Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Kees Zeelenberg]

Op 13-10-18 om 19:58 schreef Paul Johnson:

The only critical flaw in TeXLive we have encountered is that it does
not include texi2pdf. Because of that absence, the R team is still
devoted to MikTeX as a part of the tool chain to build/use R for
windows. I spent a while trying to figure out how to compile texi2pdf
on Windows and gave up. (It appears to me the efforts to make open
source things work on windows are fraught with danger. The Windows
test system here has 5 or 6 different Cygwin-based installations and
the path is a tangled web of incompatible libraries and executables.
Sorry, that's just a Unix guy in foreign territory whining.)


texi2pdf is a script around makeinfo. MikTeX does not have texi2pdf / 
makeinfo either. Probably MikTeX is used because it has texify. It is 
true that texify is able to call makeinfo. But from looking at the 
source at https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex, it appears that it does this 
only if a certain option for that is given on the command line of 
texify; and if makeinfo is then not available,  texify quits.


So it might well be that what texify actually does, is to run latex, 
bibtex etc. several times; and for that it is indeed very handy. There 
may be an alternative for this in TeXLive or elsewhere. If not, then it 
would probably be quite easy to compile texify. In any case, its source 
code is GPL.


As far as I recall, texipdf / makeinfo is only needed for documents 
written in an older version of the TeXInfo format. But if it is really 
needed, then it is easy to compile for Windows, since from the sources 
at GnuWin32, it appears that it compiles without changes on Windows, 
with the mingw compiler or with the VisualC++ compiler. It is even 
easier to compile on Linux with a cross compiler for Windows; so no need 
for Cygwin.


Kees

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[John White]

On Tuesday, October 16, 2018 3:32:43 PM PDT Benedict Holland wrote:
> I have lyx working with texlive and it is awesome. No issues. TexLive is
> really hard to install though.

Is not.  Its in the Debian Stretch repositories.

John

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Benedict Holland]

I have lyx working with texlive and it is awesome. No issues. TexLive is
really hard to install though.

On Tue, Oct 16, 2018 at 3:16 PM Richard Kimberly Heck 
wrote:

> On 10/15/18 12:13 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
> > Hi:
> >
> > I was trying to compile texinfo on Windows, if you succeed, let me know
> how.
> >
> > https://www.gnu.org/software/texinfo
>
> I was able to cross-compile on Linux, but I'm a bit clueless about what
> to do with the result.
>
> The files texi2* that it installs are all scripts, for what it's worth.
> The main one seems to be texi2any, which is a Perl script. I'm not sure
> how much one really needs to run it.
>
> There's also this an older set of binaries here:
>
> http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages/texinfo.htm
>
> which might be good enough.
>
> Riki
>
>
>
> > On Sat, Oct 13, 2018 at 1:12 PM Richard Kimberly Heck 
> wrote:
> >> On 10/13/18 1:58 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
> >>> The only critical flaw in TeXLive we have encountered is that it does
> >>> not include texi2pdf. Because of that absence, the R team is still
> >>> devoted to MikTeX as a part of the tool chain to build/use R for
> >>> windows. I spent a while trying to figure out how to compile texi2pdf
> >>> on Windows and gave up.
> >> Can you point me at the source code? I'd certainly have a go at
> >> cross-compiling it on Linux with mingw.
> >>
> >> Riki
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 10/15/18 12:13 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
> Hi:
>
> I was trying to compile texinfo on Windows, if you succeed, let me know how.
>
> https://www.gnu.org/software/texinfo

I was able to cross-compile on Linux, but I'm a bit clueless about what
to do with the result.

The files texi2* that it installs are all scripts, for what it's worth.
The main one seems to be texi2any, which is a Perl script. I'm not sure
how much one really needs to run it.

There's also this an older set of binaries here:

    http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages/texinfo.htm

which might be good enough.   

Riki



> On Sat, Oct 13, 2018 at 1:12 PM Richard Kimberly Heck  
> wrote:
>> On 10/13/18 1:58 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
>>> The only critical flaw in TeXLive we have encountered is that it does
>>> not include texi2pdf. Because of that absence, the R team is still
>>> devoted to MikTeX as a part of the tool chain to build/use R for
>>> windows. I spent a while trying to figure out how to compile texi2pdf
>>> on Windows and gave up.
>> Can you point me at the source code? I'd certainly have a go at
>> cross-compiling it on Linux with mingw.
>>
>> Riki
>>
>>
>

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Paul Johnson]

Hi:

I was trying to compile texinfo on Windows, if you succeed, let me know how.

https://www.gnu.org/software/texinfo
On Sat, Oct 13, 2018 at 1:12 PM Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:
>
> On 10/13/18 1:58 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
> >
> > The only critical flaw in TeXLive we have encountered is that it does
> > not include texi2pdf. Because of that absence, the R team is still
> > devoted to MikTeX as a part of the tool chain to build/use R for
> > windows. I spent a while trying to figure out how to compile texi2pdf
> > on Windows and gave up.
>
> Can you point me at the source code? I'd certainly have a go at
> cross-compiling it on Linux with mingw.
>
> Riki
>
>


-- 
Paul E. Johnson   http://pj.freefaculty.org
Director, Center for Research Methods and Data Analysis http://crmda.ku.edu

To write to me directly, please address me at pauljohn at ku.edu.

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 10/13/18 1:58 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
>
> The only critical flaw in TeXLive we have encountered is that it does
> not include texi2pdf. Because of that absence, the R team is still
> devoted to MikTeX as a part of the tool chain to build/use R for
> windows. I spent a while trying to figure out how to compile texi2pdf
> on Windows and gave up. 

