Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list
On Mon, 31 Jan 2011 20:07:34 -0800 Jonathan Marsden jmars...@fastmail.fm wrote: On 01/31/2011 02:44 AM, Phill Whiteside wrote: I've had a couple of people suggest that we put the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Get%20Involved/WhoWeAre page into some sort of order. I can do it by name, IRC nick or language (language being my preferred one), ... Can we ask what purpose the ordering is expected to serve? In techie-speak, are there any use cases defined for this database? :) To me, language seems a slightly odd choice of primary sort key, especially since it is primary language only (some of us speak more than one)... and as long as I can communicate about with someone about Lubuntu in some language that we both know, I don't care all that much what their primary language is... I just want to communicate with them. Timezone info is on Launchpad anyway, assuming people set it (!), so it is currently just a click away from the WhoAreWe list. Do we need to duplicate that info on the wiki, and then update it in two places as we move around the world? Is the benefit worth the cost? Ordering by seniority or date added as it is now (longest-serving members at the top, new people add themselves to the end of the list) also has some value, as that is information which would be lost (well, except by laboriously looking back through wiki history) if the list were re-ordered at all. If we re-order, should a date-added column be introduced so that info is not accidentally lost? SUMMARY: This seems like a bike-shedding kind of a topic :) However, since you asked, I'd suggest order by date added -- in other words, leave it as it is. But I'm interested in hearing about use cases which are helped by a different ordering. I fail to see any reason to sort the list at all and nobody, so far, has given a reason. -- Steve Cook (Yorvyk) http://lubuntu.net ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list (and editing information in multiple places)
On Tuesday 01,February,2011 01:00 PM, Benny Hult wrote: And UTC is changed twice a year, there's winter time and summer time (daylight saving) and it requires editing to keep it up-to-date. UTC isn't changed twice a year, by the way. UTC != GMT. -- Kind regards, Loong Jin signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Lubuntu-desktop] Members list
Hiyas team, I've had a couple of people suggest that we put the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Get%20Involved/WhoWeAre page into some sort of order. I can do it by name, IRC nick or language (language being my preferred one), the other suggestion is that we add a time-zone column and order it by that. Let me know what you all think, I know adding a TZ column means you all have to and edit your entries. Let me know of you thoughts on the matter. Regards, Phill. -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list
Hiyas Jared, I've added a Time Zone column, now I just need everyone to go back and edit their entries! I can see the sence in having it ordered by timezone. Once it is completed I can group it as per the idea at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors But, as ever, I await comments. Regards, Phill. On 31 January 2011 11:52, Jared Norris jrnor...@gmail.com wrote: On 31 January 2011 20:44, Phill Whiteside phi...@ubuntu.com wrote: Hiyas team, I've had a couple of people suggest that we put the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Get%20Involved/WhoWeAre page into some sort of order. I can do it by name, IRC nick or language (language being my preferred one), the other suggestion is that we add a time-zone column and order it by that. Let me know what you all think, I know adding a TZ column means you all have to and edit your entries. Let me know of you thoughts on the matter. Regards, Phill. -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktophttps://launchpad.net/%7Elubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktophttps://launchpad.net/%7Elubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp Phil, I think some sort of order will be needed (any list over 5 or 6 people long really needs some sort of order in my opinion). I like the idea of the time zone because then it gives people an idea of when you will be around as well. After time zone then first name should be used I think. Well that's my 2 cents anyway Regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list
On 1 February 2011 03:21, Phill Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote: Hiyas Jared, I've added a Time Zone column, now I just need everyone to go back and edit their entries! I can see the sence in having it ordered by timezone. Once it is completed I can group it as per the idea at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors But, as ever, I await comments. Regards, Phill. On 31 January 2011 11:52, Jared Norris jrnor...@gmail.com wrote: On 31 January 2011 20:44, Phill Whiteside phi...@ubuntu.com wrote: Hiyas team, I've had a couple of people suggest that we put the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Get%20Involved/WhoWeAre page into some sort of order. I can do it by name, IRC nick or language (language being my preferred one), the other suggestion is that we add a time-zone column and order it by that. Let me know what you all think, I know adding a TZ column means you all have to and edit your entries. Let me know of you thoughts on the matter. Regards, Phill. -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp Phil, I think some sort of order will be needed (any list over 5 or 6 people long really needs some sort of order in my opinion). I like the idea of the time zone because then it gives people an idea of when you will be around as well. After time zone then first name should be used I think. Well that's my 2 cents anyway Regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw Good morning Phill Lubuntu Team, I hope you don't mind but I have gone through and changed the Time Zone column to the first column because if we're organising based up that it makes it easier to read if it's the first column (let me know if you don't agree). I have also organised them by the time zone data where it was available and put in a ? as a marker of where people can update their own. regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list
