at the office
Or maybe a cittern?
Mark
-Urspruengliche Nachricht-
Von: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] Im
Auftrag
von Monica Hall
Gesendet: Samstag, 19. Dezember 2009 12:43
An: tio...@gmail.com
Cc: Lutelist
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: another day
Well, there's Jewish tradition in between. Rich musical temple services
are described in the Babylonian Talmud, tractate Arakhin. Levites
playing all kinds of kinnorim (lyres), nevalim (harps), khatzotzerot
(trumpets), khalilim (flutes), tuppim (drum) and many others. The reason
why these
: another day at the office take two
Well, there's Jewish tradition in between. Rich musical temple services
are described in the Babylonian Talmud, tractate Arakhin. Levites
playing all kinds of kinnorim (lyres), nevalim (harps), khatzotzerot
(trumpets), khalilim (flutes), tuppim (drum) and many others
On Dec 21, 2009, at 6:48 AM, Monica Hall wrote:
But surely the prohibition applied only to playing musical
instruments in worship on the Sabbath not other days of the week.
As a practical matter, it did, probably because of the lost-Temple
business.
I seem to remember when doing some study
What can this debate be about?
In Italy during the 17th century, the guitar was never played at sacred
occasions because the Church had banned the guitar from service (one
counterexample will do to prove wrong)?
In Italy during the 17th century, composers would strictly exclude the
guitar from
Hi, all.
No specific counterexamples here, but in general having something
banned by the Church is not (IMHO) a reliable indicator that it was not
done.
I'll quote as best I can from a 16th century French writer (sorry,
can't remember the name, I'm sure someone here knows)
On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 1:59 AM, David Tayler vidan...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
So our day job is playing in a baroque orchestra to support our hobby
of playing in a baroque orchestra on original instruments.
:-)
Sort of, I suppose. When you've turned your hobby into your job, it's
nice to have a
Big money in baroque guitar?
Gary
- Original Message -
From: Martyn Hodgson hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
To: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 1:22 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Regarding
howard posner wrote:
On Dec 18, 2009, at 3:43 AM, Monica Hall wrote:
to which I would respond - is there any authority for David's
proposition other than his own whim?
I'm not sure what David's proposition is, but yours seems to be
something like, there was no church in Italy in the
They entered Jerusalem and went to the temple of the LORD with harps
and lutes and trumpets. .. and were brought to Jerusalem to celebrate
joyfully the dedication with songs of thanksgiving and with the music
of cymbals, harps and lyres... Accompanied by trumpets, cymbals and
other instruments,
...@ca.rr.com
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 11:00 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
howard posner wrote:
On Dec 18, 2009, at 3:43 AM, Monica Hall wrote:
to which I would respond - is there any authority for David's
proposition other than his own
On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 5:43 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
Just for the record - because 2010 is the 400 anniversary of the printing of
the Vespers the English periodical Early Music Review has articles on
Thank you, Monica, that's interesting. I will read it. And I will have
; howardpos...@ca.rr.com
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
To All:
While I trust Monica's expert opinion that guitars were not likely
found in concerted church music in the early 17th century, there
actually is evidence of loud winds doubling voices
Or evidence that anyone performed sober? Perhaps only on special occasions.
d
How about the proposition that there was no church in Italy in the
first half of the17th century in which the singers all performed in
the nude? Well.. who knows? But how likely is it?
Or evidence that anyone
a pattern or even a reference.
Ron Andrico
www.mignarda.com
Date: Sun, 20 Dec 2009 11:00:55 +
To: howardpos...@ca.rr.com
CC: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
From: s.wa...@ntlworld.com
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
howard posner wrote:
On Dec 18
was the revolution that begat
coffeehouse conversation, which in turm begat Kant and Hamann.
RT
- Original Message -
From: David Tayler vidan...@sbcglobal.net
To: lute-cs.dartmouth.edu lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 1:29 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
- Original Message - From: Stuart Walsh s.wa...@ntlworld.com
To: howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 11:00 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
howard posner wrote:
On Dec 18, 2009, at 3:43 AM, Monica Hall
-cs.dartmouth.edu lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 1:29 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Or evidence that anyone performed sober? Perhaps only on special occasions.
d
How about the proposition that there was no church in Italy in the
first half of the17th
And considering the average lifespan, it's a miracle that as much
culture and civilization as there was seems to have prevailed. We are
wrestling with a heritage left to us by world of underage alcoholics.
