Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-07-05 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 03:25 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 14:38:23 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:


On 06/11/2013 02:03 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:


On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML,
simple HTML, or who knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
might look something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
  outputNamelatexlayout.layout/myemphL
  outputTypeCommand
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
  outputNamesimphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
  outputTypeInlineTag
else outputtype == msword
  outputNamewinwordlayout.layout/myemphW
  outputTypeCharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check
inside the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one
output type at a time without getting errors from the ones you
haven't developed yet.

This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't
provided for in the layout files.

Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be
surprised if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML
export you want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably.
Try as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to p, nor could I
get Section to map to h1, etc.

If you want to send me your layout file, I will get it working.

Richard

Thanks Richard,

I'm sending you an entire tarballed directory tree with a minimal
example. As you'll see, LyxHTML convert respects my HTMLtag configs in
my layout file, except for mapping of Section and Subsection to h1
and h2 respectively, instead it maps to h1 and h3 respectively.


This is because you mis-spelled the layout name: It should be
Subsection, not SubSection. Same for Subsubsection and for
Subparagraph. These have to match what is in stdclass.inc, which
you are including, and which in turn includes stdsections.inc.

If you look on the paragraph style drop down, you will see that you
are getting new styles instead of modifying the old ones.


Convert to HTML does not respect my layout file's HTMLTag configs at
all.


That is because eLyXer does not know anything about layout files.
(It also does not know what LyX knows about translation.) As I said
in a separate message, this is in large part because it is not part of
LyX.

Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-07-05 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 03:25 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 14:38:23 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:


On 06/11/2013 02:03 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:


On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML,
simple HTML, or who knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
might look something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
  outputNamelatexlayout.layout/myemphL
  outputTypeCommand
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
  outputNamesimphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
  outputTypeInlineTag
else outputtype == msword
  outputNamewinwordlayout.layout/myemphW
  outputTypeCharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check
inside the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one
output type at a time without getting errors from the ones you
haven't developed yet.

This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't
provided for in the layout files.

Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be
surprised if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML
export you want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably.
Try as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to p, nor could I
get Section to map to h1, etc.

If you want to send me your layout file, I will get it working.

Richard

Thanks Richard,

I'm sending you an entire tarballed directory tree with a minimal
example. As you'll see, LyxHTML convert respects my HTMLtag configs in
my layout file, except for mapping of Section and Subsection to h1
and h2 respectively, instead it maps to h1 and h3 respectively.


This is because you mis-spelled the layout name: It should be
Subsection, not SubSection. Same for Subsubsection and for
Subparagraph. These have to match what is in stdclass.inc, which
you are including, and which in turn includes stdsections.inc.

If you look on the paragraph style drop down, you will see that you
are getting new styles instead of modifying the old ones.


Convert to HTML does not respect my layout file's HTMLTag configs at
all.


That is because eLyXer does not know anything about layout files.
(It also does not know what LyX knows about translation.) As I said
in a separate message, this is in large part because it is not part of
LyX.

Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-07-05 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 03:25 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 14:38:23 -0400
Richard Heck  wrote:


On 06/11/2013 02:03 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck  wrote:


On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML,
simple HTML, or who knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
might look something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
  outputNamelatexlayout.layout/myemphL
  outputTypeCommand
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
  outputNamesimphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
  outputTypeInlineTag
else outputtype == msword
  outputNamewinwordlayout.layout/myemphW
  outputTypeCharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check
inside the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one
output type at a time without getting errors from the ones you
haven't developed yet.

This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't
provided for in the layout files.

Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be
surprised if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML
export you want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably.
Try as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to , nor could I
get Section to map to , etc.

If you want to send me your layout file, I will get it working.

Richard

Thanks Richard,

I'm sending you an entire tarballed directory tree with a minimal
example. As you'll see, LyxHTML convert respects my HTMLtag configs in
my layout file, except for mapping of Section and Subsection to 
and  respectively, instead it maps to  and  respectively.


This is because you mis-spelled the layout name: It should be
"Subsection", not "SubSection". Same for "Subsubsection" and for
"Subparagraph". These have to match what is in stdclass.inc, which
you are including, and which in turn includes stdsections.inc.

If you look on the paragraph style drop down, you will see that you
are getting new styles instead of modifying the old ones.


Convert to HTML does not respect my layout file's HTMLTag configs at
all.


