Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: So the term ERT is more or less dead and I'm opposed to reintroduce it. Well, as long as you are basically the only one advocating it here, you will have to revert it. It turns out that the majority does not support your arguments, so I reverted to the status

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: > > So the term "ERT" is > > more or less dead and I'm opposed to reintroduce it. > > Well, as long as you are basically the only one advocating it here, you > will have to revert it. It turns out that the majority does not support your arguments, so I reverted to the

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

everybody around has its own goal and its nothing wrong with it. If so, why do we then discuss such issues? Several developers proposed to reintroduce the term ERT. Fine, that means to change the menus, design a new toolbar button, revise all docs and Wiki-pages. I am not sure whether I am

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: I am not sure whether I am counted among the several developers but for the reconrd my proposal as it stands is: add in the section about TeX Code a paragraph about the term ERT, along with an index entry. i would support this. pavel

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

everybody around has its own goal and its nothing wrong with it. If so, why do we then discuss such issues? Several developers proposed to reintroduce the term ERT. Fine, that means to change the menus, design a new toolbar button, revise all docs and Wiki-pages. I am not sure whether I am

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > I am not sure whether I am counted among the "several developers" but > for the reconrd my proposal as it stands is: add in the section about > TeX Code a paragraph about the term ERT, along with an index entry. i would support this. pavel

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

On Tue, Nov 9, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller sp...@lyx.org wrote: Uwe Stöhr wrote:   * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) Sure, but 99.9% of the cases it is used for TeX. The docbook section of the docs explain that TeX code has to be used. I don't ask again, as

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 9 nov. 10 à 01:56, Uwe Stöhr a écrit : Am 08.11.2010 23:20, schrieb Jean-Marc Lasgouttes: The 2 occurrences in the code I now corrected are the inset label but as long as you don't change the inc-files you don't see a label for TeX code insets in LyX 1.6.x. I think it should reappear

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

I think it should reappear (maybe in tooltips). Some people do like it, and I can swear it will not kill any new user. It is not _that_ evil. I'm tired of such discussions. You haven't replied to my arguments and I don't understand why you don't consider that usability and intuitivity is

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: The decision was once made and I'm not the one to blame here. I only want to have consistency. Renaming the menu entry for LyX 2.0 to the one of 1.5.0 and all occurrences in the docs is, sorry, stupid. Playing ping-pong doesn't help in anyway and doesn't improve the

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

everybody around has its own goal and its nothing wrong with it. If so, why do we then discuss such issues? Several developers proposed to reintroduce the term ERT. Fine, that means to change the menus, design a new toolbar button, revise all docs and Wiki-pages. Sure we can do this, but

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: everybody around has its own goal and its nothing wrong with it. If so, why do we then discuss such issues? Several developers proposed to reintroduce the term ERT. Fine, that means to change the menus, design a new toolbar button, revise all docs and Wiki-pages. Sure we

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

On Tue, Nov 9, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: > Uwe Stöhr wrote: >>  > * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) >> >> Sure, but 99.9% of the cases it is used for TeX. The docbook section of >> the docs explain that TeX code has to be used. > > I don't

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 9 nov. 10 à 01:56, Uwe Stöhr a écrit : Am 08.11.2010 23:20, schrieb Jean-Marc Lasgouttes: The 2 occurrences in the code I now corrected are the inset label but as long as you don't change the inc-files you don't see a label for TeX code insets in LyX 1.6.x. I think it should reappear

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

> I think it should reappear (maybe in tooltips). Some people do like > it, and I can swear it will not kill any new user. It is not _that_ > evil. I'm tired of such discussions. You haven't replied to my arguments and I don't understand why you don't consider that usability and intuitivity is

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: > The decision was once made and I'm not the one to blame here. I only want > to have consistency. > Renaming the menu entry for LyX 2.0 to the one of 1.5.0 and all occurrences > in the docs is, sorry, stupid. Playing ping-pong doesn't help in anyway and > doesn't improve the

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

> everybody around has its own goal and its nothing wrong with it. If so, why do we then discuss such issues? Several developers proposed to reintroduce the term ERT. Fine, that means to change the menus, design a new toolbar button, revise all docs and Wiki-pages. Sure we can do this, but

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: > > everybody around has its own goal and its nothing wrong with it. > > If so, why do we then discuss such issues? Several developers proposed to > reintroduce the term ERT. Fine, that means to change the menus, design a > new toolbar button, revise all docs and Wiki-pages.

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Err, did we ever discuss this? Yes, about 2 years ago. Since LyX 1.6.0 almost all documentation files use TeX code. And also the menu entry in the insert menu was renamed. * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) We have to find an intuitive name and it is used in 99.95 of

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 8 nov. 10 à 20:16, Uwe Stöhr a écrit : Err, did we ever discuss this? Yes, 2 years a go or so. Since LyX 1.6.0 almost all documentation files use TeX code. * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity For long-term users yes, but not for new ones. And so? I

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Would you have a link? (or at least a time window)? http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.editors.lyx.general/55769 But parts of it seems to be missing :S.. Vincent

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Vincent van Ravesteijn wrote: Would you have a link? (or at least a time window)? http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.editors.lyx.general/55769 thanks for pointer since i also can't remember we discussed it. it somewhat strange to decide such things on users list :) But parts of it seems to be

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Am 08.11.2010 23:20, schrieb Jean-Marc Lasgouttes: Yes, 2 years a go or so. Since LyX 1.6.0 almost all documentation files use TeX code. * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity For long-term users yes, but not for new ones. And so? I fail to see the argument