Can you point me at the source code? I'd certainly have a go at
cross-compiling it on Linux with mingw.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Paul Johnson]

On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 9:10 PM Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:
>
> On 9/14/18 2:38 AM, Baris Erkus wrote:
> > If the intention is more like a complete WYSIWYG software package (or
> > bundle) allowing users to produce documents right after installation
> > without much hassle of Tex and other setups and preventing them from
> > dealing with low-level Latex programming, it would be more reasonable
> > to develop LyX as a bundle/package of LyX Frontend+TeX system+misc
> > components. This would make the bundle more predictable and manageable
> > if the components of the package are package-specific and they are
> > developed specifically for the package. In this case, the TeX system
> > should be customized by the LyX developers and should not be allowed
> > to be updated by a third party software. This is the approach taken by
> > Scientific Workplace and Bakoma, I guess.
> >
> > If the intention is develop only a powerful frontend that allows users
> > to juggle around the TeX system, to do their own customization, allow
> > different TeX systems to be used  (and let the TeX developers to do
> > job of developing TeX systems) and even maybe allow users install
> > their own addons and functions to LyX, then LyX should have a module
> > that can communicate with different TeX systems efficiently and should
> > be immune to changes and updates in the TeX system.
> >

This was a great thread last month and I'm sorry I did not add this back then.

1. We changed over to TeXLive on Windows systems and encourage all LyX
users here to do the same.  It seemed as though every time we had a
workshop, the MiKTeX users were chronically locked up by the failure
to get the packages installed. It is much easier to take the "one
giant distribution" and install it. (https://crmda.ku.edu/latex-help)

The only critical flaw in TeXLive we have encountered is that it does
not include texi2pdf. Because of that absence, the R team is still
devoted to MikTeX as a part of the tool chain to build/use R for
windows. I spent a while trying to figure out how to compile texi2pdf
on Windows and gave up. (It appears to me the efforts to make open
source things work on windows are fraught with danger. The Windows
test system here has 5 or 6 different Cygwin-based installations and
the path is a tangled web of incompatible libraries and executables.
Sorry, that's just a Unix guy in foreign territory whining.)

There is one LaTeX distribution project worth tracking in this vein.
Yihui Xie, who LyX users will remember as an important contributor in
LyX support for Sweave and knitr, offers an R package "tinytex"
(https://yihui.name/tinytex/).  It is a MikTeX-style alternative
distribution based on TeXlive.  Although I gave up with the "on demand
package installation" idea  for LyX/MikTeX, I also would not bet
against this new thing.  The creator has been wildly successful in
ways that, frankly, I thought were impossible.

But, honestly, for the absolute beginner, the simplest thing is to
just install LaTeX  everything: TeXLive!  A 2GB download is feasible
for almost everybody these days.  Disk space is cheap and not too many
of us are running LaTeX in our cell phones.


2. I wrote a help page called "How to Cheat on your LaTeX Homework: A
Beginner's Guide to LyX and LaTeX" and has the theme of the earlier
posts in this tread. We offer workshops with that idea. I agree with
the idea that one of LyX's best contributions is the Code view window.

I prefer to write with LyX, but sometimes my team members are hard
core "raw" LaTeX users and I have to go with that. Also, we have more
demand to write documents with R markdown.  I keep LyX open so I can
remember "how did LyX turn a table sideways" or how did they get a
table to have borders and joined cells "just so." Without LyX, I find
it is much more error prone to make he layout just right.  I end up
Googling and finding incorrect answers from strangers.There are too
many people that are willing to offer advice that is based on
incorrect code or outmoded and unusual packages.   And, once you
follow the badly thought-out advice of an isolated individual in the
internet, you are in a world of hurt.  Almost all of the time, the
LaTeX code that LyX prepares is accurate and understandable in the
"raw" LaTeX document we write.

Best regards
pj

-- 
Paul E. Johnson   http://pj.freefaculty.org
Director, Center for Research Methods and Data Analysis http://crmda.ku.edu

To write to me directly, please address me at pauljohn at ku.edu.

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 09/16/2018 03:06 PM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
> On Sun, Sep 16, 2018 at 06:34:31PM +, Baris Erkus wrote:
>
>> I have been looking into the LyX Bug reporter and changes made to the 
>> code by the developers, and I have realized that I am not actually too 
>> far away from code being developed. I studied C and C++ long time ago, 
>> but I have never had a chance to put it into action. After clearing up 
>> some of the major work and projects I have on my plate, I am hoping to 
>> get more involved with developing LyX. Who knows how long it will 
>> take... Thanks again to all...
> Nice! Even though I have been a LyX "developer" for some years now, I
> still consider myself somewhere in-between beginner and intermediate in
> terms of my C++ knowledge. 

That makes many of us, I think. My skills are still pretty basic. Over
time, I've gotten to know parts of the code pretty well. That's what
really makes a difference: just being involved.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Sun, Sep 16, 2018 at 06:34:31PM +, Baris Erkus wrote:

> I have been looking into the LyX Bug reporter and changes made to the 
> code by the developers, and I have realized that I am not actually too 
> far away from code being developed. I studied C and C++ long time ago, 
> but I have never had a chance to put it into action. After clearing up 
> some of the major work and projects I have on my plate, I am hoping to 
> get more involved with developing LyX. Who knows how long it will 
> take... Thanks again to all...

Nice! Even though I have been a LyX "developer" for some years now, I
still consider myself somewhere in-between beginner and intermediate in
terms of my C++ knowledge. When you are looking for your first issue to
tackle, try to start *very* small. Also, feel free to email the
lyx-devel list to ask for advice if you are stuck.

Best,

Scott


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Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Baris Erkus]