That is because eLyXer does not know anything about layout files.
(It also does not know what LyX knows about translation.) As I said
in a separate message, this is in large part because it is not part of
LyX.

Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the proper
styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX file could be
used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple HTML, or who
knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the output
side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side might look
something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
outputName  latexlayout.layout/myemphL
outputType  Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
outputName  simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
outputType  InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
outputName  winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
outputType  CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside the
output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output type at a
time without getting errors from the ones you haven't developed yet.


This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine 
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't 
provided for in the layout files.


Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised if 
it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you want 
simply by writing a new layout file.


Richard



It seems to me that something like this would be a logical way of
turning LyX into a universal front end while changing very little of
LyX's core code.

I'm not a good enough programmer to do this in C++, so feel free to view
this suggestion with some healthy skepticism.

Thanks,

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance




Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread stefano franchi
On Tue, Jun 11, 2013 at 9:32 AM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:

 On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

 This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine anything
 you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't provided for in
 the layout files.

 Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised if it
 were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you want simply
 by writing a new layout file



Richard,

I just spent the last hour converting a short (2800 words)  lyx/pdf file
into Word. Could you tell me where I should look to fix the problems I
detail below?

Setup: Lyx + memoir + biblatex = Biber. Usually typeset to pdf with
lualatex. . File contained two images (in floats, reduced from the
originals by latex) Archlinux box with TL2012

I tried the elyxer routes (both regular and html(word)) and they failed
with too many errors to report here. I then exported to xhtml, imported
into abiword and exported to doc format. Opened it it libreoffice for final
cleanup.

Here are the problems I found. My guess is that part of these are LyX/XHMTL
issues and part are due to AbiWord.

1. Bibliography did not come over and was just ignored. I had to copy and
paste from the pdf output. Biblatex issue?

2. Footnote text came over but not as a footnote. It was just pasted in the
correct location but as a regular text.

3. Latex special character issues: em-dash as triple hyphen came over as
a triple hyphen and not as an em-dash. tilde as non-breaking space (I
routinely use that in references) came over as tilde.

4. Images were pasted more or less where the floats were inserted, at full
original size.

5. Captions followed the images as regular text.

6. Formatting of the paragraph environment was lost (I guess it's too
deeply nested to have a corresponding h level?)

Are these issues that a proper layout file would sort out?


Cheers,

Stefano

-- 
__
Stefano Franchi
Associate Research Professor
Department of Hispanic StudiesPh:   +1 (979) 845-2125
Texas AM University  Fax:  +1 (979) 845-6421
College Station, Texas, USA

stef...@tamu.edu
http://stefano.cleinias.org


Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:

 On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
  These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
  proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
  file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple
  HTML, or who knows what else.
 
  To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
  should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
  output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
  might look something like this:
 
  CharStyle MyEmph
  Font
  Shape Italic
  EndFont
 
  if outputtype == latex
  outputName  latexlayout.layout/myemphL
  outputType  Command
  elsif outputtype == simplehtml
  outputName  simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
  outputType  InlineTag
  else outputtype == msword
  outputName  winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
  outputType  CharacterStyle
  End
 
  Environments would be similar.
 
  Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside
  the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output
  type at a time without getting errors from the ones you haven't
  developed yet.
 
 This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine 
 anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't 
 provided for in the layout files.
 
 Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised
 if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you
 want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably. Try
as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to p, nor could I get
Section to map to h1, etc.

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance


Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 01:18 PM, stefano franchi wrote:



Here are the problems I found. My guess is that part of these are 
LyX/XHMTL issues and part are due to AbiWord.


1. Bibliography did not come over and was just ignored. I had to copy 
and paste from the pdf output. Biblatex issue?


Probably. If there's no BibTeX inset, then the bibliography will not be 
produced, and I guess you don't have that for BibLaTeX, except maybe in 
a note. So this is really an effect of the fact that we have no formal 
support for BibLaTeX.


2. Footnote text came over but not as a footnote. It was just pasted 
in the correct location but as a regular text.


Footnotes are just exported as div's, with class=footnote, so AbiWord 
or whatever will not recognize it as a footnote. There's not really any 
HTML equivalent of a footnote, so I'm not sure there is much to be done 
here.


3. Latex special character issues: em-dash as triple hyphen came 
over as a triple hyphen and not as an em-dash. tilde as non-breaking 
space (I routinely use that in references) came over as tilde.


