Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Tony – You ask very important questions – but – as Acee has answered in a subsequent email – all of these questions were openly debated in the WG during the work on what became RFC8919/8920. This debate was contentious, took years, and the WG eventually reached consensus on what became the two

Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Peter Psenak
Tony, On 28/07/2021 22:06, Tony Li wrote: Les, ASLA exists to support the advertisement of attributes which can be used in application specific ways. Why do we need separate and different copies of attributes for different applications? The SRLG tries to capture the risk relationships

Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Voyer, Daniel
Hi there, I completely agree with Les here. ASLA exist already as per RFC8919, RFC8920. Example of application is here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-lsr-flex-algo-17#section-12. Generic Metrics fits the application specific paradigm. What are we trying to accomplish here

Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Acee Lindem (acee)
Speaking as WG chair: We had a protracted discussion of the usage of link attributes for multiple applications. The outcome was RFC 8919 and RFC 9820. If you browse the ospf and isis WG archives for the years 2015-2018, you’ll see there was lots of discussion. You can also view the IETF

Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Tony Li
Les, > ASLA exists to support the advertisement of attributes which can be used in > application specific ways. Why do we need separate and different copies of attributes for different applications? The SRLG tries to capture the risk relationships between multiple links. Those

Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Tony – IMO, you are asking the wrong question.  ASLA exists to support the advertisement of attributes which can be used in application specific ways. In any particular deployment case, a given attribute advertisement might be used by one app, multiple apps, or all apps. ASLA allows to

Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Peter Psenak
On 28/07/2021 20:22, Tony Li wrote: FWIW, I think that this is the wrong question. I think that a better question is: Is there a usecase that is so overwhelmingly compelling that the added complexity of ASLA is warranted? both TE metric and delay, that is used as metric for flex-algo, are

Re: [Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Tony Li
FWIW, I think that this is the wrong question. I think that a better question is: Is there a usecase that is so overwhelmingly compelling that the added complexity of ASLA is warranted? Tony > On Jul 28, 2021, at 11:18 AM, Shraddha Hegde > wrote: > > WG, > >Generic metric as

[Lsr] Generic metric: application-specific vs application-independent

2021-07-28 Thread Shraddha Hegde
WG, Generic metric as described in https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-lsr-flex-algo-bw-con can advertise multiple metric-types and values and be used by any application. All the use cases that I heard from network operators while writing the draft could be solved

Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-lsr-flex-algo-17 (was: I-D Action: draft-ietf-lsr-flex-algo-bw-con-01.txt)

2021-07-28 Thread Shraddha Hegde
Peter, There is an agreement to open the Flex-algo draft and clarify the text and here is a proposal for the modified text. We can discuss about generic-metric in another thread. New text for section "12. Advertisement of Link Attributes for Flex-Algorithm " 2 nd And 3rd

Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-lsr-flex-algo-17 (was: I-D Action: draft-ietf-lsr-flex-algo-bw-con-01.txt)

2021-07-28 Thread Peter Psenak
Ron, the problem in hand is whether Generic Metric should be defined as an application specific attribute or not. I have explained several times why making it application specific makes sense and also provided examples of other metrics that are defined as application specific (TE metric,