On 15-Sep-18 5:10 AM, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:
> On 9/14/18 2:38 AM, Baris Erkus wrote:
>> If the intention is more like a complete WYSIWYG software package (or
>> bundle) allowing users to produce documents right after installation
>> without much hassle of Tex and other setups and preventing them from
>> dealing with low-level Latex programming, it would be more reasonable
>> to develop LyX as a bundle/package of LyX Frontend+TeX system+misc
>> components. This would make the bundle more predictable and manageable
>> if the components of the package are package-specific and they are
>> developed specifically for the package. In this case, the TeX system
>> should be customized by the LyX developers and should not be allowed
>> to be updated by a third party software. This is the approach taken by
>> Scientific Workplace and Bakoma, I guess.
>>
>> If the intention is develop only a powerful frontend that allows users
>> to juggle around the TeX system, to do their own customization, allow
>> different TeX systems to be used  (and let the TeX developers to do
>> job of developing TeX systems) and even maybe allow users install
>> their own addons and functions to LyX, then LyX should have a module
>> that can communicate with different TeX systems efficiently and should
>> be immune to changes and updates in the TeX system.
>>
>> In my opinion, it is just not feasible/meaningful to achieve these two
>> different-and conflicting-by-nature intentions at the same time.
> Unfortunately, my own sense is that it is of LyX's essence to straddle
> that line. On the one hand, we do strive to ease the learning curve for
> people who ulimately need or want to know LaTeX. (Many of us on the
> development team are like that.) But, on the other hand, we also hope to
> make LyX usable by folks who know nothing of LaTeX. We have had
> important developers (e.g. Abdel Younes) who knew very little LaTeX.
> I've got many students who use LyX who are in the same boat.
>
> On a different note: It is worth remembering that LyX does not just
> (directly) export TeX. It also exports DocBook and XHTML, and the latter
> might long-term be more important due to its compatibilty with ebook
> formats. If I had more time---I wrote the XHTML export code---I'd do a
> lot more in that direction. But even though I don't, it would not be
> difficult for people who cared about such functionality to do that work:
> It has more to do with time and experimentation (e.g., what CSS works
> and what does not) than it does to do with complex coding in C++/Qt.
> Anyone who cares about that, please let me know, and I can direct you to
> a lot of bugs that need attention.
>
> So, as so often with FOSS (Free and Open Source Software) projects, the
> issues fundamentallly concern people power. We *know* what LyX's
> weakenesses are, but we do not have the people-hours to address all of
> them. All of us who work on LyX are volunteers, so we generally work on
> what matters to us---but there are about half as many of us as there
> were when I started, around 2006. And of course we are 'advanced' users.
>
> Riki

I have been looking into the LyX Bug reporter and changes made to the 
code by the developers, and I have realized that I am not actually too 
far away from code being developed. I studied C and C++ long time ago, 
but I have never had a chance to put it into action. After clearing up 
some of the major work and projects I have on my plate, I am hoping to 
get more involved with developing LyX. Who knows how long it will 
take... Thanks again to all...

Baris

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 9/14/18 2:38 AM, Baris Erkus wrote:
> If the intention is more like a complete WYSIWYG software package (or
> bundle) allowing users to produce documents right after installation
> without much hassle of Tex and other setups and preventing them from
> dealing with low-level Latex programming, it would be more reasonable
> to develop LyX as a bundle/package of LyX Frontend+TeX system+misc
> components. This would make the bundle more predictable and manageable
> if the components of the package are package-specific and they are
> developed specifically for the package. In this case, the TeX system
> should be customized by the LyX developers and should not be allowed
> to be updated by a third party software. This is the approach taken by
> Scientific Workplace and Bakoma, I guess.
>
> If the intention is develop only a powerful frontend that allows users
> to juggle around the TeX system, to do their own customization, allow
> different TeX systems to be used  (and let the TeX developers to do
> job of developing TeX systems) and even maybe allow users install
> their own addons and functions to LyX, then LyX should have a module
> that can communicate with different TeX systems efficiently and should
> be immune to changes and updates in the TeX system.
>
> In my opinion, it is just not feasible/meaningful to achieve these two
> different-and conflicting-by-nature intentions at the same time. 

Unfortunately, my own sense is that it is of LyX's essence to straddle
that line. On the one hand, we do strive to ease the learning curve for
people who ulimately need or want to know LaTeX. (Many of us on the
development team are like that.) But, on the other hand, we also hope to
make LyX usable by folks who know nothing of LaTeX. We have had
important developers (e.g. Abdel Younes) who knew very little LaTeX.
I've got many students who use LyX who are in the same boat.

On a different note: It is worth remembering that LyX does not just
(directly) export TeX. It also exports DocBook and XHTML, and the latter
might long-term be more important due to its compatibilty with ebook
formats. If I had more time---I wrote the XHTML export code---I'd do a
lot more in that direction. But even though I don't, it would not be
difficult for people who cared about such functionality to do that work:
It has more to do with time and experimentation (e.g., what CSS works
and what does not) than it does to do with complex coding in C++/Qt.
Anyone who cares about that, please let me know, and I can direct you to
a lot of bugs that need attention.

So, as so often with FOSS (Free and Open Source Software) projects, the
issues fundamentallly concern people power. We *know* what LyX's
weakenesses are, but we do not have the people-hours to address all of
them. All of us who work on LyX are volunteers, so we generally work on
what matters to us---but there are about half as many of us as there
were when I started, around 2006. And of course we are 'advanced' users.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Steve Litt]

On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 12:56:25 -0700
Hal Kierstead  wrote:

> > 
> > True. I don't think that we have as a goal for LyX users never to
> > learn LaTeX. In fact, I usually advocate learning LaTeX well before
> > using LyX, because I agree with you that eventually the user will
> > need to learn it anyway.
> > 
> > 
> > Scott  
> 
> I think people should be encouraged to use LyX to learn LaTeX. The
> code window is very useful! In a collaborative world, it is
> impossible to only use LyX, but you can get started only using LyX.
> For instance students should be encouraged to use LyX for homework
> problems, and then their theses, and then editing other peoples
> LaTeX, etc.
> 
> Hal

I'd add to learn Plain-TeX too. Plain-TeX is much more straightforward,
has less exceptions and depends much less on huge arrays of packaged
addons. I can take Plain TeX, with csplain, eplain, kpfonts plus
cs-schola, plipsum, and opmac, and create almost anything except a
colored background (that's the one thing that still eludes me).

Yeah, I could do all that with LaTeX too, but it requires you to either
evaluate and remember sooo many addon packages, or to jump through
some amazing hoops to undo some of LaTeX' defaults.

Also, if one learns Plain-TeX, one is in a much better position to
learn the ins and outs of LaTeX.

SteveT

Steve Litt 
September 2018 featured book: Quit Joblessness: Start Your Own Business
http://www.troubleshooters.com/startbiz

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 12:56:25PM -0700, Hal Kierstead wrote:
> I think people should be encouraged to use LyX to learn LaTeX. The code 
> window is very useful! In a collaborative world, it is impossible to only use 
> LyX, but you can get started only using LyX. For instance students should be 
> encouraged to use LyX for homework problems, and then their theses, and then 
> editing other peoples LaTeX, etc.