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) Sure, but 99.9% of the cases it is used for TeX. The docbook section of the docs explain that TeX code has to be used. I don't ask again, as usual, where you got that statistics from, since it simply does not

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: And because the menu entry names it also TeX code. Which is, strictly taken, also not adequate. So the term ERT is more or less dead and I'm opposed to reintroduce it. Well, as long as you are basically the only one advocating it here, you will have to revert it. Jürgen

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

> Err, did we ever discuss this? Yes, about 2 years ago. Since LyX 1.6.0 almost all documentation files use "TeX code". And also the menu entry in the insert menu was renamed. > * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) We have to find an intuitive name and it is used in 99.95

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 8 nov. 10 à 20:16, Uwe Stöhr a écrit : > Err, did we ever discuss this? Yes, 2 years a go or so. Since LyX 1.6.0 almost all documentation files use "TeX code". > * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity For long-term users yes, but not for new ones. And so? I

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

> Would you have a link? (or at least a time window)? http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.editors.lyx.general/55769 But parts of it seems to be missing :S.. Vincent

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Vincent van Ravesteijn wrote: > > Would you have a link? (or at least a time window)? > > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.editors.lyx.general/55769 thanks for pointer since i also can't remember we discussed it. it somewhat strange to decide such things on users list :) > But parts of it seems to

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Am 08.11.2010 23:20, schrieb Jean-Marc Lasgouttes: Yes, 2 years a go or so. Since LyX 1.6.0 almost all documentation files use "TeX code". > * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity For long-term users yes, but not for new ones. And so? I fail to see the argument

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: > > * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) > > Sure, but 99.9% of the cases it is used for TeX. The docbook section of > the docs explain that TeX code has to be used. I don't ask again, as usual, where you got that statistics from, since it simply does not

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Uwe Stöhr wrote: > And because the menu entry names it also TeX code. Which is, strictly taken, also not adequate. > So the term "ERT" is > more or less dead and I'm opposed to reintroduce it. Well, as long as you are basically the only one advocating it here, you will have to revert it.

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 7 nov. 10 à 16:31, uwesto...@lyx.org a écrit : Log: stdinsets.inc, InsetERT.cpp: change ERT to TeX to be consistent - the documentation and all other menus use consequently since LyX 1.6.0 TeX-code because it turned out that ERT is a meaningless abbreviation for new users Err, did we

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Op 7-11-2010 22:19, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes schreef: Le 7 nov. 10 à 16:31, uwesto...@lyx.org a écrit : Log: stdinsets.inc, InsetERT.cpp: change ERT to TeX to be consistent - the documentation and all other menus use consequently since LyX 1.6.0 TeX-code because it turned out that ERT is a

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: Err, did we ever discuss this? I am personally for keeping ERT. * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity i have very similar feelings here. pavel

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 7 nov. 10 à 22:30, Vincent van Ravesteijn a écrit : Yes. Users thought we were being unrespectful to (La)TeX by calling it evil. Look back in the archives ;). Would you have a link? (or at least a time window)? This is very interesting. The church of TeX? JMarc

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

On Sun, Nov 07, 2010 at 10:43:40PM +0100, Pavel Sanda wrote: Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: Err, did we ever discuss this? I am personally for keeping ERT. * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity i have very similar feelings here. +1 -- Enrico

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 10:19 PM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: Personally, I would appreciate to see that removed. And we should probably do an ffort to explain why this is named ERT and why using it is not some kind of silver bullet. And yes, I do use some ERT in my

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: Err, did we ever discuss this? I am personally for keeping ERT. +1. * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) And it's not even TeX in the most cases (but LaTeX). Jürgen

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 7 nov. 10 à 16:31, uwesto...@lyx.org a écrit : Log: stdinsets.inc, InsetERT.cpp: change "ERT" to "TeX" to be consistent - the documentation and all other menus use consequently since LyX 1.6.0 "TeX-code" because it turned out that ERT is a meaningless abbreviation for new users Err,

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Op 7-11-2010 22:19, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes schreef: Le 7 nov. 10 à 16:31, uwesto...@lyx.org a écrit : Log: stdinsets.inc, InsetERT.cpp: change "ERT" to "TeX" to be consistent - the documentation and all other menus use consequently since LyX 1.6.0 "TeX-code" because it turned out that ERT is a

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > > Err, did we ever discuss this? > > I am personally for keeping ERT. > > * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity i have very similar feelings here. pavel

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Le 7 nov. 10 à 22:30, Vincent van Ravesteijn a écrit : Yes. Users thought we were being unrespectful to (La)TeX by calling it evil. Look back in the archives ;). Would you have a link? (or at least a time window)? This is very interesting. The church of TeX? JMarc

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

On Sun, Nov 07, 2010 at 10:43:40PM +0100, Pavel Sanda wrote: > Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > > > > Err, did we ever discuss this? > > > > I am personally for keeping ERT. > > > > * it has been named like that for ages and is part of LyX identity > > i have very similar feelings here. +1 --

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 10:19 PM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > Personally, I would appreciate to see that removed. And we should probably > do > an ffort to explain why this is named ERT and why using it is not some kind > of > silver bullet. And yes, I do use some ERT in my

Re: r36189 - in lyx-devel/trunk: lib/layouts src/insets

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > Err, did we ever discuss this? > > I am personally for keeping ERT. +1. > * this is not used only for TeX (works in docbook AFAIK) And it's not even TeX in the most cases (but LaTeX). Jürgen