Re: [Ltsp-discuss] OT!! Re: will Wayland affect LTSP?
On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 11:50:35AM +0100, Xavier Brochard wrote: This thread is a bit strange: currently there is nothing as a wayland only application. Nothing can prevent you tu run an X server. I don't understand why everyone is scared. i think people are understandably worried about seeing problems like firefox and openoffice's pixmap caching bugs, which were (are?) crippling for LTSP environments. because many applications are being developed to be more desktop focused, serious bugs impacting network functionality sometimes linger or even proliferate. obviously X didn't prevent those sorts of bugs from becoming a problem and for all i know, the limitations of X actually lead people to implement such bugs. but fear that (most) development efforts will move towards something that completely drops support for network transparency is not unreasonable for a project that absolutely relies on that feature. even though X is still there, if developers are no longer working on it X may get stale and dysfunctional... the capacity to re-use older hardware has long been a strength of LTSP, and like any new project, wayland doesn't yet support much in the way of hardware, so that's another concern that will hopefully improve over time. since the LTSP community depends on network transparency, i think it's only smart to raise those concerns and work together to address them. good thing we've been working on fat clients. :) live well, vagrant -- Beautiful is writing same markup. Internet Explorer 9 supports standards for HTML5, CSS3, SVG 1.1, ECMAScript5, and DOM L2 L3. Spend less time writing and rewriting code and more time creating great experiences on the web. Be a part of the beta today http://p.sf.net/sfu/msIE9-sfdev2dev _ Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
[Ltsp-discuss] OT!! Re: will Wayland affect LTSP?
TOP: Last two posts are perfect example of why I hate top posting. What has your digest got to do with discussion on this thread?? On 17 November 2010 06:00, Scott MacCallum scottmac...@gmail.com wrote: There is Lubuntu and other distributions with the goal of producing a desktop operating system that requires minimal hardware resources. I think it has the potential to be perfectly suited for LTSP but I have not tried. It seems that a move away from X by Lubuntu would not be in its best interest in order to achieve its design goal. The project does wants to have the official endorsement of Ubuntu so I wonder how things will play out in next few years. Sorry for sounding absolutely ignorant but wouldn't it be feasible to run both wayland and X together? One for the server and other for LTSP clients? -- Regards, Sudev Barar Read http://blog.sudev.in for topics ranging from here to there. PS: Replying using bottom post/in-line post makes email conversations whole lot easier for meaningful dialogue. Snip out what is not relevant. Adopt this and spread the message. -- Beautiful is writing same markup. Internet Explorer 9 supports standards for HTML5, CSS3, SVG 1.1, ECMAScript5, and DOM L2 L3. Spend less time writing and rewriting code and more time creating great experiences on the web. Be a part of the beta today http://p.sf.net/sfu/msIE9-sfdev2dev _ Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
Re: [Ltsp-discuss] OT!! Re: will Wayland affect LTSP?
Le mercredi 17 novembre 2010 11:16:32, Sudev Barar a écrit : Sorry for sounding absolutely ignorant but wouldn't it be feasible to run both wayland and X together? One for the server and other for LTSP clients? May be. But what for? you don't need a graphical interface on you LTSP server. You just need an X server running in the background. Even if you need a graphical interface on the server, you don't need to run Wayland on the server if you run X. And again, Wayland is able to run a X server - look for X as a Wayland client in http://wayland.freedesktop.org/architecture.html This thread is a bit strange: currently there is nothing as a wayland only application. Nothing can prevent you tu run an X server. I don't understand why everyone is scared. While it's true that X developers wants to migrate toolkits to EGL and to abandon X, it will take time. Nobody wants to abandon distant access (the solution might be something like RedHat's Spice). But all of this is not ready. Xavier xav...@alternatif.org - 09 54 06 16 26 -- Beautiful is writing same markup. Internet Explorer 9 supports standards for HTML5, CSS3, SVG 1.1, ECMAScript5, and DOM L2 L3. Spend less time writing and rewriting code and more time creating great experiences on the web. Be a part of the beta today http://p.sf.net/sfu/msIE9-sfdev2dev _ Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
Re: [Ltsp-discuss] OT!! Re: will Wayland affect LTSP?
Xavier Brochard xav...@alternatif.org wrote on 11/17/2010 04:50:35 AM: From: Xavier Brochard xav...@alternatif.org To: ltsp-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net Date: 11/17/2010 04:55 AM Subject: Re: [Ltsp-discuss] OT!! Re: will Wayland affect LTSP? Le mercredi 17 novembre 2010 11:16:32, Sudev Barar a écrit : Sorry for sounding absolutely ignorant but wouldn't it be feasible to run both wayland and X together? One for the server and other for LTSP clients? May be. But what for? you don't need a graphical interface on you LTSP server. You just need an X server running in the background. Even if you need a graphical interface on the server, you don't need to run Wayland on the server if you run X. And again, Wayland is able to run a X server - look for X as a Wayland client in http://wayland.freedesktop.org/architecture.html This thread is a bit strange: currently there is nothing as a wayland only application. Nothing can prevent you tu run an X server. I don't understand why everyone is scared. I'm not afraid for today, tomorrow, or the next year or so.. However, the purpose of Wayland is for people to forget about X. If they forget about X, then applications will be written that are impossible to perform properly on remote X desktops. Right now, in my estimation, it seems that one of the major struggles is to get X to behave in very non-X ways. 3D acceleration on desktop widgets and such. Instead of creating a way for X to communicate these commands across the network, their solution seems to be to abandon X and communicate with Video Hardware more directly. So even if toolkit providers technically don't abandon X altogether, will it really work when all of the applications are written to expect the performance and functionality of Wayland, and for everyone to stop innovating X to get performance across the network as well? You may even have applications that technically work on both X and Wayland, but my guess is that there will be a great number of apps that it only makes sense to run under Wayland. However, if the toolkits (like GTK) continue to support both X and Wayland, and the X support matures in a way that makes these same apps function properly across the network with X, we may see a smoother operation of LTSP. This may allow developers to focus on getting great features out of apps on standalone desktops with Wayland, and getting lean performance across the network with X. It may require the graceful negotiation of features in a way that is abstracted from the applications that use GTK. At this point I'm completely brainstorming, and my thoughts could be a great distance from reality. While it's true that X developers wants to migrate toolkits to EGL and to abandon X, it will take time. Nobody wants to abandon distant access (the solution might be something like RedHat's Spice). But all of this is not ready. Xavier xav...@alternatif.org - 09 54 06 16 26 Jeremy D. Young Systems Analyst O'Reilly Auto Parts This communication and any attachments are confidential, protected by Communications Privacy Act 18 USCS § 2510, solely for the use of the intended recipient, and may contain legally privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient, please return or destroy it immediately. Thank you. -- Beautiful is writing same markup. Internet Explorer 9 supports standards for HTML5, CSS3, SVG 1.1, ECMAScript5, and DOM L2 L3. Spend less time writing and rewriting code and more time creating great experiences on the web. Be a part of the beta today http://p.sf.net/sfu/msIE9-sfdev2dev _ Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