That makes sense. I've known several people who have been successful
doing it that way.

Scott


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Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Hal Kierstead]

> 
> True. I don't think that we have as a goal for LyX users never to learn
> LaTeX. In fact, I usually advocate learning LaTeX well before using LyX,
> because I agree with you that eventually the user will need to learn it
> anyway.
> 
> 
> Scott

I think people should be encouraged to use LyX to learn LaTeX. The code window 
is very useful! In a collaborative world, it is impossible to only use LyX, but 
you can get started only using LyX. For instance students should be encouraged 
to use LyX for homework problems, and then their theses, and then editing other 
peoples LaTeX, etc.

Hal

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 06:38:30AM +, Baris Erkus wrote:

> Hello Again;
> 
> This is a tough one.

+1

> I think the target audience and intended scope is also important.
> 
> If the intention is more like a complete WYSIWYG software package (or bundle) 
> allowing users to produce documents right after installation without much 
> hassle of Tex and other setups and preventing them from dealing with 
> low-level Latex programming, it would be more reasonable to develop LyX as a 
> bundle/package of LyX Frontend+TeX system+misc components. This would make 
> the bundle more predictable and manageable if the components of the package 
> are package-specific and they are developed specifically for the package. In 
> this case, the TeX system should be customized by the LyX developers and 
> should not be allowed to be updated by a third party software. This is the 
> approach taken by Scientific Workplace and Bakoma, I guess.

This approach would require more volunteers who are willing to be LyX
developers on Windows. Unfortunately, most LyX developers are not
comfortable on Windows. Riki has very bravely jumped into the Windows
world to tackle the issues that prevent us from making a release. But
the situation is not sustainable.

> In my opinion, it is just not feasible/meaningful to achieve these two 
> different-and conflicting-by-nature intentions at the same time.

It's possible that's true, I don't know. We tried to achive both by
having both a bundle and an installer. But that just didn't work.
I'm not convinced that a LyX installer bundling TeX Live would not work,
I'm just convinced that right now we don't have a volunteer to put in
the time to get that.

> One of them should be chosen. My preference is the second approach since one 
> can never avoid a certain level of low-level intervention when dealing with 
> LaTeX even if the first time users(!).

True. I don't think that we have as a goal for LyX users never to learn
LaTeX. In fact, I usually advocate learning LaTeX well before using LyX,
because I agree with you that eventually the user will need to learn it
anyway.

> Eventually every single user of LyX goes to SE, mailing list or other 
> resources to achieve a specific thing.

+1

> Anyhow, I again want to thank to everyone, who put a big effort into 
> development of LyX no matter what direction is to be taken.

Thanks for your thoughts on this tricky issue, Barış!

Scott


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Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Baris Erkus]

On 12-Sep-18 12:20 AM, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:
On 09/10/2018 11:02 PM, Baris Erkus wrote:
On 9/9/2018 4:15 AM, Peter Taylor wrote:
Hi,

I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade again if I 
don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your webpage which says:

(start quote)

Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause the 
MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See 
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems, the 
solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.

We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version before 
installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to update MiKTeX, you 
can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. 
(You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you may 
wish to do that anyway. See this page 
for information on subscribing.)
(end quote)

This information does not mention specific versions – just says “latest version 
of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is version 2.9.6751.

I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I want to 
collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an easier editor for 
him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I want to check that LyX is 
something I can recommend to him.

However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to try out 
LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.

Regards,
Peter


Sent from Mail for Windows 10


Hello,

I am trying to follow the conversation(s) regarding the MikTeX issues. I have 
just observed from the MikTeX web page that MikTeX has gone through some major 
changes. I do not know exactly when these changes occurred, so some of them may 
have been there for a while. The major changes are:

  *   A completely new GUI have been implemented.
  *   MikTeX was originally for Windows. Now it can be installed on Mac and 
Linux.
  *   It can be rollout to a group of computers.
  *   It an be installed through a  Docker container.
  *   The concept of "scalable TeX (minimalist TeX, install-on-the-fly TeX)" 
has been introduced.
  *   May be some other changes...

This suggests that the author of MikTeX is putting a big effort into it and 
changes it constantly. This is quite opposite of what conventional TeX systems 
does (at least this is what I have been observing). Systems like TeXLive 
publish major versions with larger periods of time and do not update the system 
in a continuous manner, which provides robustness to the TeX system and avoids 
surprises. Further, MikTeX is more prone to failures and issues due to this 
reason.

Just by considering all these changes to MikTeX, I would say it is quite normal 
for LyX users having issues with MikTeX all the time since it changes, being 
updated, modified frequently. It would be really difficult for LyX developers 
to follow all these changes and provide a LyX setup that is compatible with 
these changes.

Particularly, the concept of minimalist TeX may be an issue. When I installed 
the latest version of LyX, I observed that MikTeX was updating some packages 
online. So, the MikTeX was updating itself from within the LyX installation. 
This sort of installation approach may be a problem for LyX if a problem occurs 
with the MikTeX update during the LyX installation. Luckily, I did not have 
issues in my case, since I keep the full TeX system on my computer (about 6 
GB), even tough MikTeX switched to a minimalist version without telling me.

In conclusion, It would be more surprise-free to use a more stable and 
"not-constantly-being-updated" TeX system -such as TeXLive- along with LyX 
rather than MikTeX. Otherwise there should be another Lyx-specific-minimalist 
MikTeX system available on the PC of the user not to have major issuesö and the 
user should not update MikTeX frequently.

That is certainly the sort of problem we've had here at LyX. There have been 
more than a few times that releases were delayed due to these kinds of issues. 
So we're making an effort, at least, to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX, so that we 
don't feel like we have to fix or work around MiKTeX bugs in our own releases. 
The first step in that direction is to terminate the production of the 
'bundled' installer.

Riki

Hello Again;

This is a tough one. I think the target audience and intended scope is also 
important.

If the intention is more like a complete WYSIWYG software package (or bundle) 
allowing users to produce documents right after installation without much 
hassle of Tex and other setups and preventing them from dealing with low-level 
Latex programming, it would be more reasonable to develop LyX as a 
bundle/package of LyX Frontend+TeX system+misc components. This would make the 
bundle more predictable and manageable if the components of 

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Dr Eberhard Lisse]

Oh, cool.