The em-dash SHOULD be exported as such. There's code in 
Paragraph::simpleLyXHTMLOnePar() that is supposed to handle this. It 
works for me in a simple test document.


The tilde is a different story. Can you file a bug about that? We do 
some LaTeX -- HTML conversion here, handling things like \u, so I just 
need to add handling of ~.


4. Images were pasted more or less where the floats were inserted, at 
full original size.


Another bug. I suppose we should scale them somehow? Please post a bug 
about this, too.


There's not really anything to do other than put the images where they 
are inserted. HTML has no concept of a page, so the placement options 
make no sense.



5. Captions followed the images as regular text.


Similar to the footnote problem, I think. Probably we should switch to 
using the new figure tag and the associated figcaption tag. Can you 
also file a bug about that?


6. Formatting of the paragraph environment was lost (I guess it's 
too deeply nested to have a corresponding h level?)


I forgot to include a tag for those. I've just fixed that for the next 
release. See

http://git.lyx.org/?p=lyx.git;a=commit;h=c6a08bc4421c960dc8148a95eb68ba90c2f95ff5
for the commit.

Sorry to ask for so much bug-filing. With 2.1 on the horizon, I can't do 
very much right now, as Vincent has trunk pretty locked.


Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 02:03 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:


On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple
HTML, or who knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
might look something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
 outputName latexlayout.layout/myemphL
 outputType Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
 outputName simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
 outputType InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
 outputName winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
 outputType CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside
the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output
type at a time without getting errors from the ones you haven't
developed yet.

This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't
provided for in the layout files.

Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised
if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you
want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably. Try
as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to p, nor could I get
Section to map to h1, etc.


If you want to send me your layout file, I will get it working.

Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the proper
styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX file could be
used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple HTML, or who
knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the output
side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side might look
something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
outputName  latexlayout.layout/myemphL
outputType  Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
outputName  simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
outputType  InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
outputName  winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
outputType  CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside the
output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output type at a
time without getting errors from the ones you haven't developed yet.


This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine 
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't 
provided for in the layout files.


Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised if 
it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you want 
simply by writing a new layout file.


Richard



It seems to me that something like this would be a logical way of
turning LyX into a universal front end while changing very little of
LyX's core code.

I'm not a good enough programmer to do this in C++, so feel free to view
this suggestion with some healthy skepticism.

Thanks,

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance




Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread stefano franchi
On Tue, Jun 11, 2013 at 9:32 AM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:

 On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

 This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine anything
 you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't provided for in
 the layout files.

 Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised if it
 were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you want simply
 by writing a new layout file



Richard,

I just spent the last hour converting a short (2800 words)  lyx/pdf file
into Word. Could you tell me where I should look to fix the problems I
detail below?

Setup: Lyx + memoir + biblatex = Biber. Usually typeset to pdf with
lualatex. . File contained two images (in floats, reduced from the
originals by latex) Archlinux box with TL2012

I tried the elyxer routes (both regular and html(word)) and they failed
with too many errors to report here. I then exported to xhtml, imported
into abiword and exported to doc format. Opened it it libreoffice for final
cleanup.

Here are the problems I found. My guess is that part of these are LyX/XHMTL
issues and part are due to AbiWord.

1. Bibliography did not come over and was just ignored. I had to copy and
paste from the pdf output. Biblatex issue?

2. Footnote text came over but not as a footnote. It was just pasted in the
correct location but as a regular text.

3. Latex special character issues: em-dash as triple hyphen came over as
a triple hyphen and not as an em-dash. tilde as non-breaking space (I
routinely use that in references) came over as tilde.

4. Images were pasted more or less where the floats were inserted, at full
original size.

5. Captions followed the images as regular text.

6. Formatting of the paragraph environment was lost (I guess it's too
deeply nested to have a corresponding h level?)

Are these issues that a proper layout file would sort out?


Cheers,

Stefano

-- 
__
Stefano Franchi
Associate Research Professor
Department of Hispanic StudiesPh:   +1 (979) 845-2125
Texas AM University  Fax:  +1 (979) 845-6421
College Station, Texas, USA

stef...@tamu.edu
http://stefano.cleinias.org


Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:

 On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
  These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
  proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
  file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple
  HTML, or who knows what else.
 