Jared, There is never an issue with you editing wiki pages! I just thew the column in to get some data in it. I was planning to get Daniel to re-order the table once there was some data on it. It's how padawans learn :) Regards, Phill. On 31 January 2011 23:55, Jared Norris jrnor...@gmail.com wrote: On 1 February 2011 03:21, Phill Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote: Hiyas Jared, I've added a Time Zone column, now I just need everyone to go back and edit their entries! I can see the sence in having it ordered by timezone. Once it is completed I can group it as per the idea at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors But, as ever, I await comments. Regards, Phill. On 31 January 2011 11:52, Jared Norris jrnor...@gmail.com wrote: On 31 January 2011 20:44, Phill Whiteside phi...@ubuntu.com wrote: Hiyas team, I've had a couple of people suggest that we put the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Get%20Involved/WhoWeAre page into some sort of order. I can do it by name, IRC nick or language (language being my preferred one), the other suggestion is that we add a time-zone column and order it by that. Let me know what you all think, I know adding a TZ column means you all have to and edit your entries. Let me know of you thoughts on the matter. Regards, Phill. -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktophttps://launchpad.net/%7Elubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktophttps://launchpad.net/%7Elubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp Phil, I think some sort of order will be needed (any list over 5 or 6 people long really needs some sort of order in my opinion). I like the idea of the time zone because then it gives people an idea of when you will be around as well. After time zone then first name should be used I think. Well that's my 2 cents anyway Regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw Good morning Phill Lubuntu Team, I hope you don't mind but I have gone through and changed the Time Zone column to the first column because if we're organising based up that it makes it easier to read if it's the first column (let me know if you don't agree). I have also organised them by the time zone data where it was available and put in a ? as a marker of where people can update their own. regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list
On 1 February 2011 10:16, Phill Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote: Jared, There is never an issue with you editing wiki pages! I just thew the column in to get some data in it. I was planning to get Daniel to re-order the table once there was some data on it. It's how padawans learn :) Regards, Phill. On 31 January 2011 23:55, Jared Norris jrnor...@gmail.com wrote: On 1 February 2011 03:21, Phill Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote: Hiyas Jared, I've added a Time Zone column, now I just need everyone to go back and edit their entries! I can see the sence in having it ordered by timezone. Once it is completed I can group it as per the idea at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors But, as ever, I await comments. Regards, Phill. On 31 January 2011 11:52, Jared Norris jrnor...@gmail.com wrote: On 31 January 2011 20:44, Phill Whiteside phi...@ubuntu.com wrote: Hiyas team, I've had a couple of people suggest that we put the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Get%20Involved/WhoWeAre page into some sort of order. I can do it by name, IRC nick or language (language being my preferred one), the other suggestion is that we add a time-zone column and order it by that. Let me know what you all think, I know adding a TZ column means you all have to and edit your entries. Let me know of you thoughts on the matter. Regards, Phill. -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp Phil, I think some sort of order will be needed (any list over 5 or 6 people long really needs some sort of order in my opinion). I like the idea of the time zone because then it gives people an idea of when you will be around as well. After time zone then first name should be used I think. Well that's my 2 cents anyway Regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw Good morning Phill Lubuntu Team, I hope you don't mind but I have gone through and changed the Time Zone column to the first column because if we're organising based up that it makes it easier to read if it's the first column (let me know if you don't agree). I have also organised them by the time zone data where it was available and put in a ? as a marker of where people can update their own. regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw Ah so sorry for stealing people's learning tools! I'll not touch it again for a while now :) Regards, Jared Norris https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list
On 01/31/2011 02:44 AM, Phill Whiteside wrote: I've had a couple of people suggest that we put the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Get%20Involved/WhoWeAre page into some sort of order. I can do it by name, IRC nick or language (language being my preferred one), ... Can we ask what purpose the ordering is expected to serve? In techie-speak, are there any use cases defined for this database? :) To me, language seems a slightly odd choice of primary sort key, especially since it is primary language only (some of us speak more than one)... and as long as I can communicate about with someone about Lubuntu in some language that we both know, I don't care all that much what their primary language is... I just want to communicate with them. Timezone info is on Launchpad anyway, assuming people set it (!), so it is currently just a click away from the WhoAreWe list. Do we need to duplicate that info on the wiki, and then update it in two places as we move around the world? Is the benefit worth the cost? Ordering by seniority or date added as it is now (longest-serving members at the top, new people add themselves to the end of the list) also has some value, as that is information which would be lost (well, except by laboriously looking back through wiki history) if the list were re-ordered at all. If we re-order, should a date-added column be introduced so that info is not accidentally lost? SUMMARY: This seems like a bike-shedding kind of a topic :) However, since you asked, I'd suggest order by date added -- in other words, leave it as it is. But I'm interested in hearing about use cases which are helped by a different ordering. Jonathan ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list (and editing information in multiple places)