But to nit a pick, it is installable on LinuX :-)-O

el

On 11/09/2018 14:09, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
> Le 11/09/2018 à 12:26, Dr Eberhard Lisse a écrit :
>> Because MikTeX does not work on Linux? :-)-O
> 
> It does, actually.
> https://miktex.org/download
> 
> JMarc
> 

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 09/10/2018 11:02 PM, Baris Erkus wrote:
> On 9/9/2018 4:15 AM, Peter Taylor wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>  
>>
>> I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
>> again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
>> webpage which says:
>>
>>  
>>
>> (start quote)
>>
>> Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause
>> the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
>> https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
>> problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.
>>
>> We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
>> *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to
>> update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You
>> do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you
>> may wish to do that anyway. See this page
>>  for information on subscribing.)
>>
>> (end quote)
>>
>>  
>>
>> This information does not mention specific versions – just says
>> “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
>> version 2.9.6751.
>>
>>  
>>
>> I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
>> want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an
>> easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I
>> want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.
>>
>>  
>>
>> However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
>> try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
>>
>>  
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Peter
>>
>>  
>>
>>  
>>
>> Sent from Mail  for
>> Windows 10
>>
>>  
>>
>
> Hello,
>
> I am trying to follow the conversation(s) regarding the MikTeX issues.
> I have just observed from the MikTeX web page that MikTeX has gone
> through some major changes. I do not know exactly when these changes
> occurred, so some of them may have been there for a while. The major
> changes are:
>
>   * A completely new GUI have been implemented.
>   * MikTeX was originally for Windows. Now it can be installed on Mac
> and Linux.
>   * It can be rollout to a group of computers.
>   * It an be installed through a  Docker container.
>   * The concept of "scalable TeX (minimalist TeX, install-on-the-fly
> TeX)" has been introduced.
>   * May be some other changes...
>
> This suggests that the author of MikTeX is putting a big effort into
> it and changes it constantly. This is quite opposite of what
> conventional TeX systems does (at least this is what I have been
> observing). Systems like TeXLive publish major versions with larger
> periods of time and do not update the system in a continuous manner,
> which provides robustness to the TeX system and avoids surprises.
> Further, MikTeX is more prone to failures and issues due to this reason.
>
> Just by considering all these changes to MikTeX, I would say it is
> quite normal for LyX users having issues with MikTeX all the time
> since it changes, being updated, modified frequently. It would be
> really difficult for LyX developers to follow all these changes and
> provide a LyX setup that is compatible with these changes.
>
> Particularly, the concept of minimalist TeX may be an issue. When I
> installed the latest version of LyX, I observed that MikTeX was
> updating some packages online. So, the MikTeX was updating itself from
> within the LyX installation. This sort of installation approach may be
> a problem for LyX if a problem occurs with the MikTeX update during
> the LyX installation. Luckily, I did not have issues in my case, since
> I keep the full TeX system on my computer (about 6 GB), even tough
> MikTeX switched to a minimalist version without telling me.
>
> In conclusion, It would be more surprise-free to use a more stable and
> "not-constantly-being-updated" TeX system -such as TeXLive- along with
> LyX rather than MikTeX. Otherwise there should be another
> Lyx-specific-minimalist MikTeX system available on the PC of the user
> not to have major issuesö and the user should not update MikTeX
> frequently.

That is certainly the sort of problem we've had here at LyX. There have
been more than a few times that releases were delayed due to these kinds
of issues. So we're making an effort, at least, to disentangle LyX from
MiKTeX, so that we don't feel like we have to fix or work around MiKTeX
bugs in our own releases. The first step in that direction is to
terminate the production of the 'bundled' installer.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Jean-Marc Lasgouttes]

Le 11/09/2018 à 12:26, Dr Eberhard Lisse a écrit :

Because MikTeX does not work on Linux? :-)-O


It does, actually.
https://miktex.org/download

JMarc

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Dr Eberhard Lisse]

Because MikTeX does not work on Linux? :-)-O

el

On 09/09/2018 23:26, Steve Litt wrote:
[...]
> As far as I know, my LyX has been working perfectly, with TeXLive, for
> many years. Why would someone choose MiKTeX?
> 
> [slitt@mydesk linux]$ uname -a
> Linux mydesk 4.17.14_1 #1 SMP PREEMPT Sat Aug 11 18:42:04 UTC 2018
> x86_64 GNU/Linux [slitt@mydesk linux]$ tex -v
> TeX 3.14159265 (TeX Live 2018)
[...]

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Baris Erkus]

On 9/9/2018 4:15 AM, Peter Taylor wrote:
Hi,

I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade again if I 
don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your webpage which says:

(start quote)

Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause the 
MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See 
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems, the 
solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.

We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version before 
installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to update MiKTeX, you 
can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. 
(You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you may 
wish to do that anyway. See this page 
for information on subscribing.)
(end quote)

This information does not mention specific versions – just says “latest version 
of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is version 2.9.6751.

I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I want to 
collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an easier editor for 
him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I want to check that LyX is 
something I can recommend to him.

However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to try out 
LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.

Regards,
Peter


Sent from Mail for Windows 10


Hello,

I am trying to follow the conversation(s) regarding the MikTeX issues. I have 
just observed from the MikTeX web page that MikTeX has gone through some major 
changes. I do not know exactly when these changes occurred, so some of them may 
have been there for a while. The major changes are:

  *   A completely new GUI have been implemented.
  *   MikTeX was originally for Windows. Now it can be installed on Mac and 
Linux.
  *   It can be rollout to a group of computers.
  *   It an be installed through a  Docker container.
  *   The concept of "scalable TeX (minimalist TeX, install-on-the-fly TeX)" 
has been introduced.
  *   May be some other changes...

This suggests that the author of MikTeX is putting a big effort into it and 
changes it constantly. This is quite opposite of what conventional TeX systems 
does (at least this is what I have been observing). Systems like TeXLive 
publish major versions with larger periods of time and do not update the system 
in a continuous manner, which provides robustness to the TeX system and avoids 
surprises. Further, MikTeX is more prone to failures and issues due to this 
reason.