  To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
  should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
  output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
  might look something like this:
 
  CharStyle MyEmph
  Font
  Shape Italic
  EndFont
 
  if outputtype == latex
  outputName  latexlayout.layout/myemphL
  outputType  Command
  elsif outputtype == simplehtml
  outputName  simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
  outputType  InlineTag
  else outputtype == msword
  outputName  winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
  outputType  CharacterStyle
  End
 
  Environments would be similar.
 
  Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside
  the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output
  type at a time without getting errors from the ones you haven't
  developed yet.
 
 This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine 
 anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't 
 provided for in the layout files.
 
 Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised
 if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you
 want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably. Try
as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to p, nor could I get
Section to map to h1, etc.

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance


Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 01:18 PM, stefano franchi wrote:



Here are the problems I found. My guess is that part of these are 
LyX/XHMTL issues and part are due to AbiWord.


1. Bibliography did not come over and was just ignored. I had to copy 
and paste from the pdf output. Biblatex issue?


Probably. If there's no BibTeX inset, then the bibliography will not be 
produced, and I guess you don't have that for BibLaTeX, except maybe in 
a note. So this is really an effect of the fact that we have no formal 
support for BibLaTeX.


2. Footnote text came over but not as a footnote. It was just pasted 
in the correct location but as a regular text.


Footnotes are just exported as div's, with class=footnote, so AbiWord 
or whatever will not recognize it as a footnote. There's not really any 
HTML equivalent of a footnote, so I'm not sure there is much to be done 
here.


3. Latex special character issues: em-dash as triple hyphen came 
over as a triple hyphen and not as an em-dash. tilde as non-breaking 
space (I routinely use that in references) came over as tilde.


The em-dash SHOULD be exported as such. There's code in 
Paragraph::simpleLyXHTMLOnePar() that is supposed to handle this. It 
works for me in a simple test document.


The tilde is a different story. Can you file a bug about that? We do 
some LaTeX -- HTML conversion here, handling things like \u, so I just 
need to add handling of ~.


4. Images were pasted more or less where the floats were inserted, at 
full original size.


Another bug. I suppose we should scale them somehow? Please post a bug 
about this, too.


There's not really anything to do other than put the images where they 
are inserted. HTML has no concept of a page, so the placement options 
make no sense.



5. Captions followed the images as regular text.


Similar to the footnote problem, I think. Probably we should switch to 
using the new figure tag and the associated figcaption tag. Can you 
also file a bug about that?


6. Formatting of the paragraph environment was lost (I guess it's 
too deeply nested to have a corresponding h level?)


I forgot to include a tag for those. I've just fixed that for the next 
release. See

http://git.lyx.org/?p=lyx.git;a=commit;h=c6a08bc4421c960dc8148a95eb68ba90c2f95ff5
for the commit.

Sorry to ask for so much bug-filing. With 2.1 on the horizon, I can't do 
very much right now, as Vincent has trunk pretty locked.


Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 02:03 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:


On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple
HTML, or who knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
might look something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
 outputName latexlayout.layout/myemphL
 outputType Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
 outputName simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
 outputType InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
 outputName winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
 outputType CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside
the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output
type at a time without getting errors from the ones you haven't
developed yet.

This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't
provided for in the layout files.

Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised
if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you
want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably. Try
as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to p, nor could I get
Section to map to h1, etc.


If you want to send me your layout file, I will get it working.

Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the proper
styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX file could be
used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple HTML, or who
knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the output
side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side might look
something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
outputName  latexlayout.layout/myemphL
outputType  Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
outputName  simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
outputType  InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
outputName  winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
outputType  CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside the
output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output type at a
time without getting errors from the ones you haven't developed yet.


This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine 
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't 
provided for in the layout files.


Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised if 
it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you want 
simply by writing a new layout file.


Richard



It seems to me that something like this would be a logical way of
turning LyX into a universal front end while changing very little of
LyX's core code.

I'm not a good enough programmer to do this in C++, so feel free to view
this suggestion with some healthy skepticism.

Thanks,

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance




Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread stefano franchi
On Tue, Jun 11, 2013 at 9:32 AM, Richard Heck  wrote:

> On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
>
> This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine anything
> you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't provided for in
> the layout files.
>
> Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised if it
> were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you want simply
> by writing a new layout file



Richard,

I just spent the last hour converting a short (2800 words)  lyx/pdf file
into Word. Could you tell me where I should look to fix the problems I
detail below?