This certainly explains a lot.
Dan
Actually there is evidence of the opposite.
Before
Time for another series of your lute seminars. Plenty more Damilano
wine where that first bottle came from. They also do a Barolo.
That is exactly right. Any recreation of music would have to have
been semi intoxicated.
d
--
To get on or off this list see list information at
: another day at the office
And considering the average lifespan, it's a miracle that as much
culture and civilization as there was seems to have prevailed. We are
wrestling with a heritage left to us by world of underage alcoholics.
This certainly explains a lot.
Dan
Actually there is evidence
Ah, Roman- the happy optimist shows his face! The glass is at least
half-full of cheap Italian red, the stuff that courses through my
veins.
Dan
Average lifespan implies that anyone surviving infancy had a
reasonable shot at dying of plague at the age of 99, like Titian.
RT
--
To get on
Don't get me started on that. Otherwise I would have to mention those
recent archeological finds in the Bethlehem area, evidencing an ancient
musical band, called the Heavenly Hosts, whose prominent soloist was a
lute player. So famous he was for his finger style playing, that you can
still see
On Dec 20, 2009, at 3:00 AM, Stuart Walsh wrote:
How about the proposition that there was no church in Italy in the
first half of the17th century in which the singers all performed in
the nude? Well.. who knows? But how likely is it?
Neither likely nor apt as an analogy, since it doesn't
On Sunday 20 December 2009 2:32:36 pm howard posner wrote:
I'm guessing that just about any instrument would have been at one
time too secular for Christian worship. Instrumental music had a
long journey to become a part of Christian worship, which hasn't
concerned us much in this discussion
in that way.
Monica
- Original Message -
From: Guy Smith guy_m_sm...@comcast.net
To: 'Ron Andrico' praelu...@hotmail.com; s.wa...@ntlworld.com;
howardpos...@ca.rr.com
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 5:58 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
FWIW
: Sunday, December 20, 2009 6:47 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Actually there is evidence of the opposite.
Before coffee overtook Europe in 1648, people drank little water (as
unsafe), but mostly beer (beer soup as standard European breakfast). So
all Europeans were slightly
:52 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Since we know the uniformity rule is almost always true, we can
surmise that any work that establishes an unique performance practice
is most likely not true.
There just was no one way to perform the Vespers. The fact that
Monteverdi published
: Lutelist
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
In Spain in the 16th century the bajon was used to accompany chant although
what it seems to have been used for was to sound the appropriate pitch note
of each section so as to keep the singers on pitch. I think the plainchant
on Paul McCreech's
...@gmail.com
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 4:15 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
In England they drank small beer which I think is less alcoholic.
But in general they must have been very de-hydrated.
Monica
- Original Message -
From
durch
den Armenier Johannes Diodato eröffnet worden sein.
- Original Message -
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
To: Roman Turovsky r.turov...@gmail.com
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 4:15 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 8:32 PM, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:
of baroque guitars in churches; players were usually listed according
to their primary instrument regardless of what they actually played.
So we wouldn't know if Clyde della tiorba played guitar that Sunday.
I'm paid
On Sun, Dec 20, 2009 at 11:09 PM, Mathias Rösel
mathias.roe...@t-online.de wrote:
Roman Turovsky r.turov...@gmail.com schrieb:
In any event: a Ukrainian cossack, resident in Vienna is credited with hte
coffee revolution:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerzy_Franciszek_Kulczycki
and a
Sorry, left out a sentence, rendering the message rather obscure.
On Dec 20, 2009, at 11:32 AM, howard posner wrote:
Christian practice derives in large part from post-Temple Jewish
practice, in which, traditionally, instruments are forbidden in
services. Alexander points out that there are
It is pretty clear that certain composers did not write for the
guitar, and that there was among some church musicians a recognition
that the guitar is going to make more bad counterpoint--chords versus
line--than most other instruments.
We have a large enough statistical base to form some
I find it easy enough to focus on an old painting or manuscript and
slip back in time, but then maybe I'm delusional.
The lessons are great, however.
dt
We can never hear how the original audience heard. Which is not an
excuse to do anything you want, of course...