Just by considering all these changes to MikTeX, I would say it is quite normal 
for LyX users having issues with MikTeX all the time since it changes, being 
updated, modified frequently. It would be really difficult for LyX developers 
to follow all these changes and provide a LyX setup that is compatible with 
these changes.

Particularly, the concept of minimalist TeX may be an issue. When I installed 
the latest version of LyX, I observed that MikTeX was updating some packages 
online. So, the MikTeX was updating itself from within the LyX installation. 
This sort of installation approach may be a problem for LyX if a problem occurs 
with the MikTeX update during the LyX installation. Luckily, I did not have 
issues in my case, since I keep the full TeX system on my computer (about 6 
GB), even tough MikTeX switched to a minimalist version without telling me.

In conclusion, It would be more surprise-free to use a more stable and 
"not-constantly-being-updated" TeX system -such as TeXLive- along with LyX 
rather than MikTeX. Otherwise there should be another Lyx-specific-minimalist 
MikTeX system available on the PC of the user not to have major issuesö and the 
user should not update MikTeX frequently.

I hope my observations are not fundamentally flawed as I am not a programmer 
person.

RE: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX -what is the minimal version needed?

[Peter Taylor]

Thanks for your responses – I remember having some problem with a MiKTeX 
upgrade recently so I can understand that you might have had a problem.

I will wait before trying to install LyX – I will keep an eye on the 
installation page to see if anything changes.

Regards,
Peter

From: Richard Kimberly Heck
Sent: 09 September 2018 17:35
To: Daniel
Cc: pptayl...@gmail.com; lyx-users
Subject: Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX 
-what is the minimal version needed?

On 09/09/2018 11:12 AM, Daniel wrote:
> On 09/09/2018 03:15, Peter Taylor wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
>> again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
>> webpage which says:
>>
>> (start quote)
>>
>> Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause
>> the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
>> https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
>> problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.
>>
>> We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
>> *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to
>> update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You
>> do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you
>> may wish to do that anyway. See this page
>> <https://www.lyx.org/MailingLists#toc2> for information on subscribing.)
>>
>> (end quote)
>>
>> This information does not mention specific versions – just says
>> “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
>> version 2.9.6751.
>>
>> I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
>> want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an
>> easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I
>> want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.
>>
>> However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
>> try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Peter
>>
>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>> Windows 10
>>
>
> I might be wrong, but I think that from official installer 2.3.0
> onwards LyX is not making any upgrades to MiKTeX on its own any more.
> So, in the worst case LyX will not work but everything else should
> still do. So, you could just give it a shot without upgrading MiKTeX
> and see whether it works.

For some reason, Uwe had the installer run something like:

    mpm.exe --verbose --update-db

just prior to LyX configuration and then install a bunch of packages,
all without asking or even informing the user. I'm still working on
undoing that and will probably release an updated installer, which is a
bit more streamlined, before too long. So Peter, you may want to wait
for that.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Daniel]

On 10/09/2018 17:30, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:

On 09/10/2018 09:43 AM, Daniel wrote:

On 10/09/2018 15:37, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:

On 09/10/2018 04:26 AM, Daniel wrote:

On 09/09/2018 23:26, Steve Litt wrote:

On Sun, 9 Sep 2018 12:05:36 -0400
Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:


On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:


Hi,

   I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to
upgrade
again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
webpage which says:

   (start quote)

Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes
cause the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then
re-install.

We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
*before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how
to update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help.
(You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but
you may wish to do that anyway. See this page
 for information on
subscribing.)

(end quote)

   This information does not mention specific versions – just says
“latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
version 2.9.6751.

   I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me
but I
want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be
an easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing
that I want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.

   However seeing this message on your website has made me
reluctant to
try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.



There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any
kind of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing
anything.

Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I
myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and
make
it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.

Riki


As far as I know, my LyX has been working perfectly, with TeXLive, for
many years. Why would someone choose MiKTeX?


Maybe because it installs and updates packages as needed/desired.


https://ctan.org/pkg/texliveonfly?lang=en

Riki


Does this work on Windows? The readme only states that

"The script was written on Ubuntu and should (hopefully) be compatible
with linux distributions."


It's a Python script, so I would suppose it would be portable, or easily
made portable.


*If* that was done and the script works rather flawlessly, then it might 
be something that could help Windows users make the transition to TeX Live.


Daniel

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 09/10/2018 09:43 AM, Daniel wrote:
> On 10/09/2018 15:37, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:
>> On 09/10/2018 04:26 AM, Daniel wrote:
>>> On 09/09/2018 23:26, Steve Litt wrote:
 On Sun, 9 Sep 2018 12:05:36 -0400
 Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:

> On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>   I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to
>> upgrade
>> again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
>> webpage which says:
>>
>>   (start quote)
>>
>> Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes
>> cause the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
>> https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
>> problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then
>> re-install.
>>
>> We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
>> *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how
>> to update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help.
>> (You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but
>> you may wish to do that anyway. See this page
>>  for information on
>> subscribing.)
>>
>> (end quote)
>>
>>   This information does not mention specific versions – just says
>> “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
>> version 2.9.6751.
>>
>>   I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me
>> but I
>> want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be
>> an easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing
>> that I want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.
>>
>>   However seeing this message on your website has made me
>> reluctant to
>> try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
>>    
>
> There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any
> kind of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing
> anything.
>
> Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I
> myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and
> make
> it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.
>
> Riki

 As far as I know, my LyX has been working perfectly, with TeXLive, for
 many years. Why would someone choose MiKTeX?
>>>
>>> Maybe because it installs and updates packages as needed/desired.
>>
>> https://ctan.org/pkg/texliveonfly?lang=en
>>
>> Riki
>
> Does this work on Windows? The readme only states that
>
> "The script was written on Ubuntu and should (hopefully) be compatible
> with linux distributions."