Setup: Lyx + memoir + biblatex = Biber. Usually typeset to pdf with
lualatex. . File contained two images (in floats, reduced from the
originals by latex) Archlinux box with TL2012

I tried the elyxer routes (both regular and html(word)) and they failed
with too many errors to report here. I then exported to xhtml, imported
into abiword and exported to doc format. Opened it it libreoffice for final
cleanup.

Here are the problems I found. My guess is that part of these are LyX/XHMTL
issues and part are due to AbiWord.

1. Bibliography did not come over and was just ignored. I had to copy and
paste from the pdf output. Biblatex issue?

2. Footnote text came over but not as a footnote. It was just pasted in the
correct location but as a regular text.

3. Latex special character issues: "em-dash as triple hyphen" came over as
a triple hyphen and not as an em-dash. "tilde as non-breaking space" (I
routinely use that in references) came over as tilde.

4. Images were pasted more or less where the floats were inserted, at full
original size.

5. Captions followed the images as regular text.

6. Formatting of the "paragraph" environment was lost (I guess it's too
deeply nested to have a corresponding h level?)

Are these issues that a proper layout file would sort out?


Cheers,

Stefano

-- 
__
Stefano Franchi
Associate Research Professor
Department of Hispanic StudiesPh:   +1 (979) 845-2125
Texas A University  Fax:  +1 (979) 845-6421
College Station, Texas, USA

stef...@tamu.edu
http://stefano.cleinias.org


Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck  wrote:

> On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
> > These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
> > proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
> > file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple
> > HTML, or who knows what else.
> >
> > To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
> > should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
> > output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
> > might look something like this:
> >
> > CharStyle MyEmph
> > Font
> > Shape Italic
> > EndFont
> >
> > if outputtype == latex
> > outputName  latexlayout.layout/myemphL
> > outputType  Command
> > elsif outputtype == simplehtml
> > outputName  simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
> > outputType  InlineTag
> > else outputtype == msword
> > outputName  winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
> > outputType  CharacterStyle
> > End
> >
> > Environments would be similar.
> >
> > Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside
> > the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output
> > type at a time without getting errors from the ones you haven't
> > developed yet.
> 
> This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine 
> anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't 
> provided for in the layout files.
> 
> Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised
> if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you
> want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably. Try
as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to , nor could I get
Section to map to , etc.

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance


Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 01:18 PM, stefano franchi wrote:



Here are the problems I found. My guess is that part of these are 
LyX/XHMTL issues and part are due to AbiWord.


1. Bibliography did not come over and was just ignored. I had to copy 
and paste from the pdf output. Biblatex issue?


Probably. If there's no BibTeX inset, then the bibliography will not be 
produced, and I guess you don't have that for BibLaTeX, except maybe in 
a note. So this is really an effect of the fact that we have no formal 
support for BibLaTeX.


2. Footnote text came over but not as a footnote. It was just pasted 
in the correct location but as a regular text.


Footnotes are just exported as div's, with class="footnote", so AbiWord 
or whatever will not recognize it as a footnote. There's not really any 
HTML equivalent of a footnote, so I'm not sure there is much to be done 
here.


3. Latex special character issues: "em-dash as triple hyphen" came 
over as a triple hyphen and not as an em-dash. "tilde as non-breaking 
space" (I routinely use that in references) came over as tilde.


The em-dash SHOULD be exported as such. There's code in 
Paragraph::simpleLyXHTMLOnePar() that is supposed to handle this. It 
works for me in a simple test document.


The tilde is a different story. Can you file a bug about that? We do 
some LaTeX --> HTML conversion here, handling things like \"u, so I just 
need to add handling of ~.


4. Images were pasted more or less where the floats were inserted, at 
full original size.


Another bug. I suppose we should scale them somehow? Please post a bug 
about this, too.


There's not really anything to do other than put the images where they 
are inserted. HTML has no concept of a "page", so the placement options 
make no sense.



5. Captions followed the images as regular text.


Similar to the footnote problem, I think. Probably we should switch to 
using the new  tag and the associated  tag. Can you 
also file a bug about that?


