wrote: > Quoting Aaron Trevena : > >> or you could get a trainer onsite. > > > That sounds like a *fabulous* idea :-) >

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Quoting Aaron Trevena : or you could get a trainer onsite. That sounds like a *fabulous* idea :-)

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 13 May 2013 23:18, Lyle wrote: > Have you considered training graduates? I hear there are a lot of them out > of work. I see a lot of Perl jobs wanting and expecting nothing less than > very experienced Perl programmers. If there aren't enough companies willing > to give fresh programmers the e

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 11:22 PM, Duncan Garland wrote: ... > > We've got several PHP projects on the go as well. It's easier to get local > PHP programmers and when we can't, there seems to be a constant supply of > good Eastern European programmers. Why isn't there the same stream of > Eastern E

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

requ...@london.pm.org You can reach the person managing the list at london.pm-ow...@london.pm.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of london.pm digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmer

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 13 May 2013 22:22, Duncan Garland wrote: > We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are > struggling. It's a shame because we've got quite a lot of development work > in the offing, mostly using Catalyst, DBIx::Class, Moose and the like. That's a good start but not much

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

We sent out an Intern Wanted posting to heads of careers departments at various colleges and Unis. This was filtered through to the students and we had a number of promising looking applicants contact us. We're a startup, no track record, tiny budget, no benefits and all we had to our credit wa

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

One thing to bear in mind is that remote-working does NOT suit everybody. It's not about lounging around watching TV or mowing the lawn. It is about being able to organize your day so ALL your jobs get done, without having the hassle of the commute. On the negative side, some people find having th

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 13/05/2013 22:48, Mark Fowler wrote: On Monday, May 13, 2013, Duncan Garland wrote: We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are struggling. The question I ask anyone who has problems hiring for any IT position is "have you considered telecommute?" Have you consid

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 13-05-13 10:48 PM, Mark Fowler wrote: On Monday, May 13, 2013, Duncan Garland wrote: We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are struggling. The question I ask anyone who has problems hiring for any IT position is "have you considered telecommute?" We've had a mix

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 13 May 2013, at 23:27, Kieren Diment wrote: > The management challenges for telecommute jobs are different to those for on > site. But it does increase the pool of potential candidates a lot. Does > anyone have any useful experience about managing mixed on-site/offsite staff? I managed s

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

t your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of london.pm digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers (Avleen Vig) 2. Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers (Kieren Diment) 3. Working from home (was: Re: Alternative

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Hi Uri, Yeah, I guess my brush was a bit broad there, I herewith send out my apologies to all the good agents, and the bad ones can suck :) So, what happened was that the agency contacted me and said they had this on-site role in CH, and I said I'd be able to work 50/50 on/off-site, and they said

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On 05/14/2013 12:09 AM, Richard Foley wrote: I had a contract role in Switzerland where the client was happy for me to come on board in a (largely) remote capacity. That meant some on-site work to familiarize me with the team and the project and then shift off-site for the majority of the work. T

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

I had a contract role in Switzerland where the client was happy for me to come on board in a (largely) remote capacity. That meant some on-site work to familiarize me with the team and the project and then shift off-site for the majority of the work. This suited both parties. The agency stepped in

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Indeed. -- Ciao Richard Foley http://www.rfi.net/books.html On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 05:48:39PM -0400, Mark Fowler wrote: > On Monday, May 13, 2013, Duncan Garland wrote: > > We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are > > struggling. > > > The question I ask anyone

Re: Working from home (was: Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers)

Very similar to my experience except I work as a contractor with a bunch of other contractors across three or more continents to develop and support a reasonably high profile high value product in it's domain. I meet a subset of the people I work with face to face once every couple of years (bu

Working from home (was: Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers)

On 13 May 2013, at 23:27, Kieren Diment wrote: > The management challenges for telecommute jobs are different to those for on > site. But it does increase the pool of potential candidates a lot. Does > anyone have any useful experience about managing mixed on-site/offsite staff? Can't speak

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

When you're employing a builder, if the house is steel framed, you might want to employ someone with experience with the framing system. If you're building a steel framed housing estate, you will need to familiarise your crews with the technology, but that's a small amount of overhead compared

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

You're not alone in facing this, and as a rule it isn't a perl-specific issue. Perl's just at the leading edge of this. 1. There are fewer perl programmers than PHP programmers. There are many reasons for this, they really don't matter that much. In the end, perl doesn't get as much exposure and i

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

1. Who are "you"? 2. Agents. There's your first problem. 3. Are you doing anything interesting? 4. Your CTO Perl is only a programming language. There's ruby, python and *spit* PHP. People learn them too. One of the companies around here doing very cool things hire programmers and then pervert

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Talk to Barbie :) Sent from my iPhone On 13 May 2013, at 23:27, Kieren Diment wrote: > The management challenges for telecommute jobs are different to those for on > site. But it does increase the pool of potential candidates a lot. Does > anyone have any useful experience about managing m

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Yeah, having the robots write code for me has been a real boon! Written on my phone On May 13, 2013 3:48 PM, "Schmoo" wrote: > Telepresence robots are all the rage these days... > > On 13 May 2013 23:27, Kieren Diment wrote: > > The management challenges for telecommute jobs are different to th

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are struggling. It's a shame because we've got quite a lot of development work in the offing, mostly using Catalyst, DBIx::Class, Moose and the like. Are you certain that the agency or agencies you are using are actually talking t

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Telepresence robots are all the rage these days... On 13 May 2013 23:27, Kieren Diment wrote: > The management challenges for telecommute jobs are different to those for on > site. But it does increase the pool of potential candidates a lot. Does > anyone have any useful experience about man

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

The management challenges for telecommute jobs are different to those for on site. But it does increase the pool of potential candidates a lot. Does anyone have any useful experience about managing mixed on-site/offsite staff? On 14/05/2013, at 8:13 AM, Job van Achterberg wrote: > I second t

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

I second this. Every YAPC::EU I chat with the sponsors there but none of them are particularly welcome to telecommuters. Is there a pattern in responses to that question, Mark? I find that it's mostly wanting to have an in-office representation, especially when it comes to meetings. Job > On Mon

Re: Alternative sources of Perl programmers

On Monday, May 13, 2013, Duncan Garland wrote: We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are > struggling. The question I ask anyone who has problems hiring for any IT position is "have you considered telecommute?" Mark

Alternative sources of Perl programmers

Hi, We're advertising for a Perl programmer again, and once again we are struggling. It's a shame because we've got quite a lot of development work in the offing, mostly using Catalyst, DBIx::Class, Moose and the like. I spoke to the agent today and asked why so few people are coming forwar