It's a Python script, so I would suppose it would be portable, or easily
made portable.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Daniel]

On 10/09/2018 15:37, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:

On 09/10/2018 04:26 AM, Daniel wrote:

On 09/09/2018 23:26, Steve Litt wrote:

On Sun, 9 Sep 2018 12:05:36 -0400
Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:


On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:


Hi,

  
I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade

again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
webpage which says:

  
(start quote)


Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes
cause the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then
re-install.

We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
*before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how
to update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help.
(You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but
you may wish to do that anyway. See this page
 for information on
subscribing.)

(end quote)

  
This information does not mention specific versions – just says

“latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
version 2.9.6751.

  
I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I

want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be
an easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing
that I want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.

  
However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to

try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
   


There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any
kind of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing
anything.

Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I
myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and make
it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.

Riki


As far as I know, my LyX has been working perfectly, with TeXLive, for
many years. Why would someone choose MiKTeX?


Maybe because it installs and updates packages as needed/desired.


https://ctan.org/pkg/texliveonfly?lang=en

Riki


Does this work on Windows? The readme only states that

"The script was written on Ubuntu and should (hopefully) be compatible 
with linux distributions."


Daniel

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 09/10/2018 04:26 AM, Daniel wrote:
> On 09/09/2018 23:26, Steve Litt wrote:
>> On Sun, 9 Sep 2018 12:05:36 -0400
>> Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:
>>
>>> On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:

 Hi,

  
 I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
 again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
 webpage which says:

  
 (start quote)

 Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes
 cause the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
 https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
 problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then
 re-install.

 We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
 *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how
 to update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help.
 (You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but
 you may wish to do that anyway. See this page
  for information on
 subscribing.)

 (end quote)

  
 This information does not mention specific versions – just says
 “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
 version 2.9.6751.

  
 I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
 want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be
 an easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing
 that I want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.

  
 However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
 try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
   
>>>
>>> There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any
>>> kind of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing
>>> anything.
>>>
>>> Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I
>>> myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and make
>>> it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.
>>>
>>> Riki
>>
>> As far as I know, my LyX has been working perfectly, with TeXLive, for
>> many years. Why would someone choose MiKTeX?
>
> Maybe because it installs and updates packages as needed/desired.

https://ctan.org/pkg/texliveonfly?lang=en

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Daniel]

On 09/09/2018 23:26, Steve Litt wrote:

On Sun, 9 Sep 2018 12:05:36 -0400
Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:


On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:


Hi,

  


I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
webpage which says:

  


(start quote)

Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes
cause the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then
re-install.

We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
*before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how
to update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help.
(You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but
you may wish to do that anyway. See this page
 for information on
subscribing.)

(end quote)

  


This information does not mention specific versions – just says
“latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
version 2.9.6751.

  


I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be
an easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing
that I want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.

  


However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
  


There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any
kind of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing
anything.

Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I
myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and make
it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.

Riki


As far as I know, my LyX has been working perfectly, with TeXLive, for
many years. Why would someone choose MiKTeX?


Maybe because it installs and updates packages as needed/desired.

Daniel

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Steve Litt]

On Sun, 9 Sep 2018 12:05:36 -0400
Richard Kimberly Heck  wrote:

> On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> >  
> >
> > I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
> > again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
> > webpage which says:
> >
> >  
> >
> > (start quote)
> >
> > Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes
> > cause the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
> > https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
> > problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then
> > re-install.
> >
> > We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
> > *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how
> > to update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help.
> > (You do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but
> > you may wish to do that anyway. See this page
> >  for information on
> > subscribing.)
> >
> > (end quote)
> >
> >  
> >
> > This information does not mention specific versions – just says
> > “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
> > version 2.9.6751.
> >
> >  
> >
> > I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
> > want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be
> > an easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing
> > that I want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.
> >
> >  
> >
> > However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
> > try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
> >  
> 
> There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any
> kind of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing
> anything.
> 
> Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I
> myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and make
> it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.
> 
> Riki

As far as I know, my LyX has been working perfectly, with TeXLive, for
many years. Why would someone choose MiKTeX?

[slitt@mydesk linux]$ uname -a
Linux mydesk 4.17.14_1 #1 SMP PREEMPT Sat Aug 11 18:42:04 UTC 2018
x86_64 GNU/Linux [slitt@mydesk linux]$ tex -v
TeX 3.14159265 (TeX Live 2018)
kpathsea version 6.3.0
Copyright 2018 D.E. Knuth.
There is NO warranty.  Redistribution of this software is
covered by the terms of both the TeX copyright and
the Lesser GNU General Public License.
For more information about these matters, see the file
named COPYING and the TeX source.
Primary author of TeX: D.E. Knuth.
[slitt@mydesk linux]$ latex -v
pdfTeX 3.14159265-2.6-1.40.19 (TeX Live 2018)
kpathsea version 6.3.0
Copyright 2018 Han The Thanh (pdfTeX) et al.
There is NO warranty.  Redistribution of this software is
covered by the terms of both the pdfTeX copyright and
the Lesser GNU General Public License.
For more information about these matters, see the file
named COPYING and the pdfTeX source.
Primary author of pdfTeX: Han The Thanh (pdfTeX) et al.
Compiled with libpng 1.6.34; using libpng 1.6.34
Compiled with zlib 1.2.11; using zlib 1.2.11
Compiled with xpdf version 4.00
[slitt@mydesk linux]$


SteveT

Steve Litt 
September 2018 featured book: Quit Joblessness: Start Your Own Business
http://www.troubleshooters.com/startbiz

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Cris Fuhrman]

I also updated my MikTeX 2.9 with two installs of 2.2.x under Windows 10 in
the past 10 days and had no problems. Is this a LyX 2.3.x problem only?