6. Formatting of the "paragraph" environment was lost (I guess it's 
too deeply nested to have a corresponding h level?)


I forgot to include a tag for those. I've just fixed that for the next 
release. See

http://git.lyx.org/?p=lyx.git;a=commit;h=c6a08bc4421c960dc8148a95eb68ba90c2f95ff5
for the commit.

Sorry to ask for so much bug-filing. With 2.1 on the horizon, I can't do 
very much right now, as Vincent has trunk pretty locked.


Richard



Re: Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-11 Thread Richard Heck

On 06/11/2013 02:03 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:32:12 -0400
Richard Heck  wrote:


On 06/10/2013 06:05 PM, Steve Litt wrote:

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the
proper styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX
file could be used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple
HTML, or who knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the
output side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side
might look something like this:

CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
 outputName latexlayout.layout/myemphL
 outputType Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
 outputName simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
 outputType InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
 outputName winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
 outputType CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside
the output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output
type at a time without getting errors from the ones you haven't
developed yet.

This can already be done, more or less. That is, I can't imagine
anything you'd want to do, as far as XHTML export goes, that isn't
provided for in the layout files.

Indeed, I am sufficiently confident about this that I'd be surprised
if it were not possible to build the sort of simple HTML export you
want simply by writing a new layout file.

Thanks Richard,

When I tried to do this with my layout file, it failed miserably. Try
as I might, I couldn't get Standard to map to , nor could I get
Section to map to , etc.


If you want to send me your layout file, I will get it working.

Richard



Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-10 Thread Steve Litt
On Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:02:15 -0500
stefano franchi stefano.fran...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 1:44 PM, Les Denham lden...@hal-pc.org
 wrote:

  I use LyX rather than Word (or its clones) because it allows me to
  produce a presentable document in about half the time it takes with
  Word. This is emphatically the case if it is a document requiring a
  detailed table of contents, an index, or a bibliography, or if it
  contains figures, cross-references or footnotes.
 
 
 I guess that's the very reason why we all use LyX. I certainly
 wouldn't be as productive in Word. But those of us working in the
 Humanities (at least some Humanities) then have to budget some time
 to convert the output to Word. Nothing else is accepted. I tend to
 think best-sellers authors' position is closer to us than to a
 physicist's, a mathematician's or a logician's. That's why a minimal
 and yet reliable LyX-to-Doc converter---a topic we've repeatedly
 discussed on the list---would make such a difference to the
 non-technical user, IMHO.

Stephano, you bring up an important point...

Ten years ago, I used LyX only because it was a front end to LaTeX. Now
I use it because it's an ultra-fast, styles-enforcing wordprocessor.
I've used it to make Kindle eBook (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B006QTBLA2),
which has absolutely nothing to do with LaTeX. Now I'm making a
converter to make it do simple HTML like you'd find on a web page,
rather than as input to an eBook. One thing perhaps I haven't
appreciated til now is what a good, fast and efficient wordprocessor
LyX is. It knows when you press space twice it was a mistake and only
prints one space. It knows when you press Enter twice that it's a
mistake and prints only one. It makes fingerprinting difficult, which
is just what I want. And I've never had LyX lose my work.

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the proper
styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX file could be
used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple HTML, or who
knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the output
side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side might look
something like this:



CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
   outputName   latexlayout.layout/myemphL
   outputType   Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
   outputName   simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
   outputType   InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
   outputName   winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
   outputType   CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside the
output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output type at a
time without getting errors from the ones you haven't developed yet.

It seems to me that something like this would be a logical way of
turning LyX into a universal front end while changing very little of
LyX's core code.

I'm not a good enough programmer to do this in C++, so feel free to view
this suggestion with some healthy skepticism.

Thanks,

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance


Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-10 Thread Steve Litt
On Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:02:15 -0500
stefano franchi stefano.fran...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 1:44 PM, Les Denham lden...@hal-pc.org
 wrote:

  I use LyX rather than Word (or its clones) because it allows me to
  produce a presentable document in about half the time it takes with
  Word. This is emphatically the case if it is a document requiring a
  detailed table of contents, an index, or a bibliography, or if it
  contains figures, cross-references or footnotes.
 
 
 I guess that's the very reason why we all use LyX. I certainly
 wouldn't be as productive in Word. But those of us working in the
 Humanities (at least some Humanities) then have to budget some time
 to convert the output to Word. Nothing else is accepted. I tend to
 think best-sellers authors' position is closer to us than to a
 physicist's, a mathematician's or a logician's. That's why a minimal
 and yet reliable LyX-to-Doc converter---a topic we've repeatedly
 discussed on the list---would make such a difference to the
 non-technical user, IMHO.