Rob
--
Monica,
We love you! Keep questioning everything!
Rob
--
To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
- Original Message -
From: tio...@gmail.com
What you think about the Cantabo Domino by Paolo Quagliati, (printed in
Fabio Costantini, Scelta di mottetti [...] libro secondo, Roma, Robletti
1618) where we have 2 pentagrams for the chitarra?
I made a mistake: there's just a continuo
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
To: David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Date: Friday, 18 December, 2009, 19:46
If it's not your whim and you are under duress from ill informed
conductors
then I owe you an apology
On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 8:46 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
you are under duress from ill informed conductors
That sums up nicely the position of any member of an orchestra-for-hire.
then I owe you an apology!
No offence given, none taken.
But briefly I don't think that the
Nearly on topic, there is this one book with Alfabeto plus B.C. from
begining to end; CANZONETTE, SPIRITUALI E MORALI, Che si cantano nell
Oratorio di Chiauena, eretto sotto la Protettione di S. Filippo
Neri...con le lettere della Chitarra Sopra Arie communi, e nuoue date
in luce
Sorry, it's called TIORBA FORTE...
F
I am not a player of either theorbo or Baroque guitar. But I've
heard
them in performances, and I've wondered how often the player has
made
the choice for the guitar simply because that way there is a
chance
On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 12:11 PM, Franz Mechsner
franz.mechs...@northumbria.ac.uk wrote:
Sorry, it's called TIORBA FORTE...
I think the discussion is lively enough to exclude liuti forti in
their various guises.
David - wonders why nobody mentioned the toy theorbo (single strung at
that), the
Thanks for the encouragment!
Monica
- Original Message -
From: Rob MacKillop luteplay...@googlemail.com
To: howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 9:01 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Monica
Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 9:02 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
- Original Message -
From: tio...@gmail.com
What you think about the Cantabo Domino by Paolo Quagliati, (printed in
Fabio Costantini, Scelta di mottetti [...] libro secondo, Roma, Robletti
1618
]Lutelist
Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 9:22 AM
Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Regarding conductor's (as opposed to player's) whims: almost all the
conductors/directors (both professional and amateur) I know or know of
are generally only too willing to defer
: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Nearly on topic, there is this one book with Alfabeto plus B.C. from
begining to end; CANZONETTE, SPIRITUALI E MORALI, Che si cantano nell
Oratorio di Chiauena, eretto sotto la Protettione di S. Filippo
Neri...con le lettere della Chitarra Sopra
God has very catholic tastes.
Monica
- Original Message -
From: Tom Draughon t...@heartistrymusic.com
To: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 11:54 PM
Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
My brother has
: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu im Auftrag von David van Ooijen
Gesendet: Sa 19.12.2009 12:18
An: Lute list
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 12:11 PM, Franz Mechsner
franz.mechs...@northumbria.ac.uk wrote:
Sorry, it's called TIORBA FORTE...
I
On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 1:22 PM, Franz Mechsner
franz.mechs...@northumbria.ac.uk wrote:
your answer hurts.
I am sorry it did. It was not intended, I can assure you. I think a
'normal' theorbo is loud enough in any orchestra, just plucking
basses, so for me the liuto (or theorbo) forte is not
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
That is interesting becuase if it just says chitarra it may not refer to
the 5-course guitar but rather to the 4-course mandora or possibly even
the chitarrone.
Never find any reference about the use of the 4 course mandora in Roma.
Also I think it's
, December 19, 2009 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
That is interesting becuase if it just says chitarra it may not refer
to the 5-course guitar but rather to the 4-course mandora or possibly
even the chitarrone.
Never find any
Or maybe a cittern?
Mark
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] Im Auftrag
von Monica Hall
Gesendet: Samstag, 19. Dezember 2009 12:43
An: tio...@gmail.com
Cc: Lutelist
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
That is interesting
' lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 4:51 PM
Subject: AW: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Or maybe a cittern?
Mark
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] Im Auftrag
von Monica Hall
Gesendet: Samstag, 19
] Im Auftrag
von Monica Hall
Gesendet: Samstag, 19. Dezember 2009 17:55
An: lute
Cc: Lutelist
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Why not? We tend to overlook this lovely instrument - but surely there
were a lot of them around - and with more than 4 courses if I remember
aright.
Monica
I have never actually played in a baroque orchestra, even though I
make my living exclusively by doing so. There is so much work I can
only take half of what is offered. But from the lute point of view we
are the most sensitive instrument to historical stringing.
If the violins, cellos and
On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 9:03 PM, David Tayler vidan...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
If the violins, cellos and double basses all used historical bridges,
which act like mutes, historical bass bars, all unvarnished gut
strings, and so on,
There's a group I play in (www.barokensembledeswaen.nl) where
On Dec 19, 2009, at 3:44 AM, Monica Hall wrote:
we should be cautiousl about claiming that what we do is historically
accurate.
And equally cautious about calling it historically inaccurate, or
wholly inappropriate, nonsense or corny.
--
To get on or off this list see list information at
So our day job is playing in a baroque orchestra to support our hobby
of playing in a baroque orchestra on original instruments.
dt
At 03:31 PM 12/19/2009, you wrote:
On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 9:03 PM, David Tayler vidan...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
If the violins, cellos and double basses all used
- Original Message -
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
I can't believe this - it is all nonsense. There is a difference between
sacred songs which may be dance like and intended to be performed in a
domestic setting and music to be performed in a liturgical context.
The problem with so many performers
...@gmail.com
To: Lutelist [3]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 5:34 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 5:57 PM, Monica Hall
[4]mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
[use of b-guitar in Monteverdi's Maria Vespers]
inappropriate
Yes - certain songs even in the secular repertoire were considered more
appropriate for the guitar than others.
Monica
- Original Message -
From: dc den...@free.fr
To: Lute list lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:40 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day
@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 9:37 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
I can't believe this - it is all nonsense. There is a difference between
sacred songs which may be dance like and intended to be performed in a
domestic
It is not about adding just another colour. By the percussive rhythm of
a guitar (with an effect almost like a snare drum, caused by excessive
forceful strumming) the whole character of the music can change.
Therefore it would be good to be well informed about the existence of
such
On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 12:43 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
to which I would respond - is there any authority for David's proposition
other than his own whim?
O dear, now it's suddenly my whim against the lack of evidence ( ...
is no evidence of lack c.). I'll pass your opinion
- From: howard posner
howardpos...@ca.rr.com
To: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:22 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
I think David's question was whether there was some authority for
this proposition other than yourself.
On Dec 17, 2009
With respect, Monica, it is clear that you are not a performer. It's
fairly easy to sit back and say 'you shouldn't do that because it
wasn't done' and quite another to be a professional musician earning
your crust, supporting a family, etc, and being booked to play a date.
As Professor Goldthwait Higginson Dorr, Ph.D. said:
'Madam, we are not musicians of the late Renaissance.'
Andrew
On 18 Dec 2009, at 12:41, Rob MacKillop wrote:
Period performance is ultimately
doomed, of course - our ears have heard Schoenberg, Hendrix,
Madonna.
We can never hear
I sympathise with you!
Monica
- Original Message -
From: jelmaa jel...@gmail.com
To: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 12:27 PM
Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
I think it is important to realize
: another day at the office
With respect, Monica, it is clear that you are not a performer. It's
fairly easy to sit back and say 'you shouldn't do that because it
wasn't done' and quite another to be a professional musician earning
your crust, supporting a family, etc, and being booked to play
-
From: David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com
To: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 12:20 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 12:43 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
wrote:
to which I would respond - is there any authority
My brother has this
nice idea that he just sits on a cloud switching channels until he
finds something he wants to listen to.
He's actually watching Britney Spears and Funniest
Cat videos on youtube right now...
Tom Draughon
Heartistry Music
http://www.heartistry.com
714 9th Avenue West
On Dec 18, 2009, at 3:43 AM, Monica Hall wrote:
to which I would respond - is there any authority for David's
proposition other than his own whim?
I'm not sure what David's proposition is, but yours seems to be
something like, there was no church in Italy in the first half of
the 17th century
Thanks David, nice strumming!
-Mensaje original-
De: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] En nombre
de David van Ooijen
Enviado el: jueves, 17 de diciembre de 2009 08:39
Para: lutelist Net
Asunto: [LUTE] another day at the office
May I ask what evidence there is that Monteverdi intended a baroque guitar
to be included in the continuo group in the Vespers?!!