On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 12:54 PM Daniel  wrote:

> On 09/09/2018 18:05, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:
> > On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
> >> again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
> >> webpage which says:
> >>
> >> (start quote)
> >>
> >> Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause
> >> the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
> >> https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems,
> >> the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.
> >>
> >> We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
> >> *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to
> >> update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You do
> >> not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you may
> >> wish to do that anyway. See this page
> >>  for information on
> subscribing.)
> >>
> >> (end quote)
> >>
> >> This information does not mention specific versions – just says
> >> “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
> >> version 2.9.6751.
> >>
> >> I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
> >> want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an
> >> easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I
> >> want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.
> >>
> >> However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
> >> try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
> >>
> >
> > There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any kind
> > of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing anything.
>
> Isn't it already working again? I had no problems today.
>
> Daniel
>
>

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 09/09/2018 11:12 AM, Daniel wrote:
> On 09/09/2018 03:15, Peter Taylor wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
>> again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
>> webpage which says:
>>
>> (start quote)
>>
>> Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause
>> the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
>> https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into
>> problems, the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.
>>
>> We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
>> *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to
>> update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You
>> do not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you
>> may wish to do that anyway. See this page
>>  for information on subscribing.)
>>
>> (end quote)
>>
>> This information does not mention specific versions – just says
>> “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
>> version 2.9.6751.
>>
>> I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
>> want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an
>> easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I
>> want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.
>>
>> However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
>> try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Peter
>>
>> Sent from Mail  for
>> Windows 10
>>
>
> I might be wrong, but I think that from official installer 2.3.0
> onwards LyX is not making any upgrades to MiKTeX on its own any more.
> So, in the worst case LyX will not work but everything else should
> still do. So, you could just give it a shot without upgrading MiKTeX
> and see whether it works.

For some reason, Uwe had the installer run something like:

    mpm.exe --verbose --update-db

just prior to LyX configuration and then install a bunch of packages,
all without asking or even informing the user. I'm still working on
undoing that and will probably release an updated installer, which is a
bit more streamlined, before too long. So Peter, you may want to wait
for that.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Daniel]

On 09/09/2018 18:05, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:

On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:


Hi,

I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade 
again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your 
webpage which says:


(start quote)

Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause 
the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See 
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems, 
the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.


We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version 
*before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to 
update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You do 
not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you may 
wish to do that anyway. See this page 
 for information on subscribing.)


(end quote)

This information does not mention specific versions – just says 
“latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is 
version 2.9.6751.


I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I 
want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an 
easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I 
want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.


However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to 
try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.




There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any kind 
of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing anything.


Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I 
myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and make 
it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.


That might not be a very helpful answer for someone who has already 
MiKTeX installed and does not want to change the system. But isn't it 
true that Peter could just install LyX and see whether it is working 
without upgrading MiKTeX or is that not advisable?


Daniel

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Daniel]

On 09/09/2018 18:05, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:

On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:


Hi,

I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade 
again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your 
webpage which says:


(start quote)

Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause 
the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See 
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems, 
the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.


We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version 
*before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to 
update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You do 
not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you may 
wish to do that anyway. See this page 
 for information on subscribing.)


(end quote)

This information does not mention specific versions – just says 
“latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is 
version 2.9.6751.


I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I 
want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an 
easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I 
want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.


However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to 
try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.




There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any kind 
of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing anything.


Isn't it already working again? I had no problems today.

Daniel

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 09/08/2018 09:15 PM, Peter Taylor wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
>  
>
> I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade
> again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your
> webpage which says:
>
>  
>
> (start quote)
>
> Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause
> the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See
> https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems,
> the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.
>
> We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version
> *before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to
> update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You do
> not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you may
> wish to do that anyway. See this page
>  for information on subscribing.)
>
> (end quote)
>
>  
>
> This information does not mention specific versions – just says
> “latest version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is
> version 2.9.6751.
>
>  
>
> I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I
> want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an
> easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I
> want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.
>
>  
>
> However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to
> try out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.
>

There is currently some major bug in MiKTeX that is preventing any kind
of update. You might want to wait a little bit before doing anything.

Frankly, this is the second catastrophic bug in MiKTeX this year. I
myself have been workigng hard to disentangle LyX from MiKTeX and make
it easier to use with TeX Live, which is a LOT more stable.

Riki

Re: you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Daniel]

On 09/09/2018 03:15, Peter Taylor wrote:

Hi,

I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade 
again if I don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your 
webpage which says:


(start quote)

Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause 
the MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See 
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems, 
the solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install.


We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version 
*before* installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to 
update MiKTeX, you can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You do 
not need to be subscribed to the mailing list to do so, but you may wish 
to do that anyway. See this page  
for information on subscribing.)


(end quote)

This information does not mention specific versions – just says “latest 
version of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is version 
2.9.6751.


I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I 
want to collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an 
easier editor for him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I 
want to check that LyX is something I can recommend to him.


However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to try 
out LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.


Regards,

Peter

Sent from Mail  for 
Windows 10




I might be wrong, but I think that from official installer 2.3.0 onwards 
LyX is not making any upgrades to MiKTeX on its own any more. So, in the 
worst case LyX will not work but everything else should still do. So, 
you could just give it a shot without upgrading MiKTeX and see whether 
it works.


But to be safe better wait for a response from some developer who knows 
the latest installer details.


Best,
Daniel

you say install latest version of MiKTeX before installing LyX - what is the minimal version needed?

[Peter Taylor]

Hi,

I have upgraded MiKTeX relatively recently – I don’t want to upgrade again if I 
don’t have to upgrade – so please could you update your webpage which says:

(start quote)
Due to a bug in MiKTeX, installation of LyX 2.3.0 can sometimes cause the 
MiKTeX installation to be corrupted. (See 
https://github.com/MiKTeX/miktex/issues/82.) If you run into problems, the 
solution will be to uninstall MiKTeX and then re-install. 
We highly recommend that MiKTeX users update to the latest version before 
installing LyX 2.3.0. If you have any questions about how to update MiKTeX, you 
can email lyx-users@lists.lyx.org for help. (You do not need to be subscribed 
to the mailing list to do so, but you may wish to do that anyway. See this page 
for information on subscribing.) 
(end quote)

This information does not mention specific versions – just says “latest version 
of MiKTeX”. My MiKTeX console window tells me it is version 2.9.6751.

I am actually using another TeX editor which works fine for me but I want to 
collaborate with a colleague and I heard that LyX might be an easier editor for 
him to use on shared documents. Before doing that I want to check that LyX is 
something I can recommend to him.

However seeing this message on your website has made me reluctant to try out 
LyX in case my MiKTeX installation gets corrupted.

Regards,
Peter


Sent from Mail for Windows 10