Stephano, you bring up an important point...

Ten years ago, I used LyX only because it was a front end to LaTeX. Now
I use it because it's an ultra-fast, styles-enforcing wordprocessor.
I've used it to make Kindle eBook (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B006QTBLA2),
which has absolutely nothing to do with LaTeX. Now I'm making a
converter to make it do simple HTML like you'd find on a web page,
rather than as input to an eBook. One thing perhaps I haven't
appreciated til now is what a good, fast and efficient wordprocessor
LyX is. It knows when you press space twice it was a mistake and only
prints one space. It knows when you press Enter twice that it's a
mistake and prints only one. It makes fingerprinting difficult, which
is just what I want. And I've never had LyX lose my work.

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the proper
styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX file could be
used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple HTML, or who
knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the output
side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side might look
something like this:



CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
   outputName   latexlayout.layout/myemphL
   outputType   Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
   outputName   simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
   outputType   InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
   outputName   winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
   outputType   CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside the
output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output type at a
time without getting errors from the ones you haven't developed yet.

It seems to me that something like this would be a logical way of
turning LyX into a universal front end while changing very little of
LyX's core code.

I'm not a good enough programmer to do this in C++, so feel free to view
this suggestion with some healthy skepticism.

Thanks,

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance


Lyx2doc: was Anyone know of a best-seller written in LyX

2013-06-10 Thread Steve Litt
On Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:02:15 -0500
stefano franchi  wrote:

> On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 1:44 PM, Les Denham 
> wrote:

> > I use LyX rather than Word (or its clones) because it allows me to
> > produce a presentable document in about half the time it takes with
> > Word. This is emphatically the case if it is a document requiring a
> > detailed table of contents, an index, or a bibliography, or if it
> > contains figures, cross-references or footnotes.
> >
> >
> I guess that's the very reason why we all use LyX. I certainly
> wouldn't be as productive in Word. But those of us working in the
> Humanities (at least some Humanities) then have to budget some time
> to convert the output to Word. Nothing else is accepted. I tend to
> think best-sellers authors' position is closer to us than to a
> physicist's, a mathematician's or a logician's. That's why a minimal
> and yet reliable LyX-to-Doc converter---a topic we've repeatedly
> discussed on the list---would make such a difference to the
> non-technical user, IMHO.

Stephano, you bring up an important point...

Ten years ago, I used LyX only because it was a front end to LaTeX. Now
I use it because it's an ultra-fast, styles-enforcing wordprocessor.
I've used it to make Kindle eBook (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B006QTBLA2),
which has absolutely nothing to do with LaTeX. Now I'm making a
converter to make it do simple HTML like you'd find on a web page,
rather than as input to an eBook. One thing perhaps I haven't
appreciated til now is what a good, fast and efficient wordprocessor
LyX is. It knows when you press space twice it was a mistake and only
prints one space. It knows when you press Enter twice that it's a
mistake and prints only one. It makes fingerprinting difficult, which
is just what I want. And I've never had LyX lose my work.

These days, it could be used as a front end to anything with the proper
styles defined, and the proper converter. So the same LyX file could be
used to output LaTeX, MSWord doc, XHTML, HTML, simple HTML, or who
knows what else.

To more easily accommodate this, it seems to me like layout files
should be split into an input side and an output side, with the output
side capable of multiple output formats. So the input side might look
something like this:



CharStyle MyEmph
Font
Shape Italic
EndFont

if outputtype == latex
   outputName   latexlayout.layout/myemphL
   outputType   Command
elsif outputtype == simplehtml
   outputName   simphtmllayout.layout/myemphH
   outputType   InlineTag
else outputtype == msword
   outputName   winwordlayout.layout/myemphW
   outputType   CharacterStyle
End

Environments would be similar.

Ideally it would be designed so that it doesn't syntax check inside the
output type's it's not. That way you can develop one output type at a
time without getting errors from the ones you haven't developed yet.

It seems to me that something like this would be a logical way of
turning LyX into a universal front end while changing very little of
LyX's core code.

I'm not a good enough programmer to do this in C++, so feel free to view
this suggestion with some healthy skepticism.

Thanks,

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance