Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Yorvyk]

For a bit more insight into Zentyal have a listen to Frostcast Episode 15, 
which interviews the founders.  http://frostbitemedia.org/
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Yorvyk]

On Fri, 12 Nov 2010 09:40:24 +
Liam Proven  wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 5:45 PM, Andrew Woodhead
>  wrote:
> > It may be a low resource gui but running an X server adds extra services
> > running which lowers security. There are also more things that can crash and
> > hang the system. Fewer complications make a better server.

Depends what the server is used for.  In smaller businesses a modern server 
really doesn’t get 'hammered' that much.

> 
> Personally, I'd tend to agree, but people coming across from Windows
> expect a GUI on a machine. A lot of modern Windows users never ever
> even look at the command line & have no idea how to use one - so a
> server that boots to nothing but a command line is going to be seen as
> scary and intimidating.

For the smaller business, with out a computer expert, a GUI is what they need 
and why Windows Servers are used.  I know one business where this software may 
be just the thing they’re looking for.  They’ve been using  OOo, Firefox and 
Thunderbird, on XP, for some time.  They’ve been using Ubuntu on one machine 
for a few months and are considering moving all machines to it, so an Ubuntu 
based server with a GUI would compliment their IT needs very nicely.

> 
> Zentyal makes a decent effort in this direction. A modern server will
> have gigs of RAM, a several-gigaHertz CPU and a graphics card, because
> you simply can't build a machine without these things any more. They
> picked a really lightweight desktop and stripped it right out to put
> Zentyal together, and that seems a good choice to me.

That is basically the spec of the server they have, overkill for what it does

> 
> I would like it if it were an optional install, to be honest, but it
> worked fine on a couple of test machines for me.
> 



-- 
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Liam Proven]

On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Benny Hult  wrote:
> On 11/11/2010 05:29 PM, matthew byers wrote:
>> Zentyal is nothing more then the old "all in one server" ebox! (i used it
>> before) This is not related to the Lubuntu distro. There are many linux
>> respins that use lxde. Lubuntu is not (unless hidden from the public) in any
>> way tailored to or around zentyal nor interacts with its development!
>>
>
> I agree.
> I've tried Zentyal I've found it horrible.
>
> I had some problems http://forum.zentyal.org/index.php?topic=5259.0
> and there was no resolution for it, so I made a rollback to pfSense and
> I'm once again a happy camper, becouse I noticed my problems with
> pfSense was that I changed shell from sh to zsh ;)
>
> Zentyal has a nice web interface, it's easy to install on fresh lubuntu,
> but after all: all eggs in a same basket is not that good thing when you
> think about it twice. And since it has a DNS problem like that (a very
> basic thing), I cannot suggest it.
>
> I don't want to bash it or anything, becouse some features seem to work
> perfectly, but as Gordon Ramsay says "less is more".
>
> Just my personal opinion about Zentyal, I really didnt never try the
> "Zentyal Desktop", but I think I didn't miss much.
>
> ps. Zentyal config saving is really annoying if you compare to pfSense.

I had problems too trying to make Zentyal a network gateway. Wiping &
reinstalling didn't help, nor did manually installing packages.

But it is not the same kind of product as pfSense, which is just a
firewall, as I understand it. Zentyal is an all-in-one integrated
server: file/print, email, web etc.

In that role, it worked absolutely fine for me and was really easy to
get working.

 Its rivals are things like ClearOS or SME Server, not firewalls such
as m0n0wall or Smoothwall.

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Liam Proven]

On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 5:45 PM, Andrew Woodhead
 wrote:
> It may be a low resource gui but running an X server adds extra services
> running which lowers security. There are also more things that can crash and
> hang the system. Fewer complications make a better server

Personally, I'd tend to agree, but people coming across from Windows
expect a GUI on a machine. A lot of modern Windows users never ever
even look at the command line & have no idea how to use one - so a
server that boots to nothing but a command line is going to be seen as
scary and intimidating.

Zentyal makes a decent effort in this direction. A modern server will
have gigs of RAM, a several-gigaHertz CPU and a graphics card, because
you simply can't build a machine without these things any more. They
picked a really lightweight desktop and stripped it right out to put
Zentyal together, and that seems a good choice to me.

I would like it if it were an optional install, to be honest, but it
worked fine on a couple of test machines for me.

And I thought the stripping-out of LXDE might be useful or relevant to
Lubuntu, but I'm beginning to regret saying anything now...! :¬)

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Benny Hult]

On 11/11/2010 05:29 PM, matthew byers wrote:
> Zentyal is nothing more then the old "all in one server" ebox! (i used it
> before) This is not related to the Lubuntu distro. There are many linux
> respins that use lxde. Lubuntu is not (unless hidden from the public) in any
> way tailored to or around zentyal nor interacts with its development!
> 

I agree.
I've tried Zentyal I've found it horrible.

I had some problems http://forum.zentyal.org/index.php?topic=5259.0
and there was no resolution for it, so I made a rollback to pfSense and
I'm once again a happy camper, becouse I noticed my problems with
pfSense was that I changed shell from sh to zsh ;)

Zentyal has a nice web interface, it's easy to install on fresh lubuntu,
but after all: all eggs in a same basket is not that good thing when you
think about it twice. And since it has a DNS problem like that (a very
basic thing), I cannot suggest it.

I don't want to bash it or anything, becouse some features seem to work
perfectly, but as Gordon Ramsay says "less is more".

Just my personal opinion about Zentyal, I really didnt never try the
"Zentyal Desktop", but I think I didn't miss much.

ps. Zentyal config saving is really annoying if you compare to pfSense.

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Liam Proven]

On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 3:43 PM, matthew byers  wrote:
> Well when you ask if there are any "connections or communications" it makes
> it seem as if your wondering if the two are connected. Better wording should
> be used next time maybe! ;)

Er, well, I actually thought it was perfectly clearly-worded myself.

> And look here for distros with
> lxde: http://wiki.lxde.org/en/Category:Linux_Distributions

That's a random assortment of distros that happen to /include/ LXDE,
not that are /based/ on LXDE. Lubuntu and Zentyal are both derived
from Ubuntu and use LXDE as their sole desktop, in other words, they
both form part of a single subgroup of the greater Ubuntu community.

I don't recognise any other linking factor in those distros, nor any
other Ubuntu derivatives. Are there any LXDE-*based* distros in that
list *that derive from Ubuntu* that you know of?

> and just because a distro uses a certain environment doesnt mean they need
> to have anything in common.

It does, rather, yes. Both are taking Ubuntu's default LXDE packages
and modifying them.

> Im not sure where you would see how a desktop
> spin like lubuntu and a server suite like zentyal have anything to do with
> each other? Maybe there is something im missint out of what you are
> suggesting??

Or maybe you are just missing it?

I'm not trying to be hostile here, but you seem not to be getting what
my mere suggestion was getting at and then aggressively blaming me for
this. I don't understand why.

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[matthew byers]

Well when you ask if there are any "connections or communications" it makes
it seem as if your wondering if the two are connected. Better wording should
be used next time maybe! ;)
And look here for distros with lxde:
http://wiki.lxde.org/en/Category:Linux_Distributions
and just because a
distro uses a certain environment doesnt mean they need to have anything in
common. Im not sure where you would see how a desktop spin like lubuntu and
a server suite like zentyal have anything to do with each other? Maybe there
is something im missint out of what you are suggesting??

On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 9:29 AM, Liam Proven  wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 6:24 AM, Andrew Woodhead
>  wrote:
> > A server OS with an X server, thats so not right
>
> Hey, neither is top-quoting, spelling "that's" without an apostrophe
> or ending a sentence without a full stop.
>
> Zentyal is not bad, actually. It doesn't need a GUI, but like Ubuntu,
> it's not optional - you get what they give you. And at least it's a
> low-resource GUI.
>
> --
> Liam Proven • Info & profile: http://www.google.com/profiles/lproven
> Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com
> Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Liam Proven]

On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 6:24 AM, Andrew Woodhead
 wrote:
> A server OS with an X server, thats so not right

Hey, neither is top-quoting, spelling "that's" without an apostrophe
or ending a sentence without a full stop.

Zentyal is not bad, actually. It doesn't need a GUI, but like Ubuntu,
it's not optional - you get what they give you. And at least it's a
low-resource GUI.

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[matthew byers]

Zentyal is nothing more then the old "all in one server" ebox! (i used it
before) This is not related to the Lubuntu distro. There are many linux
respins that use lxde. Lubuntu is not (unless hidden from the public) in any
way tailored to or around zentyal nor interacts with its development!

On Wed, Nov 10, 2010 at 9:11 PM, Liam Proven  wrote:

> I was wondering if there was any connection or communications between
> the Lubuntu team and that behind the Zentyal Ubuntu-based server
> distro, as its desktop too is based on LXDE. I'm not aware of any
> other Ubuntu remixes with LXDE.
>
> --
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> Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com
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[Lubuntu-desktop] Zentyal

[Liam Proven]

I was wondering if there was any connection or communications between
the Lubuntu team and that behind the Zentyal Ubuntu-based server
distro, as its desktop too is based on LXDE. I'm not aware of any
other Ubuntu remixes with LXDE.

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