On 01/31/2011 09:21 AM, Phill Whiteside wrote: I've added a Time Zone column, now I just need everyone to go back and edit their entries! I respectfully suggest that you don't really need everyone to do that :) If we need TZ info on this list (as opposed to one click away from the list as it is already), then why not use the TZ info that people have already put in their Launchpad accounts, instead of asking everyone to re-edit the Lubuntu-specific list to add that same info? Am I missing something? Ideally, write some little script to dynamically query LP for the TZ info, so that we each only have to edit our TZ in one place (on LP) when we move around :) Failing that, if we really have to statically duplicate this information, could I suggest we at least initialize the new column using the TZ data that is currently in LP for every LP user? Thinking about this a bit more broadly, there might even be a way to dynamically generate the entire WhoAreWe page by querying LP about members of ~lubuntu-desktop ?? Jonathan ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list (and editing information in multiple places)
On 02/01/2011 06:31 AM, Jonathan Marsden wrote: On 01/31/2011 09:21 AM, Phill Whiteside wrote: I've added a Time Zone column, now I just need everyone to go back and edit their entries! I respectfully suggest that you don't really need everyone to do that :) If we need TZ info on this list (as opposed to one click away from the list as it is already), then why not use the TZ info that people have already put in their Launchpad accounts, instead of asking everyone to re-edit the Lubuntu-specific list to add that same info? Am I missing something? Ideally, write some little script to dynamically query LP for the TZ info, so that we each only have to edit our TZ in one place (on LP) when we move around :) Failing that, if we really have to statically duplicate this information, could I suggest we at least initialize the new column using the TZ data that is currently in LP for every LP user? Thinking about this a bit more broadly, there might even be a way to dynamically generate the entire WhoAreWe page by querying LP about members of ~lubuntu-desktop ?? Jonathan As I've wondered this thing, I think there's really no need for time zones. Like most of you guys seems to live at night from my point of view (which is a normal point of view ;). And UTC is changed twice a year, there's winter time and summer time (daylight saving) and it requires editing to keep it up-to-date. I suggest to roll back to Revision 43 and keep the arrangement as latest addition in bottom. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list (and editing information in multiple places)
On 01/31/2011 08:31 PM, Jonathan Marsden wrote: I respectfully suggest that you don't really need everyone to do that :) Failing that, if we really have to statically duplicate this information, could I suggest we at least initialize the new column using the TZ data that is currently in LP for every LP user? In case anyone might think I am doing more complaining than positive actions here, I just added a pile of UTC times to the wiki page based on people's TZ settings on LP. Jonathan ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Members list (and editing information in multiple places)
On 01/31/2011 09:00 PM, Benny Hult wrote: ..., I think there's really no need for time zones. This comes back to use cases... Phill, why are people wanting TZ info on WhoWeAre? What are the likely uses that will be made of it? In practice, if this is intended for real time online communication, wouldn't something more useful be a column headed say Usually on #lubuntu between which might have entries like M-F: 0300-0700 UTC, Sa-Sun: 0200-0800 UTC or whatever? Like most of you guys seems to live at night from my point of view (which is a normal point of view ;). Most of us live continuously (few of us die and resurrect every day!). I think we often work or are at school during the day time, and so we have fun playing with computers (with Ubuntu and Lubuntu) during non-daytime. Isn't that normal? :) And UTC is changed twice a year, there's winter time and summer time (daylight saving) and it requires editing to keep it up-to-date. Right. Linux, Lubuntu and Launchpad all store TZ info as the usual (standard?) strings representing a relative path to a tzfile under /usr/share/zoneinfo/, like America/Los_Angeles or Europe/Berlin, and not as a UTC offset. Given one of those strings, a trivial TZ=:America/Los_Angeles date +%z will display the offset from UTC in your local bash shell, and it will be correct in both summer and winter :) Now, for maximum information correctness with minimum end-user effort, we just need the GPS in a cellphone to communicate with its owners laptop, so as they travel, the laptop knows and sets its current local timezone automatically ... and maybe, even, the laptop then auto-updates the owner's LP timezone entry whenever its TZ changes and the laptop has an Internet connection :) :) :) But even then, we would still have to return to the question of who will *use* the TZ info on LP (or on WhoWeAre), for what purposes :) Jonathan ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop Post to : lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