I know you can take a white horse anywhere, perhaps even a white
elephant.but the baroque guitar? What ever next? the ukelele?
Monica
-
I suspect the same evidence that tells us of the general use of the
theorbo by JS Bach at St Thomas's Leipzig
MH
--- On Thu, 17/12/09, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
davidvanooi...@gmail.com
Cc: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:32 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
May I ask what evidence there is that Monteverdi intended a baroque guitar
to be included in the continuo group in the Vespers?!!
I know you can
at the office
I suspect the same evidence that tells us of the general use of the
theorbo by JS Bach at St Thomas's Leipzig
MH
--- On Thu, 17/12/09, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
From: Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
To: David
On Dec 17, 2009, at 6:32 AM, Monica Hall wrote:
May I ask what evidence there is that Monteverdi intended a baroque
guitar to be included in the continuo group in the Vespers?!!
That would be the least interesting of the performance practice
questions you could ask. You might also ask about
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
May I ask what evidence there is that Monteverdi intended a baroque guitar
to be included in the continuo group in the Vespers?!!
I have no idea, but your abundant use of exclamations marks after the
question mark tells
Well- if you have to be stuck in an office job, you've got one of the
better ones. Not as funny as The Office but much easier on the eyes
and especially the ears. Jeez, what a dress code!
--
To get on or off this list see list information at
To: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 3:47 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
wrote:
May I ask what evidence there is that Monteverdi intended a baroque
guitar
to be included
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 5:57 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
[use of b-guitar in Monteverdi's Maria Vespers]
inappropriate
Can you tell us why you think so?
David
--
***
David van Ooijen
davidvanooi...@gmail.com
www.davidvanooijen.nl
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 5:57 PM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
Getting on with the job doesn't wholly justify something which is wholly
inappropriate
Wholeheartedly agreed. My job for these 20-odd years includes playing
Monteverdi's Maria Vespers a number of times every year; it's
...but at least I listened to it.
Monica
- Original Message -
From: David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com
To: Lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 5:34 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 5:57 PM, Monica Hall mjlh
Very, very nice David! And nice kind of an office you have... ;)
And the baroque guitar really suits and adds up to certain parts of the
Maria vespers by Monteverdi. No question of that instrument being
inappropriate to the sacred music of M's time and place! There are lots
and lots of sacred
.
Monica
- Original Message -
From: wikla wi...@cs.helsinki.fi
To: David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com
Cc: lutelist Net Lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:13 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
Very, very nice David! And nice kind
]davidvanooi...@gmail.com
To: Lutelist [3]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 5:34 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 5:57 PM, Monica Hall
[4]mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
[use of b-guitar in Monteverdi's Maria Vespers
Peter Martin écrit:
Evidence of guitar in the 1610 Vespers: no.
Evidence of guitar with voice in Italy at this time: certainly. James
Tyler in his book The Early Guitar gives a four-page listing (pp 96-99)
of Italian printed songbooks with alfabeto, starting with Kapsperger in
1610
Here is Gerard Rebours, writing about the guitar in France, admittedly
not Italy, but early in the 17th century, in alfebeto-only times (as far
as publications are concerned):
...the guitar appeared in 'charivaris', in comical and grotesque
situations, associated with Spaniards or Italian
: jueves, 17 de diciembre de 2009 16:06
Para: wikla
CC: Lutelist
Asunto: [LUTE] Re: another day at the office
I can't believe this - it is all nonsense. There is a difference between
sacred songs which may be dance like and intended to be performed in a
domestic setting and music to be performed
I am not a player of either theorbo or Baroque guitar. But I've heard
them in performances, and I've wondered how often the player has made
the choice for the guitar simply because that way there is a chance it
will be heard. Sometimes the number of string players is too large, or
On Dec 17, 2009, at 2:54 PM, Suzanne and Wayne wrote:
But a
theorbo among a string orchestra of even 3/3/2/1 on a part will
simply
not be heard in my listening experience.
You mean you don't hear much of it as a discrete, identifiable
sound. What you don't know is how different the
I think David's question was whether there was some authority for
this proposition other than yourself.
On Dec 17, 2009, at 1:05 PM, Monica Hall wrote:
I can't believe this - it is all nonsense. There is a difference
between sacred songs which may be dance like and intended to be
performed
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